Opinion Stephen Silvagni

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HavUEvaSeenTheRain said:
SOS has done a great job imo and I’m sure there would be dozens of people out there who could do the job equally as good under the same circumstances but there was absolutely no luck involved in him getting the conditions he had to work under. He demanded it and that was one of the best things that came out of this whole rebuild and SOS deserves great credit for that
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The fans demanded change. We're the ones who've made the most noise.
 
Blue__Balls said:
"This is a direct quote out of The Age "A more cohesive football club would have found a way to navigate the differences between Silvagni, a favourite son, and his chief executive""
This statement is a load of shite. How much more "cohesive" would a club need to be to have avoided this? Perhaps the club is now more cohesive for having made the decision? Would a "more cohesive" club have remained as cohesive with these particular individuals involved? It's a pointless, self-perpetuating statement that says absolutely nothing of any worth. More cohesive clubs don't have these issues, until they do at which point they become less cohesive and other more cohesive clubs would handle it better.
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That statement may have come about just to provoke, but it doesn't mean it hasn't any fact attached to it.
There's simply too much evidence displayed by the CFC to the contrary, for us to to claim to be unified and cohesive. We're not and haven't been for some time.

Every team has issues and when you're losing it stands to reason that the issues will show themselves to be magnified, but we just keep doing it.
We keep finding ourselves in 'awkward' situations better run clubs would not find themselves in. Is this even disputable?
 
Bostonian said:
Too early to tell. It hasn't achieved anything yet.

When we start making and winning finals then we can look back and say he did an awesome job.

Are you denying that our unwillingness to go for a full rebuild made the job of his predecessors far more difficult to build a young competitive team?
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The list doesn’t have to achieve anything for you to have a positive or negative feeling about it.
It would be interesting to understand your subjective inner feeling irrespective of achievement. How do you feel about our list?
 
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Now the faceless men are leaking that there was a conflict of interest. Did they never consider this when they appointed him, knowing full well that his sons were coming through the system? Ofcourse not. Then we have the drafting and delisting for Deluca. Plays all 6 games, and was not the worst player, and yet they uproot this kid, and ruin his life. I wonder was whether this was another kick in the guts for SOS?
 
Moody Blue said:
Now the faceless men are leaking that there was a conflict of interest. Did they never consider this when they appointed him, knowing full well that his sons were coming through the system? Ofcourse not. Then we have the drafting and delisting for Deluca. Plays all 6 games, and was not the worst player, and yet they uproot this kid, and ruin his life. I wonder was whether this was another kick in the guts for SOS?
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Ruin his life?

Spare us.
 
slashin_velvet said:
If this happens, then it's further evidence that SOS had huge sway with MLG.

Lethlean was rumoured to have been offered our CEO role until the board knocked it back. Has been a few comments suggesting Lethlean and SOS are good mates.
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Not sure he started the rumour but ricky Nixon did bring it up. He thought the friendship sos has with ratten and gubby Allen could sway him.
 
HARKER said:
That statement may have come about just to provoke, but it doesn't mean it hasn't any fact attached to it.
There's simply too much evidence displayed by the CFC to the contrary, for us to to claim to be unified and cohesive. We're not and haven't been for some time.

Every team has issues and when you're losing it stands to reason that the issues will show themselves to be magnified, but we just keep doing it.
We keep finding ourselves in 'awkward' situations better run clubs would not find themselves in. Is this even disputable?
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Not saying we're "cohesive", just saying that claiming a more cohesive club would have avoided the issue is vague, lazy, uninformative "journalism". You could claim any club with issues could potentially avoid them by being "more cohesive". The issues would likely have been worse if we were less cohesive, so perhaps we've managed it better than other clubs would have given the circumstances. And an arbitrarily "more cohesive" organisation may still have ended up with the same outcome.

It says nothing other than that the journalist wants to imply that Carlton should have handled it better, and a club like <insert cohesive club> would have.

Would a "better run club" have simply avoided this situation by not employing a list manager who was going to find himself in the position of having his sons on the list he was managing?
 
Moody Blue said:
Now the faceless men are leaking that there was a conflict of interest. Did they never consider this when they appointed him, knowing full well that his sons were coming through the system? Ofcourse not. Then we have the drafting and delisting for Deluca. Plays all 6 games, and was not the worst player, and yet they uproot this kid, and ruin his life. I wonder was whether this was another kick in the guts for SOS?
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Say what Moody.
 
Blue__Balls said:
Not saying we're "cohesive", just saying that claiming a more cohesive club would have avoided the issue is vague, lazy, uninformative "journalism". You could claim any club with issues could potentially avoid them by being "more cohesive". The issues would likely have been worse if we were less cohesive, so perhaps we've managed it better than other clubs would have given the circumstances. And an arbitrarily "more cohesive" organisation may still have ended up with the same outcome.

