"St Kilda smashed through the midfield" says Lyon

[Persevering Saint]

From the real footy website

St Kilda's midfield too soft, Lyon says

Lyall Johnson | May 5, 2008

IT'S one of the oldest cliches in football, but games of football are almost always won, or lost, in the midfield.
And St Kilda coach Ross Lyon was honest enough after Saturday night's thrilling three-point win over Richmond to admit his side got totally smashed through the midfield and, as a result, possibly didn't deserve to win.
The Tigers, in Lyon's words, "annihilated" St Kilda in the middle of the ground (the statistics for hard-ball-gets alone were 66-28 Richmond's way). And if not for Richmond turning the ball back over to the Saints with monotonous regularity, it would have come out on top, which would have made irrelevant the 11 seconds "lost" by the timekeepers that muddied the result.
Lyon said yesterday the main worry he had with his side was that while the midfielders were performing well individually, they were yet to play well together on the same day.
"The biggest concern is our midfield," Lyons said on radio 3AW yesterday. "Games are won and lost there. Your ability to put scoreboard pressure on and help your defence is from there.
"In a real sense, bar (Nick) Dal Santo and (Robert) Harvey last night, up to half-time, we were annihilated in there. Their ruckmen spread on us and got a lot of ball and Lenny (Hayes), who's been outstanding all year, was tagged heavily and (Leigh) Montagna was tagged heavily and struggled.
"It wasn't until we put (Adam) Schneider and Xavier Clarke on the wings in the second half that we got some pace and some more ball-winning ability. And as soon as that happened, we scored five goals really quickly …
"So, to me, our biggest issue — and the numbers tell you that and the contested ball (stats) tell you that — at the minute, it's the midfield not supplying enough opportunity. They've all had good games but not collectively. Clearly, we'd like more goals from them."
It is fair to say Richmond was the better side on the night in all but two areas. For a start, the scoreboard shows it lost, Jack Riewoldt's after-the-siren kick falling short by a couple of metres.
Second, despite 70-odd more possessions than St Kilda and being ahead in nearly every statistical department, the Tigers' use of the football was so average, it cost them the game.
Stephen Milne was a star for the Saints, kicking 7.3, while Matthew Richardson was superb for the Tigers, booting five as he roved the ground for most of the night.

 

[CHBench]

Re: St Kilda's midfield too soft, Lyon says

I may be alone in saying this but i want Ben Cousins at the saints next year.

Could really do with an experienced midfielder who is a match winner and can provide a spark.

But very unlikely it will happen though.....

We either need to trade for a lowish draft pick or trade for an experienced mid, who has skill i.e someone like Daniel Kerr (if the rumours are true)

 

[Squizz]

Re: St Kilda's midfield too soft, Lyon says

Stupid headline. Nothing to do with soft, but may as well make something up as Voss did. Troy Simmonds played a great game, and hit to advantage which helped the clearance work.

 

[stfan]

Re: St Kilda's midfield too soft, Lyon says

Stupid headline. Nothing to do with soft, but may as well make something up as Voss did. Troy Simmonds played a great game, and hit to advantage which helped the clearance work.

Exactly...the papers Editors have completely misrepresented what the article was about.

String should be retitled to reflect the intent of the article and not The Age's rubbish headline that some stupid sub-editor gave to it.

 

[Kildonan]

I edited the title to better reflect the interview

 

[Persevering Saint]

yeah, sorry about that guys - i just put it up as written. Totally agree with you that the tone is a lot different to what the headline suggests.

 

[Sir Robert]

Re: St Kilda's midfield too soft, Lyon says

I may be alone in saying this but i want Ben Cousins at the saints next year.

Could really do with an experienced midfielder who is a match winner and can provide a spark.

But very unlikely it will happen though.....

We either need to trade for a lowish draft pick or trade for an experienced mid, who has skill i.e someone like Daniel Kerr (if the rumours are true)

I'm with you re Cousins I would def take him if we could have him.

This draft I hope we go for another ruck to get a duo going with McEvoy in the next decade (as seeing King this year has made me realise how important a good ruck is), a skilled mid (important to hit our targets for a change), and then I'm undecided. Might wait til October before thinking about this again

Can anyone create a thread re a summary on Casey's game???

 

[Look2Me4Guidance]

Re: St Kilda's midfield too soft, Lyon says

I'm with you re Cousins I would def take him if we could have him.

This draft I hope we go for another ruck to get a duo going with McEvoy in the next decade (as seeing King this year has made me realise how important a good ruck is), a skilled mid (important to hit our targets for a change), and then I'm undecided. Might wait til October before thinking about this again

Can anyone create a thread re a summary on Casey's game???

They had the bye this week mate.

