NWO/Illuminati US politics - Pt 2

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Just what was Hunter doing on the Burisma board?
Making money due to his family name and connections.

Which may explain why the GOP Senate investigation into it found there was no illegality, seems to be a pretty common practice in politics over there, doubt they'd want to open that can of worms.

Hunter is an absolute amateur in this game as well, Jared "Saudi $2B" Kushner says hi.
 

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Accepting bribes and selling his fathers influence, apparently:

Another report you may be interested in mate


"Problematic"
"Awkward"
"Not a good look"

Yep that'll fly in court, no problems :tearsofjoy:
 
Making money due to his family name and connections.

Which may explain why the GOP Senate investigation into it found there was no illegality, seems to be a pretty common practice in politics over there, doubt they'd want to open that can of worms.

Hunter is an absolute amateur in this game as well, Jared "Saudi $2B" Kushner says hi.
You don't think Joe Biden threatening to withdraw $1B of aid unless the preosecutor targetting Burisma was fired, was corruption? Joe Biden had also repeatedly said he had never talked to Hunter about hs overseas business dealings. Why lie about it if it was all above board?
 
You don't think Joe Biden threatening to withdraw $1B of aid unless the preosecutor targetting Burisma was fired, was corruption? Joe Biden had also repeatedly said he had never talked to Hunter about hs overseas business dealings. Why lie about it if it was all above board?
This didn't happen.

Also for the second part.
It's like saying that asking your kid how their day was at school is the same as actively being involved in curating the national curriculum.


Casual conversations about aspects of a persons life aren't the same as discussing deliberate actions into how to cause outcomes for gain, through illicit/illegal/corrupt means.
 
https://edition.cnn.com/2019/09/25/politics/donald-trump-ukraine-transcript-call/index.html


Speaking of 'nothing to see here'.

President Zelenskyy:I would also like to thank you for your great support in the area of defense. We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps specifically we are almost ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes.​
The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike… I guess you have one of your wealthy people… The server, they say Ukraine has it. There are a lot of things that went on, the whole situation. I think you’re surrounding yourself with some of the same people. I would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to get to the bottom of it. As you saw yesterday, that whole nonsense ended with a very poor performance by a man named Robert Mueller, an incompetent performance, but they say a lot of it started with Ukraine. Whatever you can do, it’s very important that you do it if that’s possible.​
President Zelenskyy: Yes it is very important for me and everything that you just mentioned earlier. For me as a President, it is very important and we are open for any future cooperation. We are ready to open a new page on cooperation in relations between the United States and Ukraine. For that purpose, I just recalled our ambassador from United States and he will be replaced by a very competent and very experienced ambassador who will work hard on making sure that our two nations are getting closer. I would also like and hope to see him having your trust and your confidence and have personal relations with you so we can cooperate even more so. I will personally tell you that one of my assistants spoke with Mr. Giuliani just recently and we are hoping very much that Mr. Giuliani will be able to travel to Ukraine and we will meet once he comes to Ukraine. I just wanted to assure you once again that you have nobody but friends around us. I will make sure that I surround myself with the best and most experienced people. I also wanted to tell you that we are friends. We are great friends and you Mr. President have friends in our country so we can continue our strategic partnership. I also plan to surround myself with great people and in addition to that investigation, I guarantee as the President of Ukraine that all the investigations will be done openly and candidly.. That I can assure you.​
The President: Good because I heard you had a prosecutor who was very good and he was shut down and that’s really unfair. A lot of people are talking about that, the way they shut your very good prosecutor down and you had some very bad people involved. Mr. Giuliani is a highly respected man. He was the mayor of New York City, a great mayor, and I would like him to call you. I will ask him to call you along with the Attorney General. Rudy very much knows what’s happening and he is a very capable guy. If you could speak to him that would be great. The former ambassador from the United States, the woman, was bad news and the people she was dealing with in the Ukraine were bad news so I just want to let you know that. The other thing, There’s a lot of talk about Biden’s son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it… It sounds horrible to me.​
President Zelenskyy: I wanted to tell you about the prosecutor. First of all, I understand and I’m knowledgeable about the situation. Since we have won the absolute majority in our Parliament, the next prosecutor general will be 100% my person, my candidate, who will be approved, by the parliament and will start as a new prosecutor in September. He or she will look into the situation, specifically to the company that you mentioned in this issue. The issue of the investigation of the case is actually the issue of making sure to restore the honesty so we will take care of that and will work on the investigation of the case. On top of that, I would kindly ask you if you have any additional information that you can provide to us, it would be very helpful for the investigation to make sure that we administer justice in our country with regard to the Ambassador to the United States from Ukraine as far as I recall her name was Ivanovich. It was great that you were the first one who told me that she was a bad ambassador because I agree with you 100%. Her attitude towards me was far from the best as she admired the previous President and she was on his side. She would not accept me as a new President well enough.​
The President: Well, she’s going to go through some things. I will have Mr. Giuliani give you a call and I am also going to have Attorney General Barr call and we will get to the bottom of it. I’m sure you will figure it out. I heard the prosecutor was treated very badly and he was a very fair prosecutor so good luck with everything. Your economy is going to get better and better I predict. You have a lot of assets. It’s a great country. I have many Ukrainian friends, their incredible people.​
President Zelenskyy: I would like to tell you that I also have quite a few Ukrainian friends that live in the United States. Actually last time I traveled to the United States, I stayed in New York near Central Park and I stayed at the Trump Tower. I will talk to them and I hope to see them again in the future. I also wanted to thank you for your invitation to visit the United States, specifically Washington DC. On the other hand, I also want to ensure you that we will be very serious about the case and will work on the investigation. As to the economy, there is much potential for our two countries and one of the issues that is very important for Ukraine is energy independence. I believe we can be very successful and cooperating on energy independence with United States. We are already working on cooperation. We are buying American oil but I am very hopeful for a future meeting. We will have more time and more opportunities to discuss these opportunities and get to know each other better. I would like to thank you very much for your support.​
The President: Good. Well, thank you very much and I appreciate that. I will tell Rudy and Attorney General Barr to call. Thank you. Whenever you would like to come to the White House, feel free to call. Give us a date and we’ll work that out. I look forward to seeing you.​



