Why is the AFL never going to be truly equal?

[Pie Guy]

Maybe we should increase the club numbers and increase the season to 34 weeks with no preseason comp. Certainly good for football fans, and if as a team you rotated players through the side more, than maybe they could go the length.

 

[Albert Ross]

Sport is founded on the very idea of being not equal. Sporting clubs exist to be not equal.

90% of people complaining about equalization stuff are actually subtly trying to tweak things to the advantage of their team.

 

[Kwality]

Sport is founded on the very idea of being not equal. Sporting clubs exist to be not equal.

90% of people complaining about equalization stuff are actually subtly trying to tweak things to the advantage of their team.

Tweaks even not so subtle Albert !

When is adjusting the status quo not resulting in improving the lot of one club at the expense of another?

Is Collingwood the major beneficiary of the FIXture - if not who is? Clearly some other Melbourne clubs need the FIXture with the Pies to make an earn.

Non Vic teams only play at home 12 times a year, Vic teams get more games at home - how is that fair?
Non Vic teams are at home to travelling sides 10 times a year, Vic teams don't get to play travelling sides as often.
Is this an equality? Should it be addressed.

Do the non Aussie Rules heartland states need a different set of rules to the establishment?

 

[Tiger2709]

Because it would make the season way too long. It's already long enough as it is, meaning we have plenty of dead rubber games and sore bodies toward the end. Another 10 weeks or so would be ridiculous.

It works in all other sports so not sure what the problem would be in AFL, of course the lists would need to be a bit larger as they were in the VFL days.

Personally I could easily handle a few extra games especially if it removed the ridiculous pre season circus, but each to there own.

 

[Stratton_Gun]

I think there is too much of a focus on equalization. Whilst I think fixuring, salary cap's etc should be equal I don't like the notion of the draft and everything that tries to help bad teams reach the top. It should be a competition first and foremost and not about equalization/charity ffs

 

[Seethus]

Tweaks even not so subtle Albert !

When is adjusting the status quo not resulting in improving the lot of one club at the expense of another?

Is Collingwood the major beneficiary of the FIXture - if not who is? Clearly some other Melbourne clubs need the FIXture with the Pies to make an earn.

Non Vic teams only play at home 12 times a year, Vic teams get more games at home - how is that fair?
Non Vic teams are at home to travelling sides 10 times a year, Vic teams don't get to play travelling sides as often.
Is this an equality? Should it be addressed.

Do the non Aussie Rules heartland states need a different set of rules to the establishment?

non vic teams also get a massive home ground advantage, west coast play at mcg against melbourne sides several times a year for example, A melbourne team might only play there 1-2 times.
It evens out.

 

[Pie Guy]

Sport is founded on the very idea of being not equal. Sporting clubs exist to be not equal.

90% of people complaining about equalization stuff are actually subtly trying to tweak things to the advantage of their team.

Couldn't be further from the truth. I as the OP, barrack for Collingwood, which is a fat cat club. They have players that want to play for us, so usually if we want the player, and are willing to give a fair trade, we can get them.

I didn't write this problem because of anything to do with my side. I actually am aware that if changes were made, Collingwood would be lesser off.

Having a communist league, where all monies gets split equally, would be fair. Teams like Collingwood would go from having one of the biggest amount of money, to having equal to everyone else. It would make an awesomely level competition. ONLY bad moves would mean the difference between good and bad.

I think they should bring in bands of money for players and coaches. You best 5 players get one wage, and the next band down may have another five players, that is on another level of money, and if a player improves, he can't get a pay rise until someone comes out of the higher band of pay. There should be players going the other way too. Regardless of injury or any other excuse, if a player doesn't play well, he drops a to a lower band. It should be the way it is, rather than an emotional decision. Players should be on 3 years maximum contracts, and the direction you move, up or down to different bands or levels, depends on your last contract period. POTENTIAL should not come into it other than 1st round 2nd round etc Draft selection.

