Certified Legendary Thread 2 x Premiership Coach Chris Scott contracted to 2026 (aka the Chris Scott volumes

[PzBlinky]

"Action is taken, confidence is restored, stock goes up." Nicholas Van Orton (The Game)
"Let's talk about the draft. I need you to make a splash, Sonny, and if you can't do it then I have to do it." Harvey Molina (Draft Day)

Some recruiting moves you simply must do, PD and JC. Others have a reason behind it, McIntosh and Clark. It worked when they were fit. Unfortunately stuff happens, be it to a vet or rook.
The point being there is always a reason. A hole to hopefully fill, speculation on potential. I remember we got a guy from NM for a year. I think they still paid some of his salary, not a star, we parked him the VFL, though I think he may have played ok in the ones a couple games. At the time I wondered why we did took him off their hands. I think it was to use some salary cap temporarily for just year, and not having to commit to a contract for longer to get above the minimum. Anyway, I felt there were more than just on field considerations at play.
So all this bother about club decision-making is kind of silly, when you realize it isn't black and white, zero sum. Not every player decision is based on 'he's going to be a gun for us'.
Unless you like an argument for an argument sake.

Are you referring to Aaron Black?

The irony is he seemed to be finally coming good as a back-line player in 2018 when he did his knee - never played another AFL game.

That said, he was great for our VFL team and continues to be a coach, so while maybe not an ideal pick-up for the team, has been good for the club.

 

[Vdubs]

Are you referring to Aaron Black?

The irony is he seemed to be finally coming good as a back-line player in 2018 when he did his knee - never played another AFL game.

That said, he was great for our VFL team and continues to be a coach, so while maybe not an ideal pick-up for the team, has been good for the club.

very talented player and exactly as you said- finally made it and CS said he'd become a best 22 player til that knee

 

[goyoucatters]

Except that already didn't apply to Rohan - he'd already played 106 games before he came to Geelong.

We gave up pick 61 for Rohan. The numbers from Draftguru suggest that a player taken in that 'range' averages less than the number of games Rohan has already played for Geelong. And, startlingly, the info also shows that for just about every two picks you take in that band, one of the players won't even make it to 10 games. For me, then, it's indisputable that recruiting him has not been a bust, by any reasonable measure.

His finals have been atrocious, I agree. His acquisition overall has objectively been far less so.

 

[standupand]

We gave up pick 61 for Rohan. The numbers from Draftguru suggest that a player taken in that 'range' averages less than the number of games Rohan has already played for Geelong. And, startlingly, the info also shows that for just about every two picks you take in that band, one of the players won't even make it to 10 games. For me, then, it's indisputable that recruiting him has not been a bust, by any reasonable measure.

His finals have been atrocious, I agree. His acquisition overall has objectively been far less so.

I agree that Rohan is far from a bust and also think the criticism of his final performances is a bit lazy. What he is is a bit inconsistent and susceptible to injuries. It's these two things that I think explain the poor performances whether in the h&a or in finals, not some rare case of September-phobia. But at the same time, I'm not convinced you can simply weigh up recruitment on some kind of itemised balance-sheet of probabilities and games played either. There's a "whole-team" aspect to any individual recruitment - namely 1) the development of team cohesion that you tend to forgo by bringing in players who you want to step into the first 22 immediately; and 2) the signalling that is made and the effect on motivation and standards etc for the whole group, particularly the younger players, by bringing in older recruits who may outperform others right now, but maybe haven't learnt the right work-ethic or whatever at their previous club. Again - not saying this applies to Rohan specifically - just a general point.

 

[goyoucatters]

I agree that Rohan is far from a bust and also think the criticism of his final performances is a bit lazy. What he is is a bit inconsistent and susceptible to injuries. It's these two things that I think explain the poor performances whether in the h&a or in finals, not some rare case of September-phobia. But at the same time, I'm not convinced you can simply weigh up recruitment on some kind of itemised balance-sheet of probabilities and games played either. There's a "whole-team" aspect to any individual recruitment - namely 1) the development of team cohesion that you tend to forgo by bringing in players who you want to step into the first 22 immediately; and 2) the signalling that is made and the effect on motivation and standards etc for the whole group, particularly the younger players, by bringing in older recruits who may outperform others right now, but maybe haven't learnt the right work-ethic or whatever at their previous club. Again - not saying this applies to Rohan specifically - just a general point.

Your overall point here is valid. And there always has to be a balance between the recruitment of PnP types against drafting of young talent. I would take the view that the balance at Geelong isn't half as out of whack as some here believe, particularly given the relatively 'late' positioning of a number of the picks we've 'given up' to bring in experienced players.

