Roast 2025 hopefully the year of being less shit. Warning includes club criticisms

[dogs105]

Chicken meet egg
Egg meet chicken

Never realised KFC was so polite...

 

[Gtowncrow]

What im saying is Burgo can get us fitter than any other club and we currently would still not get near the 8.

But having a fitness advantage would get us nearer.

It's really all about developing and supporting each individual athlete to their maximum potential. This is a skill every bit as specialised and important as any of the football coaches.

We have lots of areas within our club that should be scrutinized and improved. Darren Burgess is not one of them.
We have an international standard fitness coach. Give him time and you'll see.

 

[footy4ever]

Does anyone think that Clarkson might be the Adelaide coach in 2024?

No

One could only hope, but no.

 

[footy4ever]

What im saying is Burgo can get us fitter than any other club and we currently would still not get near the 8.

Spot on.

We are at minimum, as fit as any other club already. We're as hard at it as anyone in the final quarters and in the last 5 or so minutes of each quarter and in the lengthy arm wrestles throughout the game. Our lack of winning or scoring at those times has nothing to do with a lack of fitness. Unfortunately our collective dumbness (call it inexperience if you wish), lack of tactics, loss of shape/structure, and our erratic skills are to blame. We can look a million dollars and in the blink of an eye be embarrassingly bad. None of that has anything to do with fitness level in our case.

 

[Sanders]

You keep saying this. I'd like to know why you think that is the case?

Well seeing as you went hard looking for articles and could only find heavily post crash ones

Why don’t you look at the ones as he was appointed?

Look at the expectation threads on here, the quotes from chapman, too, the club when he was appointed

They are just unambiguous, and frankly to be perfectly honest, my guess is you’ve already seen them in your last research exercise

There was NO expectation from ANYONE about what happened

 

[Soggy2112]

Well seeing as you went hard looking for articles and could only find heavily post crash ones

Why don’t you look at the ones as he was appointed?

Look at the expectation threads on here, the quotes from chapman, too, the club when he was appointed

They are just unambiguous, and frankly to be perfectly honest, my guess is you’ve already seen them in your last research exercise

There was NO expectation from ANYONE about what happened

Nicks appointed Senior Coach

The Adelaide Football Club has announced Matthew Nicks as its new Senior Coach

www.afc.com.au

“Our Club is embarking upon an exciting new era and Matthew is the perfect person to guide and develop our talented playing list as it goes through a period of rejuvenation,” Chapman said.

“Embarking on a new era” and “goes through a period of rejuvenation” sounds like club speak for rebuild.

 

[NSolis]

I think the club expected a rebuild of a sort - that we would not be contending for a flag for a period - but not a total cleanout which is where we ended up going after the very poor start to 2020.

That makes sense too. The bottom-up rebuild is always a last resort and rarely works, plus even though it's popular with diehard fans on Bigfooty I think most fans of the club prefer the team to be competitive week on week versus some sort of fairytale three wooden spoons followed by a flag type scenario.

 

[MRB37]

Nicks appointed Senior Coach

The Adelaide Football Club has announced Matthew Nicks as its new Senior Coach

www.afc.com.au

“Our Club is embarking upon an exciting new era and Matthew is the perfect person to guide and develop our talented playing list as it goes through a period of rejuvenation,” Chapman said.

“Embarking on a new era” and “goes through a period of rejuvenation” sounds like club speak for rebuild.

"Rejuvenation" was the word they were using a ton to start with before the 2020 season started and they couldn't sell that anymore after 12 straight losses or whatever it was.

 

[feenix67]

Nicks appointed Senior Coach

The Adelaide Football Club has announced Matthew Nicks as its new Senior Coach

www.afc.com.au

“Our Club is embarking upon an exciting new era and Matthew is the perfect person to guide and develop our talented playing list as it goes through a period of rejuvenation,” Chapman said.

“Embarking on a new era” and “goes through a period of rejuvenation” sounds like club speak for rebuild.

Not at all. It's soft speak. The club didn't envisage certain players falling off a cliff, or not meeting predraft expectations.

