Strategy Trade and List management Thread Part 6 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

[Foxman98]

Not so much for output as to position. He is elite around the ground and dropping back in the hole, I'm not denying his talent. His consistency and lack of aggression still bother me though.

If he was willing and able to halve Ruck/Forward with Darcy or lobb I'd have less issue with it.

I think we will get the natural progression with Darcy once he fills out more but fair enough

 

[doggies ftw]

We’d almost certainly get band one.

Would be such a shame to finish high and get a crappy pick 15 or whatever. I guess being restricted we can always match & force a trade

 

[Foxman98]

Would be such a shame to finish high and get a crappy pick 15 or whatever. I guess being restricted we can always match & force a trade

He's not ****ing leaving!!! Given how much he has improved year on year the last 3 I can see why his management are holding off

 

[Mojorisin]

I think we will get the natural progression with Darcy once he fills out more but fair enough

I'd be looking to do a more even split now, similar to the cats game. Lobb will hold down the fort until Darcy is ready to take over (hopefully by end of the year).

 

[Foxman98]

I'd be looking to do a more even split now, similar to the cats game. Lobb will hold down the fort until Darcy is ready to take over (hopefully by end of the year).

English needs that 70%+ most weeks the odd change up like the cats game is fine but 50% split doesn't benefit his style

 

[doggies ftw]

He's not ******* leaving!!! Given how much he has improved year on year the last 3 I can see why his management are holding off

Won’t ultimately peak until 28-30 either like all ruckmen, will be interested to see how much improvement he has in him & how far he goes

 

[DueWest]

Darcy will improve a bit next couple of years but his true impact won’t be seen until 2026 2027, years 5 and 6 and best years 2028 plus.

English started impacting games significantly year 6 and All Aust year 7

 

[Mojorisin]

English needs that 70%+ most weeks the odd change up like the cats game is fine but 50% split doesn't benefit his style

I prefer his role similar to when Stef was playing.

 

[Foxman98]

Won’t ultimately peak until 28-30 either like all ruckmen, will be interested to see how much improvement he has in him & how far he goes

His hitout win % is up 6% in 2 years and HOTA % is up 2% from last year too he is improving the weaknesses

 

[Foxman98]

I prefer his role similar to when Stef was playing.

He is a very different player to what he was then though he is a Top 2 ruck in the comp and as Max declines more he will be #1 very soon

 

[Foxman98]

**** I love Treloar

 

[bobs head soup]

The semi and prelim in 2021 are just not an accurate representation of his ceiling, they are significant outliers. We can’t be factoring that in when giving him his next contract, he hasn’t come close to touching those heights before or after.

How can an actual performance not be an accurate representation of somebody's ceiling? By definition their best performance is their ceiling.

 

[Foxman98]

How can an actual performance not be an accurate representation of somebody's ceiling? By definition their best performance is their ceiling.

Because he hasn't gone close to replicating them,

Similar to Bruce kicking 10 against Norf

 

[Libbaaaa]

How can an actual performance not be an accurate representation of somebody's ceiling? By definition their best performance is their ceiling.

But it’s not a realistic expectation of levels he can hit on a consistent basis, and that’s okay, doesn’t mean he won’t become a good player.

 

[Euku]

I think he's much better 50 50 , he's super dangerous as a forward and he performs better in the ruck the less he is in there

English needs that 70%+ most weeks the odd change up like the cats game is fine but 50% split doesn't benefit his style

 

[Foxman98]

I think he's much better 50 50 , he's super dangerous as a forward and he performs better in the ruck the less he is in there

How is 50 50 much better? We have seen what happened with Gawn and Grundy it doesn't work with Gawn/English style rucks who yes can be dangerous up forward but are just ball winning freaks in there

 

[Euku]

Every game english has played decent minutes up forward he looks deadly, he has never been that good in the ruck AA or not wasn't that good this year and has played best when he's been 50 50 when Martin was there when Lobb was there it's a no brainer, it gets him and Lobb both more involved in the game and doesn't burn him out either (got worse as the season went on

How is 50 50 much better? We have seen what happened with Gawn and Grundy it doesn't work with Gawn/English style rucks who yes can be dangerous up forward but are just ball winning freaks in there

 

[BulldogMuscle]

Tim English said it himself tonight on stage ''Ruckcraft isn't my strong point'' then credited Sweet as being a better tap-ruck than him.

