VAFA General Discussion

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Chazz M Michaels said:
It's a pretty serious issue. I have friends that have had to close businesses as a result of these lockdowns. Glad to see you manage to get some tongue in cheek sarcasm out of blatant breaches of government health orders though.

Your consideration for the welfare of others is something to behold.

Drip.
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Driving thru Coburg-Brunswick just before our 5th lockdown and could not believe how many vacant shop fronts there were. It was like being time-warped to the Depression. The State is spiralling to a $200bn debt and none of the media seems interested. They will in 5 years when 35% of the budget is needed to repay minimum debt obligations.
 
AM said:
Seems a lot of people here are coming to conclusions that are significantly emotion-based. The VAFA has the responsibility to seek out and marshal the facts, objectively appraise them and act on them.

Because the main player in this matter has a record of poor behaviour and is a bit of a tool isn't something that the VAFA would be taking into account in the investigative process. If there was objective proof the club knew of the actions and did nothing that would be the time to look at past behaviour.

To act on other than the objective facts would open up the VAFA to a tirade of criticism.

Think I've made it clear the known information doesn't square with me and I'd guess it doesn't square with at least some of the movers-n-shakers at HQ. But that isn't a sufficient basis on which to hand out substantial sanctions.

I don't see an issue with referring the matter of the coaching accreditation to AFL Vic as accreditation is part of their role. I do wonder why the flagrant breach of the CHO's direction wasn't also referred to the relevant authority.

Just why the board/committee of the football hasn't got on the front foot publicly stating they were unaware of the activity and expressing their displeasure and that they have told those from the club who were there so and in no uncertain terms is troubling.

This piece on the matter from the HS today.

VAFA calls on AFL Vic to investigate lockdown training session

The Victorian Amateur Football Association will take no action against a club whose players trained in defiance of Victoria’s lockdown rules.

Instead it has handballed the issue to the state’s governing body, AFL Victoria.

A Richmond Central player recorded a group of players from VAFA club Kew training at the Kevin Bartlett Oval last Sunday week.

He challenged the players and had a verbal stoush with Kew senior coach Ian Aitken, the former Carlton premiership defender.

“Oi, who the f--k is in charge here? What’s going on? This is our oval, you can’t be f--king training here, and it’s f--king lockdown too,’’ the Richmond Central player says at the start of the video.

“What are you doing?

“This is Richmond Central, get the f--k off our oval … you can’t be doing this, it’s our oval and it’s lockdown.’’

At one point, a player can be seen trying to push Aitken away from the confrontation.

The Richmond club sent the footage to the VAFA and also contacted Yarra Council about the episode.

A Richmond Central official said the player who took the video had seen a group of players taking part in organised training at the Kevin Bartlett Oval a week earlier, also during lockdown.

The VAFA investigated the matter and Kew has escaped punishment.

The association will also take no action against Aitken, but it has referred him to AFL Victoria.

In a statement on Tuesday, VAFA chief executive Brett Connell said the VAFA accepted Kew’s explanation that the training session wasn’t sanctioned by the club and “no further action will be taken against the club’’.

“As the matter directly relates to coaching and coach accreditation, the VAFA has referred the matter to AFL Victoria and requested that they investigate the matter and advise further of any sanctions or recommendations,’’ he said.

“The matter has been elevated to AFL Victoria as it is clear (from the video evidence provided) that this is a coaching-related activity held during the recent state government-enforced lockdown and we believe the actions may have breached restrictions in place at the time.

“As coach accreditation is the domain of the AFL, we have requested that AFL Victoria investigate the matter as it relates directly to the coach accreditation.’’

Connell added: “The VAFA views the actions that took place in the video footage from all concerned dimly and reiterate that state government restrictions and AFL Victoria return to play protocols must be strictly adhered to by all members of the VAFA community.

“To be concise, any individual or club not observing the current restrictions and protocols in place, are putting the remainder of the VAFA season and finals series in jeopardy.’’

Aitken, 64, figured in Carlton’s 1987 premiership team and had 61 matches for the Blues before crossing to St Kilda, where he played five games in 1993.[/1]
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Were any members of the VAFA acting in the Covid 19-Hotel Royal Commission? They sound like they may have.
 