 

[Ramify]

They don't train the same thats true but they are all elite athletes with professional fitness coaches and the difference in overall fitness levels between clubs would be measurable and would never substitute for the quality of the list you have. Yes you may get a slight edge with the best fitness dept. in the league but a half fit Geelong would still torch a peak bottom 8 team any day of the week.

Yeah I the guess you gotta ask wether a fit and strong Crows squad would torch the exact same lineup if they were all fat and injury prone.

I know it's not the be all and end all, but it's a significant contributing factor.

 

[Ramify]

What im saying is Burgo can get us fitter than any other club and we currently would still not get near the 8.

Ok that's something different.

 

[1970crow]

You keep saying this. I'd like to know why you think that is the case?

Surely not a serious question?

 

[1970crow]

But having a fitness advantage would get us nearer.

It's really all about developing and supporting each individual athlete to their maximum potential. This is a skill every bit as specialised and important as any of the football coaches.

We have lots of areas within our club that should be scrutinized and improved. Darren Burgess is not one of them.
We have an international standard fitness coach. Give him time and you'll see.

I don’t think you get max benefit from any area if your core philosophies and culture aren’t equally as elite. Why would players who aren’t subject to being accountable to less than elite standards maximise the program made available to them.

We’ve already seen that inherent cultures have muted Burgess’ philosophy that players need to train with intensity during the week to be able to play. He can’t change us from his role, we’re doomed until the board and footy dept is broomed.

 

[jenny61_99]

Well seeing as you went hard looking for articles and could only find heavily post crash ones

Why don’t you look at the ones as he was appointed?

Look at the expectation threads on here, the quotes from chapman, too, the club when he was appointed

They are just unambiguous, and frankly to be perfectly honest, my guess is you’ve already seen them in your last research exercise

There was NO expectation from ANYONE about what happened

Ok. News for you. I’ve been ****ing sick and haven’t had time or inclination to find anything. I hurriedly put together something the other day. Included links to shutvyou up, and I’m still accused of deliberately misleading or knowing shot and denying it. Honestly sanders… it doesn’t mean that much to me. I don’t even know why I even attempted to play your stupid little juvenile games. If I could be ****ed - I can’t - I’m sure I could find plenty of older articles talking about the rebuild. But like I said I can’t.

 

[1970crow]

Ok. News for you. I’ve been ******* sick and haven’t had time or inclination to find anything. I hurriedly put together something the other day. Included links to shutvyou up, and I’m still accused of deliberately misleading or knowing shot and denying it. Honestly sanders… it doesn’t mean that much to me. I don’t even know why I even attempted to play your stupid little juvenile games. If I could be *ed - I can’t - I’m sure I could find plenty of older articles talking about the rebuild. But like I said I can’t.

If we ignore context, you actually got the last sentence right. We weren’t rebuilding until we discovered how crap we were after the covid break of 2020. Nobody thought Nix would drive us so low.

 

[Dangerousfield]

Where did the "fantastic core group of players" in that 2019 quote go to?

Or was that just a figment of the collective AFC imagination?

Given we cruised to a coveted Wooden Spoon less than 12 months later it's yet another complete mis-read of our real situation.

AFC - do something this trade and draft period, get imaginative and bold!

 

[Soggy2112]

If we ignore context, you actually got the last sentence right. We weren’t rebuilding until we discovered how crap we were after the covid break of 2020. Nobody thought Nix would drive us so low.

View attachment 1459168

I don’t think we expected to be quite so bad in 2020. But I also don’t think any coach is going to come out and say that they expect to go backwards to rebuild. I can only find a couple articles around Nicks’ appointment, I tried to find what the general line was leading up to 2020 but couldn’t really, but what I have read sounds like club speak for rebuild. I also remember having pretty low expectations of the team before round one, maybe that’s hindsight altering my recollection though.

