Coach Sam Mitchell's direction for the club and 2024 news

[Strapping Young Lad]

If anyone wants to have a listen about what the data is saying in regards to whether we have actually gotten worse this year have a listen to this from the 9:15 mark.

I know a few people have already touched on it, but the data is also showing that our results this year have been slightly better despite actually putting out a younger team and dealing with some injuries.




And here.

 

[Blackhawk42]

Not to be a total buzzkill but I do think a lot of this streak has been a prolonged dead cat bounce once we were in a hopeless position. Part of the fun was us being the perceived bad team, knocking off perceived better teams. But it just kept going and going, and us not moving up the ladder for most of it only made it even more enjoyable.

Something funky has happened with the last two seasons where teams have come back from dead positions and teams with wins in the bank have gone off the edge of a cliff. This league was predictable for quite a while with "top 8 set after 6 rounds" sort of narrative having gone on the backburner now that we see wild swings in win-loss.

Changing from 22 to 23 H&A games can't have had THAT dramatic an effect so maybe it's a cumulative effect with less preseason and competitive games starting closer to summer than ever before. I feel like this Hawthorn run is part of a phenomenon we need more data to assess rather than something we specifically as a club are doing.

The list is still a fair way off. Have we had a single 'good' loss this season? I feel like there hasn't been a single game this season which was a loss to take something away from, they were all just largely bad and uncompetitive showings, and the once-in-a-decade Port disaster in its own category.

We are on the right track but I also think with the wrong fixture we're 0-4 or 1-5 next year and right back where we were this season.

I left Adelaide Oval in Gather Round really proud of the boys effort and was genuinely surprised that Collingwood supporters were acting so arrogantly on the way out of the stadium.
They got out of jail.

That belief to keep on working hard, trusting the result will come was evident that day.

Now we're seeing the fruits of the labour.

 

[wahawk]

Aren’t those cats meant to be dead ?

 

[HawthornHawk]

The list is still a fair way off. Have we had a single 'good' loss this season? I feel like there hasn't been a single game this season which was a loss to take something away from, they were all just largely bad and uncompetitive showings, and the once-in-a-decade Port disaster in its own category.

I really can't see how anyone can think the list is a fair way off. I reckon if we're a couple of pieces from being right in contention.

What do you think we need?

 

[Hawkers Hero]

I really can't see how anyone can think the list is a fair way off. I reckon if we're a couple of pieces from being right in contention.

What do you think we need?

Agreed.

If you were being picky you would want Weitering and Ugle-Hagan in the side along with another top line mid.

Basically, we need a time machine to get a few pre-seasons into Dear, Frenchie, Ward and McCabe all at once.

 

[BIGHAWK23]

Not to be a total buzzkill but I do think a lot of this streak has been a prolonged dead cat bounce once we were in a hopeless position. Part of the fun was us being the perceived bad team, knocking off perceived better teams. But it just kept going and going, and us not moving up the ladder for most of it only made it even more enjoyable.

Something funky has happened with the last two seasons where teams have come back from dead positions and teams with wins in the bank have gone off the edge of a cliff. This league was predictable for quite a while with "top 8 set after 6 rounds" sort of narrative having gone on the backburner now that we see wild swings in win-loss.

Changing from 22 to 23 H&A games can't have had THAT dramatic an effect so maybe it's a cumulative effect with less preseason and competitive games starting closer to summer than ever before. I feel like this Hawthorn run is part of a phenomenon we need more data to assess rather than something we specifically as a club are doing.

The list is still a fair way off. Have we had a single 'good' loss this season? I feel like there hasn't been a single game this season which was a loss to take something away from, they were all just largely bad and uncompetitive showings, and the once-in-a-decade Port disaster in its own category.

We are on the right track but I also think with the wrong fixture we're 0-4 or 1-5 next year and right back where we were this season.

Take a long walk

 

[peetoo]

Agreed.

If you were being picky you would want Weitering and Ugle-Hagan in the side along with another top line mid.