It says nothing other than that the journalist wants to imply that Carlton should have handled it better, and a club like <insert cohesive club> would have.

Would a "better run club" have simply avoided this situation by not employing a list manager who was going to find himself in the position of having his sons on the list he was managing?
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Niall in this case was spot on
 
Opine said:
The list doesn’t have to achieve anything for you to have a positive or negative feeling about it.
I’m interested in your subjective inner feeling irrespective of achievement. How do you feel about our list?
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I'm neither up nor down on the list. I'd say I'm interested to see how some of the things we've done pan out.

I don't think it's a balanced list as such so it's going to again rely on a the few areas of strength we have to drag along and up the areas of weakness.
 
Blue__Balls said:
......
Nobody has done anything wrong, there, have they? CEO, GM of Football, Board have proactively removed a potential integrity risk in our LM team, SOS has gotten upset at losing his job (who wouldn't) but stuck it out and still did right by the club on draft night. Maybe there were other clashes and arguments and name calling and whatever, but the club realises that there is nothing to be gained in tarnishing any names, and instead sanitise the announcement and focus purely on the CoI concerns.
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I think this is your best paragraph. I really don't think much else needs to be said.
 
Stamos said:
Niall in this case was spot on
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How would a "more cohesive" club have avoided it?

By sacking someone different? By never employing SOS in the first place? By moving someone into a different role? By not allowing SOS the autonomy he had in the first place? By not drafting their list manager's kids?

It's naive to think that there must have been a way to come out of this with all staff still employed in the same roles and everyone happy with eachother. Life isn't that neat and tidy.
 

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Bostonian said:
I'm neither up nor down on the list. I'd say I'm interested to see how some of the things we've done pan out.

I don't think it's a balanced list as such so it's going to again rely on a the few areas of strength we have to drag along and up the areas of weakness.
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Ok. Are you feeling that our weaknesses greatly exceed our areas of strength?
 
Blue__Balls said:
How would a "more cohesive" club have avoided it?

By sacking someone different? By never employing SOS in the first place? By moving someone into a different role? By not allowing SOS the autonomy he had in the first place? By not drafting their list manager's kids?

It's naive to think that there must have been a way to come out of this with all staff still employed in the same roles and everyone happy with eachother. Life isn't that neat and tidy.
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Simply by managing the situation more effectively. By avoiding the power struggle.
This was a massive own goal, which was entirely unnecessary.

And if it did get to the point where they did actually have to sack SOS, they could have done it in a manner which showed more respect to SOS, 2 current players, and the members and supporters.
 
Opine said:
Ok. Are you feeling that our weaknesses greatly exceed our areas of strength?
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I'd say we have a shallow list with 1-2 elite players and a huge amount of question marks that will determine how far the list can go.

If a person rates the likes of Dow, O'Brien etc as being reasons why the list will be top shelf then they will differ from people who don't rate such players that highly on what they have seen in them thus far.
 
Arr0w said:
What about an amoji of the grumpy old men sitting in the balcony of the muppet show?

Might get a decent run around here
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Stamos said:
Simply by managing the situation more effectively. By avoiding the power struggle.
This was a massive own goal, which was entirely unnecessary.

And if it did get to the point where they did actually have to sack SOS, they could have done it in a manner which showed more respect to SOS, 2 current players, and the members and supporters.
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This is all easy to say from the outside - it could have been "better", managed more "effectively", power struggle "avoided".

But maybe this was as good as it could get. Much as I'd love for SOS's exit to be effected with a celebration of his contribution, a parade though Princes Park and hugs and handshakes all round, it is entirely possible that he was deeply offended by not having his contract renewed and was prepared to go out guns blazing - maybe "managing the situation well" was keeping him quiet, minimising talk of fractured relationships, and focusing on a sanitary (and valid) reason like the growing conflict of interest.
 
Bostonian said:
I'd say we have a shallow list with 1-2 elite players and a huge amount of question marks that will determine how far the list can go.

If a person rates the likes of Dow, O'Brien etc as being reasons why the list will be top shelf then they will differ from people who don't rate such players that highly on what they have seen in them thus far.
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What do you believe is the primary cause of our “shallow list” ?
 
Blue__Balls said:
This is all easy to say from the outside - it could have been "better", managed more "effectively", power struggle "avoided".

But maybe this was as good as it could get. Much as I'd love for SOS's exit to be effected with a celebration of his contribution, a parade though Princes Park and hugs and handshakes all round, it is entirely possible that he was deeply offended by not having his contract renewed and was prepared to go out guns blazing - maybe "managing the situation well" was keeping him quiet, minimising talk of fractured relationships, and focusing on a sanitary (and valid) reason like the growing conflict of interest.
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do you think SOS was being overuled on list decisions because of the conflict of interest?
 

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Opinion Stephen Silvagni

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