In the end, there is obviously a risk/reward and cost/benefit balance to making it harder for young draftees to just easily find their way into the side. Still, I find the evidence on this matter generally remains in the club's favour. After all, I think you can count on one hand the number of players in the last decade who've left Geelong and gone on to make a real go of it somewhere else. So the notion that we've been burning really promising players by virtue of our demonstrated willingness to recruit and trade for experienced types doesn't really match with the empirical reality in my view.

 

[Ricky Vaughn]

I agree that Rohan is far from a bust and also think the criticism of his final performances is a bit lazy. What he is is a bit inconsistent and susceptible to injuries. It's these two things that I think explain the poor performances whether in the h&a or in finals, not some rare case of September-phobia.

As somebody who has heavily criticized Gary Rohan's terrible finals performances, there is just a staggering amount of evidence that would make those criticisms seem less lazy, but eventually it becomes depressing reading and I have no interest in bumming myself out to that degree.

I prefer to keep it as "Gary Rohan has been terrible in Finals." Concise and accurate but maybe a little lazy.

 

[Gazza Greatness]

Jarvis - his stint at Geelong was bizarre

Scott picks him for his 1st game ( and only game ) in a huge game against Richmond - actually Grimes went up to him - and shook his hand - and said gee they have picked you for a big game - so Grimes must be a decent bloke

In what turned out a deplorable match for Geel at the Gold Coast - i thought Jarvis showed a glint of being an AFL player - took a nice mark etc

Yet gets dropped immediately - banished - we never see him again

Scott and he does deserve great credit for the 2011 flag - however at this point in time - all the Scott fans - and all the Scott sympathises - they cant defend one action of Scotts - and that was picking Dahlaus for basically every game last year ( his form was absolutely garbage- he is long finished as an AFL player ) yet in true bizarre C Scott fashion to a tee - he dropped Dahlhaus for the elimination final against the GWS- because he had his neck on the line in a knockout final

Scotts continual selection of Dahlhaus last year - is undefendable - just the sign of a lazy coach - please wake me up in 2 years time when he is gone

Support your comments GOB

Train the way you want to play, play the way you want to win finals footy.

My biggest beef with Chris Scott over a long period of time now (unlike with Mark Thompson) is that he doesn't have the side playing finals type footy 'consistently' through playing seasons, this has gone on for a few seasons now, so much so that going back 2 or 3 seasons ago in mid-season games against Footscray and Hawthorn that I became so frustrated in the way we were playing that I did not watch either game after half time which taking into consideration I watch most other games until games end (final siren), gives a insight into my level of frustration with Chris Scott. This slow methodical game style he wants us to play is just bullshit and frustrates the crap out of me as it will never win a collection of hotly contested finals football. Sure we've had a extremely talented side with good depth for sometime now and good enough to win most home and away games playing with varying degrees of different game styles but is was with a ten goal win against Freo in Perth mid-late last year where a piece of play within that game was highlighted by media to how successful Geelong's methodical play was, with the ball moving from backline to forward line with slow precision kicking and marking with a goal resulting. From that very moment I thought we were f**ked because I knew in my heart of hearts that is how Chris Scott wants us to play. End of rant!

 

[Partridge]

This slow methodical game style he wants us to play is just bullshit and frustrates the crap out of me as it will never win a collection of hotly contested finals football. Sure we've had a extremely talented side with good depth for sometime now and good enough to win most home and away games playing with varying degrees of different game styles but is was with a ten goal win against Freo in Perth mid-late last year where a piece of play within that game was highlighted by media to how successful Geelong's methodical play was, with the ball moving from backline to forward line with slow precision kicking and marking with a goal resulting. From that very moment I thought we were f**ked because I knew in my heart of hearts that is how Chris Scott wants us to play. End of rant!

Doesn't need to though. It protects the older players, hides our weaknesses against most teams, and does enough to get us to finals. Good for revenue, which means it's good for the club, which means it's good for Scott. It's just not good for fans who would like their team to be in serious premiership contention.

 

[Partridge]

In the end, there is obviously a risk/reward and cost/benefit balance to making it harder for young draftees to just easily find their way into the side. Still, I find the evidence on this matter generally remains in the club's favour. After all, I think you can count on one hand the number of players in the last decade who've left Geelong and gone on to make a real go of it somewhere else. So the notion that we've been burning really promising players by virtue of our demonstrated willingness to recruit and trade for experienced types doesn't really match with the empirical reality in my view.

True, but if you keep guys in the seconds for five years it's not like they get a lot of chances to show you're wrong. And games at senior level in those early years are vital.