What has Biden ever been shown to have done, that is as explicit as this?
Considering that this is constantly ignored and waved off as 'completely normal' and a 'witch hunt'.
What's Biden done that's worse?

Not asking for implications or random conspiratorial subjects. But factual, in that it's something that has actually happened.
 
Not hearsay like your standard of proof

So, you're saying you have hard evidence and those arguing against you don't, is that it?

For the umpteenth time, I am requesting you to post the evidence that has convinced you to hold certain views that the rest of us laugh at.

I mean, you're literally saying you have a higher standard of proof for your views, so why can't you ever post any of it?
 

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I knew you'd get something right eventually, I could feel it in my waters!

100% correct mate. Its more stuff like fake electors, asking state reps to 'find' votes and pressuring your VP not to certify.
It's the consistent inconsistencies that never have an answer.

Why do they know and accept that there is nothing wrong just questioning election outcomes, or raising concerns about some aspects of an election. When pretending that that's all the Trump and MAGA did/does.

But then when forced to engage with things like the Jan 6th insurrection, they will say that Hillary did EXACTLY THE SAME THING as Trump and MAGA, because of a single NPR interview from 2017.


https://edition.cnn.com/2017/09/18/politics/hillary-clinton-russia-2016-election/index.html
NPR’s Terry Gross asked Clinton directly during the interview whether she would “completely rule out questioning the legitimacy of this election if we learn that the Russian interference in the election is even deeper than we know now?”​
“No. I would not,” Clinton said.​
Gross asked: “You’re not going to rule it out?”​
“No,” Clinton said. “I wouldn’t rule it out.”​

As if there is any comparison to the 'stolen election' rhetoric and actions.

1719047609413.png 1719047651967.png
 
https://edition.cnn.com/2019/09/25/politics/donald-trump-ukraine-transcript-call/index.html


Speaking of 'nothing to see here'.

