Team Mgmt. Talk about the makeup of our list - midfield balance, height profile, endurance runners

[Lore]

That's very kind of you.

The devil is Bruno

 

[TheGrizz]

You're not getting it. My point of interest is this year's "oh, but we're developing" narrative everyone is going with. I'm keen to follow the progress of that, if that's what we're doing.

Did they play Voss forward on the weekend? If it's a role they want they probably should've at least tried to draft one last year. Too busy taking 25 year olds?

The reality is that most signs pointed towards a slow start to the year and that was before a healthy amount of injuries we have had. Not to mention we have one of the youngest lists in the comp so expecting that finals was not necessarily the be all and end all was entirely foreseeable.

But to play along, McGrath could develop into that player quite easily.

He is still young enough (turns 24 this year) and we know he has an understanding of a healthy mix between defensive discipline and knowing when to run off his opponent from his time in the back half.

 

[yodellinhank]

So you just want to have a sook? Not discuss anything, or form a coherent thought based on the coach literally saying it’s something they’d like to develop.

It's something he'd like to develop, so how is he going about that? Discuss...

 

[faible]

It's something he'd like to develop, so how is he going about that? Discuss...

I added some discussion points. You did not.

So as before; your turn.

 

[yodellinhank]

I added some discussion points. You did not.

So as before; your turn.

Okay.

We say we are in a development phase, but the players we are supposedly developing with are 25 years old at the youngest. On the basis of that, the club is clearly ****ed.

We've been through clean air and chemistry, and moved on to the rebuild that isn't. Essendon supporters say the darndest things.

 

[faible]

but the players we are supposedly developing with are 25 years old at the youngest

Well this is demonstrably false.

the rebuild that isn't

As is this.

High quality contributions there, maybe fact check things next time.

 

[yodellinhank]

Well this is demonstrably false.



As is this.

High quality contributions there, maybe fact check things next time.

Shiel 29
Stringer 27
Langford 25

Did Voss or Hobbs play run with on the weekend?

 

[faible]

Shiel 29
Stringer 27
Langford 25

Did Voss or Hobbs play run with on the weekend?

So you were wrong, now you want to narrow the definition of ‘development’ to mean very specifically ‘did we play someone under 25 as a dedicated tagger on the weekend despite no club playing dedicated taggers anymore and therefore it being highly likely an absolute waste of a young players development’.

Ok then.

 

[yodellinhank]

So you were wrong, now you want to narrow the definition of ‘development’ to mean very specifically ‘did we play someone under 25 as a dedicated tagger on the weekend despite no club playing dedicated taggers anymore and therefore it being highly likely an absolute waste of a young players development’.

Ok then.

What was I wrong about, I asked a question. Who are we developing, then you named 3 25+ year old players and said maybe Hobbs or Voss could do it.

But now you say we didn't/won't try to develop them that way because it'd be a waste of young talent?

 

[faible]

What was I wrong about, I asked a question. Who are we developing, then you named 3 25+ year old players and said maybe Hobbs or Voss could do it.

But now you say we didn't/won't try to develop them that way because it'd be a waste of young talent?

‘Who are we developing’ is very different to ‘who are we developing very specifically to play as a tagger despite no clubs doing that’.

Yeah, you’re really battling with this one.

Clubs simply don’t play a dedicated tagger. Some have defensive midfielders who are good enough to play on ball, that they can use in a more direct negative role when required.

Fundamentally they develop them as midfielders though. Not taggers.

Any more pearls of wisdom for us?

 

[boncer34]

Didn’t want to answer the question?

Who in the 22 on Saturday would you have sent to centre bounces to tag Neale without compromising our ability to win clearances?

Caldwell

 

[faible]

Caldwell

Constructive contribution, I like it.

 

[boncer34]

Constructive contribution, I like it.

Or McGrath.

 

[yodellinhank]

‘Who are we developing’ is very different to ‘who are we developing very specifically to play as a tagger despite no clubs doing that’.

Yeah, you’re really battling with this one.

Clubs simply don’t play a dedicated tagger. Some have defensive midfielders who are good enough to play on ball, that they can use in a more direct negative role when required.

Fundamentally they develop them as midfielders though. Not taggers.

Any more pearls of wisdom for us?

Let me help you out, this is from the post I replied to

Rutten said himself he is keen to develop someone to add that capability to the side.
It's not being ignored, they didn't have a player they felt could do the job on the weekend that would provide a benefit to the team without taking more away from it.

Don't mistake not wanting to talk publicly about tactics as we don't have any. This is a fraternity that clings to naming a player only to then rule them out to eat up as much opposition time as they can. They ain't going to discuss actual tactics in public.

He has said they would like to have a player to do that, but we are a developing side and as it currently stands we are still finding which players are going to be a part of our best 22.
They have used Langford in the role previously, they have used stringer in a role where they sit him on the opposition best player at stoppages and then a handover occurs around the ground.

They do things, what has undoubtedly occured is they didn't have someone that they regularly turn to in the role in the best 22 on the weekend, they discussed doing something about Neale, it wasn't missed or not understood, they decided that they had the best chance of scoring was from stoppage so they wanted to be as attacking as they could be.

They didn't have a move to make on the weekend because we don't have a player like that on the side.
Shock horror a developing not top 4 side in the league is missing pieces and not complete yet.
Are we hanging the 2nd year coach for this?

And at the end of the day restricting Neale from having 41 and limiting him to 30 doesn't help us win the game.
We lost because we couldn't kick straight, our skills were shit and we made dumb mistakes (on top of Neale carving them up).

