List Mgmt. 2018 St Kilda Trade Thread Part 2

[The Enemy Within]

Each supporter base has their own opinions. Hannebery 100% won't be traded straight for pick 4 any supporters from the Swans who think that are just delusional, I think if the trade does go through it will involve a swap of first round selections (Which I doubt either set of supporters would be happy with).

As I stated before Sydney actually don't have any issues with the salary cap at the moment, so it is highly unlikely they won't accept a trade they don't perceive as value for Hannebery.

St Kilda also don't have any selections they would equate to fair value for Hannebery right now.

Personally I doubt this trade will be made (I would much rather keep Hanners for the length of his contract, especially if we are going to be in contention over the next few years).

I think the deal will get done,
He wants to come home
The saints want him
& Sydney are open to trading him in spite of Sydney saying he is a required player they have to say that as he has a concrete contract, required or not he could be your boot studder & still get payed.

 

[bird_man]

Lycett more likely to go to Port

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/tr...d/news-story/931be29272b207887a07928417f3dec3

 

[gringo2011]

From what I've heard the Swans actually have a bit of cap space available. Losing his salary wouldn't be so much a dump to get cap breathing room as it'd be clearing space for trade targets. Sydney are definitely keen to keep Hannebery.

That makes zero sense to me. They want to keep him but also shopped him around. He's broken and they don't want to pay $850,000 for a player who has lost he weapons that made him a gun. But then they have all this cap space? That seriously lacks any logic what so ever. Maybe they are trying to get him to take less money. That is the only reason they would shop him around.

 

[bungwahl]

That makes zero sense to me. They want to keep him but also shopped him around. He's broken and they don't want to pay $850,000 for a player who has lost he weapons that made him a gun. But then they have all this cap space? That seriously lacks any logic what so ever. Maybe they are trying to get him to take less money. That is the only reason they would shop him around.

I didn't say Sydney had "all this cap space", I responded to a previous comment that Sydney's cap was bursting and in dire need of a salary cap dump. It's not. The club has an interest in some other trade targets, hence if Hannebery was to leave it'd make obtaining those targets more straightforward. Hopefully that clears it up for you.

There is zero evidence that Sydney has "shopped him around". Sydney typically don't leak any trade details early. They might have given his manager their blessing to test the waters, but word from the people I know at the club is they definitely want Hannebery to stay.

 

[VDS66]

I didn't say Sydney had "all this cap space", I responded to a previous comment that Sydney's cap was bursting and in dire need of a salary cap dump. It's not. The club has an interest in some other trade targets, hence if Hannebery was to leave it'd make obtaining those targets more straightforward. Hopefully that clears it up for you.

There is zero evidence that Sydney has "shopped him around". Sydney typically don't leak any trade details early. They might have given his manager their blessing to test the waters, but word from the people I know at the club is they definitely want Hannebery to stay.

I'd say your club needs a reset in terms of player types and game plan.

Yes, you have been competitive, but not good enough for the ultimate for quite a few years. The game has trended away from the Roos / Longmire philosophy.

And that's not having a go because I admire your club.

That said, I believe you will have to make some tough calls to accommodate those list changes, if not for cap space, then purely for list spots in your starting 22.

Your club aren't mugs when it comes to list management and have shown they will make the tough calls on the past.

On that basis, I reckon Hanners is expendable if possible. If not they keep him. Letting him to would solve a few issues in one hit, especially if you are looking to land another gun lime Gaff for example... Or whoever.

Your club is as good as any other when it comes to identifying a player, then securing them.

In terms of cap, yes you will free up a fair bit with some retirements, but that will be clawed back from your improving youngsters wanting a pay rise.

 

[bungwahl]

I'd say your club needs a reset in terms of player types and game plan.

Yes, you have been competitive, but not good enough for the ultimate for quite a few years. The game has trended away from the Roos / Longmire philosophy.

And that's not having a go because I admire your club.

That said, I believe you will have to make some tough calls to accommodate those list changes, if not for cap space, then purely for list spots in your starting 22.

Your club aren't mugs when it comes to list management and have shown they will make the tough calls on the past.

On that basis, I reckon Hanners is expendable if possible. If not they keep him. Letting him to would solve a few issues in one hit, especially if you are looking to land another gun lime Gaff for example... Or whoever.

Your club is as good as any other when it comes to identifying a player, then securing them.

