AFL Autopsy RND 3: Done by the Dees

[bomberlegend2007]

Anyone else tired of being a medicore side?

100%. But, shit happens. In hindsight, we shouldn’t have gone after Shiel and maybe picked a Key Forward from the picks we traded.

In the last decade, even things outside of the drug scandal haven’t gone our way. Some of it our doing, some of it just lack of luck. As soon as we were building a talented forward line, it was gone is an example.

We believed we were gonna pinch a flag with the players coming back and such. And to be fair, I don’t blame the club for trying. The alternative would have been to burn the place down and start again, but I don’t believe that would have been a wise move for the club. I admire the club for having a crack, but we took an L and this is the result.

I would rather us go through this period for a sustained attack at the flag in the coming years. We could quite easily do a St Kilda and trade for all these players whose time is up, in the hope we can moneyball our way to a flag, or we can stick it out, have a window of 3 years/60-70 games for our youth to become a unit and build a side that will be ready to have a tilt at a flag. We will get there. Every club has periods of success. Our time will come.

 

[Kyptastic]

The half back line is a major concern, but Hind deserves some credit for his lock down efforts, Pickett was basically a non-factor last night. Problem is that it means you need to get drive from Redman and Heppell, which isn’t happening.

I actually like that Redman tried something different from the kick in, instead of going long to the flank. If it comes off, we’re out and have a quick forward 50 entry and it makes us less predictable. It was a problem of execution, not strategy.

 

[TheGrizz]

The half back line is a major concern, but Hind deserves some credit for his lock down efforts, Pickett was basically a non-factor last night. Problem is that it means you need to get drive from Redman and Heppell, which isn’t happening.

I actually like that Redman tried something different from the kick in, instead of going long to the flank. If it comes off, we’re out and have a quick forward 50 entry and it makes us less predictable. It was a problem of execution, not strategy.

Yeah watching it on the TV you could see the option and just knew he would try it. He absolutely shanked the kick which didn't help.

The thing with Redman is that he is a risk taker by foot. You need guys like that in your team but Redman is at his best when he is linking up in transition with overlap run and taking risks inside the attacking half of the ground.

It's when he starts trying the high risk-high reward stuff out of the back half against a set defence that he gets in trouble. The key to taking risks is knowing the best times to take them, and that's where Red Dog struggles sometimes and the outcome can look horrific.

 

[Inspecta Gadget]

One thing I noticed last night is that I've never seen a team have an easier time of moving it outside their defensive 50, it's like our zones start 70m from goal

 

[Loonerty]

One thing I noticed last night is that I've never seen a team have an easier time of moving it outside their defensive 50, it's like our zones start 70m from goal

It's an issue we have had for a while, last year included. We are really susceptible to quick transitions from defence and struggle to defend against it ourselves.

 

[citizen-erased]

Captain currently has Francis’s spot.

Seems a simple fix to two equations.

 

[doug85]

The half back line is a major concern, but Hind deserves some credit for his lock down efforts, Pickett was basically a non-factor last night. Problem is that it means you need to get drive from Redman and Heppell, which isn’t happening.

I actually like that Redman tried something different from the kick in, instead of going long to the flank. If it comes off, we’re out and have a quick forward 50 entry and it makes us less predictable. It was a problem of execution, not strategy.

I could excuse 1 goal costing mistake. But he had 3. Was pretty bad against the cats too.

 

[brutus76]

Just not enough depth with the players out.

Help and Dev have fallen off a cliff. Can't hide them anywhere and are cooked.

Play Hobby FFS. He'll at least run both ways.

Kelly's doing his job making sure his opponent gets bugger all. Fritsch kicked 6 in a GF and was well held.

Pidge might need to be our blanket man. I think they thought Langer's could be that but he's not.

Caldwell is class.

We get enough of the ball just can't defend nor kick a winning score.

Yearning for the days when Fletch would kick out to Wellman or Solly who then pass on the runners then down the other end to Hird Lucas or Lloyd and goal.

 

[Shane Heard]

Just not enough depth with the players out.

Help and Dev have fallen off a cliff. Can't hide them anywhere and are cooked.

Play Hobby FFS. He'll at least run both ways.

Kelly's doing his job making sure his opponent gets bugger all. Fritsch kicked 6 in a GF and was well held.

Pidge might need to be our blanket man. I think they thought Langer's could be that but he's not.

Caldwell is class.

We get enough of the ball just can't defend nor kick a winning score.