This weekend I’ll be selling booze from a little pop up bar next to the canteen and club rooms.
Should my club be worried? Of course not, they know nothing about it, therefore it’s not actually sanctioned by the club.
I will donate all profits to the club following the game though.
I suggest that someone unaffiliated with each club do this each week.
 

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AM said:
Seems a lot of people here are coming to conclusions that are significantly emotion-based. The VAFA has the responsibility to seek out and marshal the facts, objectively appraise them and act on them.

Because the main player in this matter has a record of poor behaviour and is a bit of a tool isn't something that the VAFA would be taking into account in the investigative process. If there was objective proof the club knew of the actions and did nothing that would be the time to look at past behaviour.

To act on other than the objective facts would open up the VAFA to a tirade of criticism.

Think I've made it clear the known information doesn't square with me and I'd guess it doesn't square with at least some of the movers-n-shakers at HQ. But that isn't a sufficient basis on which to hand out substantial sanctions.

I don't see an issue with referring the matter of the coaching accreditation to AFL Vic as accreditation is part of their role. I do wonder why the flagrant breach of the CHO's direction wasn't also referred to the relevant authority.

Just why the board/committee of the football hasn't got on the front foot publicly stating they were unaware of the activity and expressing their displeasure and that they have told those from the club who were there so and in no uncertain terms is troubling.

This piece on the matter from the HS today.

VAFA calls on AFL Vic to investigate lockdown training session

The Victorian Amateur Football Association will take no action against a club whose players trained in defiance of Victoria’s lockdown rules.

Instead it has handballed the issue to the state’s governing body, AFL Victoria.

A Richmond Central player recorded a group of players from VAFA club Kew training at the Kevin Bartlett Oval last Sunday week.

He challenged the players and had a verbal stoush with Kew senior coach Ian Aitken, the former Carlton premiership defender.

“Oi, who the f--k is in charge here? What’s going on? This is our oval, you can’t be f--king training here, and it’s f--king lockdown too,’’ the Richmond Central player says at the start of the video.

“What are you doing?

“This is Richmond Central, get the f--k off our oval … you can’t be doing this, it’s our oval and it’s lockdown.’’

At one point, a player can be seen trying to push Aitken away from the confrontation.

The Richmond club sent the footage to the VAFA and also contacted Yarra Council about the episode.

A Richmond Central official said the player who took the video had seen a group of players taking part in organised training at the Kevin Bartlett Oval a week earlier, also during lockdown.

The VAFA investigated the matter and Kew has escaped punishment.

The association will also take no action against Aitken, but it has referred him to AFL Victoria.

In a statement on Tuesday, VAFA chief executive Brett Connell said the VAFA accepted Kew’s explanation that the training session wasn’t sanctioned by the club and “no further action will be taken against the club’’.

“As the matter directly relates to coaching and coach accreditation, the VAFA has referred the matter to AFL Victoria and requested that they investigate the matter and advise further of any sanctions or recommendations,’’ he said.

“The matter has been elevated to AFL Victoria as it is clear (from the video evidence provided) that this is a coaching-related activity held during the recent state government-enforced lockdown and we believe the actions may have breached restrictions in place at the time.

“As coach accreditation is the domain of the AFL, we have requested that AFL Victoria investigate the matter as it relates directly to the coach accreditation.’’

Connell added: “The VAFA views the actions that took place in the video footage from all concerned dimly and reiterate that state government restrictions and AFL Victoria return to play protocols must be strictly adhered to by all members of the VAFA community.

“To be concise, any individual or club not observing the current restrictions and protocols in place, are putting the remainder of the VAFA season and finals series in jeopardy.’’

Aitken, 64, figured in Carlton’s 1987 premiership team and had 61 matches for the Blues before crossing to St Kilda, where he played five games in 1993.[/1]
Click to expand...

I hear/(see) you loud and clear. On a completely unrelated note, I see Lin Jong has retired, terrific player - real shame he couldnt reach his potential. Perhaps I'll ask him to play at my local football club as I'm acquaintances with his cousin. I'll offer him $500 in cold hard cash per game, and an extra $100 for every goal he kicks. The money will be paid under the table from my company that I own and operate and I wont tell the club committee about it the "specific" details.
Seems fair to me and if I ever get caught, well the club should be fine as the committee knows nothing about it so no problem there.
Excellent. Terrific. Makes sense to me.
 
