Mega Thread The Adam Goodes Megathread - Now with Added Poll!

[Dan26]

Calm down, I just supplied you with his quote and you are still in denial. Take off your blinkers and read the words.
Jason Dunstall is not indigenous.

The point, which you missed, was that the girl claimed her comments were not racist. She didn't use the term "black." She used the term "ape", which was based on his appearance, not his race.

 

[Balony_pony16]

Below is a fairly in depth review of my thought process on the whole matter. It's worth a read, whatever side you're on.

At first I thought, "Oh come on, people can't be being him for being racist, he's a flog on field, has teared apart opposition teams and plays for frees and sometimes does silly things and sticks his arms out whinging to the umps, nothing wrong with booing him."

Over the next few days I heard the calls of racism and got really annoyed, because I think he can be a dickhead and I'm not racist. So I thought more about the situation, delving into the racial elements of it. I didn't like the way the girl was treated after the "ape" incident, not just by Goodes, more so the media, and I really hoped Goodes could have done more to help calm the situation; despite being obviously hurt, he is still the adult and could have done without the "face of racism" thing, in whatever context he meant it. I'd like to think the girl was just ignorant of the term and could have been educated in a loving way by Goodes after the fact. Certainly not upset with him pointing her out, that was in the moment and emotions were running wild. So I thought, OK that's a fair argument, they aren't booing him because of a racial reason, they just disagreed with his methods in dealing with it. (I did recently learn of his tweet saying to leave the girl alone, that's great.)

Then I thought about the Carlton fans/war dance moment. I thought it was silly at the time to celebrate a goal being so far up against a shit side, even if being booed by a bunch of ferals. I thought, sure it's indigenous round, but perhaps directing the dance at a negative group of people would only have the dance associated with further negativity. Emotions are running high, the crowd is in pack mode, perhaps don't incite them. Maybe at the end of the night the indigenous guys could have celebrated with a loving friendly dance which celebrated the positive aspects of the indigenous culture. After the booing continued, I thought surely they are booing him because they disagreed with the provocative nature of the dance (no different to if he through his fist up at them), not the fact it was an indigenous dance. So I stood up for the booing, even though I didn't go to a game and boo myself.

But today.

**** me.

Jeff Garlett. A bloody lovable, smiling guy. Does the nicest, friendliest celebration ever and gets booed.

That's it.

I retract it all.

Goodes can be an idiot on field (sliding, frees, footy stuff), and my views about whether a moment calls for reconciliation via provocation versus education may differ from his, but that is no excuse for what he is going through.

I don't want a ban on booing. I'm sure he doesn't want to silence the crowd. What needs to happen is that the booers who were like me, those who are getting caught up in the emotion of seemingly being called racist or being told you can't have the right to boo or react in the crowd, we need to stop.

Let the racists boo. Hopefully they are the few. The rest of will stop and make it just how obvious those *******s are.

EDIT: I fear no one will read this.

I feel kinda similar, but on the "War Dance" incident I think it was a very poorly thought out act by Goodes at the very least.

Just prior to the indigenous I recall Goodes highlighting racism at footy again as you would expect, and I have absolute no issue with that and I applaud him for keeping the discussion going. But surely he must have known there is a sensitivity surrounding him and alleged racists AFL supporters?

Now on the "war Dance" I understand it isn't this "Traditional" dance that people keep going on about, but more something is being brought into the game from inspiration of how the Maoris use the HAKA. The Haka has a rich history and is certainly traditional and has a identity that people can recognize and know what it is. But what exactly is the Indigenous War dance that is suppose to be so traditional? I certainly don't have have an issue with Indigenous players trying to bring in a "War Dance" and grow it into something of tradition, but the way Goodes has used the "War Dance" really confuses me in what he was thinking.

So come to the Indigenous round and think of supporters be wary of the sensitivities surrounding Goodes and Racism, and Goodes does a celebration or "War Dance" and makes a bee line towards a bemused looking section of the crowd. What followed was amazing and something the AFL have completely managed poorly. The AFL's security guards then flooded the area as if to be looking for the next Adam Goodes racist and cameras were glued regularly to get in on the action. Goodes would have seen such the response from the security and surely would have known what the fans in that section went through in the aftermath. The AFL then who has its security obviously looking for the next racists washed their hands with it by trying to tell us they were there on an unrelated matter!! Goodes response is that it was just a war dance. Turns out the crowd is innocent and Goodes got his Indigenous round moment in the sun.

