The war against renewable energy

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nut said:
Absolute Murdoch news Rubbish.
EV sales are growing world wide despite tariffs set by the US, Canada and Europe.


Meanwhile, total EV sales grew by 21% in Q2 2024 vs. Q2 2023, while ICE sales fell by 9% in the same period.

www.strategyand.pwc.com

Electric Vehicle Sales Review Q2-2024

Strategy& and PwC Autofacts® have analyzed electric vehicle sales worldwide in the second quarter of 2024.
www.strategyand.pwc.com www.strategyand.pwc.com
Click to expand...

Didn't realise the Australian Automobile Association was a Murdoch news rubbish

Electric Vehicle Index - Australian Automobile Association

www.aaa.asn.au www.aaa.asn.au

In the past 12 months, Hybrids have grown 7.5% to 14.9% of the market. Battery EV have declined from 8.7 to 8%

Also the PW report is also saying that nearly all of the growth in EVs is due to hybrids.
 
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Captivating said:
Market share has dropped from 8.7% to 8%. So yes, that's a decline.

BEV sales dropped from 25,696 to 25,353. That's a growth of minus 343 🤣
Click to expand...

It can be more complicated.
Market share includes all cars.
Those people who bought MG3's were never going to buy electric cars.
They bought a new MG with 10 years warranty rather than buying a 10 year old Corolla .

Kind of funny people were saying Australia didn't have a big enough market for an Auto industry.
MG only sell 300 000 cars or so per year in China. BYD sell well over a million ( and they sell a 10 000 cheapy hatch too ).
If you are selling 300 000 cars, adding 50 000 in Australia is not chicken feed.
 
SaintsSeptember said:
It can be more complicated.
Market share includes all cars.
Those people who bought MG3's were never going to buy electric cars.
They bought a new MG with 10 years warranty rather than buying a 10 year old Corolla .

Kind of funny people were saying Australia didn't have a big enough market for an Auto industry.
MG only sell 300 000 cars or so per year in China. BYD sell well over a million ( and they sell a 10 000 cheapy hatch too ).
If you are selling 300 000 cars, adding 50 000 in Australia is not chicken feed.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't try and over complicate it. Better to just stick with actual sales results rather than trying to understand a buyers motive.

The BEV market has flatlined and hybrids have over taken them as the second most popular drivetrain type. The reports of the ICE's demise were greatly exaggerated.

Also, Australia isn't big enough for an Auto manufacturing industry. We could never compete with MG selling cars so cheaply.
 
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Maybe people understand as technology improves, not rushing to change to electric cars is smart , as they will get better

It’s called the bleeding edge.

Mind you at work we had Prius 20 years ago.
 
peetoo said:
Maybe people understand as technology improves, not rushing to change to electric cars is smart , as they will get better

It’s called the bleeding edge.

Mind you at work we had Prius 20 years ago.
Click to expand...

Of course. The early adopters have come and gone and to try to encourage others to switch, EV companies have slashed the price to the point of dumping.

I think most people think that the idea of plugging in a car to charge is ludicrous. The 1990's called and want their extension lead back.

Self-charging gives you the best of both worlds.
 
Captivating said:
I wouldn't try and over complicate it. Better to just stick with actual sales results rather than trying to understand a buyers motive.

The BEV market has flatlined and hybrids have over taken them as the second most popular drivetrain type. The reports of the ICE's demise were greatly exaggerated.

Also, Australia isn't big enough for an Auto manufacturing industry. We could never compete with MG selling cars so cheaply.
Click to expand...

If you don't want to over complicate it, don't talk about % market share, talk about actual number of EV's.
Not to say that the ICE is about to go away. ( In Europe a lot of the people with knowledge about engine design had been sacked , they are now wanting to hire people and struggling to find the expertise ).

A decade ago you could buy a rear wheel drive large SUV for $35000.
Compared to what you can get now the differences are :
Didn't have a Tablet bolted to the dashboard.
Didn't fall apart before 200 000km.
Prices haven't doubled.

The main issue with the Auto industry here is that it was owned, and not supported by Americans. ( Toyota would have stayed if the others stayed ). Decision to pull out made during a time of temporary high Australian Dollar value.
We signed a free trade agreement with Thailand, they then threw an environmental tax onto their system that precluded the Australian cars ( based on engine size ). The Australian built cars were historically good value, they didn't fit in with their parent companies plans for shared platforms. Instead they made other garbage that failed.
GM genuinely thought that Holden would sell more cars by importing.
The Ford Rangers you see everywhere were designed in Australia.

Based on Chinese surveys , MG are not a particularly reliable or high selling car in China.
 
SaintsSeptember said:
If you don't want to over complicate it, don't talk about % market share, talk about actual number of EV's.
Not to say that the ICE is about to go away. ( In Europe a lot of the people with knowledge about engine design had been sacked , they are now wanting to hire people and struggling to find the expertise ).

A decade ago you could buy a rear wheel drive large SUV for $35000.
Compared to what you can get now the differences are :
Didn't have a Tablet bolted to the dashboard.
Didn't fall apart before 200 000km.
Prices haven't doubled.

The main issue with the Auto industry here is that it was owned, and not supported by Americans. ( Toyota would have stayed if the others stayed ). Decision to pull out made during a time of temporary high Australian Dollar value.
We signed a free trade agreement with Thailand, they then threw an environmental tax onto their system that precluded the Australian cars ( based on engine size ). The Australian built cars were historically good value, they didn't fit in with their parent companies plans for shared platforms. Instead they made other garbage that failed.
GM genuinely thought that Holden would sell more cars by importing.
The Ford Rangers you see everywhere were designed in Australia.

