Current WAR CRIMES Israel - Hamas - Hizbullah - Houthis

[Ghost Patrol]

You're pushing the left wing view of history.

The one where the things that happened all over the world and undertaken by everyone are only ascribed to the Europeans as being bad.

Colonising only matters when it was Europeans doing it seems to be the angle. Otherwise it's down play it as a thing.

Do you prefer the far right, Nazi Germany view of history?

Because you seem to be supporting a far right government and it's policies/actions right now...

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

The ones who spread Arab culture and a religious ideology throughout the region.

Still having a horribly negative impact on the world today.

Ah, so you're conflating Arab and Muslim here.

You do realise the people ruling large areas of Palestine whom the Muslim Rashidun Caliphate conquered were the Ghassanids, a Christian Arab kingdom who fought along side the Byzantines?

Many prominent Christian families in Palestine today trace their lineage back to the Ghassanid kingdom.

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

Kind of like how certain people only talk about slavery from a few hundred years ago by certain nations but say sweet FA about the 50 million slaves in 2024.

Well not really. The exact opposite, in a way.

Are you trying to excuse the use of slaves in the Americas by saying this?

 

[Bostonian]

Do you prefer the far right, Nazi Germany view of history?

Because you seem to be supporting a far right government and it's policies/actions right now...

I prefer the actual one.

I'm not supporting anyone.

Unlike you who is an openly going into bat for all kinds of terrorist organisations.

 

[Bostonian]

Well not really. The exact opposite, in a way.

Are you trying to excuse the use of slaves in the Americas by saying this?

Well that's a perfect example of how people were brainwashed into a false historical account of how things happened.

It was always pushed as being a European thing.

When in fact it was a world wide trade involving all kinds of people and nations.

I have seen morons who thought there were Europeans running all around Africa catching slaves.

When the reality they were just buying them from the Africans themselves.

Rinse and repeat world wide.

 

[Bostonian]

Ah, so you're conflating Arab and Muslim here.

You do realise the people ruling large areas of Palestine whom the Muslim Rashidun Caliphate conquered were the Ghassanids, a Christian Arab kingdom who fought along side the Byzantines?

Many prominent Christian families in Palestine today trace their lineage back to the Ghassanid kingdom.

Well given the prophet was from Arabia...

Palestine didn't exist back then.

In fact that area has been controlled by that many different groups over the centuries it seems who ever has the military strength to hold it, holds it.

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

Well that's a perfect example of how people were brainwashed into a false historical account of how things happened.

It was always pushed as being a European thing.

When in fact it was a world wide trade involving all kinds of people and nations.

I have seen morons who thought there were Europeans running all around Africa catching slaves.

When the reality they were just buying them from the Africans themselves.

Rinse and repeat world wide.

OK theres no way I'm continuing down this path. Not sure why I engaged tbh.

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

Well given the prophet was from Arabia...

...and?

Palestine didn't exist back then.

Well it wan't a state, but the word dates back the 12 century BCE.

In fact that area has been controlled by that many different groups over the centuries it seems who ever has the military strength to hold it, holds it.

You could say that for most of the world. Until the second half of the 20th century anyway, which is when the world attitude changed. Might is right is no longer an acceptable motto.

Back to your original post - Arabs conquered Arabs and Byzantines. Some people eventually took up the Islamic religion.

Why is that relevant to apartheid in Israel?

 

[Jazny]

None of it is relevant now. Israel exists and Israelis belong in the land, Palestinians exist and Palestinians belong in the land. Now it's all about finding a solution where the two people can live peacefully together without this constant back and forth nonsense.

 

[Bostonian]

...and?

And the colonisers spread their faith via war and conquest.

Well it wan't a state, but the word dates back the 12 century BCE.

A word that is associated with who ruled the area then.

The Greek lineage Philistines.

Amazing howany different people held that land.

Almost like nobody has any real claim over it.

You could say that for most of the world. Until the second half of the 20th century anyway, which is when the world attitude changed. Might is right is no longer an acceptable motto.

I could say that and I do. It's still happening. Not just in the Israel region.

Aack to your original post - Arabs conquered Arabs and Byzantines. Some people eventually took up the Islamic religion.

Why is that relevant to apartheid in Israel?

Arabs didn't just conquer Arabs though did they...

Their caliphates pushed much further out.

It's relevant because all these people who keep moaning about 1948 don't ever mention all the other countless times different colonial powers held those lands.

It's a common thing in that area over history yes?

 

[Zidane98]

 

[Festerz]

Documents discovered by the highly respected media outlet the New York Times reveal that Hamas tried to persuade Iran and Hezbollah to join its 7 October Attack on Southern Israel with the goal of creating a broader conflict across the Middle East.

The Times reviewed the minutes of 10 meetings among Hamas’s top leaders. The records show the militant group avoided several escalations since 2021 to falsely imply it had been deterred — while seeking Iranian support for a major attack.

