List Mgmt. 2019/20 Trade/Delist/Re-sign Predictions/Opinion (now with TRADE RADIO)

[Jarman3]

Agree, it is a win for sure, but why do we have to pay anything, if Eddie's the one breaking the contract?

Because it's in our own best interest to do so. Sure, it would be ideal to not pay any of it, but at the end of the day it's not a huge amount in the grand scheme of things. It's not like we need to free up that $100k to help bring across a gun from some other club. We're just stocking up on draft picks.

 

[absolutezero]

Those in the know arent on here.

Or they are and aren't going to risk friendships/careers with AFC staff by posting inside information on a footy forum that will come out eventually....

 

[Mismatched]

Just looking at the picks clubs are asking for players like Howard and AhChee Papley etc, If we were to lose B Crouch it would have to be at least 2 top 1st round picks. Barret saying pick 15 is totally idiotic. I cant believe GC have not snapped Greenwood up. He is easily best 22 in that club.

I end up listening to a fair bit of Barrett and I've found his assessment of Crouch to be weird. He obviously doesn't rate Crouch, but he's not getting employed for his football nouse, its for his ability to report on the off-field aspects of football. What he'd do in most situations is assess the situation being a contracted, current best and fairest winner, Suns needing established talent now rather than later and its clear Crouches value is greater than pick 15 in this trade period, yet he's just stopping at "I wouldn't pay more than pick 15 for Crouch because I don't rate him...". Nobody care's what you'd do Damien, you're there to assess what would actually be offered/required and to provided some inside info from "sources".

 

[NikkiNoo]

I just don't get it. Player wants to break contract, choose club of his choice, go to Melbourne for family and commercial opportunity, but Crows pay part of his $$...???

WTF?

There doesn't seem to be anything in the PLayers CBA about a player breaking the contact, but in order to remove a player from your list is covered here in the CBA (page 90 - http://www.aflplayers.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/2017-2022-CBA.pdf)

17. Termination Payment
(a) An AFL Club shall be entitled to apply to the AFL to delete a Player’s name from its List and by written notice to the Player in accordance with the Player’s Standard Playing Contract, terminate the contract upon the Player being delisted. In such case, the Player’s Standard Playing Contract shall be at an end provided that the AFL Club shall pay the Player by way of compensation:
(i) the balance of the base payment payable for the year in which the Player was delisted;
(ii) Match payments calculated at the rate applicable to the relevant competition (AFL Senior or State Body equivalent) in which the Player last played, for the balance of the year in which the Player was delisted;
(iii) where the Player’s Standard Playing Contract had one or more further years to run, the base payment for each year following the year in which the Player was delisted; and
(iv) where the Player’s Standard Playing Contract had one or more further years to run, a further number of Match payments calculated at the rate applicable to the relevant competition in which the Player last played (in total not to exceed 22).

The obligation on the AFL Club to pay further base payments for the years following delisting shall apply only in the case where a delisted Player had one or more years 84 under his Standard Playing Contract to run. In all cases where a Player was delisted in the final year of his Standard Playing Contract, the Player shall be entitled to the balance of the base payment for the year in which he was delisted together with Match payments for Matches played for that year calculated at the relevant rate applicable to the competition (AFL or State Body) in which the Player last played with the AFL Club....

So this is all about delisting, but I wonder if there is something about the new club having to take on board the agreed contract during the trade exchange and if they are not doing so but creating a new contract (by the sounds of this it is a new deal with Carlton with different amount etc), then there might be something to do with some quid pro going on to make the trade exchange okay in the eyes of the AFL and the AFLPA.

 

[WeedsMullet84]

FMD, Cornes and Plough talking on Trade Radio, took a call from an Adelaide caller asking about the status of the Jacobs, Keath and Greenwood trades

Cornes answered by saying 'As far as Jacobs goes i'd say that's going to be a late pick, i would have thought the same for Greenwood...'

Plough then interjected and warned the caller to 'not really expect a whole lot from those three this trade period'

I personally had a massive go at Plough (credit to him though he does involve in twitter convo) last year for being WAY off the mark with his trade analysis, particularly involving Crows players, Kane is just predictable.

This year no different.

 

[Shaz2012]

And a really tight confidentiality agreement lol

Thar Mrs Betts has to sign as well

 

[footy4ever]

There doesn't seem to be anything in the PLayers CBA about a player breaking the contact, but in order to remove a player from your list is covered here in the CBA (page 90 - http://www.aflplayers.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/2017-2022-CBA.pdf)

17. Termination Payment
(a) An AFL Club shall be entitled to apply to the AFL to delete a Player’s name from its List and by written notice to the Player in accordance with the Player’s Standard Playing Contract, terminate the contract upon the Player being delisted. In such case, the Player’s Standard Playing Contract shall be at an end provided that the AFL Club shall pay the Player by way of compensation:
(i) the balance of the base payment payable for the year in which the Player was delisted;
(ii) Match payments calculated at the rate applicable to the relevant competition (AFL Senior or State Body equivalent) in which the Player last played, for the balance of the year in which the Player was delisted;
(iii) where the Player’s Standard Playing Contract had one or more further years to run, the base payment for each year following the year in which the Player was delisted; and
(iv) where the Player’s Standard Playing Contract had one or more further years to run, a further number of Match payments calculated at the rate applicable to the relevant competition in which the Player last played (in total not to exceed 22).