I do agree, he looks better as a fwd-ruck than a ruck-fwd, nothing will change my mind on that.

 

[adogsfan5]

Re Lobb.

Doesn’t seem to be disliked by teammates on his Instagram page or the footage of him mingling tonight at the bnf.

Load of sh**?

 

[doggiesin08]

But it’s not a realistic expectation of levels he can hit on a consistent basis, and that’s okay, doesn’t mean he won’t become a good player.

Agree with this. His level from the first half of 2022 was pretty damn good and was a long enough stretch to suggest it is a realistic level on a consistent basis.

As far as gaps between "ceilings" and consistent levels go, I don't think they come much bigger than Wayde Skipper. The bloke kicked 5 goals on the (then) 2-time reigning and eventual 6-time All Australian full back in Matthew Scarlett!

 

[Substance]

Darcy will improve a bit next couple of years but his true impact won’t be seen until 2026 2027, years 5 and 6 and best years 2028 plus.

English started impacting games significantly year 6 and All Aust year 7

2019 I think I and others saw what he would become. 2021 he was hitting his straps before injury. Same for 2022. Could have had 2-3 AAs so far if not for concussions.

 

[doggy_dog]

I'll gladly eat my own words if he can average 28 and 2 goals a game.

I think you’re getting way too hung up on his goal kicking here. When people say back to his 2021 finals form I think we’re talking more generally, no one is actually expecting him to kick 2 goals a game. That’s prime GAJ level for a midfielder.

I could very easily imagine him averaging 28 and 0.5 goals a game which would be an exceptional return for a midfielder

 

[Dale4captain]

Sam Clohesy on Dogs radar. Running half back/wing playing for Werribee in 2023.

Several clubs have been chatting with him.

 

[Unorth]

Tim got pantsed by a first gamer in a must win game. And those sorts of performances are not unusual although his first half of the year was great.

Obviously the coaches didn’t rate his season tremendously well either. And he got AA ruck in a very weak year for the position.

He has his strengths and is much improved in the ruck but he’s also incredibly dangerous up forward.

The lesson that took too long for Bevo to learn was that we just need to be flexible with our ruck arrangement. Tim shitting the bed against a random? Throw him forward and switch it up. Pair him with someone who has a point of difference in ruck contests. Lobb isn’t a great ruck but he is a bit of a campaigner, he saw a debutant and took delight in kicking arse in the middle. Was just ripping clearances away and throwing his weight around.

Should also be remembered in 2021 - when we were actually playing winning, meaningful footy - that we were so adverse to Tim solo rucking we threw Lewis Young

33

Lewis Young

Age

25

Ht

202cm

Wt

99kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.6

3star

K

7.5

3star

HB

4.1

3star

M

4.4

4star

T

1.6

4star

MG

197.9

3star

D

4.0

1star

K

3.0

1star

HB

1.0

1star

M

3.0

3star

T

0.0

1star

MG

26.0

1star

D

14.4

4star

K

8.2

4star

HB

6.2

4star

M

6.4

5star

T

2.0

4star

MG

181.6

3star

to the wolves.

Tim should continue to improve but we can’t let his positional demands hold us hostage. Should always be looking at how each game is unfolding and be prepared to change it up to the extent that we did in Geelong.

 

[doggy_dog]

Despite his AA season I still believe the optimal role for Tim is a floating forward/utility role (Westhoff style).

A Briggs type ruckman for 65-70% with Tim chopping out the rest would be deadly. He would annihilate basically every other back up in the league. Could be a huge weapon for us