Now what degree of hate or what ever word you want to use towards Goodes prior to the Indigenous Round... he just didn't do himself any favors and it is no surprise that people didn't buy his "War Dance" explanation. And if his intentions were that pure (only Goodes would know), it baffles me how he didn't see how his actions could be perceived.

Just so poorly thought out

Does he deserve the relentless boo from that? Well I wouldn't boo him but I understand why the natural booing fans of the AFL choose to and Majority aren't doing it for racist reason like some people like to make us think

 

[Fruit_Platter]

No. We learn from the past. And we have. Last time I checked Any Australian regardless of colour is allowed to vote and are subjected to the same laws. This wasn't always the case.

If anything, affirmative action (an abhorrent concept) has seen white people discriminated against. Quotas, for instance.

White people being discriminated? that is abhorrent. Best we stick to discriminating those dark people then.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

She claimed she wasn't being racist. And we have to take her at her word. She used the word "ape" because he was a big hairy man. Jason Dunstall gets called a gorilla all the time.

Goodes may have taken it as racist, but there is no evidence that her comments were based on race. They were based on his bearded appearance.

Yeah I said some really hurtful ignorant things when I was 13 too. My parents, or my teachers, or my siblings, or my friends, or my elders pulled me up on it and left me in no doubt about what is right and correct. Good on Goodesy.

 

[Dan26]

If no one cares about his race, why are so many of you consistently referring to incidents involving race?

Those that boo Goodes don't care about his race.

The booers are rejecting Goodes himself, not the race he belongs to. The booers are rejecting Goodes own opinions and actions about race.

 

[Tiges1229]

Media have really gone ballistic on this story in the last 3 days.

 

[romeohwho]

No. We learn from the past. And we have. Last time I checked Any Australian regardless of colour is allowed to vote and are subjected to the same laws. This wasn't always the case.

If anything, affirmative action (an abhorrent concept) has seen white people discriminated against. Quotas, for instance.

Yep and last time I looked Adam Goodes quite correctly pointed out that the constitution has a clause that can 'stop people from voting on the basis of their skin colour.'

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

Those that boo Goodes don't care about his race.

The booers are rejecting Goodes himself, not the race he belongs to. The booers are rejecting Goodes own opinions and actions about race.

So you keep saying, without a scintilla of proof.

 

[Dan26]

Yeah I said some really hurtful ignorant things when I was 13 too. My parents, or my teachers, or my siblings, or my friends or my elders pulled me up on it and left me in no doubt about what is right and correct. Good on Goodesy.

You don't think pointing to the crowd, pointing out a 13 year old, made him look like a bully, and was one of several factors that has contributed to people not liking him?

Obviously that incident contributed to making Goodes look sooky, over-the-top and appear to be a bully.

And the fans reject that. Listen to them.

 

[Tiges1229]

Calm down, I just supplied you with his quote and you are still in denial. Take off your blinkers and read the words.
Jason Dunstall is not indigenous.

Dunstall is from Planet of the Apes .

 

[Summer Nights]

Massacres of aboriginal people did happen, the last massacre was in the 1930s known as the Conniston massacre.Why is it so hard to acknowledge the wrongs that have been committed. That is how we move forward as a country. By the way my grandmother survived the Conniston massacre but her younger siblings did not. I never heard my grandparents talk ill of white people in general. People need to read a book called Blood on the wattle.

Massacres of Aborigines was also common by Aborigines as part of regular tribal warfare. The settlers did wrongs by our standards today. So did Aborigines.

 

[sherb]

So you keep saying, without a scintilla of proof.

Apparently Dan has surveyed them all. Either that or he has completed his Diploma of Advanced Mass Mind Reading.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

You don't think pointing to the crowd, pointing out a 13 year old, made him look like a bully, and was one of several factors that has contributed to people not liking him?

Obviously that incident contributed to making Goodes look sooky, over-the-top and appear to be a bully.

And the fans reject that. Listen to them.

You're an expert on how to immaculately respond to racial taunts from an unknown crowd member with grace and savoir-faire when playing in front of 50K people and hundreds of thousands more via TV?

Do go on, and please first table you credentials.