President Zelenskyy:I would also like to thank you for your great support in the area of defense. We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps specifically we are almost ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes.​
The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike… I guess you have one of your wealthy people… The server, they say Ukraine has it. There are a lot of things that went on, the whole situation. I think you’re surrounding yourself with some of the same people. I would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to get to the bottom of it. As you saw yesterday, that whole nonsense ended with a very poor performance by a man named Robert Mueller, an incompetent performance, but they say a lot of it started with Ukraine. Whatever you can do, it’s very important that you do it if that’s possible.​
President Zelenskyy: Yes it is very important for me and everything that you just mentioned earlier. For me as a President, it is very important and we are open for any future cooperation. We are ready to open a new page on cooperation in relations between the United States and Ukraine. For that purpose, I just recalled our ambassador from United States and he will be replaced by a very competent and very experienced ambassador who will work hard on making sure that our two nations are getting closer. I would also like and hope to see him having your trust and your confidence and have personal relations with you so we can cooperate even more so. I will personally tell you that one of my assistants spoke with Mr. Giuliani just recently and we are hoping very much that Mr. Giuliani will be able to travel to Ukraine and we will meet once he comes to Ukraine. I just wanted to assure you once again that you have nobody but friends around us. I will make sure that I surround myself with the best and most experienced people. I also wanted to tell you that we are friends. We are great friends and you Mr. President have friends in our country so we can continue our strategic partnership. I also plan to surround myself with great people and in addition to that investigation, I guarantee as the President of Ukraine that all the investigations will be done openly and candidly.. That I can assure you.​
The President: Good because I heard you had a prosecutor who was very good and he was shut down and that’s really unfair. A lot of people are talking about that, the way they shut your very good prosecutor down and you had some very bad people involved. Mr. Giuliani is a highly respected man. He was the mayor of New York City, a great mayor, and I would like him to call you. I will ask him to call you along with the Attorney General. Rudy very much knows what’s happening and he is a very capable guy. If you could speak to him that would be great. The former ambassador from the United States, the woman, was bad news and the people she was dealing with in the Ukraine were bad news so I just want to let you know that. The other thing, There’s a lot of talk about Biden’s son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it… It sounds horrible to me.​
President Zelenskyy: I wanted to tell you about the prosecutor. First of all, I understand and I’m knowledgeable about the situation. Since we have won the absolute majority in our Parliament, the next prosecutor general will be 100% my person, my candidate, who will be approved, by the parliament and will start as a new prosecutor in September. He or she will look into the situation, specifically to the company that you mentioned in this issue. The issue of the investigation of the case is actually the issue of making sure to restore the honesty so we will take care of that and will work on the investigation of the case. On top of that, I would kindly ask you if you have any additional information that you can provide to us, it would be very helpful for the investigation to make sure that we administer justice in our country with regard to the Ambassador to the United States from Ukraine as far as I recall her name was Ivanovich. It was great that you were the first one who told me that she was a bad ambassador because I agree with you 100%. Her attitude towards me was far from the best as she admired the previous President and she was on his side. She would not accept me as a new President well enough.​
The President: Well, she’s going to go through some things. I will have Mr. Giuliani give you a call and I am also going to have Attorney General Barr call and we will get to the bottom of it. I’m sure you will figure it out. I heard the prosecutor was treated very badly and he was a very fair prosecutor so good luck with everything. Your economy is going to get better and better I predict. You have a lot of assets. It’s a great country. I have many Ukrainian friends, their incredible people.​
President Zelenskyy: I would like to tell you that I also have quite a few Ukrainian friends that live in the United States. Actually last time I traveled to the United States, I stayed in New York near Central Park and I stayed at the Trump Tower. I will talk to them and I hope to see them again in the future. I also wanted to thank you for your invitation to visit the United States, specifically Washington DC. On the other hand, I also want to ensure you that we will be very serious about the case and will work on the investigation. As to the economy, there is much potential for our two countries and one of the issues that is very important for Ukraine is energy independence. I believe we can be very successful and cooperating on energy independence with United States. We are already working on cooperation. We are buying American oil but I am very hopeful for a future meeting. We will have more time and more opportunities to discuss these opportunities and get to know each other better. I would like to thank you very much for your support.​
The President: Good. Well, thank you very much and I appreciate that. I will tell Rudy and Attorney General Barr to call. Thank you. Whenever you would like to come to the White House, feel free to call. Give us a date and we’ll work that out. I look forward to seeing you.​



What has Biden ever been shown to have done, that is as explicit as this?
Considering that this is constantly ignored and waved off as 'completely normal' and a 'witch hunt'.
What's Biden done that's worse?

