2012 draft

[Mr Magic]

sorry have to disagree with this. these are my support players from their gf,
wojo,harley,hunt,burnes,n ablett,stokes and rooke. all these players complimented the guns.

Harley was Captain and AA how can you say he was a support player??

Wojo was a threat at times with his pace and Ablett was in his prime in the finals. In any case I said 5-6 support players at best so do you agree with me then>

 

[THE_GUN]

FYI - Quigley reckons its a close call as to whether Whitfield deserves #1 ahead of Grundy...

Just saying

And we have people on this Forum arguing Grundy v Vlastuin (which some rate as high as late teens)
Personally i want a kid thats could become the player thats going to break a game apart with class and talent

Vickery/Grundy = 12 years of Ruck/Fwd Domination

 

[Mr Magic]

well you have to get the ball first AND distribute it smartly not just slam it on the boot. this is what the best do better than most as they dont WASTE a clearance.

Yeah nah these days under the Swans maul there is hardly any room to distribute etc.. as a percentage play with smooth precision so you relying on Goodes and Jetta to explode onto the ball with pace etc... and create the goals where they have sufficient space to enable the creation IMO.

Ideally you are looking for inside and outside players like Tyson

 

[theflea]

Harley was Captain and AA how can you say he was a support player??

Wojo was a threat at times with his pace and Ablett was in his prime in the finals. In any case I said 5-6 support players at best so do you agree with me then>

no you said hardly any and i think if we had this quality of support staff then we'd play finals.also they had additional support on there list of blake,johnston,prismall,tenace,varcoe,egan(injury),king and milburne. and i stand behind those players as support irrespective of aa's or captain status.

 

[Mr Magic]

we didnt win the ball enough for long enough. the fact that we were close at all is irrelevant as we want to be miles ahead in the score. if we win the ball more we dont have to have these hand in mouth close contests we hate.

I agree but I don't agree we didn't win enough soley in the middle

 

[theflea]

Yeah nah these days under the Swans maul there is hardly any room to distribute etc.. as a percentage play with smooth precision so you relying on Goodes and Jetta to explode onto the ball with pace etc... and create the goals where they have sufficient space to enable the creation IMO.

Ideally you are looking for inside and outside players like Tyson

but thats a PLAN to space knowing jetta is there and using it to advantage not just blindy slamming it on the boot( see tuck).

 

[Mr Magic]

no you said hardly any and i think if we had this quality of support staff then we'd play finals.also they had additional support on there list of blake,johnston,prismall,tenace,varcoe,egan(injury),king and milburne. and i stand behind those players as support irrespective of aa's or captain status.

Egan, Milburn , King were AA , not support players??. This is about winning in the GF

 

[_RT_]

Varcoe was around in 2007 But he was a quality pick that slipped due to injury. Was top 10 talent I believe. Tenace, David Johnson and Blake didn't play in the GF. Nathan Ablett son of God was a father son.

Stokes is a quality player even though hasn't made AA/ Byrnes maybe the weakest link but serviceable. 5-6 support players at best in that team including the likes of Ablett and Stokes that were big contributors particularly Ablett. The point is who won the GF for them?

Like Varcoe the same applies to Vlastuin, as I said was a likely top 5 pick heading into this year but due to injury has slipped down the order a bit.

 

[Mr Magic]

but thats a PLAN to space knowing jetta is there and using it to advantage not just blindy slamming it on the boot( see tuck).

Tuck isn't the long term solution grant you but is Vlastuin if he is just a support player in a GF scenario?

 

[theflea]

Egan, Milburn , King were AA , not support players??. This is about winning in the GF

but they are still support not GUNS. they played as a gun team so of course their output is highlighted.

ps king wasnt aa in 2007 cox and lade were.

 

[Mr Magic]

Like Varcoe the same applies to Vlastuin, as I said was a likely top 5 pick heading into this year but due to injury has slipped down the order a bit.

Why don't people say Vlastuin is top 5 talent who has slipped due to injury/circumstances??

 

[THE_GUN]

Like Varcoe the same applies to Vlastuin, as I said was a likely top 5 pick heading into this year but due to injury has slipped down the order a bit.

So why wouldnt we look at Stringer who was rated #1 back in the day or Menzel who even with injury is still being touted as a top 5.

Would you still want Vlastuin even if Stringer,Menzel,Grundy were available at our selection ?

 

[Mr Magic]

but they are still support not GUNS. they played as a gun team so of course their output is highlighted.

no they were Guns, Egan was AA in the year and King and Milburn had AA quality about them while going about there business in 2007

 

[theflea]

Tuck isn't the long term solution grant you but is Vlastuin if he is just a support player in a GF scenario?

well considering gf are all out cp's id say he would be very important. others have talked about vlas as support i was merely saying support is very important and cant be ignored. i wouldnt know how good vlas or others are and dont really profess to say otherwise 1 way or the other. 1 thing i do think is we do have cream in our team but really lack this support for them(depth). who's to know how you would catagorise vlas i couldnt do it.

 

[theflea]

no they were Guns, Egan was AA in the year and King and Milburn had AA quality about them while going about there business in 2007[/quote

you and i have a different definition of gun. bartel,ga jnr, stevie j are guns.

