NoisyMinor
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- Oct 22, 2022
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- #126
Nah, heard it on the radio.
Autopsy Round 6, 2024: St Kilda v Western Bulldogs
- Thread starter Hubnester
- Start date
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Steven May goes all right as a 193cm Key Back.
We went way to hard on Pou being a star. Just did a quick check of his stats, it doesn't make for pretty reading.
Has never had a 20 possession game, only kicked more than 1 goal on 1 occasion, and that was his second game. Only taken 6 marks or more 3 times.
Reality is, he has not don't much. Doesn't get the ball enough. Not really a goal kicker.
Has never had a 20 possession game, only kicked more than 1 goal on 1 occasion, and that was his second game. Only taken 6 marks or more 3 times.
Reality is, he has not don't much. Doesn't get the ball enough. Not really a goal kicker.
Howard and Webster in defence. Wood, Crouch and Dow across the centreline. King and Henry up forward. Hunter as utility, kinda Paton.
It's not lost on me that the Dogs can drop players like Daniel, or Macrae early on and our cupboard is completely bare.
Having said that, you play with who you put out there and there was at least a dozen who showed very little heart or desire tonight.
Tonight was embarrassing to such an extent, most of the supporters who stayed til the end were all smiles and laughing - what else can you do?
It's not lost on me that the Dogs can drop players like Daniel, or Macrae early on and our cupboard is completely bare.
Having said that, you play with who you put out there and there was at least a dozen who showed very little heart or desire tonight.
Tonight was embarrassing to such an extent, most of the supporters who stayed til the end were all smiles and laughing - what else can you do?
Need a few more than that I reckon, we’ve been very hesitant to make changes but after an effort like that I’d like a few pushed out.
In
King, Howard, schoey, collard
Out
Butler, Jones, Bonner, Sharman
- Jun 30, 2014
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Well it's a good thing players dont play for their entire career like they do in their first 30 games.
You have some seriously shocking takes.
NoisyMinor
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Let me guess, he's going to magically turn into a phenom once he reaches 50 games?
Plugger35
Umpiring Expert
- Sep 27, 2008
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We have quite a young team at present but some of our younger players were our best players tonight while our older players let us down.
Phillipou was the only real let down out of our younger players, he seems to have gone backwards from last year and needs a spell at Sandy.
- Jun 30, 2014
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I dont remember saying that, just the same way I wouldn't have said Alex Rance will always be a terrible player even though he was one for his first 70+ games.
Thinking you can see a players entire scope within 30 matches is incredibly daft.
- Jun 17, 2018
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Thought Windy and Garcia were good. Wilson, Caminiti, Hill and Battle, kept going to varying levels of success.
Everything else was a s*it show...we are glacially slow, and our decision making and skills deplorable.
Everything else was a s*it show...we are glacially slow, and our decision making and skills deplorable.
A backline of Doogs, Cordy, Battle and Shoey??
I don't really think anything that can be done this week will fix our issues. Reality is we need some grunt players back in the side and up to speed.
Jweb, Dow, Crouch, Wood, Hunter*
We are soft as shite at the moment.
Confidence is low. Once you lose faith the rest goes pretty quickly.
- Jun 1, 2010
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Tom Hawkins, even Goddard looked average early days. People writing Pou off now are very brave.
Personally I don’t like the role he is playing, looks lost and lacks any real influence. Once we have some troops return I’d love to see him back at Sandy to rack up 30 touches for a few weeks and get some confidence.
- Aug 17, 2014
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I'm willing to give us one of these games - 5 day break, on the road for a month, bad umpiring, and we haven't been properly smacked in a while so you saw the players lose confidence and second guess themselves.
Our biggest problem remains - when we are on top we never capitalise properly and punish teams. We were never winning this game but we had a 10-15 minute dominant patch in the second which we completely wasted and it killed us. This has been an issue since the Richardson era.