Not asking for implications or random conspiratorial subjects. But factual, in that it's something that has actually happened.

Can you put in your own words what is so bad about this call between Trump and Zelensky and possibly show quotes in the transcript as to why you think what you do?

Many of us who considered this call and the following impeachment as a political witch hunt did so because we fail to see what is wrong in the transcript.
 
Can you put in your own words what is so bad about this call between Trump and Zelensky and possibly show quotes in the transcript as to why you think what you do?

Many of us who considered this call and the following impeachment as a political witch hunt did so because we fail to see what is wrong in the transcript.
During their discussion that is mostly meant to be a formality showing respect etc.
Trump brings up that it's only really the US that Ukraine can rely on for help, and how much Ukraine needs that help. Manipulative wording such as "the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.
Zelenskyy diplomatically thanks Trump (the US), agrees that Ukraine needs the help and support from the US, and specifically mentions the next steps in the US aid to Ukraine.
Trump replies to this by pointing out that he needs a favour.
This is the often talked about 'quid pro quo'.

Trump then goes in to discuss the need to look into Biden and find something.

Zelenskyy continues to diplomatically point out that all corruption etc will be investigated openly and candidly.
Trump keeps insisting that it would be better if Zelenskyy and Giuliani meet and discuss the outcomes of an investigation.

The full quotes are in the link. I've snipped these to make it possibly more visible. But it can be misleading without the entire conversation, let alone the full quotes.​
President Zelenskyy:We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps specifically we are almost. ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes.​
The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it.​
President Zelenskyy:I also plan to surround myself with great people and in addition to that investigation, I guarantee as the President of Ukraine that all the investigations will be done openly and candidly.​
The President: Mr. Giuliani is a highly respected man. He was the mayor of New York City, a great mayor, and I would like him to call you. I will ask him to call you along with the Attorney General. Rudy very much knows what’s happening and he is a very capable guy. If you could speak to him that would be great.​
The other thing, There’s a lot of talk about Biden’s son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it…​




https://edition.cnn.com/2019/09/25/politics/donald-trump-ukraine-transcript-call/index.html
UNCLASSIFIED
Declassified by order of the President
September 24, 2019
MEMORANDUM OF TELEPHONE CONVERSATION
SUBJECT: Telephone Conversation with President Zelenskyy of Ukraine
Participants: President Zelenskyy of Ukraine
Notetakers: The White House Situation Room
Date, Time July 25, 2019, 9:03-9:33 am EDT
and Place: Residence

The President: Congratulations on a great victory. We all watched from the United States and you did a terrific job. The way you came from behind, somebody who wasn’t given much of a chance, and you ended up winning easily. It’s a fantastic achievement. Congratulations.

President Zelenskyy: You are absolutely right Mr. President. We did win big and we worked hard for this. We worked a lot but I would like to confess to you that I had an opportunity to learn from you. We used quite a few of your skills and knowledge and were able to use it as an example for our elections and yes it is true that these were unique elections. We were in a unique situation that we were able to achieve a unique success. I’m able to tell you the following; the first time you called me to congratulate me when I won my presidential election, and the second time you are now calling me when my party won the parliamentary election. I think I should run more often so you can call me more often and we can talk over the phone more often.

The President: (laughter) That’s a very good idea. I think your country is very happy about that.

President Zelenskyy: Well yes, to tell you the truth, we are trying to work hard because we wanted to drain the swamp here in our country. We brought in many many new people. Not the old politicians, not the typical politicians, because we want to have a new format and a new type of government. You are a great teacher for us and in that.

The President: Well it is very nice of you to say that. I will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort and a lot of time. Much more than the European countries are doing and they should be helping you more than they are. Germany does almost nothing for you. All they do is talk and I think it’s something that you should really ask them about. When I was speaking to Angela Merkel she talks Ukraine, but she ·doesn’t do anything. A lot of the European countries are the same way so I think it’s something you want to look at but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine. I wouldn’t say that it’s reciprocal necessarily because things are happening that are not good but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.

