When will the AFL and Vic clubs abolish VFL premierships as AFL achievements?

[Eddie_Mcguire]

when will the interstate "franchise" supporters realise their "franchises" are playing in our league???? what a geeza the OP is!! you should worry about ro$$ lyin trading off your 1st round picks for spuds for the next few years

lol

 

[ant22]

I reckon its high time some of these non-vic supporters got rid of the almighty big chip on their shoulder.

The competion had a name change in 1990 to recognise the introduction of interstate clubs. The competition did not stop and a new competition start. It was a name change. Your clubs choose to join the victorian comp because it was recognised as the best and the most professional.

Do we fail to recognise everything that happened in Saigon is irrelevant because of the name change to Ho chi Minh city? Do we write of all of south melbournes history because they relocated. Lets just forget everything the south african cricket team did because prior to being called the Proteas.

How about you be a little grateful that you have come into a competition that has embraced the interstate sides, a competition who administration is open minded enough to do what ever it can to help interstate sides succeed. You could have done alot worse and been a rugby league state trying to break into the nrl . They are so narrow minded in sydney that they think queensland should not have teams in their comp let alone a Melbuorne club and they consider expansion opening up new clubs in nsw.

Most victorians I know now love that national comp and have grown to embrace interstate sides its a pity that some(not all) non vics still have an us against them mentality.

 

[sherb]

But here's a case in point, all the Victorian clubs continue to count their state comp premierships in their premiership total, yet us at Port Adelaide, you shoot us down when we count our state comp premierships as part of our premiership total.

Because the VFL and the AFL are the one, continuous competition, whereas the SANFL and the AFL are not.

 

[One PAFC]

Because the VFL and the AFL are the one, continuous competition, whereas the SANFL and the AFL are not.

I can understand that, but the Port Adelaide Football Club from the SANFL entered the AFL, hence why we have x amount of SANFL/AFL premiership. There wasn't a brand new Port Adelaide Football Club established. It's the same club that has been around since 1870

 

[Gough]

I always think of Port Adelaide as a club with a shit load of SANFL premierships and one AFL premiership.
There SANFL premierships are valid, and worthy, all premierships at any level of the game are. But they are not AFL/VFL premierships.

 

[Starburns_]

This argument is tiresome. I'm not a Victorian and I support a relatively young club not based in Victoria, but FFS the VFL evolved into the AFL. All the flags count in the AFL.

If the VFL teams moved into a new league called the AFL, then the flags don't count in the AFL.

So, in the distant future of 2525, when Europe and the US have long collapsed, making Australia and Asia the most powerful and populated areas in the word, and Aussie Rules expands worldwide and people talk about the ancient sport of soccer as a weird game to have been played by their forefathers, and the AFL has evolved again to become World Wide Football (having easily eliminated the World Wildlife Fund and the McMahon family's 'rasslin business some centuries earlier), Gordan Gecko's decendent will raise a thread on the BigFooty intermind (think internet but it's all programmed directly into your brain) about abolishing AFL premierships as being part of the WWF, when the Carlton Blue Spectre Dragons and the Essendon Long Tailed Bombing Bandicoots are looking to be the first team to reach 112 VFL/AFL/TASSIE FL (Don't ask, it was a dark time under our Bob Brown overlord)/AFL/WWF premierships...*phew... breath...*, jorel6669's great great great great great great great... great grandson, jorel6668, will still be defending the logical right to refer to flags won in the same competition, despite the evolution.

Fremantle would still have no flags.

 

[RogersResults]

I can understand that, but the Port Adelaide Football Club from the SANFL entered the AFL, hence why we have x amount of SANFL/AFL premiership. There wasn't a brand new Port Adelaide Football Club established. It's the same club that has been around since 1870

The question is who awards the Premierships?

The AFL only recognizes as AFL Premierships, Premierships awarded by them, 1897 onwards. Port Adelaide's SANFL Premierships have no more status with the AFL than does West Melbourne's (who merged with Nth Melbourne in 1908) 1906 Victorian Football Association, Premiership.

You can make 600 in the backyard but don't expect Cricket Australia to recognise it or for it to appear in Wisden.

Too much argument here from people living in alternate realities.

Lets hear why AFL history prior to 1990 should somehow be wound-up and discounted.

 

[Hornet]

some of the same clubs, completely different league...Its really not that hard to understand

This is where your argument fails...

Are you of the belief that Collingwood's 1990 AFL flag is rated higher than Hawthorn's 1989 VFL premiership, being a "completely different league" albeit the change of one letter? Pretty silly when you look at it that way...

 

[AngryLittleMan]

If it's the same league why isn't the all Australian team made up of players from the WAFL and SANFL like it used to be?

Find me a WAFL/SANFL or any player from any other state worthy of AA in 2011.

No one is trying to say that Victorian clubs achievements prior to 1990 don't mean anything, coz they do.

But here's a case in point, all the Victorian clubs continue to count their state comp premierships in their premiership total, yet us at Port Adelaide, you shoot us down when we count our state comp premierships as part of our premiership total.

Let's compromise, you can keep saying you have x amount of VFL/AFL premierships, but Port Adelaide get to say we have x amount of SANFL/AFL premierships. Fair enough?

I have read alot of this thread and etheir you can't read or your that stubborn that there is no point. But anyways, the SANFL is a seperate competition. You have 36 SANFL premierships and 1 AFL/VFL premiership.
If Carlton joined the SANFL which had changed its name to the AFL in 1990 then they would have 15 VFL and 1 AFL/SANFL and Port would have 36 AFL/SANFL competitions. I doubt you would have it any other way? Why should you its still the same comp right? Just a different name.

The AFL= VFL and is a seperate competition with a seperate history to every other state league. Why should we disregard OUR competitions history because you lot joined.

