Preview 2023 Pre-Season discussion

[Drunkcat]

Anyone catch this on SEN?

It's not the first time Paddy's gone big... what do we all think about this?

Was a couple of us who said he was going to be a star from his first VFL game, so no surprise to us he has the tools to be anything

 

[PzBlinky]

Was a couple of us who said he was going to be a star from his first VFL game, so no surprise to us he has the tools to be anything

That was the smashing of North, right? Yeah, he jumped out of the blocks from Day 1.

 

[PzBlinky]

Is “the next Judd” the new “training the house down” ?

How many players has the comparison been made to across the comp? Considering "training the house down" is used 10+ times each season, I'm guessing there must be a dozen "next Judds" floating around too?

Seriously, the media love to latch onto these titles and Paddy is known for making outlandish calls every now and then. While a lot of us want to see what his ceiling is, probably nobody is seriously thinking he's going to be the next Judd unless he starts making that happen on the field.

What we're excited for is the potential of our younger players and the off-season is a good time to talk about. Plus, why shouldn't be there a vibe of positivity here? Our "old, decrepit team with a style that doesn't stack up in finals" just smashed their way to a 10th cup!

P.S. Did you actually watch Max play this year? His performance for a second year player was outstanding and he's an automatic lock for best 18 now. If you're not excited by that, well...?

 

[D BRIDGE]

The thing I loved most about Holmes last year is that he really learned to harness his speed.

He was getting get the ball and just running with blokes on his tail, but even with a bounce he could hold them off and gain that extra meterage that most players can't do or even attempt to do.

He started kicking goals this season and was bringing up his touches per game to the 20's late in the season (but he is a highly damaging player that doesn't need 30+ to have a big impact on the scoreboard).

He is only going to get better... Gun player and an inspired/risky pick swap on draft night by Wells to make him ours.

 

[Farmer2Goggin]

The thing I loved most about Holmes last year is that he really learned to harness his speed.

He was getting get the ball and just running with blokes on his tail, but even with a bounce he could hold them off and gain that extra meterage that most players can't do or even attempt to do.

He started kicking goals this season and was bringing up his touches per game to the 20's late in the season (but he is a highly damaging player that doesn't need 30+ to have a big impact on the scoreboard).

He is only going to get better... Gun player and an inspired/risky pick swap on draft night by Wells to make him ours.

His trajectory from his debut season to 2022 was breath taking.
Kicking is now an asset as he can roost it very long distances quickly as he kicks it quite low - those quads will do that
Hope his nerve response/hamstring issue gets sorted , almost priority #1 for our medicos I'd have thought .......

 

[Live in hope]

The thing I loved most about Holmes last year is that he really learned to harness his speed.

He was getting get the ball and just running with blokes on his tail, but even with a bounce he could hold them off and gain that extra meterage that most players can't do or even attempt to do.

He started kicking goals this season and was bringing up his touches per game to the 20's late in the season (but he is a highly damaging player that doesn't need 30+ to have a big impact on the scoreboard).

He is only going to get better... Gun player and an inspired/risky pick swap on draft night by Wells to make him ours.

Agree. Addressed nerves with kicking and now it is a weapon. And tackling. And play reading and decision making. So impressive for a kid who was focused on athletics. Obviously focused and a good learner.

I love the obvious concern that opponents have on his speed and tackling (eg. Josh Daicos in the final - was a huge moment in context of that game).

Only worry is susceptibility to soft tissue injuries, otherwise I’d back the potential that Danger sees.

 

[Catman]

Gotta love the handful of regular Cats posters in here when we are up and down pointing out all the problems, completely ghosting it since winning the flag, but still posting on the main board. Not sure how they could possibly enjoy this sport tbh.

if you‘re reading this thinking I’m talking about you…yeah I probably am.

Anyone know if catscollector/Bobby has eaten his humble pie yet?

 

[Strange Cat]

Anyone know if catscollector/Bobby has eaten his humble pie yet?

To be fair he’s been quite good in the Dusty thread on the MB, fighting the good fight

 

[doctor_evil]

How many players has the comparison been made to across the comp? Considering "training the house down" is used 10+ times each season, I'm guessing there must be a dozen "next Judds" floating around too?

Seriously, the media love to latch onto these titles and Paddy is known for making outlandish calls every now and then. While a lot of us want to see what his ceiling is, probably nobody is seriously thinking he's going to be the next Judd unless he starts making that happen on the field.

What we're excited for is the potential of our younger players and the off-season is a good time to talk about. Plus, why shouldn't be there a vibe of positivity here? Our "old, decrepit team with a style that doesn't stack up in finals" just smashed their way to a 10th cup!

P.S. Did you actually watch Max play this year? His performance for a second year player was outstanding and he's an automatic lock for best 18 now. If you're not excited by that, well...?