 

[standupand]

Your overall point here is valid. And there always has to be a balance between the recruitment of PnP types against drafting of young talent. I would take the view that the balance at Geelong isn't half as out of whack as some here believe, particularly given the relatively 'late' positioning of a number of the picks we've 'given up' to bring in experienced players.

In the end, there is obviously a risk/reward and cost/benefit balance to making it harder for young draftees to just easily find their way into the side. Still, I find the evidence on this matter generally remains in the club's favour. After all, I think you can count on one hand the number of players in the last decade who've left Geelong and gone on to make a real go of it somewhere else. So the notion that we've been burning really promising players by virtue of our demonstrated willingness to recruit and trade for experienced types doesn't really match with the empirical reality in my view.

I don't necessarily mean that we're burning opportunities for young players. I just mean that the philosophy has to be team ethic and structure first, and personnel second. The team makes the success of the player not the other way around. As much as I can't stand Clarkson in a lot of respects, I feel like he epitomised that philosophy perfectly. It wasn't necessarily about draft v trade - he traded in many key players who were successful there. But the philosophy at the hawks during their successful era was still always: one soldier goes out, another one in. That galvanises a team. CS tends to have the other way of looking at things. Who do I have available, and how can I fit them on a team sheet? ... You know: "I'm not going to pretend it's going to be easy to replace [insert big name player here] for the next game..."

 

[Gavin Excell]

We gave up pick 61 for Rohan. The numbers from Draftguru suggest that a player taken in that 'range' averages less than the number of games Rohan has already played for Geelong. And, startlingly, the info also shows that for just about every two picks you take in that band, one of the players won't even make it to 10 games. For me, then, it's indisputable that recruiting him has not been a bust, by any reasonable measure.

His finals have been atrocious, I agree. His acquisition overall has objectively been far less so.

The relevant question is not so much his acquisition but the fact he plays as best 22 each week

 

[SJ]

Support your comments GOB

Train the way you want to play, play the way you want to win finals footy.

My biggest beef with Chris Scott over a long period of time now (unlike with Mark Thompson) is that he doesn't have the side playing finals type footy 'consistently' through playing seasons, this has gone on for a few seasons now, so much so that going back 2 or 3 seasons ago in mid-season games against Footscray and Hawthorn that I became so frustrated in the way we were playing that I did not watch either game after half time which taking into consideration I watch most other games until games end (final siren), gives a insight into my level of frustration with Chris Scott. This slow methodical game style he wants us to play is just bullshit and frustrates the crap out of me as it will never win a collection of hotly contested finals football. Sure we've had a extremely talented side with good depth for sometime now and good enough to win most home and away games playing with varying degrees of different game styles but is was with a ten goal win against Freo in Perth mid-late last year where a piece of play within that game was highlighted by media to how successful Geelong's methodical play was, with the ball moving from backline to forward line with slow precision kicking and marking with a goal resulting. From that very moment I thought we were f**ked because I knew in my heart of hearts that is how Chris Scott wants us to play. End of rant!

Where that becomes evident is that the amount of times our game style has capitulated under pressure in knock out finals, often in the first quarter, or if not, when we have been ahead and are challenged typically in the second half.

And yet it has almost never, if ever, happened the other way around.

 

[PhatBoy]

Doesn't need to though. It protects the older players, hides our weaknesses against most teams, and does enough to get us to finals. Good for revenue, which means it's good for the club, which means it's good for Scott. It's just not good for fans who would like their team to be in serious premiership contention.

The guy is a premiership coach with a brilliant record overall - do you think he’s going to not be able to find a job if he’s not with us? Does he even need one? He’s been a professional player and coach with two of the strongest sides of the afl era for a quarter of a century. I doubt he NEEDS the job.

This is probably the biggest thing I personally struggle with from the anti Scott faction. Not so much the criticism - we haven’t won anything in a decade, that’s indisputable.

The question of him allegedly not wanting to win though or at least not trying anything to win because he is too comfortable or whatever: does anyone seriously believe that?

If he’s THAT desperate to keep his job and to make a living from it, wouldn’t he then in turn be THAT desperate to win and make his own worth rise exponentially?

 

[catempire]

Gary Rohan. Traded for pick 61.
85 goals in 3 seasons = successful trade.

Objectively true but I’d be happy to never see him in the senior side again. Wishful thinking, I know.

 

[Partridge]

Not as easy as that. Would we have been 2 goals less without him? Who would have been better? I don't see our version of Shane Ellen.
And, quite often, crook players can be dosed up and get through a game, let alone a KO Prelim game.