President Zelenskyy: Yes you are absolutely right. Not only 100%, but actually 1000% and I can tell you the following; I did talk to Angela Merkel and I did meet with her I also met and talked with Macron and I told them that they are not doing quite as much as they need to be doing on the issues with the sanctions. They are not enforcing the sanctions. They are not working as much as they should work for Ukraine. It turns out that even though logically, the European Union should be our biggest partner but technically the United States is a much bigger partner than the European Union and I’m very grateful to you for that because the United States is doing quite a lot for Ukraine. Much more than the European Union especially when we are talking about sanctions against the Russian Federation. I would also like to thank you for your great support in the area of defense. We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps specifically we are almost. ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes.

The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike… I guess you have one of your wealthy people… The server, they say Ukraine has it. There are a lot of things that went on, the whole situation. I think you’re surrounding yourself with some of the same people. I would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to get to the bottom of it. As you saw yesterday, that whole nonsense ended with a very poor performance by a man named Robert Mueller, an incompetent performance, but they say a lot of it started with Ukraine. Whatever you can do, it’s very important that you do it if that’s possible.

President Zelenskyy: Yes it is very important for me and everything that you just mentioned earlier. For me as a President, it is very important and we are open for any future cooperation. We are ready to open a new page on cooperation in relations between the United States and Ukraine. For that purpose, I just recalled our ambassador from United States and he will be replaced by a very competent and very experienced ambassador who will work hard on making sure that our two nations are getting closer. I would also like and hope to see him having your trust and your confidence and have personal relations with you so we can cooperate even more so. I will personally tell you that one of my assistants spoke with Mr. Giuliani just recently and we are hoping very much that Mr. Giuliani will be able to travel to Ukraine and we will meet once he comes to Ukraine. I just wanted to assure you once again that you have nobody but friends around us. I will make sure that I surround myself with the best and most experienced people. I also wanted to tell you that we are friends. We are great friends and you Mr. President have friends in our country so we can continue our strategic partnership. I also plan to surround myself with great people and in addition to that investigation, I guarantee as the President of Ukraine that all the investigations will be done openly and candidly.. That I can assure you.

The President: Good because I heard you had a prosecutor who was very good and he was shut down and that’s really unfair. A lot of people are talking about that, the way they shut your very good prosecutor down and you had some very bad people involved. Mr. Giuliani is a highly respected man. He was the mayor of New York City, a great mayor, and I would like him to call you. I will ask him to call you along with the Attorney General. Rudy very much knows what’s happening and he is a very capable guy. If you could speak to him that would be great. The former ambassador from the United States, the woman, was bad news and the people she was dealing with in the Ukraine were bad news so I just want to let you know that. The other thing, There’s a lot of talk about Biden’s son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it… It sounds horrible to me.

President Zelenskyy: I wanted to tell you about the prosecutor. First of all, I understand and I’m knowledgeable about the situation. Since we have won the absolute majority in our Parliament, the next prosecutor general will be 100% my person, my candidate, who will be approved, by the parliament and will start as a new prosecutor in September. He or she will look into the situation, specifically to the company that you mentioned in this issue. The issue of the investigation of the case is actually the issue of making sure to restore the honesty so we will take care of that and will work on the investigation of the case. On top of that, I would kindly ask you if you have any additional information that you can provide to us, it would be very helpful for the investigation to make sure that we administer justice in our country with regard to the Ambassador to the United States from Ukraine as far as I recall her name was Ivanovich. It was great that you were the first one who told me that she was a bad ambassador because I agree with you 100%. Her attitude towards me was far from the best as she admired the previous President and she was on his side. She would not accept me as a new President well enough.

The President: Well, she’s going to go through some things. I will have Mr. Giuliani give you a call and I am also going to have Attorney General Barr call and we will get to the bottom of it. I’m sure you will figure it out. I heard the prosecutor was treated very badly and he was a very fair prosecutor so good luck with everything. Your economy is going to get better and better I predict. You have a lot of assets. It’s a great country. I have many Ukrainian friends, their incredible people.

