Strategy Trade and List Management Thread Part 7 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

[LondonBulldog]

I think there are going to be a lot of disappointed people on here. Geelong may budge a tiny bit at the very end, but it won't be much more than 17. Maybe some late picks swaps as well to satisfy us.

 

[4Seasons]

Teams like the doggies have too much spiritual substance to deal with for Bailey Smith. Quality’s such as loyalty and grit are beyond such Instagram obsessed freaks. Go and have another look in the mirror before you age you fu*king toe nail. Tomorrow you will be older and uglier - remember that

All young people use Instagram these days, including our players.

 

[Bald]

We aren't in a misfortunate position though we aren't pushing him out he is OOC which is a very common occurrence

You're not understanding what I'm saying Foxman, or you haven't read the conversation in it's totality. I posed the question - why would Geelong give us more than a first round pick for a player they could pick up with that first round pick?

Baileys management will ensure no other club takes him in the draft, so if there are two avenues to acquire Bailey, why would they not choose the avenue that was most beneficial for them?

That's the situation we find ourselves in, that is the unfortunate position we are in. When factoring in the player, the management group and the fact that we don't have a pick before the team the player is requesting a trade to (or a reasonable way to acquire one), I would say that is a very uncommon position.

 

[DannyB4]

Anyone else considering the Host Plus PDS and T&D?

 

[Foxman98]

You're not understanding what I'm saying Foxman, or you haven't read the conversation in it's totality. I posed the question - why would Geelong give us more than a first round pick for a player they could pick up with that first round pick?

Baileys management will ensure no other club takes him in the draft, so if there are two avenues to acquire Bailey, why would they not choose the avenue that was most beneficial for them?

That's the situation we find ourselves in, that is the unfortunate position we are in. When factoring in the player, the management group and the fact that we don't have a pick before the team the player is requesting a trade to (or a reasonable way to acquire one), I would say that is a very uncommon position.

Why did West Coast for Tim Kelly then?

 

[Bald]

Why did West Coast for Tim Kelly then?

Are you deliberately being difficult?

 

[Dannnnnnnnnn]

Why did West Coast for Tim Kelly then?

Because clubs do shit trades all the time.

Geelong rarely do.

 

[Charlie Bucket]

All young people use Instagram these days, including our players.

Big difference between using it and it being part of your personality which is the case for BS.

 

[Pencil case]

 

[threenewpadlocks]

I agree that Smith almost certainly makes his way to Geelong through one mechanism or another.

But it's also not quite right to suggest that even if/when Geelong draft Smith, even if they pay less in a draft output than a trade with us, that it's all smooth for Geelong, or that Geelong want a draft rather than a trade to be their starting point with Smith being a listed player.

I don't think it's anywhere near as likely that another team drafts Smith as people are making it out here, but at the same time, any probability above zero has to factor into Geelong's calculations, and the probability is above zero.

Geelong might have to ultimately restructure their contract offer to Geelong, which is something that they would obviously want to avoid.

And more broadly speaking, if they continue to not pay up in a trade, that might force the AFL to re-examine their overall list rules, especially in the context of a player moving from a team lower on the ladder to a team higher on the ladder. There's no point blowing up the whole system just for Bailey Smith

6

Bailey Smith

Age

23

Ht

185cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.3

5star

K

8.5

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

2.3

2star

T

3.8

5star

CL

2.7

4star

D

19.8

5star

K

9.6

4star

HB

10.2

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

3.2

4star

CL

3.2

4star

D

14.8

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.2

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

3.4

5star

CL

1.6

4star

.

The AFL might look deeper into Geelong's overall contract/draft tampering and third-party payments, which Geelong would want to ignore.

So it's not as if Geelong can just walk him to the draft without any risk/no additional loss involved.

The Dogs can still use that as leverage.

 

[_Mike_]

Isn't Smith still contracted till end of October?

Yeah, end of this month IIRC

 

[Lockstock79]

What would happen if Bailey Smith

6

Bailey Smith

Age

23

Ht

185cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.3

5star

K

8.5

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

2.3

2star

T

3.8

5star

CL

2.7

4star

D

19.8

5star

K

9.6

4star

HB

10.2

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

3.2

4star

CL

3.2

4star

D

14.8

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.2

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

3.4

5star

CL

1.6

4star

was taken by another team in the draft before Geelong as a first-round pick, would it be a three-year contract like other first rounders?

 

[_Mike_]

That's the situation we find ourselves in, that is the unfortunate position we are in.

Agree, would be insane for us to believe that Geelong would throw in anything above a first rounder. If they do it's on their terms & basis they want him so bad they're not prepared risk seeing him go to the PSD.

Baileys management will ensure no other club takes him in the draft, so if there are two avenues to acquire Bailey, why would they not choose the avenue that was most beneficial for them?

This is the flaw of the drafting system, allowing players (who are not free or restricted agents) to refuse being picked up by a club which has a lower pick. Any player who's agent refuses to deal at the trade table for a currently listed player should be forced down the path of either

• nominating for the P/M drafts with no guarantees, they get drafted by whoever, or
• de-register them as an AFL player, they sit out an entire season playing in the VFL or other state competitions. Smith is not going to get his 800K per year playing for a VFL team whilst not being on an AFL contract. Then they renominate again in the following PSD.