 

[_RT_]

And we have people on this Forum arguing Grundy v Vlastuin (which some rate as high as late teens)
Personally i want a kid thats could become the player thats going to break a game apart with class and talent

Vickery/Grundy = 12 years of Ruck/Fwd Domination

Knightmare had Vlastuin ranked second in his early phantom rankings. In fact if you look at his OP in his phantom he ranks Grundy at 8 and Vlastuin at 10 in his power rankings. If you take out those already on lists in O'Meara and Crouch they are ranked 6th and 8th.

 

[_RT_]

Why don't people say Vlastuin is top 5 talent who has slipped due to injury/circumstances??

Because many of them simply don't know or it doesn't suit their arguments to admit that the kid was a highly rated kid early on.

 

[_RT_]

So why wouldnt we look at Stringer who was rated #1 back in the day or Menzel who even with injury is still being touted as a top 5.

Would you still want Vlastuin even if Stringer,Menzel,Grundy were available at our selection ?

Yes because under our recruitment policy Vlastuin is the best fit.

 

[Mr Magic]

Gun for me is gun in position. I don't demote a player just because they are not in the middle or forward line because you need guns in the backline and forwardline along with the centre to win a premiership and play their roles

 

[MR]

So why wouldnt we look at Stringer who was rated #1 back in the day or Menzel who even with injury is still being touted as a top 5.

Would you still want Vlastuin even if Stringer,Menzel,Grundy were available at our selection ?

Stringer was never rated at 1. O'Meara and Whitfield always had the tags on them as pick 1. Stringer was touted as a top 5 picks but personally, I think it was because his dominance was from him being a man among children in the under 18s. He is a pretty bad non-preferred too and the leg break is much more severe than a niggling ankle injury.

Also, I would rather Menzel over Vlastuin. Hell, I would rather Menzel than Toumpas. I think he is an absolute champion in the making. There aren't many midfielders who have the capability to go forward and kick 6-10 goals a game. Very, very, very special talent. Mix between Pendlebury, Ablett and SteveyJ.

 

[Infamy]

Stringer was never rated at 1.

I definitely remember Stringer getting flagged as a likely #1 selection earlier this year on TV.


Will be very interesting if Grundy is still on the board when our pick comes around, will probably be the biggest call FJ has had to make in his entire time at the club if he overlooks him. If he does the kid would want to be a standout player.
I hope we go for Grundy, I know we have a few 200cm players on our list now, but they are all athletic, it will make us unpredictable and very hard to match up on. Look at how difficult it is to match up on West Coast and their big men.

 

[TJTIGER]

Menzel sounds a very special player M_R. whitfield must also be exceptional to go @ one or would you rate Menzel ahead of him ?

 

[THE_GUN]

Stringer was never rated at 1. O'Meara and Whitfield always had the tags on them as pick 1. Stringer was touted as a top 5 picks but personally, I think it was because his dominance was from him being a man among children in the under 18s. He is a pretty bad non-preferred too and the leg break is much more severe than a niggling ankle injury.

Also, I would rather Menzel over Vlastuin. Hell, I would rather Menzel than Toumpas. I think he is an absolute champion in the making. There aren't many midfielders who have the capability to go forward and kick 6-10 goals a game. Very, very, very special talent. Mix between Pendlebury, Ablett and SteveyJ.

Perhaps they may of rated him as #1 taking into consideration that O'Meara is already gone,But i specifically remember on the show with shifter sheehan and Hutchy i think it was where they mentioned him as a likely number #1 if not for his injuries.

Yes because under our recruitment policy Vlastuin is the best fit.

Thats just simply wrong !! why should we have a pre determined 'POLICY' It should automatically be best talent available at our pick - No policy or position should come into it.

I definitely remember Stringer getting flagged as a likely #1 selection earlier this year on TV.


Will be very interesting if Grundy is still on the board when our pick comes around, will probably be the biggest call FJ has had to make in his entire time at the club if he overlooks him. If he does the kid would want to be a standout player.
I hope we go for Grundy, I know we have a few 200cm players on our list now, but they are all athletic, it will make us unpredictable and very hard to match up on. Look at how difficult it is to match up on West Coast and their big men.

Well the Rumour about grundy has been around for 2 weeks before the draft, FJ and the rest of the clan have certainly had enough time to consider this scenario - They will have to live with their decision(lets hope its the correct decision)

Knightmare had Vlastuin ranked second in his early phantom rankings. In fact if you look at his OP in his phantom he ranks Grundy at 8 and Vlastuin at 10 in his power rankings. If you take out those already on lists in O'Meara and Crouch they are ranked 6th and 8th.

If by your admission Grundy is ranked higher , why would we take a lower ranked player - simply because of structural need for the now - thats crazy

I have nothing against the kid & if he is the best at our selection - Fine BUT i just cant see the star/Game breaker/champion in him just looks like a very very good worker that gives his all.
Perhaps not upto Vlastuin's level yet but wouldnt suprise me to find similar players from picks 20-50 that can become extremely good inside extractors

 

[tigertaskforce]

Easy Tiger(s)
Lets back the club in on this one
oh what the heck, its a forum ; rip into each other

your asking us NOT to eat our own ? you sure your following richmond ? learn some club history pmsl

 

[Wacky Tiger]

Haven't been into other team forums but are they arguing as much as we are???

We all have our preferences and none of us has the final say. In 4-5 years time a few of us can say I told you so whilst others hide in shame. It's all a bit of fun lads.

The one thing we can be confident on is the club have positioned themselves well with recruiting staff over the last couple of years and we should have no repeats of JON any time soon.