Yearning for the days when Fletch would kick out to Wellman or Solly who then pass on the runners then down the other end to Hird Lucas or Lloyd and goal.

Ahh the memories

Fletcher to a Solomon, Wellman or Hardwick,Barnes mark

Handpass to a running Rama who’d link up with JJ, Caracalla or Heffernan

Kick to a leading Lucas or Hird at half forward/ wing

Drill to a leading Lloyd or Boris

Set shot ..goal

 

[sameolds33]

It's an issue we have had for a while, last year included. We are really susceptible to quick transitions from defence and struggle to defend against it ourselves.

we are better in F50 defence when Jones, Snelling and AMT are in the team

 

[NAB777]

Most sane people would have had us 0-3 after three rounds.

 

[ant555]

100%. But, shit happens. In hindsight, we shouldn’t have gone after Shiel and maybe picked a Key Forward from the picks we traded.

In the last decade, even things outside of the drug scandal haven’t gone our way. Some of it our doing, some of it just lack of luck. As soon as we were building a talented forward line, it was gone is an example.

We believed we were gonna pinch a flag with the players coming back and such. And to be fair, I don’t blame the club for trying. The alternative would have been to burn the place down and start again, but I don’t believe that would have been a wise move for the club. I admire the club for having a crack, but we took an L and this is the result.

I would rather us go through this period for a sustained attack at the flag in the coming years. We could quite easily do a St Kilda and trade for all these players whose time is up, in the hope we can moneyball our way to a flag, or we can stick it out, have a window of 3 years/60-70 games for our youth to become a unit and build a side that will be ready to have a tilt at a flag. We will get there. Every club has periods of success. Our time will come.

I agree that paying a price for Shiel and even the season before when we traded for Stringer / Smith and Saad now look like the wrong way to go. They tried topping up but the list was not good enough. I will say one thing , there where limited KP forwards in the draft around the picks that we traded for Shiel.

 

[ant555]

Seems a simple fix to two equations.

Are you suggesting some sort of Tonya Harding maneuver ?

 

[Shane Heard]

Most sane people would have had us 0-3 after three rounds.

Pretty much.

I envy those tiger and now Dees flag sides who were gifted by the footy gods with minimum injuries to the bulk of their key senior players and had a good run at right from round 1

I’m already dreaming of a solid lineup next year devoid of B grade foot soldiers and plodding ageing captains

There’s a lot to look forward to with Martin, Wangas, Hobbs, Jones etc becoming regular senior players and more improved Perkins, Draper, Caldwell, 2MP and maybe another top 10 draft pick

We just have to nail the games against weaker or equal teams this year and get quality wins on the board. Finishing 9th or 10th is no big deal as long as we don’t capitulate with pathetic performances vs the likes of Saints, North, Port, Carlton, Freo etc

There is much light ahead ..

 

[ant555]

Pretty much.

I envy those tiger and now Dees flag sides who were gifted by the footy gods with minimum injuries to the bulk of their key senior players and had a good run at right from round 1

I’m already dreaming of a solid lineup next year devoid of B grade foot soldiers and plodding ageing captains

There’s a lot to look forward to with Martin, Wangas, Hobbs, Jones etc becoming regular senior players and more improved Perkins, Draper, Caldwell, 2MP and maybe another top 10 draft pick

We just have to nail the games against weaker or equal teams this year and get quality wins on the board. Finishing 9th or 10th is no big deal as long as we don’t capitulate with pathetic performances vs the likes of Saints, North, Port, Carlton, Freo etc

There is much light ahead ..

Along the lines of my thinking. My prediction was to finish around 6th if we had no injuries but we have and it was also based around Jones being ready to step into around 35 goals and Walla and Stringer being fully fit for round 1. Right now if we can bring consistent effort most weeks and win 9 to 11 games it may be better long term if we get more of the new guys a bit of exposure and go to the draft with another pick in the 7-12 range. No way I want to tank. They have to work on playing solid / improving footy but unlike the Malthouse prediction we where not top 4 contenders anyway.

 

[Yoda_]

Most sane people would have had us 0-3 after three rounds.

What do we make of Carlton supporters celebrating this though? They aren't exactly normal

 

[Yoda_]

Pretty much.