Based on Chinese surveys , MG are not a particularly reliable or high selling car in China.
Click to expand...

I did. The number of BEV's sold in Q2 '24 25,343, less than the 25,696 sold in Q2 '23 months before that. Cut t he numbers every which way and you get to the same conclusion that BEVs have stagnated.

Hybrids 46,727 compared to 22,212. Hence the Murdoch biased media headlines
 
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Captivating said:
Of course. The early adopters have come and gone and to try to encourage others to switch, EV companies have slashed the price to the point of dumping.

I think most people think that the idea of plugging in a car to charge is ludicrous. The 1990's called and want their extension lead back.

Self-charging gives you the best of both worlds.
Click to expand...

Want to buy a Phone off me , it has a little motor in it, you just need to keep filling it up with petrol. Pain in the ass but duhhh who wants that 1990s plug in technology in their phone. :drunk:
Self charging is just a petrol motor with an alternative transmission.

How about self charging with the option to plug in?
 
Captivating said:
I did. The number of BEV's sold over the past 12 months was 25,343, less than the 25,696 sold in the 12 months before that. Cut t he numbers every which way and you get to the same conclusion that BEVs have stagnated.

Hybrids 46,727 compared to 22,212. Hence the Murdoch biased media headlines
Click to expand...

I think you'll find there was a period where Tesla 3's weren't available here, then there was a sales surge.
I wouldn't just look at 2 years results.

roadgenius.com

Australia EV Sales Statistics - How Many EVs in 2023?

In 2023, electric car sales in Australia hit 98,409 units, marking a 60% growth compared to 2022. Hybrid vehicles (HEVs) led the market, with 101,439 units sold.
roadgenius.com

so 2024 is around the same as 2023?
 
SaintsSeptember said:
Want to buy a Phone off me , it has a little motor in it, you just need to keep filling it up with petrol. Pain in the ass but duhhh who wants that 1990s plug in technology in their phone. :drunk:
Self charging is just a petrol motor with an alternative transmission.

How about self charging with the option to plug in?
Click to expand...

No one wants plug in on their phone. Why do you think most phones have shifted to wireless charging.
 
Captivating said:
No one wants plug in on their phone. Why do you think most phones have shifted to wireless charging.
Click to expand...

Wireless charging is just a less efficient way of connecting your phone to the power grid.
You could do it with cars too ( in principle ) but.....less efficient.

You confuse technology with fashion.
Plugging in a battery to charge it is not a fashion associated with a particular decade.
 

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SaintsSeptember said:
Wireless charging is just a less efficient way of connecting your phone to the power grid.
You could do it with cars too ( in principle ) but.....less efficient.





You confuse technology with fashion.
Plugging in a battery to charge it is not a fashion associated with a particular decade.
Click to expand...

The tech is ancient. Battery tech has been around for eons and hybrids have been mainstream in the locomotive industry since the diesel electric was introduced 100 years ago.

What you call fashion is convenience. Hybrids offer huge convenience. Get over 1,000km per fill and no need to charge anything.

Something’s happening in the market for hybrids to be gaining popularity. Be interesting to see Q4 24 sales data to see if the price drop of BEV had an impact
 
Captivating said:
But on the same day, the price was also positive....so people using a kettle had to pay.
Click to expand...
I'm with Amber, I also have a battery and a 6.7kw solar system. My systems setup so I can export to the grid when prices spike, and import when prices are negative/low. Ive had days when my battery is 100%, I'm producing through my system and the prices in the grid are negative, so I can import and run my house for nothing. My last bill for Sept was $4.85, and I've had times when my systems identified a price spike and it's exported to the grid and earnt me over $12 per kw I've exported.
 
Captivating said:
Engie in my hood offers 12c for the first 8 kWh, then 3.3 thereafter. But, I have to pay more than 20c more for grid power. So using more than 5kWH off the grid makes Engie more expensive.

Amber ain't much better either. The peak rates are crippling.

Also, do you get 10c uncapped. Because, my research of NSW essential energy plan tells me the FIT is either fixed at 5.5c or 12c for the first 8kwH and then 5.5 thereafter but only if your inverter is 10KwH or less.
Click to expand...
Amber has Bill Guarantee Rates that are applicable for your area, Im with Powercor so we receive a credit to our bill if this rates exceeded.


We guarantee that over the course of each quarter you'll never pay more than your applicable Bill Guarantee rate on average for your usage, or we will credit you the difference.
Click to expand...
 
Elroo said:
Amber has Bill Guarantee Rates that are applicable for your area, Im with Powercor so we receive a credit to our bill if this rates exceeded.

Click to expand...
That's an average over an entire month, which doesn't help if you use 395KwH at 10c and then 5kWh at $18. You'd still be billed $129.8 as the cap prevents you paying more than $135.4 (400kWh x 33.85). If you went with Tango, you'd pay $58 for the same 400kWh.
 
Captivating said:
The tech is ancient. Battery tech has been around for eons and hybrids have been mainstream in the locomotive industry since the diesel electric was introduced 100 years ago.

What you call fashion is convenience. Hybrids offer huge convenience. Get over 1,000km per fill and no need to charge anything.

Something’s happening in the market for hybrids to be gaining popularity. Be interesting to see Q4 24 sales data to see if the price drop of BEV had an impact
Click to expand...

But you don't find it inconvenient to put petrol in your Petrol powered electric drive train vehicle.
You're being silly.
 
Captivating said:
Kia Aust CEO says demand for EV has plummeted. He halved the sales target of his EV5 from 10,000 to 5,000.
Click to expand...

Maybe people are waiting for the wave of new options on the horizon, like th Zpeng Mona base model that has over 500km range and will retail at $16800USD…. I know I am.

Let the bloodbath continue.
 

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