2019 "World" Cup Shamblefier - Scotland robbed again, no Associates at World Cup for first time ever

[The Speaker]

It’s one day cricket. Clearly I’d be f***ing disappointed if they missed it but if I have a choice between building a semi-competitive Test unit, which they are, and having a terrible odi unit, compared with having a shit test side with no hope and a decent odi outfit, I know what I’d choose.

They're walking pretty close to having neither. Barbados would put up just as much fight, possibly even more.

 

[PhatBoy]

They're walking pretty close to having neither. Barbados would put up just as much fight, possibly even more.

In recent times in test cricket they’ve: beaten Pakistan in the UAE
Beaten Pakistan in the West Indies
Beaten England in England
Won a series in Zimbabwe (not a great effort but they did have their strongest side in years

They copped it in NZ but that doesn’t undo what came before it. Any way you choose to shape it, their test side IS getting better.

 

[The Speaker]

In recent times in test cricket they’ve: beaten Pakistan in the UAE
Beaten Pakistan in the West Indies
Beaten England in England
Won a series in Zimbabwe (not a great effort but they did have their strongest side in years

They copped it in NZ but that doesn’t undo what came before it. Any way you choose to shape it, their test side IS getting better.

It's not like they're untalented. It's the fact that their talent is so mismanaged that will be their undoing.

Their best performance of the year came when they had just been absolutely smashed, and they had something to prove to the world.
They lost a series to Pakistan at home for the first time ever.
Their sole series win came against a country that can't afford to host Test matches any more.

Given most of their side is Bajan, it would probably be to their benefit if they could just play as Barbados. They would feel a greater sense of unity, and they wouldn't have to deal with the WICB.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

If they miss out it may mean the end of the Windies and the confirmation that they need to expand the WC in 2023.

Agreed. Some of the larger nations in the West Indies might figure they can make more money qualifying solo for World T20, if there isn't any World Cup money. Although with Australia hosting, we'll no doubt push for it the T20s to have only 6 teams or something.

edit: Yeah, the ICC has said there will be more teams in the T20 comp (as if that won't just force teams to focus on the T20 game) but CA will be pushing on behalf of broadcasters for that not to happen when we host.

 

[The Speaker]

Updated with Ireland and West Indies squads.

Gayle is playing, but Darren Bravo, Pollard, Russell and Narine all opted to play in the Pakistan Super League instead.

 

[Cochblocked]

I would also like to see a proper World Cup Qualification tournament open to all nations similar to Soccer. There is no reason why this couldn't at least be tested with the T20 format? There are probably enough nations playing this version of cricket that it could be viable.

I think this is what they will be doing for t20s after the next one. It makes sense for Asia (India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Afghanistan, UAE, Hong Kong,Oman,Nepal) playing regional qualifiers. Europe kinda works (England, Scotland, Netherlands, Ireland) Africa to some extent (South Africa, Zimbabwe, Kenya, Namibia) then it drops off. Oceania: (Australia, NZ, PNG) Americas: (West Indies, Canada). There isn't enough T20Is played to do it by ranking so it's difficult to predict.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

Ideally all nations would have to qualify for the world cup. Home and away qualifiers between nations would actually become big events - part of the World Cup Show - like the Socceroos matches.

The game can't afford India, Australia or England to miss out though which leads to this compromised situation.

They sort of do, but not the same way with everyone starting on zero points and going through every stage of qualifying (for their continent).
The full members need to reach a certain ranking to auto-qualify. Everyone else can earn a spot in qualifiers by climbing through the World Cricket League division structure. Within the cycle it is possible, if a team were good enough, to go from division six to the top of the WCL.

I'd like to see 14 or 16 teams in the WC, with maybe only four to six auto-qualified spots.

 

[The Speaker]

They sort of do, but not the same way with everyone starting on zero points and going through every stage of qualifying (for their continent).
The full members need to reach a certain ranking to auto-qualify. Everyone else can earn a spot in qualifiers by climbing through the World Cricket League division structure. Within the cycle it is possible, if a team were good enough, to go from division six to the top of the WCL.

I'd like to see 14 or 16 teams in the WC, with maybe only four to six auto-qualified spots.

I'd go with 20, ala rugby union. The two sports have a lot in common with regards to their position in the world.

 

[Marklar_33]

I think this is what they will be doing for t20s after the next one. It makes sense for Asia (India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Afghanistan, UAE, Hong Kong,Oman,Nepal) playing regional qualifiers. Europe kinda works (England, Scotland, Netherlands, Ireland) Africa to some extent (South Africa, Zimbabwe, Kenya, Namibia) then it drops off. Oceania: (Australia, NZ, PNG) Americas: (West Indies, Canada). There isn't enough T20Is played to do it by ranking so it's difficult to predict.

