2019 Trade thread

[irel]

The way this trade period is shaping, the interest in Lewy, Cuts, Robbo is minimal at best and unlikely to get us anything of value.

Nobes said we would like to take at minimum four picks in the draft. With two upgrades Hinge and BigO and three new incoming players that’s nine new spots that would need to be created on the senior list. Work the numbers guys. That means another year where there will be considerable number of de-listings. All this means the only way Lewy, Robbo and Cutler will find clubs is as cheap trades (fourth rounders) or as a de-listed free agents. Other clubs a not stupid. They can see we will need to make room. They just need to wait until the trade period is over and we will be forced to find spots to take to the draft. We have a strong hand with our picks so we will use them.

Bringing in more players just puts extra pressure on the list. Another reason why I find the Birchil signing, never mind his age, injury history etc... very puzzling. His signing means someone like Robbo has to exit to make room.

 

[T Rick]

The fact that Taylor couldn't get a game in our best performing team should tell us more than how many games he played in the previous five seasons when we were largely rubbish.

Fair point - on this basis what do you think Ah Chee is worth?

 

[Dalions]

The fact that Taylor couldn't get a game in our best performing team should tell us more than how many games he played in the previous five seasons when we were largely rubbish.

IMO Lewy has consistently shown more than AhChee and Jack Martin and could very well add a lot to another team? I think a pick in the late 30’s early 40’s is no too much to ask.

 

[jackess]

IMO Lewy has consistently shown more than AhChee and Jack Martin and could very well add a lot to another team? I think a pick in the late 30’s early 40’s is no too much to ask.

Does that pick have much value to us?

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

Fair point - on this basis what do you think Ah Chee is worth?

We seem to be committed to Ah Chee so I think we will probably pay overs for him but we need to accept that our list managers know more about this caper than we do.

 

[briztoon]

From my perspective, with our team from the season just gone, Lewy Taylor is very much in the 21 to 25 range in terms of list depth.

And that’s counting on us re-signing Bundy who is also still out of contract, and the player I view as Lewy contending with for a best 22 spot.

If we needed a wing/forward flanker he’s currently first reserve for that position.

The signing of Ah Chee might push Taylor back in to the 26 to 30 range on list depth.

But Ah Chee has yet to prove his fitnesses, and then overtake Taylor to force Taylor out of position on list depth.

Otherwise we’re counting on Cedric Cox, Tom Berry, and if we draft either or both, Keidean Coleman and Noah Cumberland for wing and forward depth.


And just on Ah Chee. He was drafted as a forward flanker and played most of career there. We might view him as a possible hbf, and Gold Coast have tried him in that position, but he has yet to prove he can play such a position effectively.

 

[BRAB]

I think at this point if interest isn't high for these players I'd be offering them 1 year contracts at lower pay and giving them a chance to boost their value in 2020 for a higher paying contract. If Taylor/Robertson/Cutler/Walker are just going to walk to other club's on really low contracts as delisted free agents I don't see how it benefits us or them for them to leave right now.

No point delisting and then bringing in younger players in the draft that might be average. I'd be combining 16 and 21 into a higher pick and then make the following three selections in the draft;
1.) Upgrade Omac 2.) Coleman 3.)High Draft pick player.

Reckon we have to keep the list changes as minimal as possible if us and the players don't benefit much from them leaving. The Birchall signing is honestly just weird given how tight we're going to be on list spots.

 

[briztoon]

Does that pick have much value to us?

That would be a question best answered by Steve Conole.

But if an early 30’s bid came in for Keidean Coleman, then yes it has value.

Or if Flynn Perez (an injured flanker who missed the whole of 2019 due to a preseason ACL with the scope to play midfield) was available at that selection, then I’d say yes as well.

 

[Dalions]

Does that pick have much value to us?

If we can do something with 16 and 21 to move up in the top ten or 12.
I think it would be of great value to have a couple of picks in the early 30’s that we may be able to package up to move into the 20’s for what may possibly only be our second pick.
It would be of better value than a pick in the 60’s, yes.

 

[M Malice]

Can anybody tell me what is the point of the rookie list*, isn't the case that rookies can play in the seniors without the need to be upgraded to the primary senior list now?