HedgeFund said:
My 2 cents….

It’s entirely plausible that this session was organised by the coach and playing group without the imprimatur of the committee.

Once a season starts, in my experience, the committee leave it up to the football department to run their show as they see fit. So unless you’ve got a controlling President (like a Jeff Kennett) the coach and their staff/players should be left to their own devices, particularly when it comes to training sessions.

In this instance, with a clearly dominant long standing coach, I’d be surprised if the Kew committee query what he’s doing from week to week.

Having said that, the club committee/board is vicariously liable for the actions of the employee, so a fine (perhaps partially payable and partially suspended) would have been appropriate for the club and hopefully the referral to AFL Victoria sees the appropriate sanction imposed on the coach.

Not only for the session being held but the way he behaved towards the guy who took the video. Conduct unbecoming of an AFL accredited coach for sure. You can lose your ticket for engaging in far less serious behaviour than this.
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Invoking 'vicarious liability' in regard to an amateur football club is nonsense. No one in club land works full time on matters relating directly to a particular club. Fining any club right now for something that is non-club sanctioned is a death sentence. If you don't believe the club, that's your prerogative, but the society we live in works on evidence-based sanctions, not the 'I don't like the coach and the club come off as smug' hunches that so many appear to have embraced in the past week or so. The investigation is passed on to a higher authority. While we have reasons to be critical of the VAFA, in this case surely it is the right decision considering the evidence that has been presented.
Original Moody Blue said:
Driving thru Coburg-Brunswick just before our 5th lockdown and could not believe how many vacant shop fronts there were. It was like being time-warped to the Depression. The State is spiralling to a $200bn debt and none of the media seems interested. They will in 5 years when 35% of the budget is needed to repay minimum debt obligations.
Click to expand...
You're treating this as an economic issue before it being a global health emergency. It is simultaneously both. Your logic is lazy. Your attack on the media is limited and boring. Your historical analysis is anecdotal and I doubt you have studied the period of the GD enough to be able to accurately compare the two. The great majority of health officials support lockdowns in the face of COVID community cases. So do the great majority of economists.
 
Do Kew have a junior club ? I wonder what they think of the coach of their senior club doing this, and acting the way he did ? Would it have a flow on effect of parents not wanting to send their boys and girls to a club that condones that behaviour ?

There isn't a lid big enough for this can of worms at the moment.
 
Gia77 said:
I hear/(see) you loud and clear. On a completely unrelated note, I see Lin Jong has retired, terrific player - real shame he couldnt reach his potential. Perhaps I'll ask him to play at my local football club as I'm acquaintances with his cousin. I'll offer him $500 in cold hard cash per game, and an extra $100 for every goal he kicks. The money will be paid under the table from my company that I own and operate and I wont tell the club committee about it the "specific" details.
Seems fair to me and if I ever get caught, well the club should be fine as the committee knows nothing about it so no problem there.
Excellent. Terrific. Makes sense to me.
Click to expand...
How jolly. Lots of fun. Now look up false equavalence.
 
HedgeFund said:
My 2 cents….

It’s entirely plausible that this session was organised by the coach and playing group without the imprimatur of the committee.

Once a season starts, in my experience, the committee leave it up to the football department to run their show as they see fit. So unless you’ve got a controlling President (like a Jeff Kennett) the coach and their staff/players should be left to their own devices, particularly when it comes to training sessions.

In this instance, with a clearly dominant long standing coach, I’d be surprised if the Kew committee query what he’s doing from week to week.

Having said that, the club committee/board is vicariously liable for the actions of the employee, so a fine (perhaps partially payable and partially suspended) would have been appropriate for the club and hopefully the referral to AFL Victoria sees the appropriate sanction imposed on the coach.

Not only for the session being held but the way he behaved towards the guy who took the video. Conduct unbecoming of an AFL accredited coach for sure. You can lose your ticket for engaging in far less serious behaviour than this.
Click to expand...

No one is saying the committee approved it, but they’re FOS if they say they weren’t aware of it.
 

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eth-dog said:
Pissweak. Absolutely shameful from the VAFA.
Click to expand...

Exactly my thoughts.
Accreditation may be an afl Vic thing but the vafa can suspend coaches?!?
This joker should not be coaching for the rest of the season at least and probably some more. Grow some cojones vafa and make a real decision for once.
🤡 show all round here.

Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
 
Last edited:
Hippster said:
I know AM..I was just muckin. I’m guilty of exactly what you just said and was not surprised at all by Chazzalenko as he’s a beauty.
From the get go I said that the Maestro, sorry last time I promise, would cop a whack and that Kew FC wouldn’t as they had no idea about it. That’s what I was told. I’ve been, like I’m sure you have, a very good boy during lockdown and would be happy with any punishment that comes the Professors…Ian’s way. Get your jab people and let’s get things back to normal.
Hipp
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Glad you've seen the error of your ways. There's a time and place for your usual "shtick" hippo, I'm sure you'll learn from this and grow from it. Your apology is accepted.
 
Chazz M Michaels said:
Glad you've seen the error of your ways. There's a time and place for your usual "shtick" hippo, I'm sure you'll learn from this and grow from it. Your apology is accepted.
Click to expand...

Wasnt reeeaaaaly an apology. I’ve been consistent all along. In fact I believe I was the first to comment on this topic. I said Kew knew nothing about it and won’t get in trouble at all and that it’s a full Beaser issue and consequences would be his alone. Sure I then threw in a snake reference, matchday maestro, the professor of promotion etc etc. But I can’t really help myself there. I think we both know that.
Hipp
 
Hippster said:
Wasnt reeeaaaaly an apology. I’ve been consistent all along. In fact I believe I was the first to comment on this topic. I said Kew knew nothing about it and won’t get in trouble at all and that it’s a full Beaser issue and consequences would be his alone. Sure I then threw in a snake reference, matchday maestro, the professor of promotion etc etc. But I can’t really help myself there. I think we both know that.
Hipp
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..... and some of us know Hip that the 'committee' didn't sanction is very different from the 'committee' didn't know. On top of that senior players were involved in the session with the senior coach.

Anyway, good luck to the Kew FC for the rest of the year and disappointing that you feel getting away with this is a 'win', but an appalling display of disrespect for many within not only the football community but the community as a whole.

Please speak to some of your 'current' players on how they feel about the whole situation - as I have. Some at the club have let them down significantly. As I have said before they are #nothappyjan

Chump.
 
Original Moody Blue said:
Driving thru Coburg-Brunswick just before our 5th lockdown and could not believe how many vacant shop fronts there were. It was like being time-warped to the Depression. The State is spiralling to a $200bn debt and none of the media seems interested. They will in 5 years when 35% of the budget is needed to repay minimum debt obligations.
Click to expand...
Like some cheese with your whine?
 
Gia77 said:
I hear/(see) you loud and clear. On a completely unrelated note, I see Lin Jong has retired, terrific player - real shame he couldnt reach his potential. Perhaps I'll ask him to play at my local football club as I'm acquaintances with his cousin. I'll offer him $500 in cold hard cash per game, and an extra $100 for every goal he kicks. The money will be paid under the table from my company that I own and operate and I wont tell the club committee about it the "specific" details.
Seems fair to me and if I ever get caught, well the club should be fine as the committee knows nothing about it so no problem there.
Excellent. Terrific. Makes sense to me.
Click to expand...
I could name a dozen clubs who operate that way now, and have been for a while ?////
 
www.vafa.com.au

Urgent VAFA Advice: 05-08-2021 | VAFA

Further to the information provided late yesterday in regard to this weekend’s round of matches, we have an update specifically related to crowds & functions. The VAFA has been advised by the Department of Sport, Recreation & Racing that the … Continued
www.vafa.com.au www.vafa.com.au
 
Champ or Chump said:
..... and some of us know Hip that the 'committee' didn't sanction is very different from the 'committee' didn't know. On top of that senior players were involved in the session with the senior coach.

Anyway, good luck to the Kew FC for the rest of the year and disappointing that you feel getting away with this is a 'win', but an appalling display of disrespect for many within not only the football community but the community as a whole.

Please speak to some of your 'current' players on how they feel about the whole situation - as I have. Some at the club have let them down significantly. As I have said before they are #nothappyjan

Chump.
Click to expand...
Very good pick-up Chump. I took those words at face value but it looks very much like it's a crafted form of words. If the administration of the football club knew of the training and just sat on its hands that wholly changes my view. The VAFA needs to clarify this as it goes to the heart of the Kew Football Club case.
 
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