Chill out mate its preseason. Go give the new dvds another whirl.

Max is one of our most influential players. Top 3 potential, if not already there.

 

[LifeSpan-Void]

Only 4 players have played a game in the #41

Barry Eddy
Ross Christensen
Garry Phillips
Shane Mumford

Josh Hunt played in 41 for several seasons until 8 was vacated IIRC

 

[PzBlinky]

Chill out mate its preseason. Go give the new dvds another whirl.

Max is one of our most influential players. Top 3 potential, if not already there.

Yeah may have been a bit harsh, but I get pissed when the media grabs a headline and hypes things up and then forums take a crack at the player. Tbh, I usually ignore most of the pre-season stuff other than how new players are coming along etc. Don't give a crap about "Player X is in tip-top shape and ready to tear the comp apart". Just happened to see this and put it up for comment, which you did.

But again, I'll believe Max is a top 3 player comp when I see that. I think he'll be one of our top 3-5 players in a couple more years, whether he can really push the limits we'll have to wait and see.

 

[Warhorse]

Was gonna post this earlier, seeing as I'm the one who originally (and ironically) compared him to the very player who is now stating the same things.

Love that he's getting big wraps, as Holmesy's upside is just insane. Saw it in his very first 3 BOG VFL games, and just keeps getting better and better with every game. Once he has another couple of pre-seasons and puts on a bit more size, he'll be the complete package.

• Elite endurance
• Elite speed
• Excellent user of the ball
• Good mark
• Perfect height at 189 for prototypical mid
• Defensive side to his game
• Can play multiple positions
• Tackles well

? Lacking size
? Lacking composure at times
? Could add more goal-kicking

? Could he develop into a dominant midfielder

Question marks listed aren't even that bad and can be worked on, and once he has those ticked off, he'll be AA level for mine. From there, sky is the limit. Most players only have one of these elements, but he has most of them.

Danger was a twig when drafted, so that's why I said Danger with better disposal early on (which is essentially Chris Judd), and I stick by it even more now that Danger has affirmed just good he thinks the kid can be.

I'm not seeing much Judd in his game at all. Judds kicking was as bad as Dangerfield. Look at the % of contested possessions early in their career - Dangerfield, Judd, Ablett all had incredibly high contested possessions at over 50% in the first 3 years. They already knew how to win the ball in the contest but needed to build up their bodies or endurance. Holmes rarely plays on other midfielders who are strong at the contest with him generally winning contests against other wings/half backs/half forwards. Those 3 players listed also have much more forward craft than Holmes.

Holmes doesn't have the power of any of the players listed above - outside of Dusty, not many do. He is faster than those listed though. He is a unique prospect and there is not any player you can really compare him to. Will be interesting how he develops

 

[Drunkcat]

I said MAX reminded me of Mick Turner first game i seen him in the VFL, just the way me moved through traffic with easy, but he is MAX Holmes not anyone else

 

[00VicWard001]

Anyone know if catscollector/Bobby has eaten his humble pie yet?

He was great after the game.

 

[dazbroncos]

PFD has not helped with his innocent conclusions.. and he might be right but id hold my tongue on analogies like that for a while.

Judd is a ridiculously high bar - and while Max appears to have the tools... im not sure the pressure and hyperbole is needed.

But the toothpaste is out now so it is what it is.

GO Catters

 

[Vdubs]

His trajectory from his debut season to 2022 was breath taking.
Kicking is now an asset as he can roost it very long distances quickly as he kicks it quite low - those quads will do that
Hope his nerve response/hamstring issue gets sorted , almost priority #1 for our medicos I'd have thought .......

Pretty sure real hammy.
And of course a priority.

 

[dazbroncos]

So im bored and there is no news...

thus:

2023 Senior list changes -
Locks to call it IMO or be told:
Zac Touhy
Isaac Smith
Gary Rohan

Maybes;
Rhys Stanley
Johnathon Ceglar
Esava Rategolea
Sam Menegola
Tom Hawkins

Thats 3 for sure IMO and up to 8 if all the maybe bounce out - its unlikely they'd all go.

But you'd imagine it will give us some TPP and SC space too. We'd have some we really need to re-sign as well so that cash will be redeployed but id imagine we could chase a FA if someone wanted to be here.

GO Catters

 

[STPer18]

Can't read it, but the herald scum has a little puff piece from the looks of things:

Young Cats pair ‘right up there’ in pre-season running


Second-year Cats Mitch Knevitt and Ollie Dempsey have pushed themselves towards the front to start Geelong’s pre-season as they search for more game time next year.