*= B grade rookie I understand the need for.

Why not just have a B grade rookies list for International/reality TV stars and that's it?

 

[Dalions]

Can anybody tell me what is the point of the rookie list*, isn't the case that rookies can play in the seniors without the need to be upgraded to the primary senior list now?

*= B grade rookie I understand the need for.

Why not just have a B grade rookies list for International/reality TV stars and that's it?

Is there some benefits with the cap?

 

[briztoon]

I think at this point if interest isn't high for these players I'd be offering them 1 year contracts at lower pay and giving them a chance to boost their value in 2020 for a higher paying contract. If Taylor/Robertson/Cutler/Walker are just going to walk to other club's on really low contracts as delisted free agents I don't see how it benefits us or them for them to leave right now.

No point delisting and then bringing in younger players in the draft that might be average. I'd be combining 16 and 21 into a higher pick and then make the following three selections in the draft;
1.) Upgrade Omac 2.) Coleman 3.)High Draft pick player.

Reckon we have to keep the list changes as minimal as possible if us and the players don't benefit much from them leaving. The Birchall signing is honestly just weird given how tight we're going to be on list spots.

One aspect I’m looking at is our Cat A rookie list is about to be cleaned out this offseason, with only Jacob Allison keeping a spot.

So we potentially have 3 rookie spots available.

I’m not sure if Eagles has to be redrafted as a Cat A rookie, or if he’ll go back on as a Cat B rookie.

I would certainly expect the club to redraft Sam Skinner, and possibly Corey Lyons in the rookie draft.

I’m not sure if we keep one spot open in the rookie draft for Noah Cumberland or not.

I do know Noble has spoken about us being keen to draft one academy player. So that might mean the club is hoping Cumberland falls through the draft and we keep him on as an U19 academy player, much like Keidean Coleman this year.

I’m not sure of the rules, but I wonder

 

[briztoon]

Can anybody tell me what is the point of the rookie list*, isn't the case that rookies can play in the seniors without the need to be upgraded to the primary senior list now?

*= B grade rookie I understand the need for.

Why not just have a B grade rookies list for International/reality TV stars and that's it?

I agree, expand the playing list to 44 and increase the tpp accordingly.

Is there some benefits with the cap?

Sort of. My understanding is that if a contracted player is moved on to the rookie list, then the equivalent value of a rookie contract portion of their contract does not count towards the tpp.

 

[irel]

I think at this point if interest isn't high for these players I'd be offering them 1 year contracts at lower pay and giving them a chance to boost their value in 2020 for a higher paying contract. If Taylor/Robertson/Cutler/Walker are just going to walk to other club's on really low contracts as delisted free agents I don't see how it benefits us or them for them to leave right now.

No point delisting and then bringing in younger players in the draft that might be average. I'd be combining 16 and 21 into a higher pick and then make the following three selections in the draft;
1.) Upgrade Omac 2.) Coleman 3.)High Draft pick player.

Reckon we have to keep the list changes as minimal as possible if us and the players don't benefit much from them leaving. The Birchall signing is honestly just weird given how tight we're going to be on list spots.

I tend to agree with you on your view as to what we do in the draft.

I am also concerned that we have been a very unstable club with continuous years of significant number of player turnover of our list. In the year we played finals, reached top two position, when just about everyone on our list performed at a very high standard and we have been told everyone on the list has bought in to the club culture we are still intending to disrupt and show very little loyalty and continue with our significant list turnover. I believe it is now we should start on the road of stability and have absolutely minimum list turnover. Bringing in three players irrespective of the fact they cost us nothing is one too many in my view.

Stability also contributes to a great culture. Let’s not eff it up because we are in love with trading and drafting.

 

[M Malice]

Ben Keays + pick 52 or 34 to the Suns for Callum Ah Chee?

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

Regardless of what they say publicly I think the Suns are feeling burnt by the Lyons saga last season and will hold firm on Ah Chee meaning pick 34 may not be enough. Whether we give them more will partly depend on whether we are successful in trading up from 16/21 onto the top 12. If we aren't then they may get pick 21 or our 2020 second rounder. I doubt they are interested in any of our players right now.

