Should I have the right to a club membership refund?

[dean33]

I’m an Afl Richmond club support member. I was stood down from my job last week with 2 young boys. My wife still works part time and we are ok financially however if I could ask for a refund from the afl and not Richmond I would. However I would think that can’t be done and I would not want to pull any money away from the club I love so I won’t be asking for any refund.

 

[The_Wookie]

I’m an Afl Richmond club support member. I was stood down from my job last week with 2 young boys. My wife still works part time and we are ok financially however if I could ask for a refund from the afl and not Richmond I would. However I would think that can’t be done and I would not want to pull any money away from the club I love so I won’t be asking for any refund.

Ask for refund. buy richmond membership you can afford?

 

[JezzasOnTheAsphalt]

All these blokes have lived lives of luxury, they earn squillions whilst the average punter who just lost his gig and is struggling to feed his family, pay rent, etc is being asked to "dig deep" and basically donate money to a football club being masqueraded around as a charity (which is basically just the AFL anyway). "big players" in the industry are acting like spoilt little brats preying on peoples emotions to extract $ (on par with your World Vision, Unicef type MO's). Lets get real for a moment, there is people dying all over the globe from some superbug and these blokes are worried about footy clubs? With attitudes like that, f*** em' let the league die. They have had it far too good for far too long.

I love the game, the game will survive, but good riddance to the AFL.

Sure people can try to get themselves a refund if they want it for any reason that they see fit. But I don't really see this kind of stance as beneficial to people and the economy in the long run. To aid recovery we need to be saving as many businesses and jobs as possible, rather than observing that because some people are extra crushed, other people and businesses should also be crushed more badly and left to die by this thing as well.
The preying on emotions I can agree with, and no one should ever have to feel ashamed to seek financial help through asking for refunds or other means. At the same time, businesses can advertise themselves as they please and if the consumer doesn't like it they are also free to choose not to put money into it going forward.

 

[Capriati]

Sure people can try to get themselves a refund if they want it for any reason that they see fit. But I don't really see this kind of stance as beneficial to people and the economy in the long run. To aid recovery we need to be saving as many businesses and jobs as possible, rather than observing that because some people are extra crushed, other people and businesses should also be crushed more badly and left to die by this thing as well.
The preying on emotions I can agree with, and no one should ever have to feel ashamed to seek financial help through asking for refunds or other means. At the same time, businesses can advertise themselves as they please and if the consumer doesn't like it they are also free to choose not to put money into it going forward.

There are T&C attached to memberships. If you buy something at a store, you aren't entitled to a refund for changing your mind, however some stores allow change of mind refunds and others do not.

Given that the clubs are requesting proof of financial hardship in order to refund members it sounds as though they have received legal advice that they are not obligated to refund members even if we have a season of no crowds.

 

[dont bowl there]

There are T&C attached to memberships. If you buy something at a store, you aren't entitled to a refund for changing your mind, however some stores allow change of mind refunds and others do not.

Given that the clubs are requesting proof of financial hardship in order to refund members it sounds as though they have received legal advice that they are not obligated to refund members even if we have a season of no crowds.

Which clubs are requesting proof of financial hardship and what’s the required proof?

 

[JezzasOnTheAsphalt]

There are T&C attached to memberships. If you buy something at a store, you aren't entitled to a refund for changing your mind, however some stores allow change of mind refunds and others do not.

Given that the clubs are requesting proof of financial hardship in order to refund members it sounds as though they have received legal advice that they are not obligated to refund members even if we have a season of no crowds.

Would be disappointing for the fans if that’s how it played out clearly. But we’re also just speculating given there’s no clarity yet regarding how the season will be structured.

 

[Capriati]

Which clubs are requesting proof of financial hardship and what’s the required proof?

I read that somewhere in the last couple of days, will try and see if I can find where I saw it.