Our biggest problem remains - when we are on top we never capitalise properly and punish teams. We were never winning this game but we had a 10-15 minute dominant patch in the second which we completely wasted and it killed us. This has been an issue since the Richardson era.
A kid who turned 19 a couple of months ago is suddenly our new scape goat? He's just a kid, not yet mature or grown into his body and because of injury he's being asked to do so much more than he should be. Yeah we build up expectations on kids far too quickly, but we are also guilty of cutting them down when they aren't dominating.
Edit: I wanted to include some DOBs for perspective...
Phillipou: 27/12/2004
Shoenmaker: 7/1/2005
Collard: 26/3/2005
Garcia: 22/5/2005
Wilson: 18/8/2005
Hastie: 19/9/2005
Edit: I wanted to include some DOBs for perspective...
Phillipou: 27/12/2004
Shoenmaker: 7/1/2005
Collard: 26/3/2005
Garcia: 22/5/2005
Wilson: 18/8/2005
Hastie: 19/9/2005
Last edited:
BigMonty
Club Legend
- Feb 20, 2014
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Just back from the game.
Worse we have played in 3 years. North on Good Friday was equal to this.
Bullies let's face it were Red Hot as their coach was pummelled on the media all week. 2 frees in the first qtr in front of goal and 3 marks that fell in their arms and 7 to 1 at qtr time its all over especially when we could not convert in the 2nd.
We looked like we had the flu. Slow fumbly disorganised etc. We will not be as bad again this season ...mark my words.
Owens is playing like he had to lift the whole team on his shoulders and he is playing like they are....no freedom. We looked better in the last with Caminiti Stocker and Hugo in the guts. Game was over by then though.
Realistically Cordy Bonner Butler and Jones are not best 23. Camaniti Burns and Ross are now fringe 23.
We were shown as the emporer with no clothes...is that the list or RTB only time will tell.
King Crouch Dow Clark will add a bit of spine and class which should allow Pou Owens et al a bit more freedom to move rather than be at the coalface. Hayes who knows where he is at talent wise but he will give a contest as will Dougie.
Found a player in Hugo and Wilson who played probably his best game. Pou better take a good hard look at himself he seems to be looking younger and more uncertain every week. Maybe try him off a back flank make him accountable....probably never done that in his career.
Anyway we seem at best a middle of the road side maybe scratching the 8. Need a statement next week otherwise season is overrrr
On SM-S916B using BigFooty.com mobile app
Worse we have played in 3 years. North on Good Friday was equal to this.
Bullies let's face it were Red Hot as their coach was pummelled on the media all week. 2 frees in the first qtr in front of goal and 3 marks that fell in their arms and 7 to 1 at qtr time its all over especially when we could not convert in the 2nd.
We looked like we had the flu. Slow fumbly disorganised etc. We will not be as bad again this season ...mark my words.
Owens is playing like he had to lift the whole team on his shoulders and he is playing like they are....no freedom. We looked better in the last with Caminiti Stocker and Hugo in the guts. Game was over by then though.
Realistically Cordy Bonner Butler and Jones are not best 23. Camaniti Burns and Ross are now fringe 23.
We were shown as the emporer with no clothes...is that the list or RTB only time will tell.
King Crouch Dow Clark will add a bit of spine and class which should allow Pou Owens et al a bit more freedom to move rather than be at the coalface. Hayes who knows where he is at talent wise but he will give a contest as will Dougie.
Found a player in Hugo and Wilson who played probably his best game. Pou better take a good hard look at himself he seems to be looking younger and more uncertain every week. Maybe try him off a back flank make him accountable....probably never done that in his career.
Anyway we seem at best a middle of the road side maybe scratching the 8. Need a statement next week otherwise season is overrrr
On SM-S916B using BigFooty.com mobile app
- Aug 17, 2014
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He's 19 years old and getting put into situations that the likes of Sheezel and Daicos were never put into. He played an entire season more or less as a key forward at 18 years old and was the youngest draftee in his year, bit early to be writing him off?