That night, anyone except for Gary Rohan.

 

[goyoucatters]

True, but if you keep guys in the seconds for five years it's not like they get a lot of chances to show you're wrong. And games at senior level in those early years are vital.

Doesn't suit the narrative, of course. But the club does continue to promote a number of young players early and give them protracted runs in the seniors soon after drafting them.

Brandan Parfitt played 15 games in his first season.
Max Holmes played 12 games in his first season.
Mark Blicavs played 22 games in his first season.
Gryan Miers played 25 games in his second season.
Jack Henry played 22 games in his second season.
Brad Close played 22 games in his second season.
Esava Ratugloea played 20 games in his third season.
Mark O'Connor played 23 games in his third season.

We could have played more younger players earlier, no doubt. But to suggest that a group of younger players haven't been tried (and persisted with) in the seniors relatively early in their AFL careers is simply not the case either.

 

[dont stop me meow]

From memory, his first goal for Geelong came from a tackle in our forward line against Richmond.

My mate and I were at that game. If I'm remembering it right Otto mowed down Richard Tambling at the top of the goal square to register his first for the cats. It was hilarious because of course Tambling (at the time) was thought to be a future gun having been taken at pick 4 the year before.
The only thing louder than the roar of the cats faithful was the booming chant of JUDAS JUDAS JUDAS from the very salty Tigers fans. Absolutely priceless.

 

[Partridge]

Doesn't suit the narrative, of course. But the club does continue to promote a number of young players early and give them protracted runs in the seniors soon after drafting them.

Brandan Parfitt played 15 games in his first season.
Max Holmes played 12 games in his first season.
Mark Blicavs played 22 games in his first season.
Gryan Miers played 25 games in his second season.
Jack Henry played 22 games in his second season.
Brad Close played 22 games in his second season.
Esava Ratugloea played 20 games in his third season.
Mark O'Connor played 23 games in his third season.

We could have played more younger players earlier, no doubt. But to suggest that a group of younger players haven't been tried (and persisted with) in the seniors relatively early in their AFL careers is simply not the case either.

Hardly relevant examples. It's the guys who get 4 games in 4 years that are relevant to this argument. Like clockwork the argument is "well they didn't deserve it" or "they should have done more". Blicavs and Ratugolea got tons of games before remotely looking competent at senior level - so there's no way all players have to earn their spot to either get in the team or stay there. Some just don't.

 

[goyoucatters]

Hardly relevant examples. It's the guys who get 4 games in 4 years that are relevant to this argument. Like clockwork the argument is "well they didn't deserve it" or "they should have done more". Blicavs and Ratugolea got tons of games before remotely looking competent at senior level - so there's no way all players have to earn their spot to either get in the team or stay there. Some just don't.

There's actually players in that category at every club. I don't think we're greatly different to many others in that regard. So I believe it is relevant to point out that the club has ongoing examples of players who got lots of games from early on. I get that you would have liked to have seen more, and different players given the opportunity at that.

Still, the fact remains that very few (if any) of our supposedly criminally neglected have gone on to press their claims elsewhere. If they were 'rotting' at Geelong, there should have been clubs queueing up to take advantage of our profligacy. And yet they often barely register anything more than passing interest when it comes to other clubs looking to top up on overlooked gems from across the league.

Constable will be the next case in point, I guess. Some here can't believe how poorly treated he was at the Cats. Others saw deficiencies in his game that were keeping him out of the senior team. Will be very interesting to see whether he can make a go of it at the Suns without the suffocating incompetence and nepotism of the Cats set-up holding him back.

 

[you pick one]

There's actually players in that category at every club. I don't think we're greatly different to many others in that regard. So I believe it is relevant to point out that the club has ongoing examples of players who got lots of games from early on. I get that you would have liked to have seen more, and different players given the opportunity at that.

Still, the fact remains that very few (if any) of our supposedly criminally neglected have gone on to press their claims elsewhere. If they were 'rotting' at Geelong, there should have been clubs queueing up to take advantage of our profligacy. And yet they often barely register anything more than passing interest when it comes to other clubs looking to top up on overlooked gems from across the league.

Constable will be the next case in point, I guess. Some here can't believe how poorly treated he was at the Cats. Others saw deficiencies in his game that were keeping him out of the senior team. Will be very interesting to see whether he can make a go of it at the Suns without the suffocating incompetence and nepotism of the Cats set-up holding him back.

I reckon the Suns bat deeper in the midfield than the Cats,Weller Rowell Miller Swallow Anderson Atkins Elis Fiorni Lakosius all go through the middle.