Basically, we need a time machine to get a few pre-seasons into Dear, Frenchie, Ward and McCabe all at once.

Didnt worry the 2008 team too much. Compare the demographics. Very even season

 

[Jammer]

Hi Hawker fans,

I'm a fan of Hawthorn ... mostly thru a Norwood and the Puopolo connection....

Just wondering if any of you that also follow the round ball can see
a dose of the Ange Postecoglou influence in Mitchell's style??

The core group of relentless running burying most teams in the 2nd half of games.
The adaptability of so many players to numerous positions.
The attacking ethos.
Finding forgotten, under rated players and having them shine.
His honesty, relatability and ability to articulate in the media.
Probably biggest one is how he relates to his players and allows them the freedom
to express themselves.... ( this was the supposed knock on Sam Mitchell )

Of course he is a talented coach in his own right
I do however get the feeling those visits to Ange's teams over the last few years
have had a fair impact... Would make a great article if he ever opened
up about what he has taken from those trips.

 

[KermitJagger]

Hi Hawker fans,

I'm a fan of Hawthorn ... mostly thru a Norwood and the Puopolo connection....

Just wondering if any of you that also follow the round ball can see
a dose of the Ange Postecoglou influence in Mitchell's style??

The core group of relentless running burying most teams in the 2nd half of games.
The adaptability of so many players to numerous positions.
The attacking ethos.
Finding forgotten, under rated players and having them shine.
His honesty, relatability and ability to articulate in the media.
Probably biggest one is how he relates to his players and allows them the freedom
to express themselves.... ( this was the supposed knock on Sam Mitchell )

Of course he is a talented coach in his own right
I do however get the feeling those visits to Ange's teams over the last few years
have had a fair impact... Would make a great article if he ever opened
up about what he has taken from those trips.

I think there's definitely impact in coaching style, the same way as you could see the impacts of time spent with the San Antonio Spurs and Gregg Popovich in the way Clarko used to do things.

In 2012 we averaged over twice as many Score Involvements more than our opponent than any other team in the league, despite only averaging a shade more goal assists than the next best. Pop's coaching philosophy was that the ball should be moving, always. Get the ball, make a decision in half a second, typically a pass, move the defence, get it to someone in a high % spot and shoot.

I have no doubt Sam is getting similar inspiration.

 

[mustang]

Would be interesting how we would go if Lewis was available, with regards to team balance it’s works so well with Chol and Dear and all the little blokes around them, if Lewis was playing we would lose a small and some run, it’s working well because we have the right mix.

 

[KermitJagger]

Would be interesting how we would go if Lewis was available, with regards to team balance it’s works so well with Chol and Dear and all the little blokes around them, if Lewis was playing we would lose a small and some run, it’s working well because we have the right mix.

I think we'd be better if Lewis were in and fit. Lewis would roam up the ground, when at his best Lewis' work rate is a massive strength.

We could still run a small forward line, with both Dear and Chol are already above average pressure and ground ball players for their height.

 

[humid hawk]

Would be interesting how we would go if Lewis was available, with regards to team balance it’s works so well with Chol and Dear and all the little blokes around them, if Lewis was playing we would lose a small and some run, it’s working well because we have the right mix.

You'd potentially see a Lewis - Breust swap. You'd lose very little run with that.

 

[The Chad and I]

I think we'd be better if Lewis were in and fit. Lewis would roam up the ground, when at his best Lewis' work rate is a massive strength.

We could still run a small forward line, with both Dear and Chol are already above average pressure and ground ball players for their height.

I agree with this, but most of Lewis' running is off the contest.
We'd lose a bit of heat from the contest and spread, but gain some forward presence, perhaps even more crumbing opportunities for our smalls.

 

[Dipper]

Would be interesting how we would go if Lewis was available, with regards to team balance it’s works so well with Chol and Dear and all the little blokes around them, if Lewis was playing we would lose a small and some run, it’s working well because we have the right mix.

That Adelaide game really made me think that if we add another tall forward to the mix that it's vital that they're quick and agile and I thought that possibly Lewis will never be the man.

