AFL Player #18: Lewis Hayes

[VelvetSledge]

Contract Status: Out of contract 2024
My Boy Draft 2024: Pick 39, Vander18

 

[Jack Richards]

Worried.

He is out of contract and not getting a game.

Surely he debuts soon..

 

[eth-dog]

If he decides to leave after 2 years as a developing KPP then the only thing we've screwed up is drafting him in the first place.

The only KPP's that have played from that draft have been Aaron Cadman (#1 pick), Harry Barnett (2 games playing second ruck when WC had basically no KPP available) and Tylar Young (Richmond, who have basically no KPP's). Two KPP's taken in the first round haven't debuted yet.

He'd also be really stupid. Baldwin and Reid are injury prone, Laverde is 28 and not really a KPP but doing an okay job at the minute. He just needs patience.

 

[Yoda_]

If he decides to leave after 2 years as a developing KPP then the only thing we've screwed up is drafting him in the first place.

The only KPP's that have played from that draft have been Aaron Cadman (#1 pick), Harry Barnett (2 games playing second ruck when WC had basically no KPP available) and Tylar Young (Richmond, who have basically no KPP's). Two KPP's taken in the first round haven't debuted yet.

He'd also be really stupid. Baldwin and Reid are injury prone, Laverde is 28 and not really a KPP but doing an okay job at the minute. He just needs patience.

I would hazard a guess that it is our supporter base that needs the patience

 

[jdstorm]

If he decides to leave after 2 years as a developing KPP then the only thing we've screwed up is drafting him in the first place.

The only KPP's that have played from that draft have been Aaron Cadman (#1 pick), Harry Barnett (2 games playing second ruck when WC had basically no KPP available) and Tylar Young (Richmond, who have basically no KPP's). Two KPP's taken in the first round haven't debuted yet.

He'd also be really stupid. Baldwin and Reid are injury prone, Laverde is 28 and not really a KPP but doing an okay job at the minute. He just needs patience.

Still all his other competition is injured and LAV isn’t a KPP and Hayes can’t get a game despite being good at VFL level.

It might seem insulting to play two players out of position (lav and Ridley) and give up one of the teams biggest advantages (free Ridley) just to not give you game time

 

[eth-dog]

Still all his other competition is injured and LAV isn’t a KPP and Hayes can’t get a game despite being good at VFL level.

It might seem insulting to play two players out of position (lav and Ridley) and give up one of the teams biggest advantages (free Ridley) just to not give you game time

He's doing okay at VFL level but there are some habits that he's getting away with below that would be really exposed at senior level. He gives too much leg rope to his players on leads, has a poor spoiling technique at times (prefers to use his right hand when on the forward's left side) amongst other things.

 

[bombreys]

If he decides to leave after 2 years as a developing KPP then the only thing we've screwed up is drafting him in the first place.

The only KPP's that have played from that draft have been Aaron Cadman (#1 pick), Harry Barnett (2 games playing second ruck when WC had basically no KPP available) and Tylar Young (Richmond, who have basically no KPP's). Two KPP's taken in the first round haven't debuted yet.

He'd also be really stupid. Baldwin and Reid are injury prone, Laverde is 28 and not really a KPP but doing an okay job at the minute. He just needs patience.

He probably should have been playing AFL earlier in the year. When Ridley was out there were times we had Lav, Heppell and Kelly back there. And Hayes was in really good form at VFL level.

His form at VFL level has dropped off recently - I think he either may have been told or just figured out on his own that perhaps form wasn’t going to get him selected this year, so he may have taken his foot off the gas a little.

I’m also not sure I’d label him ‘stupid’. Times have changed - he’s out of contract and appears a long way off being given an opportunity here. If another side approached him and said you’ll be higher in our pecking order (as well as possibly more years and/or money), I wouldn’t judge him too harshly for looking at it.

 

[eth-dog]

He probably should have been playing AFL earlier in the year. When Ridley was out there were times we had Lav, Heppell and Kelly back there. And Hayes was in really good form at VFL level.

His form at VFL level has dropped off recently - I think he either may have been told or just figured out on his own that perhaps form wasn’t going to get him selected this year, so he may have taken his foot off the gas a little.

I’m also not sure I’d label him ‘stupid’. Times have changed - he’s out of contract and appears a long way off being given an opportunity here. If another side approached him and said you’ll be higher in our pecking order (as well as possibly more years and/or money), I wouldn’t judge him too harshly for looking at it.

His form at VFL level is still good. But the habits I've seen are based on a year and a half of viewing as areas that would get exposed badly at AFL level.

If he leaves when our KPD stocks are McKay, a constantly injured Reid and Baldwin, and an undersized Laverde who is 28 and not likely to be able to take actual KPF's for a lot longer, because he can't get a game two years in, he is stupid. One injury to McKay or Laverde and he's probably in.

 

[bombreys]

His form at VFL level is still good. But the habits I've seen are based on a year and a half of viewing as areas that would get exposed badly at AFL level.

If he leaves when our KPD stocks are McKay, a constantly injured Reid and Baldwin, and an undersized Laverde who is 28 and not likely to be able to take actual KPF's for a lot longer, because he can't get a game two years in, he is stupid. One injury to McKay or Laverde and he's probably in.

I agree his form’s still good - I don’t think quite as good as it was early-mid season though.

I don’t agree with that at all. He wasn’t any closer to a game when Ridley, Baldwin, Reid and Weideman were out. It’s not stupid. This is his career. He’d be stupid not to carefully consider all his options

 

[faible]

I agree his form’s still good - I don’t think quite as good as it was early-mid season though.

