Toast Tom Lonergan

[InnocentBystandr]

He coming along well, Cloke was getting the better of Harry early and Tom was moved onto him and shut him down. Well done.

 

[noclashjumpers]

I criticised him recently for his lack of awareness and decision making in tight situations.

Well, he was great in that area tonight. Well done.

 

[DanA]

I'd have given him votes for his performance. Shut down Cloke completely

 

[Brasil2007]

A lot less fumbly tonight below his feet too.

I still reckon he's unfairly assessed on that performance against Brisbane last year when half the team was out, the ball was getting pumped in regularly and J Brown was running riot. Nobody would have stopped Brown that night, and there was bugger all Lonners could do.

 

[WindShear]

Loners was superb tonight, he gave Cloke a bath after CLoke looked dangerous early

 

[vealesy]

Cloke is useless anyway.

How many turnovers were due to poor decisions by Lonergan last night.

I lost count after 3.

 

[Gaz_Brownlow]

Cloke is useless anyway.

How many turnovers were due to poor decisions by Lonergan last night.

I lost count after 3.

Vealesy, mate you should concentrate on the good things a little more. Lonergan was superb, took a challenging role up and succeeded - did his job fantastically and in my eyes really cemented his position tonight.

The whole geelong team contributed to some very unusal turnovers in the first half - the forward 50 entry was very poor, but mainly due to the huge collingwood press. Lonergans disposal on the whole was above that of the majority of his team mates!

 

[Turbocat]

Ask Taylor if he wants him in the side.
The last two weeks , he has played on players I thought he might struggle with
Yet last night on Cloke , who a bit like our Tom , has hit some form , he shut him down when he was giving Harry probs. He is still not the guy I want to see trying finesse the ball , much rather him belt the crap out it to someone further up the field but bit by bit he is becoming a true , reliable Cat defender


As far as others in the V's go. I think Drum and Gillies will give us the chance to build replacements for the future.Both will see an aging backline that is worth working to be a part of. Drum especially know what life is like on the other side of the street If this is Dasher last year , either will be pushing for his spot next year.

I doubt TL is going anywhere now.He deserves credit , he has played his way into a Premiership side , secured his spot on the list and he is no longer the last picked in the best 22

 

[Gaz_Brownlow]

Drum is still a long way off playing senior football for the cats....has potential, but definitely needs a stack of hard work behind him before he will be an adequate replacement for Milburn!!

Gillies is apparently stepping up, and was pleasing to hear Egan rate his game last week as the best of his career. Laidler should not be forgotten as well - has the potential, just needs to bide his time and put the extra grunt work in!!

Lonergan though has done his time - the hard way - and is now reaping rewards. Will never be a gun, but is a good honest performer.

 

[Gavin Excell]

I admit to being a critic.

But he has been very good and never thought I'd say this about him, self assured in defence.

 

[Exhale You]

Cloke was cutting Harry up, the switch was made, Lonners went to him and tore him a new one.

Cloke has been the form forward of the competition of late and looks ominous early against Harry but Tom went to him and completely quelled his influence, to the point where one wouldn't have even known he was out there.

Tom still has moments where his hands aren't as clean as they should be, especially in big matches but we must remember that he was our second least experienced player last night.

Odd blip aside he's been superb this year and despite weekly calls for his omission, he's earned his spot and will justifiably keep it, at least in the short term.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Lonergan's value is really only to shut down opponents. Admittedly he did well on Cloke last night, but in this team is it enough to hold your spot?? Lonergan's position is really going to be determined by who we play and match ups. Unfortunately he doesnt really have the versatility to play elsewhere.

FWIW I really want to see him get a premiership, after Pods, would be the fairytale of the season.

 

[Turbocat]

Lonergan's value is really only to shut down opponents. Admittedly he did well on Cloke last night, but in this team is it enough to hold your spot?? Lonergan's position is really going to be determined by who we play and match ups. Unfortunately he doesnt really have the versatility to play elsewhere.

FWIW I really want to see him get a premiership, after Pods, would be the fairytale of the season.

Surely Ling ,perhaps Blake would also qualify as guys who are at their best as shut downs. If Lonergan could do nothing else but take down the best forward from every side we play the rest of the year , he would be one of the first picked

 

[meto]

Still has only played 40 Games and most players need to get over 50 games before they show their best.
I know he is 25 but he basically lost 2 development years because of his injury.
When Drum comes back Lonergan may have to fight for his position but at the momement he is doing a good job.