In terms of cap, yes you will free up a fair bit with some retirements, but that will be clawed back from your improving youngsters wanting a pay rise.

Absolutely agree with you.

We seem to have a list that is built for attacking footy and we play a horrible, congested, ugly game style every week. We're still infatuated with the "slingshot" game plan of repeatedly allowing the ball in to our defensive 50 and then trying to turn it over and rebound. It worked well in 2012 with Jetta standing on his own in a paddock of space, but not so much now. Problem is we over commit to defense and then move the ball forwards too slowly.

Anyway... that's probably enough Sydney-list discussion for the St Kilda board!

 

[Premium]

Each supporter base has their own opinions. Hannebery 100% won't be traded straight for pick 4 any supporters from the Swans who think that are just delusional, I think if the trade does go through it will involve a swap of first round selections (Which I doubt either set of supporters would be happy with).

As I stated before Sydney actually don't have any issues with the salary cap at the moment, so it is highly unlikely they won't accept a trade they don't perceive as value for Hannebery.

St Kilda also don't have any selections they would equate to fair value for Hannebery right now.

Personally I doubt this trade will be made (I would much rather keep Hanners for the length of his contract, especially if we are going to be in contention over the next few years).

Good i hope he stays at the Swans

 

[saintmagic]

I didn't say Sydney had "all this cap space", I responded to a previous comment that Sydney's cap was bursting and in dire need of a salary cap dump. It's not. The club has an interest in some other trade targets, hence if Hannebery was to leave it'd make obtaining those targets more straightforward. Hopefully that clears it up for you.

There is zero evidence that Sydney has "shopped him around". Sydney typically don't leak any trade details early. They might have given his manager their blessing to test the waters, but word from the people I know at the club is they definitely want Hannebery to stay.

The past three years his disposal count has declined (30.9 to 24.7 to 18.8) and his contested possession count has declined (13.2 to 9.8 to 6.8).

He will be 28 by the time next season starts and has started having calf injuries which is generally a sign that things are on the decline. Sure, he didn't really have a preseason and maybe he can get over his injury issues. But even if he does i just don't see him going back to the A grade star that he was 2 years ago. He will still be good but i think there is a question as to whether he will be great again. He also makes whats rumoured to be $800k a season.

That is not to say that i don't want him. We would love his leadership and he fits a hole in our list (also his salary isn't an issue for us). However, i see him more as a Bernie Vince type player who will help set the standards at training and be a leader on field. Vince was traded at a similar age for pick 23 which sounds about right to me (Vince isn't as good but he didn't have the injury issues).

Personally i don't see a scenario where our pick 3/4 is included in the deal. The top end of the draft this year is just too good and a 10 pick downgrade to 14 is substantial (even if the points difference makes it seem like it isn't). I don't know how it will get done or even if it will get done, but I would only do it for an early second round pick (which we would have to acquire from somewhere). If you guys insist on 3/4 being involved then if it was up to me i would walk away (though maybe our list management team thinks differently).

There does seem to be a bit too much smoke around this deal happening and where there is smoke there is generally fire. It sounds to me like the clubs have talked and think that they will be able to work out a deal, it will be interesting to see how it goes down.

 

[bird_man]

Do we turn our interest to Preuss if Lycett does decide to go to Port?

Hard to know what he's worth. He'd be a good get but I'd be worried North would ask a lot due to his contract.

 

[Ducky Tie]

Do we turn our interest to Preuss if Lycett does decide to go to Port?

Hard to know what he's worth. He'd be a good get but I'd be worried North would ask a lot due to his contract.

I don't think so. He would cost plenty pickwise. The main attraction to Lycett would be that we don't have to give up anything and can get a net gain by moving on Hickey and or Longer. Wouldn't be surprised to see us back Pierce in if we miss out on Lycett.

 

[St Neil]

From what I've heard the Swans actually have a bit of cap space available. Losing his salary wouldn't be so much a dump to get cap breathing room as it'd be clearing space for trade targets. Sydney are definitely keen to keep Hannebery.

Then why don’t the Swans shut down the speculation immediately? It’s pretty obvious.

He’s locked away tighter than a drum. Until the end of 2021.

Numerous articles and commentators refer to Hannebery’s annual salary of $850,000+ and Sydney’s need to shed salary cap space to accommodate re-signed players and attract recruiting targets like Darcy Moore. This stuff is being openly reported.

