Strategy Trade and List Management Thread Part 7 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

[Deadly Darcy]

XO is a massive upgrade up VDM. Tackles, kicks goals, has speed. Hard to get a constant game at GWS when the best in the business in Daniels is there.

It’s just a change up in whipping boy if we swop them out. Would be list clogging. Much rather hit a late pick in the draft for any spot he would be taking.

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

Could the deal with cotton on and knowing he would be requesting a trade to Geelong in the future have had an affect on his form in 2023 ?

I suggested the same on the draft and trading board.

 

[who_let_the_dogs_out]

Lol check out the Cats trade thread, what a smug bunch of campaigners.

 

[Northernsoul74]

This is the thing, not knocking SDK as a talent at all, it just raises similar questions to me as the Barrass attempt.

It’s not that all our options are better, but is it the right use of Baz as an asset given our list.

Jones, Lobb, JoD, Buss, Buku, Coffield and Gardner are ALL contracted.

There are no A graders in that list and Jones + Lobb are getting on but even then, that’s ample coverage.

Yes SDK-Buss-JoD sorts us out long term, but that can also be addressed with an older recruit down the line. We also can’t just assume Jones and Lobb will miss games - probably, but you can’t plan your best/round 1 side around it.

We also used a good pick on Buss, he hasn’t debuted in two seasons, we just signed him on for two more and it’s already difficult getting him in to the side.

Previously I was ok with Barrass as I kind of assumed Buss was on the move, re-signing him means we surely have the view of him being in the side next season (and he looks ready for it).

Not saying any one of them is or isn’t better than Barrass or SDK but how much of a need is it compared to other positions? We have been screaming for a wing and small forward for ages. Need some pace and class at both positions. Surely that would be a better use of Baz as an asset?

I’m guessing there is just nothing else potentially available. Smith is going now so we have maximise what we can possibly get now.

 

[Norm De Guerre]

Sure, they might make some face saving noises in that regard, But the club would want to have some pretty compelling evidence in hand of contract tampering and collusion between Smith, Cotton-On and Geelong before actually going public. Because it would be brave, if somewhat counter productive to burn the competitions house down whilst we stand in the middle of it by taking civil action against another club, a league sponsor and ultimately the league.

Its in nobodies interest to open the pandoras box to the scrutiny of discovery during proceedings.

It's the kind of thing, like sending Smith to the PSD that appeals to supporter fever dreams in hotbeds of uberfandom on the internet. But an outside of the competition investigation just isn't a viable option in a system that we are part of.

The deal will remain the same. Their first, and a shuffling of later picks that are slightly fun our favour.

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

As in keeping things quiet.


The AFL already looked into Smith and cotton on giving there tick of approval in regards to the new deal with Geelong. The dogs have now asked them to look into the current deal with Cotton On related to the last two years. If they don't look properly it will end up in the courts.

The fact that the AFL have a deal with Cotton On and they are the major sponsor of Geelong, seems a conflict of interest. I will not buy anymore Cotton On clothing.

But also, their previous list manager would pay fair market price, whereas Mackie seems to want to play hardball, and comes across as a arrogant w***er, this might bite them in the bum.

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

Lol check out the Cats trade thread, what a smug bunch of campaigners.

Seriously, I have been to every State to watch the Bulldogs and the worst supporters, in terms of abusive is Geelong. Once upon a time before 2007, they were my second favourite team, but now I hate them.

 

[Bald]

Nothing will happen with the Cotton On/Geelong/Bailey Smith

6

Bailey Smith

Age

23

Ht

185cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.3

5star

K

8.5

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

2.3

2star

T

3.8

5star

CL

2.7

4star

D

19.8

5star

K

9.6

4star

HB

10.2

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

3.2

4star

CL

3.2

4star

D

14.8

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.2

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

3.4

5star

CL

1.6

4star

situation. Let's not fill pages and pages of nonsense on it.

 

[Next Waiting]

Sure, they might make some face saving noises in that regard, But the club would want to have some pretty compelling evidence in hand of contract tampering and collusion between Smith, Cotton-On and Geelong before actually going public. Because it would be brave, if somewhat counter productive to burn the competitions house down whilst we stand in the middle of it by taking civil action against another club, a league sponsor and ultimately the league.

Its in nobodies interest to open the pandoras box to the scrutiny of discovery during proceedings.

It's the kind of thing, like sending Smith to the PSD that appeals to supporter fever dreams in hotbeds of uberfandom on the internet. But an outside of the competition investigation just isn't a viable option in a system that we are part of.

The deal will remain the same. Their first, and a shuffling of later picks that are slightly fun our favour.

I don't know Norm. Maybe we should burn it to the ground. The appeal of the game and the clamour for television rights won't disappear. It's as solid and immovable as Trump's base.

Out of the ashes of destruction an equitable fixture and fair distribution of block buster/marquee games could arise like a football shaped Phoenix.

 

[Bulldogs85]

Come on Smith nominate Geelong already

 

[adogsfan5]

If we turned Smith, Daniel and Macrae into O’Halloran, Clohesy and two picks in the top 25, would you consider that a win?

 

[Doggy]

If we turned Smith, Daniel and Macrae into O’Halloran, Clohesy and two picks in the top 25, would you consider that a win?

Break even at best

 

[maddog37]

Nothing will happen with the Cotton On/Geelong/Bailey Smith situation. Let's not fill pages and pages of nonsense on it.

Likely so but I’ve got nothing else on at the moment so let’s all enjoy the hot takes.