 

[Timewillcome]

One of the class action firms are going to take this up if the AFL want to play the no refunds game. Clubs seem to be following the AFL on this issue. Its a grey area that one of those firms would love to challenge.

 

[The_Wookie]

One of the class action firms are going to take this up if the AFL want to play the no refunds game. Clubs seem to be following the AFL on this issue. Its a grey area that one of those firms would love to challenge.

Maybe. But the overwhelming majority of members want their clubs to keep the money as far as I know, so who knows how successful it would be.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

As an overseas retiree - in the past I have chosen to support the Tigers as an "overseas member". I got streaming games access, a bumper sticker, lanyard and the satisfaction of supporting the club.

For the last 2 years the club has been saving a few sheckels by sending the membership packs (and the additional team shirts I ordered) by regular post. No option to have at least registered post if I paid. So - given the decrepid state of Aussie Post and their overseas partners - NOTHING ever arrives. So this year - pfffft, I paid for WatchAFL instead .....as I was never getting any packages regardless.

Now - WatchAFL, refuse a refund for the annual fee - sending us all an email today offering to let us watch *replays* this year, and 3 months free access next year. What a crock. With their rip-off fees setup and the abysmal monthly payment option to extend beyond the 3 months, you are going to add an annual fee subscription anyway - so the 3 months "free" is worth NOTHING to us. FoxSports/WatchAFL - you will not get another cents from me or any expats overseas if this is the cr@p option you offer instead of a REFUND. Retirees need every cent - our self-funded super has TANKED like everything else.

That is outrageous, I'd be demanding a refund and / or telling them I'm lodging a complaint with the ACCC and the relevant ombudsman.

 

[CrimsonButterfly]

Yes.

I'm a North Melbourne member and haven't considered asking for a refund, but if you what you paid for isn't being delivered then you should be entitled to a refund. I would urge only people in dire need of a refund, like people who have lost their job unexpectedly to ask for the money back, otherwise keep supporting your club.

 

[Twoslabs]

Another option as a way to reward fans that can stay is to add a "bonus year/s" to the years of consecutive membership.

I lost a couple of years when my oldest was sick, otherwise I would have been platinum (first joined 93).

This year I'm back to 8, with the bonus year I'd go gold next year with better access to GF tickets.

IMHO Either way there has to be an option for those that need it to get their $$$ back or an additional reward for those that can afford to keep going.

 

[Big Sauce 21]

I wont be asking for a refund but the club can make sure I actually get my pack. Never received it.

 

[Chuckie2]

It’s not anyone’s fault, but if a service has not been provided YOU RECEIVE A REFUND.
A club is not a charity, it’s a business.
Clubs shouldn’t be staying silent and just hoping no one asks.
Letters should be send out detailing the refund process, or stating members can use that money for 2021.

Exactly right i am on a pension and bought full membership for myself and 2 grandkids but when i rang the club they said no we are not offering refunds yet ,what a weak answer when you cant supply a service i paid for.

 

[Chuckie2]

Well if a smaller club makes way then fingers and toes crossed it’s the lions. I don’t think it will get to that point though

your only saying that coz we beat you in two grand finals,i guarantee you if every supporter had a vote for one club to get booted it would be collingwood.

 

[sounda]

Grand Final by membership tier or add on (more money) tier. Other finals all members buy at the same time.

A good topic that got me thinking.

If, the AFL and the 18 clubs are going to lean so heavily on members and their membership dollars for support during this time, the very least they could do is promise to all club members that the next 10 GF's are opened up to the average supporter. Of the 100,000 seats at the MCG on GF day - 97,000 to be distributed between the clubs. The remaining 3000 - make the 'corporates' squabble, squawk and pay through the noise for those seats - just like supporters have to in the weeks leading up to the GF.

That, at the very least, would show the how much the AFL values mum and dad supporters over 'corporates'. Screw the 'corporates' - you can't have it both ways - lean on supporters but give all the 'fruit', like GF tickets to corporates.

Give the biggest day on the footy calendar back to the supporters.