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/young-guns-leading-the-way-in-geelongs-early-preseason-form/news-story/e8fa1e7128f233fe4321cbb6aaa21d74

 

[cats_09]

Young guns leading the way in Geelong’s early pre-season form​

After getting a taste of AFL in their first year at Geelong, a young pair has hit the ground running to start this pre-season.

Second-year Cats Mitch Knevitt and Ollie Dempsey have pushed themselves towards the front to start Geelong’s pre-season as they search for more game time next year.

Drafted in late 2021, Dempsey and Knevitt were able to power through their first year in the AFL system without any major injury hiccups, with each of them playing two games at the top level in 2022.

The blond teens were pushed out as Geelong steadied its best team mid-year on the way to the flag, but returned to a second pre-season without any niggles and ready to push their case again.

Geelong’s head of player development Matthew Egan said the pair were “both right up there in the running for the whole group” and the Cats would make use of their aerobic power in 2023.

“They are both naturally really good runners, that is why we played Mitch Knevitt a lot on the wing (in 2022) because he just runs and is a really hard worker,” Egan said.

“In the under-18s he played inside mid but we think he has some really great traits that fit on the wing really nicely so he is a natural runner and an extremely hard worker when he is in the game.

“Ollie Dempsey is probably more of a half-forward who we pushed up to the wing because of his work ethic. As a half-forward he would work right to the end of the ground and sprint back to the forward line.

“He had a great season in the VFL, (head coach Chris Scott) really likes players who can play multiple positions so Ollie played some half-back as well. We don’t pigeonhole them and say ‘you are only a half-forward’. It is always good to learn some different positions.”

Also drafted last year, Toby Conway, Flynn Kroeger, James Willis and Cooper Whyte each had interrupted seasons due to injury and were set to slowly improve their fitness this summer.

“We build them up a bit slower because really, we want to see them play footy,” Egan said.

“We don’t want to build them up quickly so they break and they don’t play any games because you learn the most about them when they are out there playing.”

josh.barnes1@news.com.au

Originally published as Young guns leading the way in Geelong’s early pre-season form

 

[CHAWKTS]

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Good puff piece to keep us interested! I understand both in top 5 runners across the pre season drills so far - which Matt’s comments seem to support.

This is two more to add to what is an incredible depth list. I struggle to see how either squeeze into the team but both would be exciting prospects and regular players at half a dozen clubs

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Anyone know if catscollector/Bobby has eaten his humble pie yet?

Actually had an exchange via private conversation, won’t share the messages Without permission from bob out of good will, but all I will say was Bobby was all class and humble about everything. I have a lot of respect for him, and I would find it hard pressed for anyone else to take issue if they heard similar praise for the coach and team.

Am very happy to back him in catscollector

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Good puff piece to keep us interested! I understand both in top 5 runners across the pre season drills so far - which Matt’s comments seem to support.

This is two more to add to what is an incredible depth list. I struggle to see how either squeeze into the team but both would be exciting prospects and regular players at half a dozen clubs

I do agree kids like knevitt and dempsey while raw would be playing at a lot of bottom 6 clubs (see nth, adel, haw etc) however i think a year in the vfl to develop physically isnt a bad thing for either of them. With retirements end 2023 they will get senior opportunities in 2024.

 

[CHAWKTS]

I do agree kids like knevitt and dempsey while raw would be playing at a lot of bottom 6 clubs (see nth, adel, haw etc) however i think a year in the vfl to develop physically isnt a bad thing for either of them. With retirements end 2023 they will get senior opportunities in 2024.

Yep…and i hope they recognise that they are actually lucky. Despite understandable frustration in 2023 not playing when other young kids get to 20-30 games, they are maximising their opportunity to become a long term player - and at a good club. At another club much more high risk as development is more hit or miss throwing young players in the deep end - in a bad team.

I heard a quote from someone pointing out there might be 10 players at Geelong where it is hard to find them a spot in the 22, but at Hawks there are 10 spots in the 22 it is hard to find players to fill!!

 

[jim boy]

PFD has not helped with his innocent conclusions.. and he might be right but id hold my tongue on analogies like that for a while.

Is Max the new Clint Bizzell?

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Yep…and i hope they recognise that they are actually lucky. Despite understandable frustration in 2023 not playing when other young kids get to 20-30 games, they are maximising their opportunity to become a long term player - and at a good club. At another club much more high risk as development is more hit or miss throwing young players in the deep end - in a bad team.

I heard a quote from someone pointing out there might be 10 players at Geelong where it is hard to find them a spot in the 22, but at Hawks there are 10 spots in the 22 it is hard to find players to fill!!

Yep agree 100 %.
I can see why someone like cooper chose to go to hawks as $ plus its a make or break year for him and he needs games, knevitt and dempsey are 2nd year guys with some time on their side and i feel its better for their development to slow burn through a strong system rather than 30 extra games but getting flogged every week in a bottom 4 side.