Also, if you look at our moves in the 2019 trade period it suggests rebuild, the majority of them were built around strengthening our 2020 draft hand, if the plan was to quickly rejuvenate the list and go again surely we would have targeted 2019 to build the list back up as quickly as possible, what we did suggests a more long term view.

 

[1970crow]

I don’t think we expected to be quite so bad in 2020. But I also don’t think any coach is going to come out and say that they expect to go backwards to rebuild. I can only find a couple articles around Nicks’ appointment, I tried to find what the general line was leading up to 2020 but couldn’t really, but what I have read sounds like club speak for rebuild. I also remember having pretty low expectations of the team before round one, maybe that’s hindsight altering my recollection though.

Also, if you look at our moves in the 2019 trade period it suggests rebuild, the majority of them were built around strengthening our 2020 draft hand, if the plan was to quickly rejuvenate the list and go again surely we would have targeted 2019 to build the list back up as quickly as possible, what we did suggests a more long term view.

I don't think our trade period suggests rebuild. We had deals on the table for Keath and Greenwood. And neither were much more than depth in their roles. Keath behind Talia and Hartigan aa a KPD and Dood as a 3rd tall. Greenwood was a bit player in the midfield who had been dropped in 2019 from memory and Chayce had some progressive stuff behind him. The core of our 4 man strategy in Crouch x 2, Gibbs and Sloane remained. Plus we picked up mature bodies Keays and Crocker. Otto retired gracefully, Dougie forcibly retired, cooked Sauce chose GWS 2 years ahead of our 1 year offer and CEY left as a FA. Much is made of the 'gutting' of our list, I guess if you look at just QTY that view could be formed. But if you looked at impact to best 22 performance, the movements had very little influence.

 

[Soggy2112]

I don't think our trade period suggests rebuild. We had deals on the table for Keath and Greenwood. And neither were much more than depth in their roles. Keath behind Talia and Hartigan aa a KPD and Dood as a 3rd tall. Greenwood was a bit player in the midfield who had been dropped in 2019 from memory and Chayce had some progressive stuff behind him. The core of our 4 man strategy in Crouch x 2, Gibbs and Sloane remained. Plus we picked up mature bodies Keays and Crocker. Otto retired gracefully, Dougie forcibly retired, cooked Sauce chose GWS 2 years ahead of our 1 year offer and CEY left as a FA. Much is made of the 'gutting' of our list, I guess if you look at just QTY that view could be formed. But if you looked at impact to best 22 performance, the movements had very little influence.

I think you’re way off with Keath, we rated him really highly, we were very disappointed to lose him and he was definitely ahead of Hartigan in the pecking order. As early as 2017 he was trusted to take on Buddy.

Depth or not, we chose to get 2020 picks for Greenwood and Keath, why not get 2019 picks if the plan was a quick rejuvenation?

I could be wrong but I remember Gibbs spending very little time on ball and he got dropped in 2019, I’m pretty sure the club more or less admitted they over paid for him and it was a massive error. I don’t think it’s accurate to say that he was a part of our core plan.

 

[1970crow]

I think you’re way off with Keath, we rated him really highly, we were very disappointed to lose him and he was definitely ahead of Hartigan in the pecking order. As early as 2017 he was trusted to take on Buddy.

Depth or not, we chose to get 2020 picks for Greenwood and Keath, why not get 2019 picks if the plan was a quick rejuvenation?

I could be wrong but I remember Gibbs spending very little time on ball and he got dropped in 2019, I’m pretty sure the club more or less admitted they over paid for him and it was a massive error. I don’t think it’s accurate to say that he was a part of our core plan.

We didn't think we needed immediate picks. We'd lost a couple of best 22 players, but not what we thought were critical pieces or where we lacked cover. Accepting 2020 picks is nothing more than retrofitting an outcome to meet your bias. Perhaps we accepted 2020 picks because that's all that was offered by clubs that held the whip hand? Maybe we were happy with the heap of picks we already had and didn't want to invest further in that particular draft. Tying accepting future picks with full rebuild belief is way out there.