 

[Rough_Edges]

Re: St Kilda's midfield too soft, Lyon says

He's on the money, we got smacked through the middle, we really need to lift.

 

[HoldenMCaulfield]

The stats are as follows for our last 4 games:

Rd 4 vs Geelong : clearances won - 39 / lost - 23 = result : loss

Rd 5 vs Essendon : clearances won - 38 / lost - 42 = result : win

Rd 6 vs Port Adelaide : clearances won - 32 / lost - 31 = result : loss

Rd 7 vs Richmond : clearances won - 26 / lost - 42 = result : win

I agree that contested footy is important, but if we win the game, I don't care too much about clearances... A few weeks ago, there was an article from Lenny Hayes that "clearance win doesn't equal victory".

But while the four last weeks have been odd in that regard, it generally helps, of course.

As to Cousins - well, from of football point of view, of course I would like to see him with St Kilda. I don't know him personally and who knows what he'll be like next year, so I can't comment on the 'non-football' factors.

Casey didn't play this week - there was only one VFL game with Geelong smashing Collingwood.

 

[seanoff]

The stats are as follows for our last 4 games:

Rd 4 vs Geelong : clearances won - 39 / lost - 23 = result : loss

Rd 5 vs Essendon : clearances won - 38 / lost - 42 = result : win

Rd 6 vs Port Adelaide : clearances won - 32 / lost - 31 = result : loss

Rd 7 vs Richmond : clearances won - 26 / lost - 42 = result : win

I agree that contested footy is important, but if we win the game, I don't care too much about clearances... A few weeks ago, there was an article from Lenny Hayes that "clearance win doesn't equal victory".

But while the four last weeks have been odd in that regard, it generally helps, of course.

Lenny needs to lay off the crack pipe. So the Saints beat two weaker sides (Richmond only just) after losing the clearances. Try losing the clearances against Hawthorn by that margin, it will be a 200 point massacre. watch the replay of the Collingwood game, if i was a St kilda defender i'd be attempting to miss that game.

The inside 50s were 54 - 40, the Saints defence did well to keep them in the game, helped by Richmond's appalling disposal skills.


reading between the lines i could see a midfielder or 2 up for trade at years end. These guys are supposed to be prime mids, they aren't playing that way and they are not getting the hard ball. Compare these guys to Judd, who was a bit quiet on Friday night but had 14 contested possessions, pretty much double all the St Kilda mids.

 

[aussie86999]

So what does this mean Lenny Hayes,Luke Ball,Robert Harvey,Nick Dal Santo and Leigh Montagna arent the talent we all thought they were and up to the standard of the other teams mid field players? Or is it theyre not working as well together or what? Obviously if we need to look at other alternative players like Cousins its suggesting they need replacing ?

 

[sauce_head]

It means they are not working well together and their structure at a stopage is not being suited to their skills. It is the same issue with the forwards, they are not setting up well or wheeling around to provide more options. It all screams structure to me. STRUCTURE! What are the midfield and forward coaches doing???

 

[SaintsSeptember]

So what does this mean Lenny Hayes,Luke Ball,Robert Harvey,Nick Dal Santo and Leigh Montagna arent the talent we all thought they were and up to the standard of the other teams mid field players? Or is it theyre not working as well together or what? Obviously if we need to look at other alternative players like Cousins its suggesting they need replacing ?

I still think it is interesting to look at the dream team value change this year as an indicator or performance compared to last ( and previous) years. It is not a full picture but it is a way of measuring combined stats.

The only Saints Midfielders to gain value since start of season are:
Lenny Hayes, Steven King, Adam Schneider, Armitage and M Gardner.
In fact the only others in the team are:
Milney, Charlie Gardner, Hudgeton, Raph, Dempster.

So with the exception of Raph, Lenny and Max and Milney, all our old stalwarts are seeing less of the ball than last year. Either they are not as good as they were, ( as a team) or the opposition are all better.

 

[aussie86999]

The interesting part about it is on this post its all about being "annihilated" in the midfield and the serious problem we have eg too slow,too old whatever and on another post we're putting in our best players votes and adding praising comments and look who they all are and thats not adding Adam Schneiders 21 possesions who no one mentioned either. This seems to be another example of a great list but not a great team which has been our problem for years . Our list may not be as good as it was 5 years ago but i believe its still strong enough. Is it only me who cant understand why clubs like the bulldogs on a low budget and regardles of how little high profile players they have usually always come out like 22 gladiators almost willing to fight to the death right to end and make our star side who should have an expected win look stupid ? As much as i dont want to think it, is the problem the old culture in the club thing that Grant Thomas (and i'll give him that i wasnt big on his coaching but i believe he was great for the club) tried to change as to why we seem to flounder along battling against lesser sides playing better football ?