 

[Thunderoad]

Sam Edmund said that Garcia is weighing up between our offer and an offer from West Coast.

He made the that 'the Eagles can easily price the Dogs out' which I found odd.

Sure, West Coast might offer Riley more money but my understanding is that we aren't under any salary cap pressure so we could, theoretically, up our offer if we wanted to.

Edmund also indicated that SDK's representatives had told him that Sam wouldn't be moving this year. He then qualified this by saying that things can change.

The Trade Bell with Sam Edmund (25.09.24) - Whateley

Gerard Whateley is one of the most respected voices in Australian sport and is joined by the biggest and most relevant sporting guests every morning from Monday to Thursday on SEN.

pca.st

 

[Bulldogs85]

If we turned Smith, Daniel and Macrae into O’Halloran, Clohesy and two picks in the top 25, would you consider that a win?

Smith not being at the club anymore I consider that as a win bloke is a headache good luck Geelong you will need it

 

[Foxman98]

If we turned Smith, Daniel and Macrae into O’Halloran, Clohesy and two picks in the top 25, would you consider that a win?

If we can add Peatling yes very big win

 

[Thunderoad]

Nothing will happen with the Cotton On/Geelong/Bailey Smith situation. Let's not fill pages and pages of nonsense on it.

I still think we can create some hassle for Geelong and perhaps use it to put some leevel of pressure on them.

A few drops to friendly figures in the media to generate some broader interest.

As has been pointed out, supporters of 16 other clubs have long harboured suspicions about Geelong's recruiting practices so it could gain some traction.

 

[Norm De Guerre]

I don't know Norm. Maybe we should burn it to the ground. The appeal of the game and the clamour for television rights won't disappear. It's as solid and immovable as Trump's base.

Out of the ashes of destruction an equitable fixture and fair distribution of block buster/marquee games could arise like a football shaped Phoenix.

 

[TiAn_]

I believe Riley Garcia is the Spanish translation of Xavier O’Halloran

 

[Bald]

I still think we can create some hassle for Geelong and perhaps use it to put some leevel of pressure on them.

A few drops to friendly figures in the media to generate some broader interest.

As has been pointed out, supporters of 16 other clubs have long harboured suspicions about Geelong's recruiting practices so it could gain some traction.

If you think the club is going to use potential contract tampering or under the table deals as a way to get slightly better draft picks, you need a dose of reality.

If there is substance to what has been shared, then it goes far beyond a 3-4 week investigation and as such won't have any implications from a trade/draft stand point (and in fact would probably lessen Baileys worth, rather than the opposite).

 

[Philthy1]

Sure, they might make some face saving noises in that regard, But the club would want to have some pretty compelling evidence in hand of contract tampering and collusion between Smith, Cotton-On and Geelong before actually going public. Because it would be brave, if somewhat counter productive to burn the competitions house down whilst we stand in the middle of it by taking civil action against another club, a league sponsor and ultimately the league.

Its in nobodies interest to open the pandoras box to the scrutiny of discovery during proceedings.

It's the kind of thing, like sending Smith to the PSD that appeals to supporter fever dreams in hotbeds of uberfandom on the internet. But an outside of the competition investigation just isn't a viable option in a system that we are part of.

The deal will remain the same. Their first, and a shuffling of later picks that are slightly fun our favour.

I know Norm, it‘s actually quite funny.

The reality is sending Smith to the PSD would get S Power sacked and he would be a laughing stock in the industry.

 

[TiAn_]

We managed to negotiate the AFL giving us a flag out of the Talia situation, I reckon we can at least get a few MCG home games, hosting the Good Friday game and a guaranteed week one finals win out of this.

 

[Sentinel]

On Clohesy, he was selected as a Cat B rookie at the end of 2022 and remained a rookie (shifted to Cat A) at the end of 2023 (https://www.geelongcats.com.au/news/1472043/cats-confirm-list-for-2024-afl-premiership-season). Being out of contract, he can therefore come to us as a free agent if he chooses, unless Geelong are offering him a senior list spot for 2025 - he doesn't need to form part of any trade even as steak knives. We might prefer a trade though given this route would mean he's a free agent for life.

A 2nd year Rookie not accepting a further Rookie contract will be considered a Delisted Free Agent, and therefore will be an Unrestricted Free Agent.

 

[Mojorisin]

On Clohesy, he was selected as a Cat B rookie at the end of 2022. Unless he was upgraded to Geelong's senior list at the end of last season (which is possible), he can come to us as a free agent if he chooses- he doesn't need to form part of any trade even as steak knives.

A 2nd year Rookie not accepting a further Rookie contract will be considered a Delisted Free Agent, and therefore will be an Unrestricted Free Agent.

That is only the case for a player being offered another rookie contract. Geelong have a one year main list deal on the table for him. They need to free up a cat B rookie spot for an Irishman of course.

 

[Thunderoad]

'List clogger' is the most over used term in the AFL lexicon.

To me, a list clogger is a player who is content to see out their contract by running around in the VFL.

They have little to no prospect of playing at AFL level and will happily see out their professional footballer days playing some footy and getting a good salary.

The player obviously has a contract so I don't have an issue with them being a list clogger other than the opportunity lost of not being able to potentially add a better or more promising player to the list.

On that basis, I don't consider VDM or McNeil list cloggers. They both played plenty of AFL games this season and are every chance to do the same next year as it stands.

Gardner probably is now a list clogger. I don't consider this any slight on Ryan at all but his prospects of playing seniors are limited and the list spot could be better used elsewhere.