 

[BF Tiger]

A good topic that got me thinking.

If, the AFL and the 18 clubs are going to lean so heavily on members and their membership dollars for support during this time, the very least they could do is promise to all club members that the next 10 GF's are opened up to the average supporter. Of the 100,000 seats at the MCG on GF day - 97,000 to be distributed between the clubs. The remaining 3000 - make the 'corporates' squabble, squawk and pay through the noise for those seats - just like supporters have to in the weeks leading up to the GF.

That, at the very least, would show the how much the AFL values mum and dad supporters over 'corporates'. Screw the 'corporates' - you can't have it both ways - lean on supporters but give all the 'fruit', like GF tickets to corporates.

Give the biggest day on the footy calendar back to the supporters.

I like it but the AFL have no power AFAIK over the MCC members. They can't force them to turnover their seating.

This is where a Waverley as originally planned would have been brilliant. Capacity of 160,000 and no MCC members taking up tens of thousands of seats.

 

[sounda]

I like it but the AFL have no power AFAIK over the MCC members. They can't force them to turnover their seating.

This is where a Waverley as originally planned would have been brilliant. Capacity of 160,000 and no MCC members taking up tens of thousands of seats.

Fair enough - in my rant about corporates - I forgot about the MCC members - doh!

I tell you what though - every year when the GF comes round I always think of the mums and dads who miss out on the opportunity to take their family to the GF. I went with our family in 2018 and we loved it - a treasured family memory for life. The corporates that were there in 2018 would have been just pigging out on grog and food and were probably blind by HT and couldn't have given a toss for the game.

As a Tigers supporter I hope you were there last year to enjoy the whole day?

I just think the AFL needs to find away (or be forced) to make the game accessible to all families - not just the wealthier ones.

I happen to be fortunate enough and can pay premium prices for our family tickets. Occasionally, we also buy tickets for some families we know that are not flush with cash. And when their kids get to go - their faces just light up. It absolutely shits me that the only barrier for them is cost. Now I know that's life but this is the footy for Heaven's sakes - not the Opera. It's something that should be accessible for all families.

I priced a family (4 tickets = 2 adults * 2 kids) for a WCE game at Optus last year and it was around $200! And then what if the kids want a drink and a pie or a burger at HT the cost can get to $250.00 pretty quick? You can rent a house in some suburbs for $250.00 per week.

Seriously, a 1 income family on an average or, less than average salary, what chance do they have?

 

[Senor M]

A good topic that got me thinking.

If, the AFL and the 18 clubs are going to lean so heavily on members and their membership dollars for support during this time, the very least they could do is promise to all club members that the next 10 GF's are opened up to the average supporter. Of the 100,000 seats at the MCG on GF day - 97,000 to be distributed between the clubs. The remaining 3000 - make the 'corporates' squabble, squawk and pay through the noise for those seats - just like supporters have to in the weeks leading up to the GF.

That, at the very least, would show the how much the AFL values mum and dad supporters over 'corporates'. Screw the 'corporates' - you can't have it both ways - lean on supporters but give all the 'fruit', like GF tickets to corporates.

Give the biggest day on the footy calendar back to the supporters.

Corporates only get between 5,000-30,000 tickets a year according to this article:

Footy's biggest day: how the tickets are allocated

Not all memberships will guarantee you a ticket to the AFL grand final. Here's how the seats are allocated.

www.smh.com.au

I guess the AFL could use some of those to go back towards club supporters??

But in this time of 'need' from the AFL---- both MCC members and AFL members are still also paying their memberships in the same way club members are. They are still the same 'Mum & Dad' supporters; they've just chosen to support the competition in a way that suits their needs better.

EDIT: I know BomberBoy doesn’t like my view on WWE, but coming & finding posts on the main board from a month ago to dislike looks pretty pathetic IMO.