The mosquito fleet along with Dear and Chol both being high pressure players works supremely well.

If we get Battle in, then I hope Weddle gets played more forward, and I think he can play in the forward line (there was a game during our 0-5 start where they put him forward and he came tearing out on the lead, it was super exciting) but also if the forward line doesn't need him then he can cause mayhem between the arcs. I think that should be the play, we don't lose any speed but we also open up more flexibility.

 

[marklar]

I think we'd be better if Lewis were in and fit.

Much better to have Hardwick, Sic, Weddle, Newc, CJ rotating through the forward line to give us a different look throughout the game. Lewis doesn't bring as much flexibility to our structure right now and, unfortunately for him, Dear has a higher ceiling and is demanding game time.

 

[Brant]

I really can't see how anyone can think the list is a fair way off. I reckon if we're a couple of pieces from being right in contention.

What do you think we need?

Need
A KPF capable of kicking 6 (Dear could grow into this player)
A KDP that can kill the high/long ball to the top of the Goal Square (Barrass for the next 3+yrs)

Want
A burst mid that receives the handball from the clearance winner (Duke / Worpel / Nash or Day), who runs 15m & hits a 30m target by foot. Like Robert Harvey, but fast AF. Or like Judd, without the 6+ uncharacteristic turnovers a game.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Not to be a total buzzkill but I do think a lot of this streak has been a prolonged dead cat bounce once we were in a hopeless position. Part of the fun was us being the perceived bad team, knocking off perceived better teams. But it just kept going and going, and us not moving up the ladder for most of it only made it even more enjoyable.

Something funky has happened with the last two seasons where teams have come back from dead positions and teams with wins in the bank have gone off the edge of a cliff. This league was predictable for quite a while with "top 8 set after 6 rounds" sort of narrative having gone on the backburner now that we see wild swings in win-loss.

Changing from 22 to 23 H&A games can't have had THAT dramatic an effect so maybe it's a cumulative effect with less preseason and competitive games starting closer to summer than ever before. I feel like this Hawthorn run is part of a phenomenon we need more data to assess rather than something we specifically as a club are doing.

The list is still a fair way off. Have we had a single 'good' loss this season? I feel like there hasn't been a single game this season which was a loss to take something away from, they were all just largely bad and uncompetitive showings, and the once-in-a-decade Port disaster in its own category.

We are on the right track but I also think with the wrong fixture we're 0-4 or 1-5 next year and right back where we were this season.

This cat must have landed on a trampoline and had a rocket strapped to its back, with how high it has bounced.

 

[The Chad and I]

We have lost 8 games this season.
3 of them have been quite close.
2 of those under 7 points.

We've had 4 bad losses: Melbourne, Suns, Sydney, Geelong.
And have beaten 4 of the current top 8.

Collingwood

Hawthorn

77 - 72

.

Port Adelaide

Hawthorn

80 - 79

You could even argue Essendon loss should have been a win:

Essendon

Hawthorn

107 - 83

The list is still a fair way off. Have we had a single 'good' loss this season? I feel like there hasn't been a single game this season which was a loss to take something away from, they were all just largely bad and uncompetitive showings, and the once-in-a-decade Port disaster in its own category.

We are on the right track but I also think with the wrong fixture we're 0-4 or 1-5 next year and right back where we were this season.

 

[crazywildhorse]

Hi Hawker fans,

I'm a fan of Hawthorn ... mostly thru a Norwood and the Puopolo connection....

Just wondering if any of you that also follow the round ball can see
a dose of the Ange Postecoglou influence in Mitchell's style??

The core group of relentless running burying most teams in the 2nd half of games.
The adaptability of so many players to numerous positions.
The attacking ethos.
Finding forgotten, under rated players and having them shine.
His honesty, relatability and ability to articulate in the media.
Probably biggest one is how he relates to his players and allows them the freedom
to express themselves.... ( this was the supposed knock on Sam Mitchell )

Of course he is a talented coach in his own right
I do however get the feeling those visits to Ange's teams over the last few years
have had a fair impact... Would make a great article if he ever opened
up about what he has taken from those trips.