President Zelenskyy: I would like to tell you that I also have quite a few Ukrainian friends that live in the United States. Actually last time I traveled to the United States, I stayed in New York near Central Park and I stayed at the Trump Tower. I will talk to them and I hope to see them again in the future. I also wanted to thank you for your invitation to visit the United States, specifically Washington DC. On the other hand, I also want to ensure you that we will be very serious about the case and will work on the investigation. As to the economy, there is much potential for our two countries and one of the issues that is very important for Ukraine is energy independence. I believe we can be very successful and cooperating on energy independence with United States. We are already working on cooperation. We are buying American oil but I am very hopeful for a future meeting. We will have more time and more opportunities to discuss these opportunities and get to know each other better. I would like to thank you very much for your support.

The President: Good. Well, thank you very much and I appreciate that. I will tell Rudy and Attorney General Barr to call. Thank you. Whenever you would like to come to the White House, feel free to call. Give us a date and we’ll work that out. I look forward to seeing you.

President Zelenskyy: Thank you very much. I would be very happy to come and would be happy to meet with you personally and get to know you better. I am looking forward to our meeting and I also would like to invite you to visit Ukraine and come to the city of Kyiv which is a beautiful city. We have a beautiful country which would welcome you. On the other hand, I believe that on September 1 we will be in Poland and we can meet in Poland hopefully. After that, it might be a very good idea for you to travel to Ukraine. We can either take my plane and go to Ukraine or we can take your plane, which is probably much better than mine.

The President: Okay, we can work that out. I look forward to seeing you in Washington and maybe in Poland because I think we are going to be there at that time.

President Zelenskyy: Thank you very much Mr. President.

The President: Congratulations on a fantastic job you’ve done. The whole world was watching. I’m not sure it was so much of an upset but congratulations.

President Zelenskyy: Thank you Mr. President bye-bye.

- - End of conversation - -


There is more to it than just the transcript. But I hope that clarifies it a bit?
 
lol, so disingenuous

No one has ever said that - just that there is no proof of corruption in the instance you're talking about.

You know, proof? That thing you generally need to get a conviction?
Batting for Joe has been feature of this thread. The whole there is no proof thing is just a fallback position. Biden's a strange guy to be defending.
 
Batting for Joe has been feature of this thread. The whole there is no proof thing is just a fallback position. Biden's a strange guy to be defending.

More of your bullshit. Basically everyone here who isn't a Trumpie holds the position that Biden is the better of two poor candidates, and the bar is very low. It's not even close between them, except for the Trumpies (including the closet ones like you).
 
I simply do not see what you describe as evidence for your reasons ...

During their discussion that is mostly meant to be a formality showing respect etc.
Trump brings up that it's only really the US that Ukraine can rely on for help, and how much Ukraine needs that help. Manipulative wording such as "the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.
Zelenskyy diplomatically thanks Trump (the US), agrees that Ukraine needs the help and support from the US, and specifically mentions the next steps in the US aid to Ukraine.
Trump replies to this by pointing out that he needs a favour.
This is the often talked about 'quid pro quo'.

What I read in the transcript was Trump saying Zelenskyy should be asking for more help from European countries and Zelenskyy saying they were almost ready to buy more Javelins.
There was no 'quid pro quo'. Zelenskyy states intent to buy and Trump asks him to investigate the Crowdstrike stuff. The exact details of that part we do not know because the transcript may not include everything verbatim then said (I remind you this is a transcript of what an agent listening heard and chose to repeat).
I believe Trump's biggest fail here is his lack of understanding about the Crowdstike stuff. At this point in time, he appears to believe there is a physical Crowdstrike server in Ukraine, which was highly unlikely (ie. Crowdstrike would use virtual servers for such a task at that time). That is, if Zelenskyy had done an open and transparent investigation in to this, it would have given Trump nothing anyways. So where is the 'quid pro quo' that you and others speak of? Trump was simply searching for truth and information and Zelenskyy said they may soon buy javelins.

...

The President: Well it is very nice of you to say that. I will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort and a lot of time. Much more than the European countries are doing and they should be helping you more than they are. Germany does almost nothing for you. All they do is talk and I think it’s something that you should really ask them about. When I was speaking to Angela Merkel she talks Ukraine, but she ·doesn’t do anything. A lot of the European countries are the same way so I think it’s something you want to look at but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine. I wouldn’t say that it’s reciprocal necessarily because things are happening that are not good but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.