'For more than two years, Yahya Sinwar huddled with his top Hamas commanders and plotted what they hoped would be the most devastating and destabilizing attack on Israel in the militant group’s four-decade history.'

'Minutes of Hamas’s secret meetings, seized by the Israeli military and obtained by The New York Times, provide a detailed record of the planning for the Oct. 7 terrorist attack, as well as Mr. Sinwar’s determination to persuade Hamas’s allies, Iran and Hezbollah, to join the assault or at least commit to a broader fight with Israel if Hamas staged a surprise cross-border raid.'
'The documents, which represent a breakthrough in understanding Hamas, also show extensive efforts to deceive Israel about its intentions as the group laid the groundwork for a bold assault and a regional conflagration that Mr. Sinwar hoped would cause Israel to “collapse.”'
The documents, which were verified by The Times, lay out the main strategies and assessments of the HAMAS leadership group:

• Hamas initially planned to carry out the attack, which it code-named “the big project,” in the fall of 2022. But the group delayed executing the plan as it tried to persuade Iran and Hezbollah to participate.
• As they prepared arguments aimed at Hezbollah, the Hamas leaders said that Israel’s “internal situation” — an apparent reference to turmoil over Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s contentious plans to overhaul the judiciary — was among the reasons they were “compelled to move toward a strategic battle.”
• In July 2023, Hamas dispatched a top official to Lebanon, where he met with a senior Iranian commander and requested help with striking sensitive sites at the start of the assault.
• The senior Iranian commander told Hamas that Iran and Hezbollah were supportive in principle, but needed more time to prepare; the minutes do not say how detailed a plan was presented by Hamas to its allies.
• The documents also say that Hamas planned to discuss the attack in more detail at a subsequent meeting with Hassan Nasrallah, Hezbollah’s leader at the time, but do not clarify whether the discussion happened.
• Hamas felt assured of its allies’ general support, but concluded it might need to go ahead without their full involvement — in part to stop Israel from deploying an advanced new air-defense system before the assault took place.
• The decision to attack was also influenced by Hamas’s desire to disrupt efforts to normalize relations between Israel and Saudi Arabia, the entrenchment of Israel’s occupation of the West Bank and Israeli efforts to exert greater control over the Aqsa mosque compound in Jerusalem, sacred in both Islam and Judaism and known to Jews as the Temple Mount.
• Hamas deliberately avoided major confrontations with Israel for two years from 2021, in order to maximize the surprise of the Oct. 7 attack. As the leaders saw it, they “must keep the enemy convinced that Hamas in Gaza wants calm.”
• Hamas leaders in Gaza said they briefed Ismail Haniyeh, Hamas’s Qatar-based political leader, on “the big project.” It was not previously known whether Mr. Haniyeh, who was assassinated by Israel in July, had been briefed on the attack before it happened.

The New York Times assessed the documents’ authenticity by sharing some of their contents with members of and experts close to Hamas. Salah al-Din al-Awawdeh, a Hamas member and a former fighter in its military wing who is now an analyst based in Istanbul, said that he was familiar with some of the details described in the documents and that keeping organized notes was consistent with the group’s general practices. A Palestinian analyst with knowledge of Hamas’s inner workings, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss sensitive topics, also confirmed certain details as well as general structural operations of Hamas that aligned with the documents.

Secret Documents Show Hamas Tried to Persuade Iran to Join Its Oct. 7 Attack

The Times reviewed the minutes of 10 meetings among Hamas’s top leaders. The records show the militant group avoided several escalations since 2021 to falsely imply it had been deterred — while seeking Iranian support for a major attack.

www.nytimes.com

 

[DapperDon]

Not denying they got these documents, but it certaintly came at a pretty good time for Israel.

 

[Festerz]

Not denying they got these documents, but it certaintly came at a pretty good time for Israel.

Good time?

I kind of think most Israelis, and a large share of Lebanese and Gaza civilians, would have preferred to have got them before 7 October 2023 rather than after.

 

[Ghost Patrol]

Not denying they got these documents, but it certaintly came at a pretty good time for Israel.

Points at calendar

 

[DapperDon]

Good time?

I kind of think most Israelis, and a large share of Lebanese and Gaza civilians, would have preferred to have got them before 7 October 2023 rather than after.

I mean good time as in it gives Israel more reasons from a PR view point to attack Iran and keep bombing Lebanon.

Though I could have used a better phrase than good time.

 

[Festerz]

I mean good time as in it gives Israel more reasons from a PR view point to attack Iran and keep bombing Lebanon.

Though I could have used a better phrase than good time.

Yep. I get it. No probs with what you posted and your intent - just drawing that line between Netanyahu /IDF generals and the Israeli people.

And while the motives of Netanyahu and the IDF can and should always be questioned I just don't think the journalistic integrity and credentials of the New York Times can be so easily dismissed on this.

 

[Kurve]

It's said that Hezbollah was found to have plans to attack Israel in a Hamas-like but larger scale attack to October 7, it was called Conquer Galilee.

I hope the NYT gets those documents as well.