So far this season he's allowed others to have far more freedom than they previously would have namely Mackie and Millburn who both earned 30 possessions coming out of the defence, not bad!!!!

Lonners has taken the tallest of the forwards, and pretty much towelled the lot so far this year, not a bad effort for someone you want to throw out, in favor of who???? Who else do we have who could contain the likes of John Brown, Chris Dawes, Cloke etc, besides seniors.
Last night it was his 18 Pozzies Vs Dawes with 6, surely you can appreciate the value of such a contribution as this.
Taking on the oppositions best forward talls is no easy task, considering this is his first season as a full member of the senior team and such responsibility.
I'd say he's warmed to the task extremely well, and getting stronger by the game.
No wonder Bomber is singing his praise!

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Lonergan is doing great.

Showing improvement I didn't think he had in him at all.

Will make for a very interesting selection dilemma when 2nd ruckman is picked and/or Ottens returns, because I can't see him being dropped while he's playing like this.

 

[meto]

Thought his containment of Kozzie was a highlight, certainly has the heart and the talent as a key post defender, has been a bonus for our defence group.

 

[candiehappy]

Re: Toast Tom Lonergan

there is no doubt that he has really stepped up and is becoming a key defender that can be relied apon. A bit Byrnes perhaps? The coaching staff saw more in him than the fickle supporters?

 

[SJ]

Re: Toast Tom Lonergan

Although I have always been a Lonergan supporter I feel that his inclusion has created an issue down back as Scarlett now doesn't have a job and we are going in too tall. Yes Scarlett is allowed to be more loose, however I feel he can create more damaging by taking a key forward and hurting him the other way. It is no coincidence that in the two games we've convincingly lost, we have been torn to shreds by the small forwards.

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

Torn to pieces by small forwards, yeah I've noticed that. I know both are lightning quick and can tackle ferociously, but how would Varcoe & Byrnes actually go minding/running off a small forward each? Mackie & Milburn both know how to kick a goal, so a rotation with Telly and the Poison Dwarf might be worth a shot.

Is this something that's actually worth a try?

EDIT: Well done Lonners!!!!

 

[iloveleigh]

I gained alot of respect for Lonergan on friday. He always played in front, and beat Kosi very, very convincingly. Rather than waiting at the back or spoiling from the back, he stood his ground and it worked. Well done Tom Lonergan

 

[Generalissimo]

Rather than waiting at the back or spoiling from the back, he stood his ground and it worked.

When you consider that he copped a nearly fatal injury by playing in front, it just proves how gutsy and determined he is.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Playing on a cardboard cut out is not that hard, but that said, Tom was very good. His spoiling is great and for me the highlight is he now gets involved and makes the right decisions when handballing etc. Coming along well this year.

 

[Partridge]

Re: Toast Tom Lonergan

Although I have always been a Lonergan supporter I feel that his inclusion has created an issue down back as Scarlett now doesn't have a job and we are going in too tall. Yes Scarlett is allowed to be more loose, however I feel he can create more damaging by taking a key forward and hurting him the other way. It is no coincidence that in the two games we've convincingly lost, we have been torn to shreds by the small forwards.

Spot on SJ, could not agree more. There have been three games this year where I feel the selection committee have made some real blunders - playing Motlop in Round 2 (when he's about 2 years away from being physically ready), playing Rooke in Round 6, and Friday night.

Firstly - Ryan Gamble. I get the distinct impression they're trying to make him a defender just to be stubborn. It's great to work on your defensive skills, it doesn't mean every player can become a great defender. Gamble got ripped up by Schneider, and just think what could have happened if not for his goals in the first half. I don't think Gamble's up to it - but they haven't done him any favours.

Most importantly - Matthew Scarlett. There has been a disturbing arrogance growing among supporters and seemingly the coaching staff too this season. This whole "play Lonergan at full back allowing Scarlett to be freed up blah blah blah".

It is complete bullshit.

For a start, Scarlett has never had any problems getting the ball playing as a fullback. And he's a once in a generation defender. Fans here seem to think he's finished and should be hidden or something. The fact is - if he does not line up at full back, it helps the opposition. It does NOT help us.

Example one - Hawthorn in Round 2. Scarlett was stupidly put on Campbell Brown (real goalkicking threat there), and Brown simply ran away from the ball all day and took Scarlett out of the action. We managed to win regardless and could easily have lost.