That's the context of the discussion. And you seemed to be following until just recently when you've decided it's about what you or I would do and not what the club is purported to be trying to do.

 

[madrigal]

Or McGrath.

Didn't we sack the last tagger who could not kick?

 

[TheGrizz]

Shiel 29
Stringer 27
Langford 25

Did Voss or Hobbs play run with on the weekend?

No, but Caldwell (22), Durham (22), Cox (20), Perkins (20), Martin (20) have all played when fit.

Baldwin (19) played round 1, Jones (21) will play when fit.

Either you intentionally left them out or I would suggest you read the team sheet.

Guys like Bryan (21), Wanganeen (18), Reid (20) and Hobbs likely to get a run eventually.

 

[boncer34]

No, but Caldwell (22), Durham (22), Cox (20), Perkins (20), Martin (20) have all played when fit.

Baldwin (19) played round 1, Jones (21) will play when fit.

Either you intentionally left them out or I would suggest you read the team sheet.

Guys like Bryan (21), Wanganeen (18), Reid (20) and Hobbs likely to get a run eventually.

Here's the context for his post. Might help you.

I’m not the coach, I don’t know exactly who they’d use in that role.

Probably not Merrett or Parish, they’ve used Stringer and Langford, neither of whom were really options (Langford not playing, Stringer only used sparingly at centre bounces this week).

Guys like Hobbs or Voss are potentially future midfielders, Voss has the physical traits to do it if he’s good enough to justify playing in the middle.

I’d investigate Shiel given he’s got a mature body, is pretty sturdy, and is good enough to genuinely be in the middle.

Now your turn?

 

[faible]

Let me help you out, this is from the post I replied to

That's the context of the discussion. And you seemed to be following until just recently when you've decided it's about what you or I would do and not what the club is purported to be trying to do.

The context is you want to have a sook, not a discussion.

The coach has given you more information about the future of the side, things he wants to develop within the playing group.

Because it’s not happening RIGHT NOW you’re complaining, instead of realising that we have quite a young playing group, and are still bedding in the fundamentals of what players can do, what the side looks like, and how the system works.

You’re wanting it all now, instead of seeing what the plan for the future is.

 

[boncer34]

Not tagging is seemingly in Essendon's DNA. It's not solely a Truck thing.

Which is infuriating as anything for me.

 

[TheGrizz]

Here's the context for his post. Might help you.

Fair enough

 

[yodellinhank]

The context is you want to have a sook, not a discussion.

The coach has given you more information about the future of the side, things he wants to develop within the playing group.

Because it’s not happening RIGHT NOW you’re complaining, instead of realising that we have quite a young playing group, and are still bedding in the fundamentals of what players can do, what the side looks like, and how the system works.

You’re wanting it all now, instead of seeing what the plan for the future is.

So what's the plan?

 

[Lore]

Not tagging is seemingly in Essendon's DNA. It's not solely a Truck thing.

Which is infuriating as anything for me.

Truck seems more likely to do it than the previous guy which is interesting. Although given the attitude of the previous guy it’s not totally surprising that we don’t really have anyone trained for it, to know when to shut down and more importantly when to run off and have an impact yourself. It’s not likely to be a priority when building a new system and bringing in a lot of new faces or new roles for old faces.

I think we have used them a little over the last couple of years though. Ambrose on Fyfe comes to mind, which was bizarre since he doesn’t belong in the midfield. In that case they tried to break the tag by putting Fyfe forward, but of course Ambrose was a defender by that point and it suited him nicely.

The other side of it isn’t just tagging, it’s also being able to break the tag. Neale wouldn’t be as much of an issue if Merrett was still having the impact he had in the first quarter.

I think in the past Merrett would go to someone when he was being tagged and cause a 2v1 since the tagger would stay with him, and at least let someone else off the chain. Also seen him run through protected zone and causing the tagger to give away 50m, although I think the opponent is allowed to follow now which is dumb.

 

[boncer34]

Truck seems more likely to do it than the previous guy which is interesting. Although given the attitude of the previous guy it’s not totally surprising that we don’t really have anyone trained for it, to know when to shut down and more importantly when to run off and have an impact yourself. It’s not likely to be a priority when building a new system and bringing in a lot of new faces or new roles for old faces.

I think we have used them a little over the last couple of years though. Ambrose on Fyfe comes to mind, which was bizarre since he doesn’t belong in the midfield. In that case they tried to break the tag by putting Fyfe forward, but of course Ambrose was a defender by that point and it suited him nicely.

The other side of it isn’t just tagging, it’s also being able to break the tag. Neale wouldn’t be as much of an issue if Merrett was still having the impact he had in the first quarter.

I think in the past Merrett would go to someone when he was being tagged and cause a 2v1 since the tagger would stay with him, and at least let someone else off the chain. Also seen him run through protected zone and causing the tagger to give away 50m, although I think the opponent is allowed to follow now which is dumb.

Is Worsfold on the same level as Voldemort now?

I'd go back even further. Hocking tagged a bit but was also let run the other way as well.

Have we ever had a pure defensive mid? And played them? In the Crowley or Ling mould?

 

[Lore]

Is Worsfold on the same level as Voldemort now?

I'd go back even further. Hocking tagged a bit but was also let run the other way as well.

Have we ever had a pure defensive mid? And played them? In the Crowley or Ling mould?

Not as far back as I can remember, which is admittedly not as far as you can remember.

 

[boncer34]

Not as far back as I can remember, which is admittedly not as far as you can remember.

That's mean.

I mean pure defensive mids are relatively rare for most teams I think so maybe it's not that unusual we don't have one.