Strategy Trade and List management Thread Part 5 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

[doggiesin08]

The uncomfortable question needs to be asked - is the premiership window still open? Will these recruits keep it open?

Our defence needs a big name rock solid general, not a couple of cleanskin 3rd talls. I think & hope our midfield and attack could still win us a premiership, but the backs are looking shoddy. We need a change in gamestyle and some genuine talent.

Agree with that and I'd be happy (or rather ok) with potentially overpaying for Collins plus bringing in Jones and Lobb too ... but not wasting list spots on blokes who it's not even clear are improvements on our own fringe players.

We've been torched by players dropping off completely versus their prior levels through a combination of injuries and unexplained form, namely Hunter, Crozier, Vandermeer, Williams, JJ (to a degree), Wallis, Duryea, McLean, Bruce, Keath. Some of those will never get back to prior performance levels but getting Williams and McLean back to their best, Duryea being fit, and Bruce and Keath getting even half-way back to their 2021 levels versus where they were in 2022 would make a bigger difference than any incomings.

 

[DognBones]

Some of the players discussed in this thread as possible trade targets are depressingly underwhelming. Rather than cream we seem to be willing to accept sour milk. We'll already be carrying several stop-gap types into next season, don't want any more. Hopefully we take our best picks to the draft and create some much needed renewal.

 

[Barking Mad]

All this talk of 190-192cm backs. Luke Cleary didn’t look out of place and seems to have a lot of composure and is a more than tidy kick. We might be pleasantly surprised after another 1-2 preseasons

 

[CDBulldog]

There is going to be a heck of a lot of competition for starting spots next year by the sounds of the trades being thrown up. Unfortunately it’s for the vfl….

 

[Flags_In_The_Bag]

Excellent observation except for the part re Bailey Smith who is still needs to buy into the team/club ethos.

I had the courage to listen to the Ads and Dunks podcast when they had Naughton on. They were glowing in praise for Naughton's professionalism and Ads proceeded to tell Naughton that if he played for a bigger Melbourne club he would be more well known. I get the impression that he still see the bulldogs as a step down.

Yeah i cant warm to him to be honest, not to many players spruik so much about their former club like he does.

 

[badkicking]

Yeah i cant warm to him to be honest, not to many players spruik so much about their former club like he does.any

I suppose I'd prefer to take a shot at a VFL kpp or ruck since they tend to come good at a later age.

Can't really think off the top of my head too many VFL mids who came good and took the step at 25 but I'm sure there's some?

Robbie mccomb ?

 

[badkicking]

Could be more hitting the Jim's...



Agree completely. 100%.

I've been a bit too lazy to post some stats, but for most of 2021 we were in (almost!) in 2016 territory when it came to defence and giving up scores.
We just didn't give up big leads.

The Brisbane prelim got closer than I expected, but in my mind we were never going to lose after Q1.

Obviously about 80 minutes of a GF were as good as 'expected' too.

This year we fell apart completely. Noticeably.

Injuries?
Duryea?
Higher press? (Although teams regularly got easy goals one through).

Would love to see some 'expected goal' numbers to see if anything changed...
...but something definitely felt off this year.

Played some who were completely motivated up to it, would cordy get a game in any other team in finals contest

 

[badkicking]

Played some who were completely motivated up to it, would cordy get a game in any other team in finals contest

Delete. Motivated and replace with not up to it

 

[Lex22]

All this talk of 190-192cm backs. Luke Cleary didn’t look out of place and seems to have a lot of composure and is a more than tidy kick. We might be pleasantly surprised after another 1-2 preseasons

Cleary can really play, it was just getting used to AFL speed at times with him, but that’s to be expected 1st year.

He’s one that could come on heaps next season and just about cement a role.

I don’t think he’s all that far away.

 

[Flags_In_The_Bag]

Agree, happy for them to lock up 1mil a year tbh, geez there can’t be much left there with their recent signings. Would firmly knock them out of any rumoured Naughty chase

Will hurt them next year when trying to stop Kossi going to Port

 

[Bazza28]

While none of the names mentioned above excite me much has anyone considered maybe we are going to lose Cordy? He has a two year contract on the table from us and hasn’t signed. And people have also suggested that Keath will retire as well. If that’s the case we need to add some depth. And hopefully a couple of young kids in the draft.

 

[TiAn_]

All this talk of 190-192cm backs. Luke Cleary didn’t look out of place and seems to have a lot of composure and is a more than tidy kick. We might be pleasantly surprised after another 1-2 preseasons

I thought Cleary was great this year, but the players we’re reportedly looking at are big enough to play a defensive role on key forwards and I don’t think that’s Cleary’s go.

 

[0utsider]

Cleary gets way too much hype in this thread. He intercepted and used the ball well in his few games but positionally he was completely lost which would be why he was dropped.

Has a lot to work on in that space and while that’s obviously part of being a young player it’s too big an if for us to be hanging our hopes on him being a big part of our future.

 

[ScottyDogg]

Cleary gets way too much hype in this thread. He intercepted and used the ball well in his few games but positionally he was completely lost which would be why he was dropped.

Has a lot to work on in that space and while that’s obviously part of being a young player it’s too big an if for us to be hanging our hopes on him being a big part of our future.

