Bye bye Clarkson

[pitchster]

So who will be the next coach by the way? All well and good to come in here and lambast Clarkson, who is his better replacement we are getting again? Seriously some of the members on this board are deadset “insert term here”. We brought in Shaw and Noble then supporters rioted and whined we need an experienced coach. Now we have one, and the rhetoric is we need a new coach with fresh ideas, give me a spell.

 

[r_boy]

I'm not a fan of playing guys who are underdone, obviously Corr and McDonald seem to be that. I don't know what to make of Jy, could be playing out of position perhaps but we should expect more. I'd prefer to give guys in the forward line the benefit of the doubt due to not winning the ball in the midfield and providing quality I50 entries (so Zurhaar and Stephenson in mind there). It actually shows how good Curtis and Larkey are that they continue to kick goals regardless of I50 quality and quantity.

On what's happened in the last two weeks, the Roos started the game well against the Blues but the umps really impacted the course of that game. Unfortunately, the ump impact subsequently impacted the players mindsets (which is why Pink looked like a deer in the headlights). Last week, we were horrendous and there aren't excuses but still the Lions had everything on the line as a team fighting to win the premiership and their senior players, especially Neale, gave our midfield a lesson.

On the Blues, the umps have had a significant impact on every game this season for them. Fortunate rub of the green, AFL wanting the Blues to win the premiership, whatever it is, we aren't the only team this season who imploded against the Blues due to umpiring.

The fixture gets easier now, and if we don't see the midfield get on top in Geelong (regardless of result) and a good showing against the Hawks, then we just might have a defeatist mentality through the group.

Rubbish. We were so undisciplined against the blues, at least in the first half when it was up for grabs.

Giving away 50s for stand rule and other stupid bs.

 

[Val Keating]

Is Alastair Clarkson actually an elite coach? has the game gone past him? or is he simply the product of Hawthorns formerly elite list?

Since the start of 2017 Clarkson has only coached a team to a positive record once. This coming in 2018 when the Hawks got dumped out in straight sets, as one of the worst top 4 teams of all time. With 18 seasons under his belt, just half have yielded a positive record with his 19th not looking likely to do so. With a win rate of 56% this compares poorly to other great coaches like Chris Scott with a record of 76%. Scott on the other although born into a great list has managed to have much greater longevity with his first ever losing season coming in 2023. This is due to Scott's ability to adapt and change his game style and roll-over his list. Something Clarkson has shown he is unable to do.
Even Ross Lyon has managed a higher win rate (barely) with 57% and he also has coached far fewer losing records than Clarkson with only 4, although he has coached 4 fewer seasons.

Was Clarkson's golden age of success due to his own coaching prowess or just due to the fact that Hawthorn possessed one of, or if not the greatest team of all time.

The bloke won 4 flags. He is a master coach.

 

[Woolly Mammoth]

I think at this point in time, Clarkson doing a good job doesn’t necessarily equal wins just yet.

The idea that he’s no longer a good coach in 2024 or has lost it is ridiculous to me. I know some disagree with that.

Have a read of this

Peggy and Gale need to go.

Merge this thread if there has already been one posted in regards to the board. Listening to Peggy O'Neal and Gale recently in the media has proven one thing to me and this football club, they are both seriously DELUDED. All this rubbish about stability and the need to make astute decisions...

www.bigfooty.com

Now I’m not suggesting North are ready to win 3 Premierships in the next few years, but it’s a good example of perceived external views based on current performance.

Interesting read but not sure how it relates to our current situation, those angry tigs supporters acknowledged some inroads had been made. Alot of people in the NM community are throwing their toys out of the pram(myself included) precisely because it's becoming a struggle to see one lick of difference Clarko has made, even in an admittedly short period of time.

On moto g22 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Woolly Mammoth]

Is Clarkson doing a good job at the moment? I honestly don't know. What I do know is that this thread, assuming the OP is serious, is ridiculous. That any comparison to McRae or Kingsley and their clubs is ridiculous. And that whatever quality of job Clarkson is doing at the moment, it's clearing the very low bar of coaching standards that almost everyone on this list has ever experienced before.

A hell of a lot of money to pay for someone to demonstrate what it's like to be better than two of the most disastrous coaching appointments in modern football

On moto g22 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Gasometer]

The bloke won 4 flags. He is a master coach.

Over different years with different blokes

 

[Billy Not Really]

Yeah, fire another coach.

That’ll solve things. What’s a ~6 year rebuild without another 10 years on top of that. I’m sure there’s no onset effects of us having another personnel, coach, staff and management changeover that subsequently turns our list over again under a new coaching game plan & philosophy.

 

[The Anvil]

Rubbish. We were so undisciplined against the blues, at least in the first half when it was up for grabs.

Giving away 50s for stand rule and other stupid bs.