With this idea, say Dale Thomas for example, he would of dropped in level due to his output in his last contract. He could move to Carlton if he wished to, but he couldn't jump up two or three bands or levels because Carlton want him heaps. Same with Buddy, he would be on probably an equal pay because he would be in the first or second band of players anyway, and his form warrants the continueing of that level in pay. He could move to Sydney, but the pay would be the same, OR, if you had an Elite band, and for some reason he wasn't in the elite band at Hawthorn, he could rise to Elite with Swans, but only for three years maximum.

I am just talking about what would work the best in an ideal world, but because we have clown running the world, AFL, at no time will we ever reach ideal.

 

[Pie Guy]

non vic teams also get a massive home ground advantage, west coast play at mcg against melbourne sides several times a year for example, A melbourne team might only play there 1-2 times.
It evens out.

Interstate teams do have a good home ground advantage, but it evens up with the difficulty of travelling almost every second week.

 

[finders]

AS in life and everything else nothing is ever really equal.Communisim tried that and we all know the outcome.

The way the current AFL is structured is about as good as it gets and its up to club managements to do the rest.
Bad management decisions EG: St Kilda, cant and shouldnt be fixed by the AFL its up to the Members to have more input and put better people on the Boards

 

[DNine]

AS in life and everything else nothing is ever really equal.Communisim tried that and we all know the outcome.

The way current AFL is structured is about as good as it gets and its up to club managements to do the rest.
Bad management decisions EG: St Kilda cant and shouldnt be fixed by the AFL its up to the Members to have more input

Communism China is a little different than running a competition that way I think. Has merit, no need for massive profit margins in a competition that equality would create more interest.

 

[footyninescom]

Wouldn't mind seeing a breakaway comp from the AFL, unfortunately it can never happen.

Why do you believe it can't happen? It can happen and rumours are that the revolution is coming!

The fundamentals of the AFL (just a rebranded VFL) mean that the AFL will never be fair or equitable. 10 teams located in the same state means that they will never be able to balance the schedule. 18 teams mean that playing each other twice (truly equal schedule) would make the season too long. The Grand Final has a 99 year contract to be played in Melbourne. These decisions are about putting money into the coffers of the brand that is the AFL. They have no interest in equality or integrity of the game of Australian football, it is all about money and protecting their brand.

I've heard that there is a start up group proposing a truly national 8 team competition (1 team from each state and territory) where you play everyone twice. Cant get more equitable then that.

 

[DNine]

Why do you believe it can't happen? It can happen and rumours are that the revolution is coming!

The fundamentals of the AFL (just a rebranded VFL) mean that the AFL will never be fair or equitable. 10 teams located in the same state means that they will never be able to balance the schedule. 18 teams mean that playing each other twice (truly equal schedule) would make the season too long. The Grand Final has a 99 year contract to be played in Melbourne. These decisions are about putting money into the coffers of the brand that is the AFL. They have no interest in equality or integrity of the game of Australian football, it is all about money and protecting their brand.

I've heard that there is a start up group proposing a truly national 8 team competition (1 team from each state and territory) where you play everyone twice. Cant get more equitable then that.

Before you have breakaway, you have loggerheads. No one is arching up about anything the AFL is doing. Sure the Fans and Commentators/Ex-players comment on things, but it is the clubs that you don't see stand up to the way it is. A Breakaway competition will not happen, unless we see a few years of clubs taking on the AFL. From what I am hearing, the Clubs seem content with the way things are going. Which baffles me, but I am not about to suggest that there is a quiet revolution is coming. There will be signs first.

 

[finders]

Why do you believe it can't happen? It can happen and rumours are that the revolution is coming!

The fundamentals of the AFL (just a rebranded VFL) mean that the AFL will never be fair or equitable. 10 teams located in the same state means that they will never be able to balance the schedule. 18 teams mean that playing each other twice (truly equal schedule) would make the season too long. The Grand Final has a 99 year contract to be played in Melbourne. These decisions are about putting money into the coffers of the brand that is the AFL. They have no interest in equality or integrity of the game of Australian football, it is all about money and protecting their brand.

I've heard that there is a start up group proposing a truly national 8 team competition (1 team from each state and territory) where you play everyone twice. Cant get more equitable then that.

Be a bit hard to achieve as the AFL are definately not stupid and they virtually own the game ,players and the licences and have all the best stadiums tied up on long term contracts.

This idea gets floated every couple of years and gets no where.

