We're gonna make 13+ Million from Pokies. U MAD NORF?

[cammo78]

Which is great that you can use them and put them down. Others are wired a little differently and become addicted much more easily. Pity they usually only learn this about themselves after a pile of damage has been inflicted on themselves and their loved ones.

So does that mean we remove all temptation to the detriment of the majority who are able to control their urges in order to control those who can't?

I think not.

While it's sad that people can and do suffer - this is a free country.

 

[cammo78]

Yeah, that's a feature of addiction, pursuing the habit to their own detriment. It's a disease, not a choice.

I have no idea.

But that doesn't mean that the majority need to go without to make sure the minority who can't control themselves don't get in trouble.

 

[Lethality]

I have no idea.

But that doesn't mean that the majority need to go without to make sure the minority who can't control themselves don't get in trouble.

I don't think we're missing out on much if we get rid of pokies. Also in this case the clubs wouldn't be destroying the pokies, they'd just on-sell them hopefully.

 

[mess]

Yeah, that's a feature of addiction, pursuing the habit to their own detriment. It's a disease, not a choice.

If it's a disease, it's one that was caught from someone's own choices.

 

[Lethality]

If it's a disease, it's one that was caught from someone's own choices.

We also have a choice not to make products that prey on people's compulsions.

 

[cammo78]

I don't think we're missing out on much if we get rid of pokies. Also in this case the clubs wouldn't be destroying the pokies, they'd just on-sell them hopefully.

So the pokies will still exist - just furnishing the pockets of other people/organizations?

Why is this a good thing?

 

[Lethality]

So the pokies will still exist - just furnishing the pockets of other people/organizations?

Why is this a good thing?

It's not, but it would be what happens if the clubs get rid of them.

 

[mess]

We also have a choice not to make products that prey on people's compulsive urges.

Yes we do, and I for one am totally fine with not making it.

 

[11sjw]

We also have a choice not to make products that prey on people's compulsions.

Yet the government promotes the hell out of the Lotteries.

 

[Lethality]

Yes we do, and I for one am totally fine with the choice we made.

We're just the middlemen, it's the designers and original owners that I'm talking about. These are machines that are designed by psychologists to be addictive and by programmers to collect guaranteed wins.

 

[cammo78]

We also have a choice not to make products that prey on people's compulsions.

Which is the case for a VERY small percentage of users.

99% of people enjoy them, and get up and walk away when it's time to do so.

This is also a key reason I, and a lot of others, advocate welfare recipients being able to spend their allowances on essentials only (rent, food, etc) and having this controlled by card, to prevent those who can't afford to gamble/drink/smoke from doing so.

Then you get the do-gooders who say "but it's their money - they can do what they want with it".

That is also garbage. It is not "their money", at all. It's taxpayer money provided to ensure they have access to necessities.

 

[cammo78]

We're just the middlemen, it's the designers and original owners that I'm talking about. These are machines that are designed by psychologists to be addictive and by programmers to collect guaranteed wins.

They are also designed to pay out > 90% of what is put into them.

 

[Lethality]

Yet the government promotes the hell out of the Lotteries.

Lotteries don't take much time or money out of individuals.

 

[Lethality]

Which is the case for a VERY small percentage of users.

It's the case for 100% of the machines.

 

[Lethality]

They are also designed to pay out > 90% of what is put into them.

Figure I heard was around 30%. The settings can be altered so it's probably a case by case basis, but I'm sure none of them are programmed to lose money.

 

[mess]

We're just the middlemen, it's the designers and original owners that I'm talking about. These are machines that are designed by psychologists to be addictive and by programmers to collect guaranteed wins.

Yep. And as long as punters are given an accurate idea of the odds and are of age, they can do what they like. The mandate of the machine makers is to be as profitable as possible. That requires attracting customers. Just because the service they provide is unfathomable to most people, doesn't make them morally lower than any other business.

 

[mess]

Figure I heard was around 30%. The settings can be altered so it's probably a case by case basis, but I'm sure none of them are programmed to lose money.

Outrageous if true!!

 

[Lethality]

Yep. And as long as punters are given an accurate idea of the odds and are of age, they can do what they like. .

I'm not talking about making pokie machines illegal. Of course people can ultimately do what they like, it doesn't change the fact that these machine create problems for people.

 

[mess]

I'm not talking about making pokie machines illegal. Of course people can do ultimately do what they like, it doesn't change the fact that these machine create problems for people.

Pokies create temptation for people. That is their only discernable product. Try your luck. Spend a little money to see if you can be the one to beat the odds. It is sad that this temptation becomes a problem for some people, but creating the temptation is not the same as creating the problem. Let's just remember which party is the thinking and grown human being and which party is the inanimate object.

Having said that, we should probably steer clear of the Ice trade though...

 

[Lethality]

Let's just remember which party is the thinking and grown human being and which party is the inanimate object.

It's a numbers game. Throw a bunch of machines out there in a city of 4 million people and problems will be created every time. Maybe on an individual basis you could say it's temptation, but overall they're exploiting proven human nature.

 

[mess]

It's a numbers game. Throw a bunch of machines out there in a city of 4 million people and problems will be created every time. Maybe on an individual basis you could say it's temptation, but overall they're exploiting proven human nature.

They are proven human nature. That's capitalism. Nobody is supposed to be guaranteed protection from themselves. I don't really think that would be ideal anyway, in the big picture.

 

[cammo78]

Figure I heard was around 30%. The settings can be altered so it's probably a case by case basis, but I'm sure none of them are programmed to lose money.

87% - it is legislated.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slot_machines_by_country

 

[Lethality]

They are proven human nature. That's capitalism.

So is cutting corners with safety in industry to benefit the bottom line. Doesn't mean we don't do something about it.

 

[Rockstar6]

You keep telling yourself that, champ. Ignorance is bliss.

How is stating a fact considered ignorance? Unless the Bulldogs are a powerhouse right now, why are you dishing out debt and assett advice? You don't see North telling Collingwood how to do business do you? I don't mind the Dogs but you nor your club are in a position to give financial advice. If I wanted financial advice from the WB, I might as well ask a heavy drug user who only has the clothes on his back as belongings. WB are falling further and further behind in debt while North are erasing theirs at a decent rate.

 

[mess]

So is cutting corners with safety in industry to benefit the bottom line. Doesn't mean we don't do something about it.

We don't. Unions do. An unaffected body swooping down to save pokie patrons/victims from themselves is not going to perform the same function. There is support for problem gamblers already out there, the problem is that they have to identify themselves.
You can't help them do that.