 

[Timewillcome]

I had an AFL membership that I have since dumped. Corporate tickets were being allocated out of the AFL member pool. So much so that I had seats double booked one time with a corporate sponsor. It was becoming very hard to book a seat to any game, and it seemed the pool of seats was getting smaller each year. Grand final seemed like the same deal.

They may publicise this number as low as 5000, but I bet this is always closer to 30,000. Players and life AFL members also get seats. Take out MCC and we are back to the usual 30k to share between club members.

No way the AFL are going to give up any more than they need to and the average supporter will not be getting better GF access as a result of the loyalty. Nice idea but corporate sponsors need to have their butt kissed often.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

I swear that some people in here forget or aren't aware of what was happening 30 years ago.

I was at that impressionable age (teenage years) to get it.

I hated what the VFL management, the then Footscray board and Fitzroy tried to do at the end of 1989. Some people should never be forgiven for that.

It upset me seeing Richmond and St. Kilda fight so hard to survive. The Richmond of today would not be here now if they didn't have that fight 30 years ago.

That is what is at stake.

Then the clubs should stop spending money they don’t have and run their operation as a business instead of trying to keep up and spending like some clubs can.
Been bloody good times for footy the last few decades and it’s just simply very poor management that all clubs don’t have a significant war chest. Don’t ask the people to fund what you threw around and wasted.

 

[Chuckie2]

Well i just watched an interview with tony jones and eddie macwire he just asked eddie should people be able to get refunds if they wanted them and eddie wouldnt answer the question just got angry and lost his cool ...EDDIE you are a disgrace!

 

[Cotchins Hair Piece]

Well i just watched an interview with tony jones and eddie macwire he just asked eddie should people be able to get refunds if they wanted them and eddie wouldnt answer the question just got angry and lost his cool ...EDDIE you are a disgrace!

Sandra Sully with the late news.

 

[RimCorp]

As a West Coast season ticket holder i do not feel I am a member of the club. The Eagles operate under the corporate umbrella of Indian Pacific Limited and as such as a supposed member there no members rights such as being able to attend the AGM, voting in office bearers or standing for a Board position, it is a closed shop boys club. so what am I a member of and what privileges do I get ?? it is also not a homely family relationship either. When negotiating for seats at Optus oval the WCE administration harsh approach was here is what you are getting and you can take it or leave it. When it comes to money they take no prisoners. Try paying only 95% of your annual subscription and you'll quickly learn that it is a commercial transaction and your seating will be promptly removed. As a commercial contract for a service Australian consumer law applies and where games are not available to a seat holder refunds should be made. To change the nature of a payment to "a donation" without authorization is an unconscionable act. Refunds for the first game should have already been made. The club is by no means poor as it has charged ticket holders a significant premium over what say Victorian club members pay. Those that want to donate can simply do so.
I love my team but not the administrators.

 

[Capriati]

As a West Coast season ticket holder i do not feel I am a member of the club. The Eagles operate under the corporate umbrella of Indian Pacific Limited and as such as a supposed member there no members rights such as being able to attend the AGM, voting in office bearers or standing for a Board position, it is a closed shop boys club. so what am I a member of and what privileges do I get ?? it is also not a homely family relationship either. When negotiating for seats at Optus oval the WCE administration harsh approach was here is what you are getting and you can take it or leave it. When it comes to money they take no prisoners. Try paying only 95% of your annual subscription and you'll quickly learn that it is a commercial transaction and your seating will be promptly removed. As a commercial contract for a service Australian consumer law applies and where games are not available to a seat holder refunds should be made. To change the nature of a payment to "a donation" without authorization is an unconscionable act. Refunds for the first game should have already been made. The club is by no means poor as it has charged ticket holders a significant premium over what say Victorian club members pay. Those that want to donate can simply do so.
I love my team but not the administrators.

All valid points.

On the other hand, I reckon if you have reserved seating at Optus and choose to request a refund, and therefore cancel your membership you should have to go to the back of the waitlist if you choose to sign up again next year.