Nobody is saying he can't get better, the point is he has been massively overhyped based on his output to date.
Maybe he becomes a gun, but there is no evidence he will be anything special yet, however it has being assumed he will be a star.
akaifu
Club Legend
- Feb 4, 2023
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The players are clearly getting complacent - their spots are safe so they don't have to perform. We will lose against the Power so just bring in the likes of Arie and Hotton and drop everyone that didn't bother to show up tonight. Make a selection statement even if it means getting smashed again.
Ratts was and still is a garbage coach
If people blame RTB for Gameday performance then maybe we should try get last years premiership coach, you know the one RTB beat on Gameday?
At the end of it this is a young list with a few spuds and a few aging players with some skill and very little leadership. At this vantage point i remember us not trading Armitage to Richmond for pick 9 2013 which would’ve given us a crack at Paddy Cripps instead Armo plays 5 more uneventful seasons and retires. If someone offers us a good deal for any player we need to seriously consider it
At the end of it this is a young list with a few spuds and a few aging players with some skill and very little leadership. At this vantage point i remember us not trading Armitage to Richmond for pick 9 2013 which would’ve given us a crack at Paddy Cripps instead Armo plays 5 more uneventful seasons and retires. If someone offers us a good deal for any player we need to seriously consider it
Who is writing him off?
Just stating he is overhyped based on his output, doesn't mean he is a trash player or won't improve.
Does he deserve future star label based on his short career to date? If we are being honest the answer is no.
He might get there, but we have been assuming it is a given. He has not done nearly enough on the field to date to be confident he is a future elite player.
FFS, that doesn't mean I have written him off
- Oct 2, 2010
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From top to bottom, everything about tonight was a disaster. Everyone needs to take a long hard look at themselves after that - players coaches, fitness staff, admin. Everyone
- We went to way too short down back. Just mauled there all night. Howard should come back in next week. not that he would have been the difference tonight.
- Felt the impact of Webster's stupidity with Weightman's first quarter. Not sure if someone was moved onto him or if he did his usual post quarter time disappearing act, but that 4 minutes he impacted took any wind out of our sails.
- The forward line was a disaster. There is no system or structure to it. Defenders must be licking their lips when they see they get to play us. Caminiti cant compete with AFL quality defenders. Membrey nonexistent when it actually matters. Higgins has been solid this year but missed his first shot so was useless for the rest of the match. King was horrible last week but tonight was yet another illustration to why anyone who suggested we were better up forward without him was completely off their head. Again, he wouldn't have made the difference but he is the only good key target we have on the list.
- What are we doing with Sharman? He is good at one thing and thats his set shot goal kicking. I know we are thin in cattle but playing him all over the ground and in different position each quarter isn't help us as a team and isn't helping him as a player. If he's not playing fwd, there is no point having him in the team.
- What are we doing with Owens? Far from our worst tonight but we are wasting him as a player. We are getting slaughtered in the midfield and he isn't having much impact, yet we still refuse to put him in the midfield to just see what happens. Tonight was the perfect opportunity to put him in the middle for the 2nd half. Maybe he wouldn't have done anything, but I would have liked to see us at least try.
- Phillipou is struggling. I think we just need to simplify his role. At the moment, he doesn't know if he is a mid or a fwd so is just lost on that field. Let's face it, there is no one to bring in to replace him for another few weeks so suggesting he goes back to the VFL isn't realistic right now. We just need to give him a simple role - maybe as simple as following 1 player around for the whole game - to get his confidence up and some clarity back in his game. Long term, he will be fine. He's a baby with 2nd year blues.
- The interrupted preseason has killed Sinclair. We need to find a way to get his form back so we are cooked as a team. No preseason killed Butler. Jones is just cooked full spot.
- Why have our basic skills gone backwards so quickly? We've never been the most skilled team but we weren't making this volume of basic errors last year. It's alarming how many previously skilled players can't execute a basic kick anymore. It is also alarming how many lowly skilled players keep continuously taking on kicks even their mother knows is beyond their capability.