 

[Cudi_420]

"Why is the AFL never going to be truly equal?"

Because you're racist and it's John Howard's fault.

 

[Seethus]

Interstate teams do have a good home ground advantage, but it evens up with the difficulty of travelling almost every second week.

that IS what I said, afterall

 

[footyninescom]

Be a bit hard to achieve as the AFL are definately not stupid and they virtually own the game ,players and the licences and have all the best stadiums tied up on long term contracts.

This idea gets floated every couple of years and gets no where.

Be a bit hard to achieve as the AFL are definately not stupid and they virtually own the game ,players and the licences and have all the best stadiums tied up on long term contracts.

This idea gets floated every couple of years and gets

Here's what I've heard.

Current AFL teams wouldn't be a part of it. Start completely from scratch with a team from each state and territory (8 in total) wearing state colours and no intellectual property of the AFL is needed. Teams are owned 50% by the governing league and 50% private investors (franchisees). Not going head to head with the actual AFL season but over the traditional offseason where there is virtually no football to enjoy.
It is a shortened format of Australian football (check out www.footynines.com) ideal to be played over summer. These offensive orientated, aesthetically pleasing shortened formats are the way the sporting world is going, Rugby Union and the International Hockey Board have submitted their Rugby 7s and Hockey 9s format as their showcase Olympic sports, the NRL have dropped their pre season schedule in favour of the rugby 9s tournament in Auckland and there's no denying the success of Twenty20 cricket.
There's a lot of good talent, players, coaches officials outside of the AFL system and anyone not currently on an AFL list is fair game. As its a shortened format and therefore less physically demanding and time consuming it is appealling to recently retired AFL players as we've seen with cricketers extending their careers playing T20. Think of the recently retired stars. Would you watch astate versus state comp over summer when there is no other footy around? All it takes is money for this to happen.

 

[HR Roughnstuf]

The fixture is the biggest issue for me - we won't have an equal competition until that's sorted.

Until every team plays every team twice, once home and once away, the comp will never ever be equal

 

[Papa G]

Too many teams makes it more unequal. It is now harder than ever before to win a flag. Being say 16th means you are in no man's land. Sure you are 3 spots off the wooden spoon, but you're also 8 spots from the 8. Previously 16th meant you'd hit rock bottom. You got a first round draft pick, the only way was up. Now, you can easily spend 3,4,5 years in the funk. Supporters/sponsors/TV viewership/membership/hope all takes a dive. No players want to play for you. The AFL seriously erred by not getting rid of or relocating 2 Vic teams when they had the chance. The always wanted GC and GWS in the comp. It was their grand plan, but by not culling before they did, they have consigned the league to far greater inequity. They will continually have 2,3,4 clubs on life support, whilst on the other hand promote the Big Vic teams ad nauseum and justify it by stating that is what is keeping the little teams alive. The cycle needed to be broken 10 years ago. Instead they have made it worse.

 

[pavilion103]

Teams like Geelong take pay cuts, making the salary cap impact almost nothing.

Suck it up

 

[LT Smash]

Sydney are the only top side making big signings for massive overs.

Shaun Burgoyne, Brian Lake, Jack Gunston... I'd say your mob has done okay.

 

[LT Smash]

Good call. Especially in Victoria.
If every club played each other twice home and away it would be a good start in evening things up.Once that is in place then we can look at the other 10 or so things to make it level. But an even home and away is a must.

If we go back to 12 teams, Port Adelaide doesn't survive that cull.

 

[PumpyChowdown]

Reducing teams would be very difficult if you want a truly national competition, given our population growth and demographics. I reckon 16 teams would be the absolute minimum.

1. Carlton
2. Collingwood
3. Essendon
4. Richmond
5. Geelong
6. Hawthorn
7. Melbourne Angels (St. Kilda/Melbourne merger) - you could argue that this team could relocate to New Zealand
8. Sydney
9. Western Sydney Bulldogs (GWS/Western Bulldogs merger)
10. Brisbane
11. Gold Coast
12. West Coast
13. Fremantle
14. Adelaide
15. Port Adelaide
16. Tassie Kangaroos (North Melbourne relocate)

7 Victorian teams
2 NSW
2 QLD
2 SA
2 WA
1 Tas
NT and Act to miss out.
Would be a 30 round home and away season with each team playing each other twice at each others home ground each year.
Remove the CoLA. Salary cap exactly the same for each club. Equal stadium deals for each club. Minimum salary cap payment reduced from 95%. Abolish Free Agency.
No more draft concessions. No more third party player payments. Revenue from all clubs taxed at the same rate and distributed at the end of the year.
Bottom 8 teams go into lottery for draft pick order - 16th placed team with best odds to win pick #1.