I envy those tiger and now Dees flag sides who were gifted by the footy gods with minimum injuries to the bulk of their key senior players and had a good run at right from round 1

I’m already dreaming of a solid lineup next year devoid of B grade foot soldiers and plodding ageing captains

There’s a lot to look forward to with Martin, Wangas, Hobbs, Jones etc becoming regular senior players and more improved Perkins, Draper, Caldwell, 2MP and maybe another top 10 draft pick

We just have to nail the games against weaker or equal teams this year and get quality wins on the board. Finishing 9th or 10th is no big deal as long as we don’t capitulate with pathetic performances vs the likes of Saints, North, Port, Carlton, Freo etc

There is much light ahead ..

Good excessive would be to name our current (list) best 22 and discuss who should be upgraded for us to be competitive and get to the pointy end of proceedings

 

[Stopher]

Most sane people would have had us 0-3 after three rounds.

I'd take our 0-3 over Port's.

 

[Shane Heard]

Along the lines of my thinking. My prediction was to finish around 6th if we had no injuries but we have and it was also based around Jones being ready to step into around 35 goals and Walla and Stringer being fully fit for round 1. Right now if we can bring consistent effort most weeks and win 9 to 11 games it may be better long term if we get more of the new guys a bit of exposure and go to the draft with another pick in the 7-12 range. No way I want to tank. They have to work on playing solid / improving footy but unlike the Malthouse prediction we where not top 4 contenders anyway.

Was listening to MM last week on radio in car. The bloke rambles on like Grampa Simpson.

A perfect situation with what we have now and no injuries ..and looking towards a core line up next year with our young players stepping up would be something like

Wanga 2MP string
Perkins Jones Langford

Martin Shiel Durham

Redman Lav Hind
Kelly Rids Stewart

Draper Parish Hobbs Zac
Cox, Snelling , Caldwell, McGrath

Trade out one or two of Gwelf ham Francis cutler maybe

Waterboy and Baldwin potential forwards

We have the 3 big boys to develop Reid etc

Get a top 10 pick

It gives me hope

 

[citizen-erased]

Are you suggesting some sort of Tonya Harding maneuver ?

Probably more peter griffin on james wood style...except microwaved steak instead of candy

 

[Zach Package]

I would have liked to have learned a little more. We already know we can slug it with the good sides for 3 and a half quarters but just lack a bit of size, a bit of experience and another reliable avenue to goal.

Dees are the most well organised team defence we’ve probably ever seen so yeah, it was always going to be hard for us.

Biggest takeaways for me are that 1v1 defending is a dead art and that the whole idea is that you read the play well enough to ensure you’re not left vulnerable in the first place and that they train so hard and so often these days the idea of getting conditioning in the VFL is practically gone. Wanganeen came in off no VFL and minimal lead in and looked completely at home fitness and intensity wise.

 

[TheGrizz]

What do we make of Carlton supporters celebrating this though? They aren't exactly normal

Ignore them?

If potentially starting 3-0 isnt enough to make them happy and they have to find joy in our misfortune, then let them be.

 

[Lore]

Ignore them?

If potentially starting 3-0 isnt enough to make them happy and they have to find joy in our misfortune, then let them be.

What a life eh

 

[citizen-erased]

Good excessive would be to name our current (list) best 22 and discuss who should be upgraded for us to be competitive and get to the pointy end of proceedings

So i started this;

Ridley Stewart Kelly
Francis Laverde Hind
Durham Shiel Cutler
Perkins Jones Langford
Snelling Wright Stringer
Draper Parish Merrett
Caldwell McGrath Heppell Redman

You can argue all should be superstars and i'd bold a few.
But as a unit, that's a decent team and still has a highly touted Hobbs, 2nd gamer in Martin and single gamers in Baldwin, Tex & Reid to come in.
I also don't have Cox in due to a lack of defined role.

Those last two on the bench i can make arguments on dropping for Martin and Cox.
Stewart is the main one for me. There's a lot riding on Reid.

What it highlights is it's less the names/talent on paper and more the balance, tactics and effort from the side.

The keys for me;
Players out of position (Francis forward, Stewart back)
Gifting games - Smith, Ham, i'm throwing Heppell in (captain or not)
IQ - Getting sucked into chasing one player with the ball and not minding the immediate space outside the contest
Skills - turnovers killed us last night. We're gonna battle through games with the top 4. We can't give them easy turnovers the way we do

 

[citizen-erased]

What do we make of Carlton supporters celebrating this though? They aren't exactly normal

eh. They're doing well. So you get your time in the sun.
premierships aren't won in March.