This shouldn’t even be an issue that is discussed. The only reason it is a live issue is that Sydney allow it to be so. They should just declare it one way or the other rather than than the dribble Tom Harley talks about which is that he doesn’t want to add to uniformed speculation.

I’m not fussed if we recruit him, in fact I’m changing my mind and would prefer that we don’t bother. But he isn’t worth a 1st RDP and St Kilda wouldn’t be that stupid to trade or downgrade that pick for him.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

That recent article is rubbish. Don't stress. He will be a saint.

i disagree ... but lets see how it plays out

 

[St Neil]

Do we turn our interest to Preuss if Lycett does decide to go to Port?

Hard to know what he's worth. He'd be a good get but I'd be worried North would ask a lot due to his contract.

Absolutely.

 

[CaptainRisky]

More than happy with your take on it - I just want to see the deal done and would be willing to send a player sweetener and a ruckman ( for the record I think both Hickey and Longer should be moved on and we should be getting 1 ruckman back in - I much prefer that to be Preuss than lycett)

with regard to Newnes being a fringe player on another list - I had not really been making that point - my point was I actually think he could still be a good number 22 on our list if he improves a couple of things - because he can play front,middle back so a handy guy to have on the bench - probably makes him better than fringe if he is best 22 and the last guy on the bench every week - his position at another club should he go - is not my concern - I don't care if he is ruck rover or orange boy once he leaves (if he was to)

Yes Jack hasnt had a great year but for anyone thinking he is not best 22 you have short memories , Robert eddie , Andrew McQualter just to name a few of

The past three years his disposal count has declined (30.9 to 24.7 to 18.8) and his contested possession count has declined (13.2 to 9.8 to 6.8).

He will be 28 by the time next season starts and has started having calf injuries which is generally a sign that things are on the decline. Sure, he didn't really have a preseason and maybe he can get over his injury issues. But even if he does i just don't see him going back to the A grade star that he was 2 years ago. He will still be good but i think there is a question as to whether he will be great again. He also makes whats rumoured to be $800k a season.

That is not to say that i don't want him. We would love his leadership and he fits a hole in our list (also his salary isn't an issue for us). However, i see him more as a Bernie Vince type player who will help set the standards at training and be a leader on field. Vince was traded at a similar age for pick 23 which sounds about right to me (Vince isn't as good but he didn't have the injury issues).

Personally i don't see a scenario where our pick 3/4 is included in the deal. The top end of the draft this year is just too good and a 10 pick downgrade to 14 is substantial (even if the points difference makes it seem like it isn't). I don't know how it will get done or even if it will get done, but I would only do it for an early second round pick (which we would have to acquire from somewhere). If you guys insist on 3/4 being involved then if it was up to me i would walk away (though maybe our list management team thinks differently).

There does seem to be a bit too much smoke around this deal happening and where there is smoke there is generally fire. It sounds to me like the clubs have talked and think that they will be able to work out a deal, it will be interesting to see how it goes down.

Those stats look alarming the way they have dropped off ,

 

[Murraj1966]

Lycett more likely to go to Port

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/tr...d/news-story/931be29272b207887a07928417f3dec3

Who needs him we've got Longer

 

[The Enemy Within]

Lycett more likely to go to Port

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/tr...d/news-story/931be29272b207887a07928417f3dec3

My gut feel is he comes to us, more opportunity to be the number 1 banana that in it self will drive his decision.

 

[bird_man]

My gut feel is he comes to us, more opportunity to be the number 1 banana that in it self will drive his decision.

Not sold he will be a huge upgrade unfortunately. I just like the fact he will be free trade wise and enable us to get something for Longer or Hickey.

I think Preuss may end up being a better first ruck option, but he wouldn't be free.

 

[Saintos The ITK]

So just for an update and to make sure my Frankie Lane is Bondi Junctioning correctly.
So far we're linked to, or chasing:
Gaff
Seedsman
Hannerberry
Menzel
Goddard

I'm sure this list will grow exponentially over the coming weeks.
From memory I think last years list was 100% incorrect.

 

[saintsrfreak]

Adelaide supporters seem pretty keen to hang on to Seedsman, and whenever I've seen him over the last couple years he's looked super damaging with his kicking skills and run & carry. The knock is that he's had a few injuries over the years, but we seem pretty confident in our medical department. I'd be pretty interested for the right price. Our forwards would be licking their lips with Billings and Seedsman on the wings.

