Current Trial Russell Hill & Carol Clay Pt 2 *Pilot Greg Lynn Guilty for the Murder of Carol Clay

[Kurve]

Here is PART 1 Russell Hill & Carol Clay - Wonnangatta *Pilot Greg Lynn Pleads Not Guilty to Murder

The Greg Lynn Police Interview Tapes

DPP v Lynn [2024] VSCA 62 (12 April 2024) INTERLOCUTORY APPEAL​

R v Lynn (Rulings 1-4) [2024] VSC 373 (28 June 2024)​

R v Lynn (Rulings 5 & 6) [2024] VSC 375 (28 February 2024)

R v Lynn (Ruling 7) [2024] VSC 376 (8 May 2024)

 

[Pamcake1]

Mobile phone pings, a burnt-out campsite and the 'Button Man': Inside the missing campers investigation

A camping trip brought Carol Clay and Russell Hill to a remote pocket of Victoria — but the pair would never emerge from the Wonnangatta Valley.

www.abc.net.au

 

[sydney_gws]

Why would he have his phone? RH is dead at this point. What, found it on the side of the road and took it?

I don't know what he should have said, I am just saying not enough evidence to convict.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

I dare say he thought he could out think the police. Would match his personality type.

I think him speaking probably helped his chances. I don't think the jury would have had any trouble finding him guilty of murder if he'd chosen to stonewall, with Hill's phone and forensic evidence of Clay being at the scene. They had surveillance of him behaving like a very guilty person and a witness that he'd been at the scene of the deaths a day or so before. I feel like people get convicted for much less.

From what I gather, once he made the decision to speak, while his story seems like a load of BS to me, he wasn't actually caught out in any 'checkmate' lies by the police who were interviewing him, which is probably why the advice to say nothing is sound for the garden variety brain-dead crim. I can't imagine it's as easy for someone who isn't a career criminal to remain mute for three days, when everyone's natural inclination is to explain why it couldn't have been them and take the suspicion away from themselves as quickly as possible.

I think he'd have looked guilty as sin if he'd remained silent in the interview and the trial and I don't think the jury would have deliberated for as long they did without his alternative scenario. Would Dann have still run with the same defence, or would he have been reduced to simply trying to pick holes in the prosecution's case, without providing any alternative scenario? I don't think either would have come as close to winning the case as I think they came to with the path they took.

 

[Percel]

As appalling as this is, I don't see why Lynn confessed to accidentally killing them and then disposing of their bodies. The evidence was pretty flimsy otherwise.
The phone didn't need to be explained in my view, that wasn't enough evidence to convict him.

Strands

 

[GrayRanga]

I don't know what he should have said, I am just saying not enough evidence to convict.

?????

Lynn has been convicted of one count of murder; ergo there was enough evidence.


He has been judged guilty of the crimes of which he was charged by a jury of his peers after deliberating on the evidence put to them in an open Court

He can appeal.

You weren't on the jury, so your stated opinion doesn't count

 

[Around the Wicket]

Not quite. One way to think about it might be the jury found:

1. There’s insufficient evidence to convict GL of the murder of RH;
2. There’s sufficient evidence to convict GL of the murder of CC.

Had GL not destroyed evidence there may have been grounds to convict GL of the murder RH. But he did and they could not.

That’s about it.

Remarkable how law works one case they can be found guilty on the balance of probabilities with close to no evidence and another the guy can burn the bodies doing everything he can do cover it up and get found not guilty.

 

[GardenGnome]

Here

https://www.news.com.au/national/crime/the-17-lowlights-in-doublemurder-case-against-former-pilot-greg-lynn-according-to-his-lawyers/news-story/c61e3fe43a581b2d662484bb322c2a82?amp

Dann’s theatrics?

 

[Zidane98]

Why would he have his phone? RH is dead at this point. What, found it on the side of the road and took it?

How would they prove GL had it without admitting it?

 

[GladdyDee]

After reading the court transcript my inner Columbo is bothered by why GL took the car keys?

Was gonna take their car somewhere? Doubt it
Had grabbed them off one or the other, could be me thinks

 

[theouthouse]

Remarkable how law works one case they can be found guilty on the balance of probabilities with close to no evidence and another the guy can burn the bodies doing everything he can do cover it up and get found not guilty.

What really muddies up any guilty verdict for Hill is the involvement of Clays death being included with the actions post death.

I would be willing to argue that if Clay was taken out of the situation completely, and everything else happened as it did, a jury would have found him guilty of Hill's murder.

 

[Analysis Reactor]

I don't know what he should have said, I am just saying not enough evidence to convict.

Have you gone through all the evidence?

 

[Lady O]

What really muddies up any guilty verdict for Hill is the involvement of Clays death being included with the actions post death.