- The 2 first years can hold their head high. Windy showing signs, although he needs to clean up some kicks/decision making but that will come with time. Felt like Hill vs the world in the first half, cant question his performance.
I'm sure there is someone I'm missing who deserves the boots stuck into them too. As much as we need a response next week, we also need to be realistic that the response isn't coming on a ground we struggle to win at and against a top team who we rarely beat even when they suck.
- We went to way too short down back. Just mauled there all night. Howard should come back in next week. not that he would have been the difference tonight.
- Felt the impact of Webster's stupidity with Weightman's first quarter. Not sure if someone was moved onto him or if he did his usual post quarter time disappearing act, but that 4 minutes he impacted took any wind out of our sails.
- The forward line was a disaster. There is no system or structure to it. Defenders must be licking their lips when they see they get to play us. Caminiti cant compete with AFL quality defenders. Membrey nonexistent when it actually matters. Higgins has been solid this year but missed his first shot so was useless for the rest of the match. King was horrible last week but tonight was yet another illustration to why anyone who suggested we were better up forward without him was completely off their head. Again, he wouldn't have made the difference but he is the only good key target we have on the list.
- What are we doing with Sharman? He is good at one thing and thats his set shot goal kicking. I know we are thin in cattle but playing him all over the ground and in different position each quarter isn't help us as a team and isn't helping him as a player. If he's not playing fwd, there is no point having him in the team.
- What are we doing with Owens? Far from our worst tonight but we are wasting him as a player. We are getting slaughtered in the midfield and he isn't having much impact, yet we still refuse to put him in the midfield to just see what happens. Tonight was the perfect opportunity to put him in the middle for the 2nd half. Maybe he wouldn't have done anything, but I would have liked to see us at least try.
- Phillipou is struggling. I think we just need to simplify his role. At the moment, he doesn't know if he is a mid or a fwd so is just lost on that field. Let's face it, there is no one to bring in to replace him for another few weeks so suggesting he goes back to the VFL isn't realistic right now. We just need to give him a simple role - maybe as simple as following 1 player around for the whole game - to get his confidence up and some clarity back in his game. Long term, he will be fine. He's a baby with 2nd year blues.
- The interrupted preseason has killed Sinclair. We need to find a way to get his form back so we are cooked as a team. No preseason killed Butler. Jones is just cooked full spot.
- Why have our basic skills gone backwards so quickly? We've never been the most skilled team but we weren't making this volume of basic errors last year. It's alarming how many previously skilled players can't execute a basic kick anymore. It is also alarming how many lowly skilled players keep continuously taking on kicks even their mother knows is beyond their capability.
- The 2 first years can hold their head high. Windy showing signs, although he needs to clean up some kicks/decision making but that will come with time. Felt like Hill vs the world in the first half, cant question his performance.
I'm sure there is someone I'm missing who deserves the boots stuck into them too. As much as we need a response next week, we also need to be realistic that the response isn't coming on a ground we struggle to win at and against a top team who we rarely beat even when they suck.
I made a point of watching a few individuals workrate in the last quarter. One thing that stood out to me was Butlers laziness. For a sub, he refused to follow his opponent on multiple occasions. There was a moment in the forward pocket when he just stopped next to Caminiti who was on the mark and allowed his opponent (who was running next to him) to run to space and present for an uncontested mark. His defensive efforts today were nothing short of disgraceful. Jogging around aimlessly, guarding space in the middle doing no hard running.
He never had the runs on the board to get back in the side and had done nothing since. All the experience in the world doesn't excuse his lack of effort today. His injury should be considered a blessing considering he now can't take the spot of a kid who will at least give it a decent crack.
He never had the runs on the board to get back in the side and had done nothing since. All the experience in the world doesn't excuse his lack of effort today. His injury should be considered a blessing considering he now can't take the spot of a kid who will at least give it a decent crack.