The obligation on the AFL Club to pay further base payments for the years following delisting shall apply only in the case where a delisted Player had one or more years 84 under his Standard Playing Contract to run. In all cases where a Player was delisted in the final year of his Standard Playing Contract, the Player shall be entitled to the balance of the base payment for the year in which he was delisted together with Match payments for Matches played for that year calculated at the relevant rate applicable to the competition (AFL or State Body) in which the Player last played with the AFL Club....

So this is all about delisting, but I wonder if there is something about the new club having to take on board the agreed contract during the trade exchange and if they are not doing so but creating a new contract (by the sounds of this it is a new deal with Carlton with different amount etc), then there might be something to do with some quid pro going on to make the trade exchange okay in the eyes of the AFL and the AFLPA.

As you say, it doesn't at all address the scenario of a player breaking a contract. Common sense says if you choose not to play the final year of your contract then you shouldn't in any way be paid for that year.

 

[Rise_up_Stiffy]

FMD, Cornes and Plough talking on Trade Radio, took a call from an Adelaide caller asking about the status of the Jacobs, Keath and Greenwood trades

Cornes answered by saying 'As far as Jacobs goes i'd say that's going to be a late pick, i would have thought the same for Greenwood...'

Plough then interjected and warned the caller to 'not really expect a whole lot from those three this trade period'

I personally had a massive go at Plough (credit to him though he does involve in twitter convo) last year for being WAY off the mark with his trade analysis, particularly involving Crows players, Kane is just predictable.

This year no different.

What are you expecting for Keith and Greenwood? I'm thinking a 2nd rd for Keith and a 3rd rd for Greenwood.

If we could get a pick around 25 for Keith and 35 for Greenwood I'd be pretty stoked.

We have too many deals going on and have admitted too much fault in terms of mismanaging our culture that we won't further damage our brand by drawing a line on the sand about someone like Alex Keith leaviing. The otther clubs also know this. We will do our best to strike a fair bargain, but we have to be realistic and accept we will be getting undersa for these guys.

 

[WeedsMullet84]

What are you expecting for Keith and Greenwood? I'm thinking a 2nd rd for Keith and a 3rd rd for Greenwood.

If we could get a pick around 25 for Keith and 35 for Greenwood I'd be pretty stoked.

We have too many deals going on and have admitted too much fault in terms of mismanaging our culture that we won't further damage our brand by drawing a line on the sand about someone like Alex Keith leaviing. The otther clubs also know this. We will do our best to strike a fair bargain, but we have to be realistic and accept we will be getting undersa for these guys.

Betts - 4th rounder
Keath - I also rate him around 25, but Dogs don't have a pick in that region. I still think Dogs P13 for Keath and P28 gets done, it actually values Keath around P35, which is good value for Keath, and i think this is the only way the Dogs get both Keath and Bruce trades done. They won't take Dogs P32 if they know Crows are dangling P28 in front of the Dogs.

Dogs are talking about packaging their 3 x 3rd rounders and turning them into a 2nd. We certainly don't need the picks, so we'll be looking for them to organise the pick upgrade, and it'll have to be done by Wednesday, which i don't see happening.

Greenwood i also rate in the 25-30 range, so i hope we're gunning for their P20 with a late pick going back to them

 

[Mutineer]

Betts - 4th rounder
Keath - I also rate him around 25, but Dogs don't have a pick in that region. I still think Dogs P13 for Keath and P28 gets done, it actually values Keath around P35, which is good value for Keath, and i think this is the only way the Dogs get both Keath and Bruce trades done. They won't take Dogs P32 if they know Crows are dangling P28 in front of the Dogs.

Dogs are talking about packaging their 3 x 3rd rounders and turning them into a 2nd. We certainly don't need the picks, so we'll be looking for them to organise the pick upgrade, and it'll have to be done by Wednesday, which i don't see happening.

Greenwood i also rate in the 25-30 range, so i hope we're gunning for their P20 with a late pick going back to them

Former Hawks List Manager Gary Buckenara said he expects we'll have to settle for pick 44 given Keath's only really shown anything this season.

 

[Rory Walkerfield]

Former Hawks List Manager Gary Buckenara said he expects we'll have to settle for pick 44 given Keath's only really shown anything this season.

If we dont get a top 20 pick offer for Keath, I’d up our offer to three years plus a 10% to 20% discount to what he’s been offered by the dogs and then politely suggest to him would he prefer to risk getting to the dogs in the preseason draft.

 

[Mutineer]

If we dont get a top 20 pick offer for Keath, I’d up our offer to three years plus a 10% to 20% discount to what he’s been offered by the dogs and then politely suggest to him would he prefer to risk getting to the dogs in the preseason draft.