 

[romeohwho]

Those that boo Goodes don't care about his race.

The booers are rejecting Goodes himself, not the race he belongs to. The booers are rejecting Goodes own opinions and actions about race.

So when he objects to being called an ape-that is his problem?
When he points out that racism exists-that is his problem?
When he highlights flaws in the constitution-its his issue?
When he points out that indigenous suffered after the arrival of the Europeans-his problem?
When he quite correctly refers to it as invasion day- his issue.
Yet you are the one who is taking issue with all these things.

 

[BFVirgin]

My ancestors to my knowledge committed no thefts, rapes or murders. I presume Goodes European ancestors didn't either.

I'm so happy for you.
For the descendants of convicts on BF, shame on you, how dare you be here - back to a hulk on the Thames!

 

[Choomah]

You don't think pointing to the crowd, pointing out a 13 year old, made him look like a bully, and was one of several factors that has contributed to people not liking him?

Obviously that incident contributed to making Goodes look sooky, over-the-top and appear to be a bully.

And the fans reject that. Listen to them.

He gets racially abused and his the bully? Ok

 

[Dan26]

So you keep saying, without a scintilla of proof.

There is no proof that the fans are booing him because he is Aboriginal. None.It's not up to me to prove that people are NOT racist, when the majoirty of people we know are not racist.

Given that racist people are a minority it's up to YOU to prove they are racist, if you think they are.

So, I'll say it again: The people boong Goodes do not care about his race. At all. They are booing Goodes the man, and are booing Goodes own opinion and actions on race.

They are not booing the Aboriginal race. Only an idiot would think that. if you think that then YOU'RE the one that needs to prove it, because it is a highly inflammatory claim.

 

[DrEvil_]

I think we could get even more inventive then that.

Can you imagine the offense if that was Goodes' face?

 

[Cyclonus]

Massacres of Aborigines was also common by Aborigines as part of regular tribal warfare. The settlers did wrongs by our standards today. So did Aborigines.

It's true, and an interesting fact, but hardly relevant to this discussion. That was the way of life for an indigenous tribe for 40,000 years. Shit got ****ed up when Europeans came. Disease and alcohol, with no resistance to either. Terrible idea. War was waged by both sides. Murder was undertaken by both sides. Guns tend to win out. Not to mention the view that murdering the indigenous was no different to killing an animal. It was an invasion. Aborigines are fair minded in that view.

 

[hardon]

i like your silent, but undeniably solid contributions.

 

[DrEvil_]

Ugh, just opened the thread for the first time and checked the poll result. Absolutely puerile. Just leave the man alone.

I hoped you voted Jack Watts...

 

[Dan26]

Yep and last time I looked Adam Goodes quite correctly pointed out that the constitution has a clause that can 'stop people from voting on the basis of their skin colour.'

I've got no idea whether that's true, but it's irrelevant because it would never be acted upon. We all know that everyone in this country can vote regardless of skin colour.

 

[sparklig]

This labelling everything 'left-right' bullshit has to stop. It's corrupted so many minds and warped anything worth discussing.

We can't even have this discussion that is clearly overdue without it becoming a parochial shit fight.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

There is no proof that the fans are booing him because he is Aboriginal. None.It's not up to me to prove that people are NOT racist, when the majoirty of people we know are not racist.

Given that racist people are a minority it's up to YOU to prove they are racist, if you think they are.

So, I'll say it again: The people boong Goodes do not care about his race. At all. They are booing Goodes the man, and are booing Goodes own opinion and actions on race.

They are not booing the Aboriginal race. Only an idiot would think that. if you think that then YOU'RE the one that needs to prove it, because it is a highly inflammatory claim.

Who is saying ALL the people booing him are racist?

This is what I repeatedly see you folk claiming, yet I see very few people actually saying that at all. And the few that are can be safely ignored.

Some people booing Goodes are racist. Some are not. Really don't see that any reasonable person would take issue with that.

 

[Balony_pony16]

Massacres of aboriginal people did happen, the last massacre was in the 1930s known as the Conniston massacre.Why is it so hard to acknowledge the wrongs that have been committed. That is how we move forward as a country. By the way my grandmother survived the Conniston massacre but her younger siblings did not. I never heard my grandparents talk ill of white people in general. People need to read a book called Blood on the wattle.

Will look out for it