 

[HR Roughnstuf]

Shaun Burgoyne, Brian Lake, Jack Gunston... I'd say your mob has done okay.

Combined wouldn't even come close to half of Tippett and Lance's contracts at the $wans.

Burgoyne did get signed from overs but we had lost a fair bit of experience in the end of 09 season. Lake took a massive pay cut to chase premiership success which he got. Jack Gunston was hardly a big fish at the time, 2 years at Adelaide and wanted to move home. Wouldn't be on more than 300k you would think, although will be up for a good pay rise next contract.

 

[greennick]

Reducing teams would be very difficult if you want a truly national competition, given our population growth and demographics. I reckon 16 teams would be the absolute minimum.

1. Carlton
2. Collingwood
3. Essendon
4. Richmond
5. Geelong
6. Hawthorn
7. Melbourne Angels (St. Kilda/Melbourne merger) - you could argue that this team could relocate to New Zealand
8. Sydney
9. Western Sydney Bulldogs (GWS/Western Bulldogs merger)
10. Brisbane
11. Gold Coast
12. West Coast
13. Fremantle
14. Adelaide
15. Port Adelaide
16. Tassie Kangaroos (North Melbourne relocate)

7 Victorian teams

2 NSW
2 QLD
2 SA
2 WA
1 Tas
NT and Act to miss out.
Would be a 30 round home and away season with each team playing each other twice at each others home ground each year.
Remove the CoLA. Salary cap exactly the same for each club. Equal stadium deals for each club. Minimum salary cap payment reduced from 95%. Abolish Free Agency.
No more draft concessions. No more third party player payments. Revenue from all clubs taxed at the same rate and distributed at the end of the year.
Bottom 8 teams go into lottery for draft pick order - 16th placed team with best odds to win pick #1.

I would rather they make it 20 teams and a 19 game season. 30 is far too long. Then we can get some love over to Tassie, ACT, etc.

How should they fund the poorer teams? Greater distributions from the AFL. Maybe have 30% of all ticket sales goes in to a pool that is shared amongst all the teams. Then the rich teams are still rich, but the poor teams aren't so poor.

In the NFL, most revenues are shared. This is why their competition is so even (also with the extreme FA system and hard salary cap helping).

 

[Djcjdees]

Reducing teams would be very difficult if you want a truly national competition, given our population growth and demographics. I reckon 16 teams would be the absolute minimum.

1. Carlton
2. Collingwood
3. Essendon
4. Richmond
5. Geelong
6. Hawthorn
7. Melbourne Angels (St. Kilda/Melbourne merger) - you could argue that this team could relocate to New Zealand
8. Sydney
9. Western Sydney Bulldogs (GWS/Western Bulldogs merger)
10. Brisbane
11. Gold Coast
12. West Coast
13. Fremantle
14. Adelaide
15. Port Adelaide
16. Tassie Kangaroos (North Melbourne relocate)

7 Victorian teams
2 NSW
2 QLD
2 SA
2 WA
1 Tas
NT and Act to miss out.
Would be a 30 round home and away season with each team playing each other twice at each others home ground each year.
Remove the CoLA. Salary cap exactly the same for each club. Equal stadium deals for each club. Minimum salary cap payment reduced from 95%. Abolish Free Agency.
No more draft concessions. No more third party player payments. Revenue from all clubs taxed at the same rate and distributed at the end of the year.
Bottom 8 teams go into lottery for draft pick order - 16th placed team with best odds to win pick #1.

All well and good but then you're starting off an unequal platform.

That's half the problem. The fabric of the game changed almost overnight (relatively) and the teams that didn't already have 8 million members get more and more screwed.