You're in fantasy land if you think we're getting a top 20 pick for an uncontracted 28 year old player [2020 season] that only has 1 season of AFL worthy form and his injury history....sure if he was contracted we might have the bargaining power but sadly he's not.

 

[Thetrader15]

You're in fantasy land if you think we're getting a top 20 pick for an uncontracted 28 year old player [2020 season] that only has 1 season of AFL worthy form and his injury history....sure if he was contracted we might have the bargaining power but sadly he's not.

What are they paying him again?

 

[Thetrader15]

Any danger of a trade being done with us before Tuesday?

 

[Elite Crow]

You're in fantasy land if you think we're getting a top 20 pick for an uncontracted 28 year old player [2020 season] that only has 1 season of AFL worthy form and his injury history....sure if he was contracted we might have the bargaining power but sadly he's not.

Bulldogs contract reflects they rate him doesn’t it?

 

[skittlebrew]

Former Hawks List Manager Gary Buckenara said he expects we'll have to settle for pick 44 given Keath's only really shown anything this season.

We can't even get a second rounder for him?

You can't pay him bulk cash and not pony up a remotely decent pick.

 

[Mutineer]

Bulldogs contract reflects they rate him doesn’t it?

Well you better get set for a big disappointment I'm afraid....Bulldogs rating won't come into the equation unfortunately.

We. Are. Not. Getting. A. Top. 20. Pick.

Late 2nd round - 3rd would be around what I'm expecting.

 

[Mutineer]

What are they paying him again?

I don't know and neither does anyone else outside of the Dogs, Keath and his manager.

 

[Elite Crow]

Well you better get set for a big disappointment I'm afraid....Bulldogs rating won't come into the equation unfortunately.

We. Are. Not. Getting. A. Top. 20. Pick.

Late 2nd round - 3rd would be around what I'm expecting.

It has to be a pick in the 20s or they can **** off

 

[Mismatched]

If we dont get a top 20 pick offer for Keath, I’d up our offer to three years plus a 10% to 20% discount to what he’s been offered by the dogs and then politely suggest to him would he prefer to risk getting to the dogs in the preseason draft.

I do worry a little that we've misread what we'd receive at the trade table for Greenwood and Keath. Subtly pushed them out in the hope we could strengthen our draft hand, only to realise that you lose bargaining power when players are out of contract.

I can understand why they've chosen Keath and Greenwood, but I do wonder if there perhaps weren't some better options.

 

[baby back Bibs]

Wonder if Nicks has a decent relationship with Bonar. Could get him interested in coming to us rather than just Victoria. Happy to have him thrown into any pick swap.

 

[WeedsMullet84]

Well you better get set for a big disappointment I'm afraid....Bulldogs rating won't come into the equation unfortunately.

We. Are. Not. Getting. A. Top. 20. Pick.

Late 2nd round - 3rd would be around what I'm expecting.

Late 2nd/Early 3rd? You’re cooked! You’re as pessimistic as Marty


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[WeedsMullet84]

I do worry a little that we've misread what we'd receive at the trade table for Greenwood and Keath. Subtly pushed them out in the hope we could strengthen our draft hand, only to realise that you lose bargaining power when players are out of contract.

I can understand why they've chosen Keath and Greenwood, but I do wonder if there perhaps weren't some better options.

Really? Both indicated they were happy to stay in Adelaide, it was just the length of the contract that was the sticking point. I say if we can’t get a good enough trade out of the Bulldogs/GC then we throw the extra year and $$ at both of them. It’s not like we’ll need the salary cap space.

Both a cracking players, particularly Keath, and Greenwood too when he’s utilised correctly. His Champion Data numbers don’t lie.

Both Bulldogs and GC have a lot riding on both these trades, don’t forget. Bulldogs are serious contenders for a Premiership with Keath in the side, and GC desperately need to be seen to able to attract players to the club.

I have every confidence in Reid to get good selections for these guys




Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Crow till I die]

Well you better get set for a big disappointment I'm afraid....Bulldogs rating won't come into the equation unfortunately.

We. Are. Not. Getting. A. Top. 20. Pick.

Late 2nd round - 3rd would be around what I'm expecting.

The deal that anumber of dogs supporters seemed ok with when i flagged it on the drafting board early on was keath + 21 (now 23) for pick 13. Values keath towards the back of 2nd round i think. + gives the dogs pick 23 for bruce....

 

[Rory Walkerfield]

Really? Both indicated they were happy to stay in Adelaide, it was just the length of the contract that was the sticking point. I say if we can’t get a good enough trade out of the Bulldogs/GC then we throw the extra year and $$ at both of them. It’s not like we’ll need the salary cap space.

Both a cracking players, particularly Keath, and Greenwood too when he’s utilised correctly. His Champion Data numbers don’t lie.

Both Bulldogs and GC have a lot riding on both these trades, don’t forget. Bulldogs are serious contenders for a Premiership with Keath in the side, and GC desperately need to be seen to able to attract players to the club.

I have every confidence in Reid to get good selections for these guys




Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

Agree with this. I’m happy to keep both and put the extra year and $ in their contracts if a decent deal can’t be done.