It's not personal to the Roos, the AFL have teams they want to showcase and this year it's the Blues (as last year was the Pies).

Sure, the players did some stupid stuff but so does every team, only some are duly penalised for it.

 

[The acurate one]

I think the carrot and attraction of players from other clubs of playing under Clarko will begin to wear thin soon (if not already) if not much change / improvement occurs. We always found it hard to attract ready made players but we had some hope when Clarko came to us that this would change a bit . The only real decent one i can think of is Griff in recent times.

Our list isn't yet what it needs to be. The great Ronald Dale Barassi went back to the Dees and couldn't get them up the ladder.

I think Al clarko will always have an aura that is built on success

Just not sure if say a Stephenson slept between Barassi and Kennedy he'd wake up a better footballer .

Al still has some weeding to do.

 

[amaz199]

He won 4 flags whilst beating Geelong at their absolute peak, Freo at their best defensively, smashed one of the best Sydney teams ever and a pretty good Eagles outfit. But yea nah he's cooked delist.

Even if he won just one I'd be just as impressed. It's not easy to win them in a 16 or 18 team competition.

I hate this thread.

 

[north_lad]

He won 4 flags whilst beating Geelong at their absolute peak, Freo at their best defensively, smashed one of the best Sydney teams ever and a pretty good Eagles outfit. But yea nah he's cooked delist.

Even if he won just one I'd be just as impressed. It's not easy to win them in a 16 or 18 team competition.

I hate this thread.

I know I'm going to bump it to the top but it's the exact kind of sugar-hit craving crap that has kept NM mediocre for so long. LET IT PLAY OUT

 

[Jeremy Jordan]

He won 4 flags whilst beating Geelong at their absolute peak, Freo at their best defensively, smashed one of the best Sydney teams ever and a pretty good Eagles outfit. But yea nah he's cooked delist.

Even if he won just one I'd be just as impressed. It's not easy to win them in a 16 or 18 team competition.

I hate this thread.

Who cares about flags. All us young kids like me and Kane care about is winning percentage, bro. Get with the times.

Kane and I would take 20 and 2 and lose the flag, over 14 and 8 and winning it.
Just like we would take 40 touches in loss, over 18 touches in a win. That’s how we do.

 

[Marstermind]

Who cares about flags. All us young kids like me and Kane care about is winning percentage, bro. Get with the times.

Kane and I would take 20 and 2 and lose the flag, over 14 and 8 and winning it.
Just like we would take 40 touches in loss, over 18 touches in a win. That’s how we do.

Kane would know. Got 37 touches in a Grand Final. And they lost by 119 points.

 

[Psi-Roos]

All I know is that I'm a big fan of keeping a coach for longer than 5 minutes. North is like an ADHD kid with coaches since Bird Skort.

 

[B4Bear]

Team with the worst backline in the AFL gets pumped as was predicted all pre-season.

Yeah, let's fire the coach.

 

[Johnny99]

Interesting read but not sure how it relates to our current situation, those angry tigs supporters acknowledged some inroads had been made. Alot of people in the NM community are throwing their toys out of the pram(myself included) precisely because it's becoming a struggle to see one lick of difference Clarko has made, even in an admittedly short period of time.

On moto g22 using BigFooty.com mobile app

At the end of 23, we lost JZ Ben C, Goldy, Hall, McKay, Turner. Thats depth and well over 1000 games of experience.
In 2024, we lost a top 5 talent and a low life human being TT.

Add to that, we have played 3 Prelim finalist from 23. Plus Freo won a final the year before.

NOW, we would all like to see improvement....But how about we give it more than 4 games before we give Clarko his marching orders?

 

[RossHenshaw]

Yeah, fire another coach.

That’ll solve things. What’s a ~6 year rebuild without another 10 years on top of that. I’m sure there’s no onset effects of us having another personnel, coach, staff and management changeover that subsequently turns our list over again under a new coaching game plan & philosophy.

Yes , we want to see improvement. How dare us members requesting this .
Improvement can come in many forms . So far we have seen 3-4 good effort quarters from from the first 4 games.
Not good enough.
I’ve said it before , it’s not all about the win loss it’s about EFFORT . Yes we don’t have the physical bodies , Gorillas in defence or the midfield but there are only 2-3 who put in put whole heated pressure on the opposition ball carrier when we don’t have the footy .
I can name them ; Wardlaw , X & Sheezel .
Sometimes maybe PC & Greenwood .
This is a coaches job to get this level of pressure, intensity & heat up.
Richmond with no ruck & 1 forward won flags based on heat opposition turn over . Yes the had dusty & co but their main game was based on genuine whole hearted effort & pressure in all parts of the ground.

 

[Val Keating]

Over different years with different blokes

The flag he won against Sydney with all the injuries they had throughout the year was one of the best coaching performances of all time.