 

[Soggy2112]

We didn't think we needed immediate picks. We'd lost a couple of best 22 players, but not what we thought were critical pieces or where we lacked cover. Accepting 2020 picks is nothing more than retrofitting an outcome to meet your bias. Perhaps we accepted 2020 picks because that's all that was offered by clubs that held the whip hand? Maybe we were happy with the heap of picks we already had and didn't want to invest further in that particular draft. Tying accepting future picks with full rebuild belief is way out there.

I could be wrong, but no club is going to finish a season where at the start we were supposed to be in the window, by declaring from the rooftops “we’re going to rebuild and be shit for a bit”.

Now as I said, I don’t think we anticipated being quite as shit as we were in 2020, I think the internal plan was to be making our way back up into the top four by around next year and that players like Laird and the Crouch brothers would be key parts of that. But reading between the lines I think rebuild was the plan.

That being said, this is something that frustrates me about our club. Do we have a clear plan for how we’re going to be successful and when that will be? I think it’s commonly accepted that the second half of this decade is where we should be aiming, but does that plan exist internally, and has it been made public? I think if that were the case then Nicks would have the freedom to make a move like drop Murphy to bring in Newchurch, as he would be less concerned about how the potential drop in short term performance effects his career. At the moment I think partially he’s coaching to keep his job, and frankly, with the way people like Roo speak in the media can you blame him?

 

[Alwaysacrow]

I don't think its as bad as it seems.

Its a game of very small margins. Get a competent coach in there and our future is a lot brighter IMO.

I think it's the opposite actually. Don't get me wrong, I'm no great fan of Nick's but he's been given a shit sandwich. Our list is one of the poorest in the AFL. Yes we have some hopeful young guys coming through but when you've got complete spud's like McHenry in your best 22 you know you've got a huge problem.

 

[1970crow]

I could be wrong, but no club is going to finish a season where at the start we were supposed to be in the window, by declaring from the rooftops “we’re going to rebuild and be s**t for a bit”.

Now as I said, I don’t think we anticipated being quite as s**t as we were in 2020, I think the internal plan was to be making our way back up into the top four by around next year and that players like Laird and the Crouch brothers would be key parts of that. But reading between the lines I think rebuild was the plan.

That being said, this is something that frustrates me about our club. Do we have a clear plan for how we’re going to be successful and when that will be? I think it’s commonly accepted that the second half of this decade is where we should be aiming, but does that plan exist internally, and has it been made public? I think if that were the case then Nicks would have the freedom to make a move like drop Murphy to bring in Newchurch, as he would be less concerned about how the potential drop in short term performance effects his career. At the moment I think partially he’s coaching to keep his job, and frankly, with the way people like Roo speak in the media can you blame him?

I genuinely think that our club thought that with the toxic elements removed, and with a refreshed, happy and United group that we'd be contending for the 8 in 2020 as we weren't far off in 2019. The midfield core remained, still had Talia, Harto, Laird, Doedee, Brown and Kelly in our back 6, forward line we lost JJ but had EH developing and had just traded in mature bodied Billy. Our best 22 was fundamentally no different on paper. Let's say Harto a downgrade on Keath, Billy/EH a downgrade on JJ, depth midfield lesser with Thor gone. But does those changes seriously make you think that Roo et al were thinking rebuild? We brought in Crocker, Keays and Billy.

 

[jackster83]

I think it's the opposite actually. Don't get me wrong, I'm no great fan of Nick's but he's been given a s**t sandwich. Our list is one of the poorest in the AFL. Yes we have some hopeful young guys coming through but when you've got complete spud's like McHenry in your best 22 you know you've got a huge problem.

Nope, he's completely out of his depth as a senior coach, up there with the likes of Primus and Bolton.

Extending him prior to this season starting was a shocking decision and one that might see Kelly's head on the chopping block also.

 

[Klug]

I saw this on The Advertiser website.
Not sure if accurate since obtaining crowd figures publicly is not as easy as it used to be, but this says the Crows have slumped to 14th average crowds in 2022!

If true, this would be alarming the board, especially as Port are nearly overtaking us!