How can you criticize the intern for being out of position in our defensive set up? Do any of them know what’s going on back there? I have an image of about 5 of our senior defenders running around like headless chooks while Jack Gunston kicked a goal between them in the final game of the year.

Kid doesn’t have a problem with positioning. Team lacks a defensive structure.

 

[Munnez]

Could be more hitting the Jim's...



Agree completely. 100%.

I've been a bit too lazy to post some stats, but for most of 2021 we were in (almost!) in 2016 territory when it came to defence and giving up scores.
We just didn't give up big leads.

The Brisbane prelim got closer than I expected, but in my mind we were never going to lose after Q1.

Obviously about 80 minutes of a GF were as good as 'expected' too.

This year we fell apart completely. Noticeably.

Injuries?
Duryea?
Higher press? (Although teams regularly got easy goals one through).

Would love to see some 'expected goal' numbers to see if anything changed...
...but something definitely felt off this year.

I think the squad was pretty banged up after 21 and never achieved full fitness in 22. And some key players were carrying injuries throughout 22 Bont & Keath spring to mind. Bont wasn't anywhere near as productive in 22 and I think a lot of that was injuries based.
Hopefully the few extra weeks and a full preseason can see a better 23

 

[0utsider]

How can you criticize the intern for being out of position in our defensive set up? Do any of them know what’s going on back there? I have an image of about 5 of our senior defenders running around like headless chooks while Jack Gunston kicked a goal between them in the final game of the year.

Kid doesn’t have a problem with positioning. Team lacks a defensive structure.

Fair call tbh, hard to know how much is player and how much is system.

 

[Hobdog]

Yeah i cant warm to him to be honest, not to many players spruik so much about their former club like he does.

I think he has this idea that people think he hates his former club and he’s anxious about it, so he overcompensates on the expressions of love.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Flags_In_The_Bag]

I think he has this idea that people think he hates his former club and he’s anxious about it, so he overcompensates on the expressions of love.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

Could do yes.

 

[Generation West]

Why don’t we just play Buku instead of picking up spuds

100% this. Buku is on the upward trajectory but Bevo seems reluctant to play him or he is first one dropped.

Jones, Gardner, Buku as the 3 tall defenders with Keath as back up. Don’t need Tomlinson or Madgen.

We need to find or develop another small lock down defender.

 

[Charlie Bucket]

How can you criticize the intern for being out of position in our defensive set up? Do any of them know what’s going on back there? I have an image of about 5 of our senior defenders running around like headless chooks while Jack Gunston kicked a goal between them in the final game of the year.

Kid doesn’t have a problem with positioning. Team lacks a defensive structure.

Yeah, definitely isn’t the 2nd year, 3rd gamer that finds himself out of position on occasion. Must be the system.

 

[W W Biscuit]

100% this. Buku is on the upward trajectory but Bevo seems reluctant to play him or he is first one dropped.

Jones, Gardner, Buku as the 3 tall defenders with Keath as back up. Don’t need Tomlinson or Madgen.

We need to find or develop another small lock down defender.

Buku is a very talented footballer with a high ceiling. His main challenge to this point has been to develop his tank. But I've seen enough to be optimistic about his future.

 

[Charlie Bucket]

Tomlinson plays okay football as a third tall in the best defensive system in the league with great support from may and lever. He won’t have that at the dogs.

I would rather back in Gardner, Jones and either Darcy, keith (to get his body right) or khamis (slightly undersized) to become the third. Use Cordy and O’Brien as coverage and bring in another developing tall defender with one of our picks.

If Tomlinson came I certainly would not be comfortable paying his contract 2x 500 k a year or even smoothing that out over 3 years. I see him playing a lot of VFL football as I believe we have better options ahead of him.

I also don’t like the idea of helping Melbourne take that contract off the books.

This is poor business to me and I’m not often critical of the club when it comes list management.

We aren’t progressing with Cordy and O’Brien as coverage.

Your logic about support around our players would be for anyone we bring in. Doesn’t matter how good they are. You only improve the output and support of your back 6/7 by improving the talent, and as it stands Tomlinson is a considerable upgrade on Cordy and O’Brien. Same goes for Jones, if he can bring some of his recent Carlton form. Are we going to argue that Jones won’t be any good because he won’t have Weitering playing along side him?

Regardless of your opinion of Tomlinson, the facts are he was probably an injury away from winning a premiership as part of one of the best defensive units in the comp. To suggest he wouldn’t get regular games in our side is a miss imo. And at 500k, I don’t see any issue with it.

 

[HK_Bulldog]

I hope the footy department are all aligned. We brought in Trengove who was a wasted spot, last year TOB was brought in and is a wasted spot. I’d hate to see more wasted list spots (and salary cap).

 

[Here we go dogs]

100% this. Buku is on the upward trajectory but Bevo seems reluctant to play him or he is first one dropped.

Jones, Gardner, Buku as the 3 tall defenders with Keath as back up. Don’t need Tomlinson or Madgen.

We need to find or develop another small lock down defender.

Let’s not forget Darcy

 

[Here we go dogs]

I hope the footy department are all aligned. We brought in Trengove who was a wasted spot, last year TOB was brought in and is a wasted spot. I’d hate to see more wasted list spots (and salary cap).

I don’t think TOB would be on much and he only got a 2 year deal.

Plus he had a interrupted preseason, I am still hopeful he can turn things around.