I would be willing to argue that if Clay was taken out of the situation completely, and everything else happened as it did, a jury would have found him guilty of Hill's murder.

Yes, it is interesting how the plaintiff and victims are perceived both in the media and in person (or in this case, by representations on their behalf), will influence a jury's decision.

Lynn had an unblemished record (as far as convictions anyway), in a vocation that has a high level of trust in the community.

Hill on the other hand was painted as a grumpy, know-all, who wasn't above telling people off and was subject to depression, was a married man in a long term relationship with his former girlfriend.

Clay was a well respected member of the CWA, but interesting to note as soon as her status as a scarlet woman was revealed the CWA was quick to remove her from their role of honour.

Had it been Hill who was the pilot and Clay his long term wife and Lynn who was the blue collar worker, I suspect the result would have been different.

 

[Terrafirma]

Here's what will happen if Greg Lynn appeals his conviction over the murder of camper Carol Clay

Even for legal minds, Greg Lynn's murder trial over the deaths of two Victorian campers was filled with "unusual" twists and turns. Here's what could come next in the long-running court case.

www.abc.net.au

Yes the experts say and appeal is likely.! Off we go again. LOL

 

[Royces Hart]

Yes the experts say and appeal is likely.! Off we go again. LOL

Not even Greg Lynn could kill this thread.

 

[Terrafirma]

Remarkable how law works one case they can be found guilty on the balance of probabilities with close to no evidence and another the guy can burn the bodies doing everything he can do cover it up and get found not guilty.

Agreed but in this instance the jury believed there was an altercation between Lynn & Hill where Hill dies. There is no evidence of how Hill dies. Lynn then realizes that there is a witness in Clay and shoots her dead. A shotgun slug with her DNA matter is found at the camp. So the jury believes Lynn had intent to kill as the motive was to eliminate the only witness. The difference here is subtle in that the jury believes Hill participated in the altercation. The story Lynn presented to the jury re Clay's death was deemed a lie and I think we all agreed. But as to the burning of the bodies what happened was Judge Croucher knew that if Lynn was found guilty of murder and his actions afterwards were used to find him guilty there would be an appeal and he would win that because his actions afterwards do not prove guilt in the essence of criminal law. So there are lot's of things going on here with the trial and yes it is very very unique. Before the trial the judge said there wasn't enough evidence to prove murder so he offered Man Slaughter however the Prosecution said NO it wasn't MS it was murder. The Pros appealed the Judge's decision and the Judge was found to be wrong and so the trial for murder went ahead. If an appeal is likely the defense must now zoom in on aspects of the trial that weren't in accordance with the law and we know the Pros made some mistakes.

 

[Terrafirma]

Not even Greg Lynn could kill this thread.

Hilarious.! Didn't think of that but you nailed it.

 

[FrankGrimes]

Rubbish

Herald-Sun just he is likely to be... what makes you think he wont?

 

[TapRuck]

It was fascinating watching the ROI. His lack of emotion/humanity didn't help his case. It was very matter-of-fact, maybe too much so. The way he described his decision-making process was extremely cold, almost robotic. Going against his solicitor's instructions was an outrageous move. From the ROI alone we are either looking at the world's unluckiest/awkward communicator or a cold-blooded killer.

The law gives people like GL every chance to wriggle and squirm their way back out into public life. More often than not, it does it's job and puts them behind bars.

There are many lessons to take from this sad and sorry case. In this day and age, we are taught to stand up for ourselves and speak our truth. Sometimes the best option is to say nothing and walk away. We don't need to "win" every argument in life. There is nothing wrong with learning and moving on. Almost always, these moments become great stories and things we laugh about.

If GL could go back, I wonder if he would have done things differently. Maybe he could've joked about the drone and had a beer or two with RH and CC. Or maybe he would've spent more time cleaning the scene and taken better care regarding the extra phone.

Thanks to all for your legal and psychological insights over the journey so far. I've thoroughly enjoyed this thread. Every opinion counts!

 

[Terrafirma]

If GL could go back, I wonder if he would have done things differently. Maybe he could've joked about the drone and had a beer or two with RH and CC. Or maybe he would've spent more time cleaning the scene and taken better care regarding the extra phone.

Thanks to all for your legal and psychological insights over the journey so far. I've thoroughly enjoyed this thread. Every opinion counts!

I think what got Lynn to this point was mostly his personality and his past. His past suggests he doesn't tolerate any noise or lack of control. He has a warped mind that controls his actions. Perhaps it was something in his upbringing. Covid played a small part as In understand he took up bee keeping during Covid and was stung which affected his heart. He then failed Pilot med examinations. If you believe in Karma and what is suggested about his past, his treatment of his 1st wife, pets and animals etc then he deserved time in jail for his actions but it took this for it to come to fruition. You can't undo time and the deaths of Clay and Hill were not warranted and I believe if we were camped next to Clay & Hill they'd still be alive today.