I don’t agree with that at all. He wasn’t any closer to a game when Ridley, Baldwin, Reid and Weideman were out. It’s not stupid. This is his career. He’d be stupid not to carefully consider all his options

He's a 19 year old KPP.

 

[Don Won]

I agree his form’s still good - I don’t think quite as good as it was early-mid season though.

I don’t agree with that at all. He wasn’t any closer to a game when Ridley, Baldwin, Reid and Weideman were out. It’s not stupid. This is his career. He’d be stupid not to carefully consider all his options

Hopefully, he loves the way that he is being developed. This is the way we should develop all our young players, lots of time in the VFL and when they are ready they come in and stay in. Geelong have done this and it has worked. We'll attract the smart players and ditch the dumb ones who get 'promised' game time.

 

[mcgrath_truther]

Hopefully, he loves the way that he is being developed. This is the way we should develop all our young players, lots of time in the VFL and when they are ready they come in and stay in. Geelong have done this and it has worked. We'll attract the smart players and ditch the dumb ones who get 'promised' game time.

while i agree with this, it (will) work best if you have a solid VFL program, i cannot comment on the state of ours, but if it's not good then it'll be difficult to actually develop players well

 

[Runk]

Worried.

He is out of contract and not getting a game.

Surely he debuts soon..

Won't happen. The club has clearly made their call on him.

 

[Jack Richards]

His form at VFL level is still good. But the habits I've seen are based on a year and a half of viewing as areas that would get exposed badly at AFL level.

If he leaves when our KPD stocks are McKay, a constantly injured Reid and Baldwin, and an undersized Laverde who is 28 and not likely to be able to take actual KPF's for a lot longer, because he can't get a game two years in, he is stupid. One injury to McKay or Laverde and he's probably in.

I would have not be mad if he chose to leave at years end. Just as I would be feeling dejected if he go delisted without getting a game.

If you're delisted after some solid form in the VFL or getting overlooked for 2 years for the likes of Laverde as a key defender, then you look elsewhere to get a game.

 

[eth-dog]

I would have not be mad if he chose to leave at years end. Just as I would be feeling dejected if he go delisted without getting a game.

If you're delisted after some solid form in the VFL or getting overlooked for 2 years for the likes of Laverde as a key defender, then you look elsewhere to get a game.

I'd be shocked if he was cut. He turns 20 in December and has shown plenty in the VFL. He'll get a contract.

 

[Keystone agony]

No way delisted

He may right now feel mckay, Ridley and Reid are all ahead of him for the next 5 years and where does he fit. He may also feel that even an injury they may play just 2 potentially and then there is Cox

There is also the world where hes being offered solid 3 and 4 year deals elsewhere

 

[bombreys]

He's a 19 year old KPP.

What’s his age got to do with anything I said? If another club offers more opportunity, money and/or years on a contract, he would be silly not to look at it.

 

[faible]

What’s his age got to do with anything I said? If another club offers more opportunity, money and/or years on a contract, he would be silly not to look at it.

As usual it seems, you’re drastically overstating how unusual it is for a young tall not to be playing AFL. He’s a 19 year old KPP.

 

[EnolaGay]

Hopefully, he loves the way that he is being developed. This is the way we should develop all our young players, lots of time in the VFL and when they are ready they come in and stay in. Geelong have done this and it has worked. We'll attract the smart players and ditch the dumb ones who get 'promised' game time.

Gary O'Donnell likes this.

 

[Yoda_]

eth-dog what are these bad habits you are witnessing in his game?

 

[eth-dog]

eth-dog what are these bad habits you are witnessing in his game?

The two big ones I've noticed are the fact that he gives his opponent too much leg rope on the lead and relies on his closing speed too much when it isn't necessarily there. He gets away with this somewhat because of the lesser skills in the VFL but at AFL level it's much less likely.

The second one is the habit that he only punches with his right hand. I can't find a good image to describe it, but when you're on the left of a leading player you're more likely to be able to spoil with your left hand as you simply don't have the reach on your right.

They're easily teachable, but he probably got away with it more in juniors because of his overall closing speed and reach so they got a little ingrained in his game.

 

[Beerfish]

Seems bizarre that someone can only spoil with one arm. Kicking I get but putting an arm out?

 

[eth-dog]

Seems bizarre that someone can only spoil with one arm. Kicking I get but putting an arm out?

I dunno. I was a full back in juniors and my coach was also a defender and it was one of the first things I learned, you need to be able to spoil with both hands.

 

[Beerfish]

I dunno. I was a full back in juniors and my coach was also a defender and it was one of the first things I learned, you need to be able to spoil with both hands.

That's what I mean. It just seems like something that would come naturally.

 

[Mercurial89]

That's what I mean. It just seems like something that would come naturally.

Could also be his gait/stride,
If Eth says he is giving leg rope his opponents and he's relying on his closing speed then it might be better to look at the overall movement to close space and spoil as the one "move" instead of just the spoiling action, which would explain why it's always the same spoiling arm.

 

[bombreys]

As usual it seems, you’re drastically overstating how unusual it is for a young tall not to be playing AFL. He’s a 19 year old KPP.

Hayes isn’t and shouldn’t be in our 22 right now. However, that night not be the case for a North, as an example. It doesn’t matter if he’s 19 or 29. You may not like it, but opposing teams may choose to offer Hayes something more than what Essendon are, be it AFL games, money, extra years on a contract.