 

[Tzatziki_Man]

Truth is, Carlton's premierships in 1906, 1907 & 1908 were not as hard to attain as their 1987 premiership was. Only 8 teams were in the competition until 1908.

Should we abolish those premierships from their tally?

Gecko, your clubs joined OUR league, history will not be reset everytime a new team joins the competition.

 

[Max zero]

Truth is, Carlton's premierships in 1906, 1907 & 1908 were not as hard to attain as their 1987 premiership was. Only 8 teams were in the competition until 1908.

Should we abolish those premierships from their tally?

Gecko, your clubs joined OUR league, history will not be reset everytime a new team joins the competition.

Nope but they are not as impressive as an AFL flag won under salary/draft rules in a professional era you would agree?

 

[HurleyTheFuture]

Just seems absurd to spout nonsense like Marc Murphy in his acceptance speech for Carlton.

I'm looking forward to help the Blues win their 17th flag.

What a joke.

Let's all take a step into reality, into the now and accept that VFL flags are a state league achievement and relic.

Its a national code. Let's move with the times

Surely the fact that you were a freo supporter mentioning premierships must of occurred in your mind before starting this thread

 

[Tzatziki_Man]

Nope but they are not as impressive as an AFL flag won under salary/draft rules in a professional era you would agree?

Who sets the precedent on whether they are as impressive or not?

For example I would say Collingwood's 2010 premiership wasn't nearly as impressive (Draw, stumble, good second week victory) as Geelong's 2011 premiership (beat last years premiers 3 times in one year) and yet...they are both regarded as premierships.

So it's only fair to have a continuation of premierships from when the competition started, rather than questioning the legitimacy of the premiership based on finances, teams in the competition, marketplace, salary cap, ect.

 

[Hornet]

The "salary/draft rules" existed during the VFL era which made a hell of a difference as opposed to the simple name change of 1990... most people don't know that. My recolection of that time was that the name change was largely forced upon due to the reluctance of South Australia to join a Victorian league.

Some can argue that it's harder to win a flag now than it was in the 1990's - it would probably be harder to win a premiership in 2050 than in 2011 etc... when do we start counting flags?

One thing's for sure is that the draw was fairer during the VFL days. Today's (unavoidable) compromised fixture makes it easier for some teams compared to others.



The best example in this country of a completely different competition resulting from a previous one would be the A-League. When it was formed, the old NSL was dissolved and every team was made to submit an application to join the new one meeting certain criteria. This did not happen when the VFL changed it's name, thus it's the same competition. There is no arguing this point...

 

[Public Enemy No1]

This is where your argument fails...

Are you of the belief that Collingwood's 1990 AFL flag is rated higher than Hawthorn's 1989 VFL premiership, being a "completely different league" albeit the change of one letter? Pretty silly when you look at it that way...

lol U actually think that the only change was a letter

just embarrassing

 

[Hornet]

lol U actually think that the only change was a letter

just embarrassing

Name away then... don't be shy.

The formation of the Commisssion, Draft and Salary Cap was done under the VFL banner...

So what made Collingwood's '90 flag so much greater than Hawthorn's '89???

 

[Max zero]

Who sets the precedent on whether they are as impressive or not?

For example I would say Collingwood's 2010 premiership wasn't nearly as impressive (Draw, stumble, good second week victory) as Geelong's 2011 premiership (beat last years premiers 3 times in one year) and yet...they are both regarded as premierships.

So it's only fair to have a continuation of premierships from when the competition started, rather than questioning the legitimacy of the premiership based on finances, teams in the competition, marketplace, salary cap, ect.

I have no problem counting them but whats wrong with pointing out they are not as impressive?

 

[Monkey King]

Just seems absurd to spout nonsense like Marc Murphy in his acceptance speech for Carlton.

I'm looking forward to help the Blues win their 17th flag.

What a joke.

Probably time to accept that this is a competition with a continuous history of more than 100 years. The competition has offered up premierships in each of its years and Carlton have won 16 of them. If they win the premiership offered up by the comp next year, they will have won 17 of them.

That the scope of the competition has changed over time and some value certain eras more highly than others is a personal consideration, not an official one. If you don't like the competition or its history, no one is holding a gun to your head forcing you support it; you came of your own accord.

 

[RogersResults]

Probably time to accept that this is a competition with a continuous history of more than 100 years. The competition has offered up premierships in each of its years and Carlton have won 16 of them. If they win the premiership offered up by the comp next year, they will have won 17 of them.

That the scope of the competition has changed over time and some value certain eras more highly than others is a personal consideration, not an official one. If you don't like the competition or its history, no one is holding a gun to your head forcing you support it; you came of your own accord.

Close the thread

 

[unstable punt]

Just seems absurd to spout nonsense like Marc Murphy in his acceptance speech for Carlton.

I'm looking forward to help the Blues win their 17th flag.

What a joke.

Let's all take a step into reality, into the now and accept that VFL flags are a state league achievement and relic.

Its a national code. Let's move with the times

It was the VFL before it became the AFL, it wasn't the WAFL or SANFL, your teams joined our league, get over it or go back to South and East Freo, please go back to South & East

 

[Doss]

How refreshing to see yet another thread about this complete waste of time of a topic.

 

[unstable punt]

I have no problem counting them but whats wrong with pointing out they are not as impressive?

if you want you can put an asterix next them saying - 'not as impressive' if that makes you feel better

 

[Max zero]

if you want you can put an asterix next them saying - 'not as impressive' if that makes you feel better

It does thanks.

 

[rhys_22]

I have a better solution. Kick the interstate clubs out of the AFL, make it the VFL again, and then they'll have no reason to whinge anymore

exactly,you'd think they'd be greatful...

 

[boncer34]

How many brownlow medallists have Sydney had?