 

[M Malice]

I wonder if one of the clubs with a selection in the top 5-6 would be interested in 16, 21 and our 1st next year (likely 18) for it? Maybe they back us to fall down the ladder.

Demons 3, Crows 4, Swans 5. = one of Lachlan Ash, Sam Flanders, Hayden Young, Caleb Serong.

 

[iBeng]

So whats stopping players, at the end of their contract, and then not being able to get traded, simply waiting to be delisted then walk as a delisted free agent? Do they not get delisted until after that period for delisted free agents?

 

[Fagenslions36]

Can anyone tell me how young madden from Ireland went this year. Heard huge wraps on him and how we won his signature over a lot of other clubs . Heard he was the quickest player to ever test over the 20m
Sprint . Is he any chance soon or does he look completely lost when playing NEAFL ? Is he a chance of being that line breaking half back we seem to be searching for ?

 

[M Malice]

Can anyone tell me how young madden from Ireland went this year. Heard huge wraps on him and how we won his signature over a lot of other clubs . Heard he was the quickest player to ever test over the 20m
Sprint . Is he any chance soon or does he look completely lost when playing NEAFL ? Is he a chance of being that line breaking half back we seem to be searching for ?

From my viewing of the NEAFL this year he certainly showed some good glimpses, I recall a few times he showed that he can transfer that elite track speed onto the field and is also pretty good by foot and hand for someone brand new to the game and looks like he is OK with the physicality of our game, as a comparison I think he has shown more on field and potential wise than Cian Hanley did in 3 seasons at the club... IMO.

 

[dlanod]

So whats stopping players, at the end of their contract, and then not being able to get traded, simply waiting to be delisted then walk as a delisted free agent? Do they not get delisted until after that period for delisted free agents?

If they have a contract offer they don't become delisted free agents.

 

[Berrygood]

I be sad if Taylor goes as well. We had few injuries last year we went back to known players.
Only Hinge and Answerth debut..
Some guys now in 2020 2-4 years in the system with few games. They either push for selection or end 2020 could be out.
No injuries does not help people getting a game earlier then what they should.
Sometimes thrown in is what will do it Answerth did extremely well with his chance

2016 Draft: Cox, Alison and C Lyons.. Rookie: Hinge
2017 Draft: Wooler, Ballenden, Payne and Starcevich
2018 Draft: T Berry, E Smith, Joyce, McFayden Rookie:Fullarton, Madden

Of that list i think Cox and C Lyons can make it to play a role in the best 22 over the next few yrs, but they have to have a big year next yr. Early back to training and a big preseason especially for cox. A bit more agility and stamina, get his head into it and he could have a breakout season. Hinge , i think, at best can be a reliable depth player, like lester has been. Unconvinced with Alison.

From the 2017 class, Payne and Starcevich definate 100+ gamers, and should be right in there pushing for games in the firsts next year. Payne i hope plays many many more. Wooller and ballenden we will know more about when their bodies fill out and they work out how to use it. Tough positions to break into but have a cpl of years to grow and develop.

The 2018 lads can be anything, a very encouraging group i think. Im glad they just played neafl this year, sadly most i think missed the gf, but they have felt a successful year in the neafl, seen a successful year in the firsts and seen the opportunity taken by answerth. They should come back early, enthusiastic and bust a gut in preseason. No better time to be a young bloke at a club.

Makes the loss of basti, taylor, n robbo, cutler and whomever else, a bit easier knowing these are the players coming thru.

 

[iBeng]

If they have a contract offer they don't become delisted free agents.

Ah, that makes sense, so they refuse the contract but then have to go to the draft?

 

[dlanod]

Ah, that makes sense, so they refuse the contract but then have to go to the draft?

Yep.

 

[brutus76]

Lions should offer Carlton 16 and 21 for 9 and 43

Carlton use 16 (plus something else) for Papley, 21 for Jack Martin

34 would be enough for Ah Chee

Cutler+55 for pick 31

Lions have 9,31,43,52,64 and would obv get something for Lewy too