President Zelenskyy: Yes you are absolutely right. Not only 100%, but actually 1000% and I can tell you the following; I did talk to Angela Merkel and I did meet with her I also met and talked with Macron and I told them that they are not doing quite as much as they need to be doing on the issues with the sanctions. They are not enforcing the sanctions. They are not working as much as they should work for Ukraine. It turns out that even though logically, the European Union should be our biggest partner but technically the United States is a much bigger partner than the European Union and I’m very grateful to you for that because the United States is doing quite a lot for Ukraine. Much more than the European Union especially when we are talking about sanctions against the Russian Federation. I would also like to thank you for your great support in the area of defense. We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps specifically we are almost. ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes.

The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike…I guess you have one of your wealthy people…


Trump then goes in to discuss the need to look into Biden and find something.

Zelenskyy continues to diplomatically point out that all corruption etc will be investigated openly and candidly.
Trump keeps insisting that it would be better if Zelenskyy and Giuliani meet and discuss the outcomes of an investigation.

Again, I fail to see what you claim about the Biden topic. Trump asks Zelenskyy to investigate the Biden thing with the Attorney General as stated in the transcript.

"The other thing, There’s a lot of talk about Biden’s son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great."


In my efforts to try to understand, I was sincerely hoping you would show some credible evidence/quotes supporting your reasons why you believed this transcript was bad for Trump. Sadly, I only see the same propaganda gaslighting used at the time to justify one of their many time wasting political witch-hunts against Trump.
 
I simply do not see what you describe as evidence for your reasons ...



What I read in the transcript was Trump saying Zelenskyy should be asking for more help from European countries and Zelenskyy saying they were almost ready to buy more Javelins.
There was no 'quid pro quo'. Zelenskyy states intent to buy and Trump asks him to investigate the Crowdstrike stuff. The exact details of that part we do not know because the transcript may not include everything verbatim then said (I remind you this is a transcript of what an agent listening heard and chose to repeat).
I believe Trump's biggest fail here is his lack of understanding about the Crowdstike stuff. At this point in time, he appears to believe there is a physical Crowdstrike server in Ukraine, which was highly unlikely (ie. Crowdstrike would use virtual servers for such a task at that time). That is, if Zelenskyy had done an open and transparent investigation in to this, it would have given Trump nothing anyways. So where is the 'quid pro quo' that you and others speak of? Trump was simply searching for truth and information and Zelenskyy said they may soon buy javelins.

...

The President: Well it is very nice of you to say that. I will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort and a lot of time. Much more than the European countries are doing and they should be helping you more than they are. Germany does almost nothing for you. All they do is talk and I think it’s something that you should really ask them about. When I was speaking to Angela Merkel she talks Ukraine, but she ·doesn’t do anything. A lot of the European countries are the same way so I think it’s something you want to look at but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine. I wouldn’t say that it’s reciprocal necessarily because things are happening that are not good but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.

President Zelenskyy: Yes you are absolutely right. Not only 100%, but actually 1000% and I can tell you the following; I did talk to Angela Merkel and I did meet with her I also met and talked with Macron and I told them that they are not doing quite as much as they need to be doing on the issues with the sanctions. They are not enforcing the sanctions. They are not working as much as they should work for Ukraine. It turns out that even though logically, the European Union should be our biggest partner but technically the United States is a much bigger partner than the European Union and I’m very grateful to you for that because the United States is doing quite a lot for Ukraine. Much more than the European Union especially when we are talking about sanctions against the Russian Federation. I would also like to thank you for your great support in the area of defense. We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps specifically we are almost. ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes.

The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike…I guess you have one of your wealthy people…




Again, I fail to see what you claim about the Biden topic. Trump asks Zelenskyy to investigate the Biden thing with the Attorney General as stated in the transcript.

"The other thing, There’s a lot of talk about Biden’s son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great."


In my efforts to try to understand, I was sincerely hoping you would show some credible evidence/quotes supporting your reasons why you believed this transcript was bad for Trump. Sadly, I only see the same propaganda gaslighting used at the time to justify one of their many time wasting political witch-hunts against Trump.