Example two - Scarlett came back against Sydney in Round 7 and took on a redhot Daniel Bradshaw. The result? Scarlett slaughtered him, and we had perhaps our most impressive win for the season. If anyone is dumb enough to think he's slipping as a footballer that game was compelling evidence to the contrary.

Lonergan has improved considerably - proving me wrong among others. But, I'll say this again and again, just because he's become reliable doesn't mean he gets first choice on key forwards when we've got the competition's best key defender alongside him. It absolutely smacks of arrogance. It's one thing to make tweaks where things aren't right, but moving Scarlett away from full back is trying to fix something tha is absolutely not broken.

SJ is dead right, the balance of our side Friday night was way out. We dropped two midfielders - Hogan and Chapman, for a key forward and a key defender. Meaning our backline had Scarlett, Taylor, Lonergan and Mackie. In wet conditions. Terrible decision making. And the small forwards duly killed us.

I used to think the club knew what they were doing at selection and you could trust them to make the right decision. I'm not so sure now. Scarlett MUST play full back, where he has for his entire career. Taylor plays centre half back, and Lonergan plays as a third tall defender. We continue to screw with that formula and I'm very wary of our chances in September.

I really hope they are paying attention. I hope some of the more mindless fans temper their misplaced arrogance too.

 

[witsend]

Re: Toast Tom Lonergan

Spot on SJ, could not agree more. There have been three games this year where I feel the selection committee have made some real blunders - playing Motlop in Round 2 (when he's about 2 years away from being physically ready), playing Rooke in Round 6, and Friday night.

Firstly - Ryan Gamble. I get the distinct impression they're trying to make him a defender just to be stubborn. It's great to work on your defensive skills, it doesn't mean every player can become a great defender. Gamble got ripped up by Schneider, and just think what could have happened if not for his goals in the first half. I don't think Gamble's up to it - but they haven't done him any favours.

Most importantly - Matthew Scarlett. There has been a disturbing arrogance growing among supporters and seemingly the coaching staff too this season. This whole "play Lonergan at full back allowing Scarlett to be freed up blah blah blah".

It is complete bullshit.

For a start, Scarlett has never had any problems getting the ball playing as a fullback. And he's a once in a generation defender. Fans here seem to think he's finished and should be hidden or something. The fact is - if he does not line up at full back, it helps the opposition. It does NOT help us.

Example one - Hawthorn in Round 2. Scarlett was stupidly put on Campbell Brown (real goalkicking threat there), and Brown simply ran away from the ball all day and took Scarlett out of the action. We managed to win regardless and could easily have lost.

Example two - Scarlett came back against Sydney in Round 7 and took on a redhot Daniel Bradshaw. The result? Scarlett slaughtered him, and we had perhaps our most impressive win for the season. If anyone is dumb enough to think he's slipping as a footballer that game was compelling evidence to the contrary.

Lonergan has improved considerably - proving me wrong among others. But, I'll say this again and again, just because he's become reliable doesn't mean he gets first choice on key forwards when we've got the competition's best key defender alongside him. It absolutely smacks of arrogance. It's one thing to make tweaks where things aren't right, but moving Scarlett away from full back is trying to fix something tha is absolutely not broken.

SJ is dead right, the balance of our side Friday night was way out. We dropped two midfielders - Hogan and Chapman, for a key forward and a key defender. Meaning our backline had Scarlett, Taylor, Lonergan and Mackie. In wet conditions. Terrible decision making. And the small forwards duly killed us.

I used to think the club knew what they were doing at selection and you could trust them to make the right decision. I'm not so sure now. Scarlett MUST play full back, where he has for his entire career. Taylor plays centre half back, and Lonergan plays as a third tall defender. We continue to screw with that formula and I'm very wary of our chances in September.

I really hope they are paying attention. I hope some of the more mindless fans temper their misplaced arrogance too.

Bomber will play people in the right position in Finals.
We didn't want to lose on Friday, but no way did we pull all stops out to win.
A loss like that also gives bomber ammunition to nip arrogance in the bud.
Have faith...2 weeks ago we were playing the best footy we ever have, without 5-6 topliners.
A week is a long time in footy...

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Re: Toast Tom Lonergan

Spot on SJ, could not agree more. There have been three games this year where I feel the selection committee have made some real blunders - playing Motlop in Round 2 (when he's about 2 years away from being physically ready), playing Rooke in Round 6, and Friday night.