The whole "unless Im drafted by club ABC I will refuse to play for anyone else" mantra should be shut down.

The above clearly doesnt apply to free agents, Bailey Smith is neither an UFA or RFA

 

[_Mike_]

What would happen if Bailey Smith was taken by another team in the draft before Geelong as a first-round pick, would it be a three-year contract like other first rounders?

Could be as little as a 1 year contract

 

[The City Boyz]

Does that mean Keath is done?

 

[Bald]

Agree, would be insane for us to believe that Geelong would throw in anything above a first rounder. If they do it's on their terms & basis they want him so bad they're not prepared risk seeing him go to the PSD.




This is the flaw of the drafting system, allowing players (who are not free or restricted agents) to refuse being picked up by a club which has a lower pick. Any player who's agent refuses to deal at the trade table for a currently listed player should be forced down the path of either

• nominating for the P/M drafts with no guarantees, they get drafted by whoever, or
• de-register them as an AFL player, they sit out an entire season playing in the VFL or other state competitions. Smith is not going to get his 800K per year playing for a VFL team whilst not being on an AFL contract. Then they renominate again in the following PSD.

The whole "unless Im drafted by club ABC I will refuse to play for anyone else" mantra should be shut down.

The above clearly doesnt apply to free agents, Bailey Smith is neither an UFA or RFA

I don't love the system, I have a million ideas for how I would fix it, none of which have no flaws.

But the system is what it is and right now, if we were Geelong, I would be livid if we offered any more than 17 for Bailey.

 

[Dogs 13]

Am i right in saying the Foxtel will be doing commentary for all games from next year onwards?

If so, it might be time to ditch channel 7 for most games.

You should always ditch Ch7 if possible, just for Foxtel no ads after goals.

 

[ossie_21]

I think there are going to be a lot of disappointed people on here. Geelong may budge a tiny bit at the very end, but it won't be much more than 17. Maybe some late picks swaps as well to satisfy us.

If it comes down to only getting a “first round” pick for him, it needs to be Geelong’s F1. It would be disgusting to only end up with a pick in the 20’s this year.

I get the argument as to why Geelong would only want to pay that, as they know full well it’s not paying the true market value and the system is designed in a way the player would be able to get there in the end, even if they shouldn’t.

Whatever happens at the end of the day, the AFL truly needs to look into why Geelong always come out on top with their deals. I can’t really believe the AFL can’t cotton on to the way they do things, it’s just a more modernised way of past players being paid out of brown paper bags.

 

[House_of_Dahl]

The circumstances around this trade are tricky for many here to accept.

The facts are, IF Smith goes to the national draft he will get to Geelong, they will use the first round pick they’re offering to us will be used to acquire Bailey. So why should Geelong give up anymore?

Because that would stress the hell out of Smith, and make the next player thinking about nominating Geelong think twice.

Geelong would definitely rather just get a deal done.

 

[Mojorisin]

Agree, would be insane for us to believe that Geelong would throw in anything above a first rounder. If they do it's on their terms & basis they want him so bad they're not prepared risk seeing him go to the PSD.




This is the flaw of the drafting system, allowing players (who are not free or restricted agents) to refuse being picked up by a club which has a lower pick. Any player who's agent refuses to deal at the trade table for a currently listed player should be forced down the path of either

• nominating for the P/M drafts with no guarantees, they get drafted by whoever, or
• de-register them as an AFL player, they sit out an entire season playing in the VFL or other state competitions. Smith is not going to get his 800K per year playing for a VFL team whilst not being on an AFL contract. Then they renominate again in the following PSD.

The whole "unless Im drafted by club ABC I will refuse to play for anyone else" mantra should be shut down.

The above clearly doesnt apply to free agents, Bailey Smith is neither an UFA or RFA

100% agree it's been broken for a long time and Bailey used it in hi draft year aswell.

Players out of contract should only be able to be selected in the preseason draft if they want to set there own terms. In the national draft they should have to abide by the same rules as draftees. 6-8 years until free agency base salary or 3 years and a 2-3 year contract depending where they get selected.
Also agree a player should be reregistered I'd they try to get out of going interstate or tell clubs they'll sit out if selected.

 

[Bald]

Because that would stress the hell out of Smith, and make the next player thinking about nominating Geelong think twice.

Geelong would definitely rather just get a deal done.

I don't think it would stress Smith at all. It's all handled by his management, as far as he knows he's already a Geelong player.

 

[BallaratBulldog]

Harsh on Clarke imo

 

[Bulldogs85]

Cal Twomey just Reported their haven’t been any talks between us and saints about Macrae

 

[Mofra]

That reads like we still have a couple of irons in the fire.
I think we can carry Clarke for another year and give the kid a chance but with JJ it just seems like his body is letting him down and Bramble is ahead of him a well.

 

[VitalDread]

Does that mean Keath is done?

A poster on here said he was already talking to local footy teams for 2025