 

[Cool Kangas]

Can this thread PLEASE be deleted. It’s offensive.

 

[RossHenshaw]

Can this thread PLEASE be deleted. It’s offensive.

Why don’t want to hear the truth … ?

 

[Billy Not Really]

Yes , we want to see improvement. How dare us members requesting this .
Improvement can come in many forms . So far we have seen 3-4 good effort quarters from from the first 4 games.
Not good enough.
I’ve said it before , it’s not all about the win loss it’s about EFFORT . Yes we don’t have the physical bodies , Gorillas in defence or the midfield but there are only 2-3 who put in put whole heated pressure on the opposition ball carrier when we don’t have the footy .
I can name them ; Wardlaw , X & Sheezel .
Sometimes maybe PC & Greenwood .
This is a coaches job to get this level of pressure, intensity & heat up.
Richmond with no ruck & 1 forward won flags based on heat opposition turn over . Yes the had dusty & co but their main game was based on genuine whole hearted effort & pressure in all parts of the ground.

How can you see improvement when you tear down a house that was flipped 3 times before it went to market and intend to do so again before its even finished being built and then expect to win a net profit from that. The skeleton isn't even up yet, because the lead contractor (Clarkson) was away for half a season.

You wanna talk effort? Fine. That's a player issue, not a coaching one. You can only tell someone and drill someone so many times about what to do and when to do it, and if they don't display urgency come game time that responsibility of effort and intent falls squarely on the player. Because what can a coach do? Be nice. Tried that. Be mean? Tried that too, didn't go far with Noble.

What you're asking is to throw the baby out with the bath water, for a fourth time in less than 10 years, and just over 5 years, with 2 of those instances happening in a short span of time.

 

[chubbspeterson]

Yes , we want to see improvement. How dare us members requesting this .
Improvement can come in many forms . So far we have seen 3-4 good effort quarters from from the first 4 games.
Not good enough.
I’ve said it before , it’s not all about the win loss it’s about EFFORT . Yes we don’t have the physical bodies , Gorillas in defence or the midfield but there are only 2-3 who put in put whole heated pressure on the opposition ball carrier when we don’t have the footy .
I can name them ; Wardlaw , X & Sheezel .
Sometimes maybe PC & Greenwood .
This is a coaches job to get this level of pressure, intensity & heat up.
Richmond with no ruck & 1 forward won flags based on heat opposition turn over . Yes the had dusty & co but their main game was based on genuine whole hearted effort & pressure in all parts of the ground.

I think you can expect a more consistent effort from players above 23 yrs old that are more likely 100-200 gamers like Zurhaar, LDU group but young 1-3 year kids can't give that intensity for more than a quarter. Even Sheezel and Wardlaw can't do it for 4 quarters.

 

[Cyber_punk]

Did lol at the Freo troll comparing the winning % of other coaches.

Ask Port supporters if they prefer Hinkley's 60% winning rate, without a single flag, vs a lower overall %, but 4 flags. Ask Saints fans the same. There is a reason why they are flagless, because their gameplans don't hold up in finals. That might change this year, but we'll see.

As for Scott, the Cats underachieved from 2011-22. 2011 they were going to win regardless of coach. Prelim virtually every year probably should have netted them 5 flags but they were figured out most of the time. Their home ground gurantees finals finishes and 22' Swans were pretty weak.

As someone else said, the calibur of teams Clarko's Hawks faced were much more impressive.

 

[RossHenshaw]

How can you see improvement when you tear down a house that was flipped 3 times before it went to market and intend to do so again before its even finished being built and then expect to win a net profit from that. The skeleton isn't even up yet, because the lead contractor (Clarkson) was away for half a season.

You wanna talk effort? Fine. That's a player issue, not a coaching one. You can only tell someone and drill someone so many times about what to do and when to do it, and if they don't display urgency come game time that responsibility of effort and intent falls squarely on the player. Because what can a coach do? Be nice. Tried that. Be mean? Tried that too, didn't go far with Noble.

What you're asking is to throw the baby out with the bath water, for a fourth time in less than 10 years, and just over 5 years, with 2 of those instances happening in a short span of time.

Coaching is not just about game plan & moving players on the whiteboard.
It’s about getting your players in the right head space & being motivational too .
Yes , player development & experience take time . But putting your body on the line & putting manic pressure on the opposition when you don’t have the ball comes from within as an all in team before running onto to the ground.
Coaches job

 

[Cool Kangas]

Why don’t want to hear the truth … ? View attachment 1957170

The truth is you’re being ridiculous. Yeah let’s sack another coach and create more instability at an already fragile club. Let’s start the process again. Let’s learn another system. Let’s go back to square one. Sounds bloody ideal And clarko knows more about coaching than you I suspect.