 

[TheJackal]

I was somewhat excited about the prospect of someone like Hanners. Now I am scared he will become Lids mk2 which was a massive fail for GWS.

 

[Premium]

Do we turn our interest to Preuss if Lycett does decide to go to Port?

Hard to know what he's worth. He'd be a good get but I'd be worried North would ask a lot due to his contract.

Bird if we can't get Lycett , we will have to back in Pierce and keep one of Hickey or Longer - Longer will most probably go due to he might get more value in the draft - Preuss is not a free agent and we don't have no 2nd and 3rd round draft picks so he will most probably ruled out - other clubs will value him more than us because we do have ruckmen even though they are average.
Carlton , Lions , Crows , Port , Giants would all be looking at getting a good ruckman. where we are really after a topline midfielder to improve and lead our young team - who they get will be interesting but they will be aiming at a topline player , but we will find out more when the season is complete.

You don't know who they are aiming at - Saints name has been brought up when talking about Langdon and Cerra from Fremantle and Neale is from Victoria , but I do think they will be looking anywhere even if they are not in the experienced types we are looking for.
Shuey would be ok and of course Gaff but they say we are not in with a chance with him.
Giants have Shiel , Coniglio as free agents next year as well as Kelly and Hopper coming out of contract and surely they all will not be staying due to salary cap and a few could walk for nothing.

I'm positive we will get someone who will add to our midfield / Hannebery might come but he will not be the main target

 

[gringo2011]

i disagree ... but lets see how it plays out

It makes much more sense that he'd go home to SA than to a club starting down at the bottom of the ladder. Port should start to get something from the list they have assembled next year.

 

[gringo2011]

I was somewhat excited about the prospect of someone like Hanners. Now I am scared he will become Lids mk2 which was a massive fail for GWS.

Looks more like Daisy Thomas to me. Stubbornly chasing a guy who's body looked cooked hasn't worked out so well for plenty of clubs.

 

[Rors]

LLyod is out of contract and would nearly be able to walk to Gold Coast for free in the pre-season draft, this affects his trade value. We also have players that can step into Llyod's role from defence, Mills, Jones, Florent and Allir (Once Melican is back in the side) can perform his role rebounding from defense.
Personally I think Llyod is worth a mid to late first round selection but due to his contract situation its unlikely we will get full value for him.

Hannebery is under contact for an additional 3 years, part of our leadership group and when fit is close to the most valuable player in our side simply due to we don't have many gut runners coming through our ranks (Florent probably being the closest player we have to potentially replacing him).
He is also expected to get over his current calf injury and should be able to perform a full preseason next year and as I am sure you all know when Hanners is fully fit he is a top 10 player in the competition.
I think Hannebery is worth somewhere from picks 8 to 12 due to his contract situation and his current value to our side. As St Kilda can't offer that I think the likely trade would be St Kilda's first round for Sydney's first round and Hannebery (In points value this is worth a selection from pick 15-18 and is somewhat closer to Hannebery's value).

To be honest I would rather Sydney keep Hannebery and not do this trade, I also struggle to see the value in St Kilda trading for him as they are unlikely to easily reach Sydney's valuation and Hannebery would only be valuable to your side for 3-4 years where you are unlikely to be in a premiership window (I hope I am wrong about this though).

Sydney's salary cap is no where near as dire as some agencies are reporting, this year alone we have Tippett (With only a small payment next year), Llyod (Highly likely), McVeigh (I imagine he will retire or move to a different club), Grundy and potentially Jack moving off our list, this should free up more than enough funds to disperse between the players on our list.

Equals.... clearing the decks for Tom Lynch?

 

[Rors]

I didn't say Sydney had "all this cap space", I responded to a previous comment that Sydney's cap was bursting and in dire need of a salary cap dump. It's not. The club has an interest in some other trade targets, hence if Hannebery was to leave it'd make obtaining those targets more straightforward. Hopefully that clears it up for you.

There is zero evidence that Sydney has "shopped him around". Sydney typically don't leak any trade details early. They might have given his manager their blessing to test the waters, but word from the people I know at the club is they definitely want Hannebery to stay.

Must be different people to who i know that have said that he & Buddy need to keep away from each other as they (badly) influence each other off field. This is the reason he's being shopped around

No better example than the bullshit injuries the Swans made up during rounds 6-8 to cover the internal club suspension they both received