I don’t know for sure, but Mitchell loves Ange Postecoglou, so probably. He went to visit at one point in the preseason. Interesting that you noticed that.

 

[Crankyhawk]

We have lost 8 games this season.
4 of them have been quite close.
3 of those under 7 points.

We've had 4 bad losses: Melbourne, Suns, Sydney, Geelong.
And have beaten 4 of the current top 8.

Collingwood

Hawthorn

77 - 72

.

Western Bulldogs

Hawthorn

91 - 98

Port Adelaide

Hawthorn

80 - 79

You could even argue Essendon loss should have been a win:

Essendon

Hawthorn

107 - 83

We did beat the dogs not lose, who is the third narrow loss?

 

[The Chad and I]

We did beat the dogs not lose, who is the third narrow loss?

Yeah, my mistake.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

and key midfielder?

Does Will Day play chess?

 

[Kanga Commando]

Hi Hawker fans,

I'm a fan of Hawthorn ... mostly thru a Norwood and the Puopolo connection....

Just wondering if any of you that also follow the round ball can see
a dose of the Ange Postecoglou influence in Mitchell's style??

The core group of relentless running burying most teams in the 2nd half of games.
The adaptability of so many players to numerous positions.
The attacking ethos.
Finding forgotten, under rated players and having them shine.
His honesty, relatability and ability to articulate in the media.
Probably biggest one is how he relates to his players and allows them the freedom
to express themselves.... ( this was the supposed knock on Sam Mitchell )

Of course he is a talented coach in his own right
I do however get the feeling those visits to Ange's teams over the last few years
have had a fair impact... Would make a great article if he ever opened
up about what he has taken from those trips.

A recent interview Sam did he mentioned Ange and how he learnt a few things from him. Might have been talking footy on Monday night.

 

[TP86]

I know the dead cat bounce suggestion wasn’t popular but given the fixture early in the season is starting to become a lot more regimented I am already worried about 0-3 next season. Should we go out of our way to request West Coast in Tassie as our first home game just to ensure there’s a soft kill somewhere in the first 5 weeks.

We are certs to play Essendon and Geelong in the first month and now that we’re a drawcard we’ll probably get Sydney away and a good Victorian team for gather round, or maybe even Port rather than say, Richmond or St Kilda.

I don’t think anyone with a straight face can tell me this team is good enough to beat Geelong or early-season-jumped-up-Essendon in 2025.

 

[moginie]

I know the dead cat bounce suggestion wasn’t popular but given the fixture early in the season is starting to become a lot more regimented I am already worried about 0-3 next season. Should we go out of our way to request West Coast in Tassie as our first home game just to ensure there’s a soft kill somewhere in the first 5 weeks.

We are certs to play Essendon and Geelong in the first month and now that we’re a drawcard we’ll probably get Sydney away and a good Victorian team for gather round, or maybe even Port rather than say, Richmond or St Kilda.

I don’t think anyone with a straight face can tell me this team is good enough to beat Geelong or early-season-jumped-up-Essendon in 2025.

If it's all the same to you, I'd rather worry about things that are about to happen, like the possibility of making finals than project imaginary fears that won't be announced until November.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

I know the dead cat bounce suggestion wasn’t popular but given the fixture early in the season is starting to become a lot more regimented I am already worried about 0-3 next season. Should we go out of our way to request West Coast in Tassie as our first home game just to ensure there’s a soft kill somewhere in the first 5 weeks.

We are certs to play Essendon and Geelong in the first month and now that we’re a drawcard we’ll probably get Sydney away and a good Victorian team for gather round, or maybe even Port rather than say, Richmond or St Kilda.

I don’t think anyone with a straight face can tell me this team is good enough to beat Geelong or early-season-jumped-up-Essendon in 2025.

I genuinely love that the 2025 fixture fretting/whining has started in July 2024. Never change, Hawks Bigfooty, never change.