Firstly - Ryan Gamble. I get the distinct impression they're trying to make him a defender just to be stubborn. It's great to work on your defensive skills, it doesn't mean every player can become a great defender. Gamble got ripped up by Schneider, and just think what could have happened if not for his goals in the first half. I don't think Gamble's up to it - but they haven't done him any favours.

Most importantly - Matthew Scarlett. There has been a disturbing arrogance growing among supporters and seemingly the coaching staff too this season. This whole "play Lonergan at full back allowing Scarlett to be freed up blah blah blah".

It is complete bullshit.

For a start, Scarlett has never had any problems getting the ball playing as a fullback. And he's a once in a generation defender. Fans here seem to think he's finished and should be hidden or something. The fact is - if he does not line up at full back, it helps the opposition. It does NOT help us.

Example one - Hawthorn in Round 2. Scarlett was stupidly put on Campbell Brown (real goalkicking threat there), and Brown simply ran away from the ball all day and took Scarlett out of the action. We managed to win regardless and could easily have lost.

Example two - Scarlett came back against Sydney in Round 7 and took on a redhot Daniel Bradshaw. The result? Scarlett slaughtered him, and we had perhaps our most impressive win for the season. If anyone is dumb enough to think he's slipping as a footballer that game was compelling evidence to the contrary.

Lonergan has improved considerably - proving me wrong among others. But, I'll say this again and again, just because he's become reliable doesn't mean he gets first choice on key forwards when we've got the competition's best key defender alongside him. It absolutely smacks of arrogance. It's one thing to make tweaks where things aren't right, but moving Scarlett away from full back is trying to fix something tha is absolutely not broken.

SJ is dead right, the balance of our side Friday night was way out. We dropped two midfielders - Hogan and Chapman, for a key forward and a key defender. Meaning our backline had Scarlett, Taylor, Lonergan and Mackie. In wet conditions. Terrible decision making. And the small forwards duly killed us.

I used to think the club knew what they were doing at selection and you could trust them to make the right decision. I'm not so sure now. Scarlett MUST play full back, where he has for his entire career. Taylor plays centre half back, and Lonergan plays as a third tall defender. We continue to screw with that formula and I'm very wary of our chances in September.

I really hope they are paying attention. I hope some of the more mindless fans temper their misplaced arrogance too.

I agree with you, and SJ, although I'd like to separate the points about a) scarlett or lonergan playing full back and b) us dealing with small forwards because to me they're completely separate.

On a), obviously Scarlett should always play on the most dangerous key forward the opposition has. Lonergan has proved me wrong at least at the moment and so on form should play, but yes, he should not take Scarlett's role. So I would always still (as we go forward this year) want to see Scarlett line up on Franklin, Hall etc. Obviously maybe Lonergan has to relieve at times with rotations etc but he shouldn't be the primary opponent.

One exception however is if the opposition's most dangerous forward is a small, then I have no problem with our premier defender (Scarlett) playing there. The problem with him on Campbell Brown was not that he was shifted to a small forward, but that he wasn't shifted to a dangerous one.

In regards to b) I don't believe the argument that Lonergan as a third back makes us too tall or is why we are vulernable to small forwards. Think about it hypothetically, let's say you took Lonergan out and went back to two talls, and brought someone in to mind a dangerous opposition small? the problem is that player doesn't presently exist (i.e. we don't have him). So I think people need to realise that while we may have had too many talls in defence in the wet on friday, that's not the real issue. The real issue is that we need to develop a player for this specific role, as some other sides have. Whether it's Taylor Hunt, or as Geelong sicko suggested, a Varcoe type ends up there, that's what we need to do.

With Gamble, I don't mind him playing defence at vfl level if that's where a gap needs to be plugged in games, but to play him defence at afl level when he clearly won't make it there is silly. If he plays again it should be forward.

On selection, I agree dropping midfielders for talls isn't ideal. That said, Hogan doesn't deserve a game on present form so I have no problem with him being dropped and a tall coming in if that's who we have. So long as the balance is redressed when senior players are back from injuries.

Like you, I have issues with faith in match committee, especially given Motlop and Rooke this year, which is why I fully expect come about round 18 Pods will get dropped so someone like Mackie can keep his gold pass, and when there's a late injury Pods won't come in because Gamble will be the inclusion and he'll play half back

Re arrogance I agree...we have a tough run home and we need to win games, thus while I'm happy to be conservative with injuries, I want to see everyone who is fit to play, play.