 

[Lady O]

Agreed but in this instance the jury believed there was an altercation between Lynn & Hill where Hill dies. There is no evidence of how Hill dies. Lynn then realizes that there is a witness in Clay and shoots her dead. A shotgun slug with her DNA matter is found at the camp. So the jury believes Lynn had intent to kill as the motive was to eliminate the only witness. The difference here is subtle in that the jury believes Hill participated in the altercation. The story Lynn presented to the jury re Clay's death was deemed a lie and I think we all agreed. But as to the burning of the bodies what happened was Judge Croucher knew that if Lynn was found guilty of murder and his actions afterwards were used to find him guilty there would be an appeal and he would win that because his actions afterwards do not prove guilt in the essence of criminal law. So there are lot's of things going on here with the trial and yes it is very very unique. Before the trial the judge said there wasn't enough evidence to prove murder so he offered Man Slaughter however the Prosecution said NO it wasn't MS it was murder. The Pros appealed the Judge's decision and the Judge was found to be wrong and so the trial for murder went ahead. If an appeal is likely the defense must now zoom in on aspects of the trial that weren't in accordance with the law and we know the Pros made some mistakes.

The more we find out, the less likely it seems that Lynn's story is more than slightly accurate.

Their first encounter was "cordial" apparently. Lynn said he told them when they asked about camping in the same area, "it's a free country", meaning he wasn't bothered that they were camping close.

Their second encounter was apparently when Lynn approached Hill at his camp and demanded to know what the drone was about. For all we know, Hill may not have even been targeting Lynn. Lynn's paranoia may have kicked in if he had been doing something that he didn't want to come to light. Lynn makes it about Hill saying he was going to report him for hunting near the camp (which of course Lynn denies). The story about him losing his CASA card seems fabricated to support his subsequent behaviour.

Their third encounter, was due to Lynn turning up the "most annoying music" he could find. You have to wonder if this was in order to trap Hill into making some move to either turn the music down or, more likely to ask Lynn to do it, thereby 'causing' an argument and giving Lynn an excuse to elevate this to violence.

Thereafter Lynn felt justified to go fully "Wolf Creek" and attack both Hill and Clay, murder them, destroy their camp and all the evidence, then take the bodies to an isolated area to do goodness knows what.

I don't believe Hill went anywhere near the firearms, as his 'barefoot and in his pyjamas', supported his 'messing around in the tent', but was unlikely with a phone in his pocket . It was simply to place Lynn in Hill's camp where the murders occurred.

In fact, what it appears to me is that Lynn instigated the chain of events that led to him being able to excuse himself for what happened. Reminded me of the pet pig incident.

 

[Kurve]

There was. The turn around at the Abbeyard gate. Forgetting to disable RH's phone was a pretty big one in his possession. There was no need to leave immediately st all, this is what got him in the end.

I don't view those two elements as panic. By the time Hill's phone pinged at Hotham, I could put that down to an error made for lack of sleep.

 

[BFew]

From what I saw of the Lynn Police interviews yesterday, I'd saying he was telling a complete pack of fabricated lies.

Had Carol Clay not been involved in this case at all, I think there's a good chance that Lynn would have been found guilty of murdering Russell Hill by at least 50% of juries. Guilty of murder by a jury, that didn't have a second option (Carol Clay's murder) to send him to prison for a very long time (hopefully).

 

[Kurve]

Does anybody recall reading or hearing word of the police labelling Lynn a "functioning psychopath"?

It probably fits imo but I haven't read it anywhere.

 

[BFew]

Does anybody recall reading or hearing word of the police labelling Lynn a "functioning psychopath"?

It probably fits imo but I haven't read it anywhere.

3 days ago as per the below. Sir_Loin Pamcake1

A lockdown project and a fallen tree: Gregory Lynn’s sliding doors moments

If Gregory Lynn had not kept bees or if a road that crossed the Wonnangatta River was not blocked on the fateful evening, a cool-headed pilot might have got away with murder.

www.theage.com.au

'John Silvester and Erin Pearson
JUNE 26, 2024'

'Police describe Lynn as a functioning psychopath, controlling, a person who could be overwhelmed by waves of rage.'

 

[Kurve]

The police described him as a “functional psychopath”. I think it’s more any threat to GL than anything else, not a random thing.

Cheeky bugger. Damn you made some claims. Where was the “functional psychopath” claim made?

'John Silvester and Erin Pearson
JUNE 26, 2024'

'Police describe Lynn as a functioning psychopath, controlling, a person who could be overwhelmed by waves of rage.'

Sir_Loin