 

[Partridge]

Constable will be the next case in point, I guess. Some here can't believe how poorly treated he was at the Cats. Others saw deficiencies in his game that were keeping him out of the senior team. Will be very interesting to see whether he can make a go of it at the Suns without the suffocating incompetence and nepotism of the Cats set-up holding him back.

He averaged more touches per game than every other midfielder we've had in recent times in his first few games. I would have thought more focus on what he could do (i.e. find the ball at senior level) might have had something close to some importance versus what he couldn't do. He only played 12 senior games, and no doubt I'm alone in this, but I could have handled seeing a few more to see what else might have come.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Not too worried about Constable. Looming as merely a draft bust. Doubt he makes us look foolish for letting him go during his time at the Suns.

 

[Ricky Vaughn]

Where that becomes evident is that the amount of times our game style has capitulated under pressure in knock out finals, often in the first quarter, or if not, when we have been ahead and are challenged typically in the second half.

And yet it has almost never, if ever, happened the other way around.

Biggest deficit we've overcome under Scott is 23 points against Port in 13 and 17 points against Hawthorn in 16.
We've conceded leads of 20 points to Freo, 20 points to Hawthorn, 21 points to Richmond, and 22 points to Richmond in the GF.

I know many of us would consider "classic Geelong" blowing a final in the first quarter, but we are far from a one trick pony when it comes to losing Finals.

 

[goyoucatters]

He averaged more touches per game than every other midfielder we've had in recent times in his first few games. I would have thought more focus on what he could do (i.e. find the ball at senior level) might have had something close to some importance versus what he couldn't do. He only played 12 senior games, and no doubt I'm alone in this, but I could have handled seeing a few more to see what else might have come.

I think his demise at the Cats was mostly down to the fact that the area of development the M.C. had potentially set for him just never seemed to be addressed in his games at VFL level. Yes, he continued to find the footy a lot in close. But it never looked like he improved his ability to spread from the contest or to work back hard when the team was in defensive transition. We 're all speculating when it comes to figuring out exactly what it is they were asking of him, and why he was coming up short of satisfying their criteria. However, given his very healthy possession numbers never seemed to be cutting through at the selection table, you have to believe that they were looking for something other than gigantic stats to see him further his case.

Of course, some will find it easier to believe that when the Carnauba wax ran out, so too did Charlie's prospects of a senior career at the club. Each to their own.

Still, as has been very apparent on here, you were far from alone in wanting to see more games from him in the ones at Geelong. I wasn't clamouring for his inclusion in the last couple of seasons, I will admit. But a number of others were bullish about him and will be watching closely to see whether he can make a go of it with the Suns. I'm not backing him in to make it up here at all. But I will join you in watching closely to see whether the club did err in letting him go.

 

[Cursed Cat]

I think his demise at the Cats was mostly down to the fact that the area of development the M.C. had potentially set for him just never seemed to be addressed in his games at VFL level. Yes, he continued to find the footy a lot in close. But it never looked like he improved his ability to spread from the contest or to work back hard when the team was in defensive transition. We 're all speculating when it comes to figuring out exactly what it is they were asking of him, and why he was coming up short of satisfying their criteria. However, given the possession numbers never seemed to be cutting through at the selection table, you have to believe that we were looking for something other than gigantic stats to see him further his case. Of course, some will find it easier to believe that when the wax ran out, so did Charlie's prospects of a senior career at the club.

Still, as has been very apparent here, you were far from alone in wanting to see more games from him in the ones at Geelong. I wasn't clamouring for his inclusion, I will admit. But a number of others were bullish about him and will be watching closely to see whether he can make a go of it with the Suns. I'm not backing him in to make it up here at all. But I will join you in watching closely to see whether the club did err in letting him go.

One thing's for sure; Constable will get opportunities at Gold Coast. No Ben King is going to cast a massive shadow over their entire season; they've got some talented kids but King was the centrepiece. Constable's opportunities might not prove to be much fun for him.

I can't see Constable's future panning out any more extraordinarily than say George Horlin-Smith's though. I liked GHS a lot. I liked Constable's game a lot too; but reading between the lines it seems these types cant quite handle the midfield workload expectations, at least at Geelong, anyway.

Will be interesting to see what young Cooper Stephens can produce this year; reputedly has the aerobic qualities to compete at the level, but has yet to really display any of those fundamentals that Constable did, even at VFL level - granted injuries have played a major role.

We've had a crack at our share of these big-framed midfielder types at the draft to support Selwood and Dangerfield - Jansen was another great white hope - but to date none have really kicked on post-2011.