No problem, I appreciate your response.

You asked me to try and put it into my own words with quotes to support it. Specifically in regards to the transcript. And I did that.
It's also hard to explain intent, manipulation, coercive language etc. Especially on such a politically charged topic.
And we are always going to interpret information with their own biases.




But it brings me back to my original point and reason for raising it.
If you cannot see anything wrong with the Trump-Ukraine scandal, then what can you possibly say that Joe Biden HAS done, with evidence, that is worse?

If you can look at that transcript, and state that there was nothing you can see that could even imply impropriety, (let alone in connection to the other actions). Then what is a single thing that Joe Biden has said or done that you can actually condemn, while maintaining your same standards for Trump?
 
More of your bullshit. Basically everyone here who isn't a Trumpie holds the position that Biden is the better of two poor candidates, and the bar is very low. It's not even close between them, except for the Trumpies (including the closet ones like you).

Why are the polls in the US showing more support for Trump?

Many Trump supporters claim the election was stolen. The current polls are showing about 5-8% swings in favor of Trump in the battleground states compared to this same time 4 years ago.
That is, the current polling numbers show Trump would win an election if held today easily ... at levels likely too hard for the Democrats to steal ... again.

The level of support for and against Trump in this thread (and other threads on BigFooty) has little correlation to the support in the US. You may want to consider the possibility that most Trump supporting BigFooty posters continually get banned from such threads and discussions. I was banned from the entire SRP forum in late 2019 for making what I consider was an evidenced backed factual statement about George Soros. I was banned by the Admin with no warnings. My story is a common story amongst Trump supporters on BigFooty.
 
Why are the polls in the US showing more support for Trump?

Many Trump supporters claim the election was stolen. The current polls are showing about 5-8% swings in favor of Trump in the battleground states compared to this same time 4 years ago.
That is, the current polling numbers show Trump would win an election if held today easily ... at levels likely too hard for the Democrats to steal ... again.

The level of support for and against Trump in this thread (and other threads on BigFooty) has little correlation to the support in the US. You may want to consider the possibility that most Trump supporting BigFooty posters continually get banned from such threads and discussions. I was banned from the entire SRP forum in late 2019 for making what I consider was an evidenced backed factual statement about George Soros. I was banned by the Admin with no warnings. My story is a common story amongst Trump supporters on BigFooty.
Trump is going to win the election.

But the popularity of a person doesn't change if something is factual or not.

You wouldn't agree with De Niro's opinion on everything, even though he is incredibly popular.


I've seen many Trump supporters banned from SRP and BigFooty in general. Some of what they posted before being banned was pretty horrific. Some just repeatedly pushed the set boundaries until they were removed.

There was a lot of hateful and dangerous rhetoric around Soros, Jews and globalists.
If you were posting about Soros in political threads, you would have been aware prior to that that it was considered conspiratorial, and that conspiracy theories were to be kept to the conspiracy forum.
You may not agree that it's a conspiracy theory etc, but I don't think it's fair to claim you had no warning or that you had no way of knowing.
 
More of your bullshit. Basically everyone here who isn't a Trumpie holds the position that Biden is the better of two poor candidates, and the bar is very low. It's not even close between them, except for the Trumpies (including the closet ones like you).
He isn't a Trump supporter... He just thinks that the Jan 6th insurrectionists did nothing wrong. :moustache:
 
Why are the polls in the US showing more support for Trump?

Many Trump supporters claim the election was stolen. The current polls are showing about 5-8% swings in favor of Trump in the battleground states compared to this same time 4 years ago.
That is, the current polling numbers show Trump would win an election if held today easily ... at levels likely too hard for the Democrats to steal ... again.

The level of support for and against Trump in this thread (and other threads on BigFooty) has little correlation to the support in the US. You may want to consider the possibility that most Trump supporting BigFooty posters continually get banned from such threads and discussions. I was banned from the entire SRP forum in late 2019 for making what I consider was an evidenced backed factual statement about George Soros. I was banned by the Admin with no warnings. My story is a common story amongst Trump supporters on BigFooty.

OK, simplify it for me.

Why are you a Trump supporter?
 
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