I think it works if Oceania and the America’s form one group for qualification

Aus, NZ, WI, USA, Canada, PNG, Bermuda, Suriname, Fiji etc

Asia is obviously a big group

India, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, Afghanistan, Nepal, Hong Kong, Oman, UAE

Africa has

South Africa, Zimbabwe, Kenya, Namibia, Uganda...yeah that drops away quick. Maybe the Persian teams qualify through here...?

Europe

England, Ireland, Scotland, Netherlands, Jersey, Guernsey


Can’t see it happening just looking at that, only up to a certain point which is where we are with the WCL anyway

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

I'd go with 20, ala rugby union. The two sports have a lot in common with regards to their position in the world.

Also reasonable. 14 is perhaps too few now there are 12 Test nations.
2019 may be the first WC not to feature a non-Test nation.

1975 : Sri Lanka were not then a Test nation, East Africa (which included future stand-alone nation Kenya)
1979 : Sri Lanka still not a Test nation, Canada
1983 : Zimbabwe were not yet a Test nation
1987 : Zimbabwe were not yet a Test nation
1992 : Zimbabwe were a few months away from becoming a Test nation (not surprising the one in Australia had the least non-full members)
1996 : Kenya, Netherands, United Arab Emirates
1999 : Bangladesh were yet to be rushed into Test status, Kenya, Scotland
2003 : Kenya made the semis, Canada, Namibia, Netherlands
2007 : Bermuda, Canada, Ireland made the super-eight, Kenya, Netherlands, Scotland (16 teams)
2011 : Canada, Ireland, Kenya, Netherlands
2015 : Afghanistan, Ireland, Scotland, United Arab Emirates (CA lobbied to have less teams, started lobbying too late)
2019 : Not even all full members qualify, yet to see if an Associate will

 

[The Speaker]

I'd go with 20, ala rugby union. The two sports have a lot in common with regards to their position in the world.

Such a tournament would include all the teams at this qualifier, plus two more.

So the groups would look something like

New Zealand  England            India        South Africa
Pakistan     Australia          Bangladesh   Sri Lanka
Ireland      Zimbabwe           West Indies  Afghanistan
Hong Kong    Papua New Guinea   Scotland     Netherlands
Kenya        Namibia            Oman         Canada

Top two in each group go through to quarter finals. That would be an genuinely interesting tournament.

 

[The Speaker]

I might even simulate my own tournament based on the above scenario. Seems like a bit of fun.

 

[Rob]

Well, let’s hope the Windies manage to get rolled in this tournament (sorry PhatBoy). I’m a massive advocate of associates in World tournaments, although if the West Indies do miss out, this may be the last WCQ we see

Yeah that's what i'm thinking. There'd be a bit of press if the Windies don't qualify because they got rolled by Ireland in the last over or something like that. And they are well and truly capable of doing that.

Aren't they the current T20 world champions?

 

[Cochblocked]

I think it works if Oceania and the America’s form one group for qualification

Aus, NZ, WI, USA, Canada, PNG, Bermuda, Suriname, Fiji etc

Asia is obviously a big group

India, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, Afghanistan, Nepal, Hong Kong, Oman, UAE

Africa has

South Africa, Zimbabwe, Kenya, Namibia, Uganda...yeah that drops away quick. Maybe the Persian teams qualify through here...?

Europe

England, Ireland, Scotland, Netherlands, Jersey, Guernsey


Can’t see it happening just looking at that, only up to a certain point which is where we are with the WCL anyway

Yeah it does drop off. I know Australia and NZ have been keen to help PNG same with West Indies and USA so it's not entirely unreasonable that they could play qualifers against them.

 

[Marklar_33]

Yeah it does drop off. I know Australia and NZ have been keen to help PNG same with West Indies and USA so it's not entirely unreasonable that they could play qualifers against them.

You know, I’d love to see PNG included in the Domestic One Day tournament to give them a leg up

I’d also like to see them in the Futures League, but that’s probably a cost too far

 

[Gough]

You know, I’d love to see PNG included in the Domestic One Day tournament to give them a leg up

I’d also like to see them in the Futures League, but that’s probably a cost too far

PNG field a team West End Redbacks League.

 

[Marklar_33]

PNG field a team West End Redbacks League.

I knew, then forgot that!

Do they compete well?

 

[ioppolo]

Updated with Ireland and West Indies squads.

Gayle is playing, but Darren Bravo, Pollard, Russell and Narine all opted to play in the Pakistan Super League instead.

Windies are better off in the long run not playing blokes like Russell and Pollard. Pollard IMO is excruciatingly average if his slogging doesn't come off.

 

[The Speaker]

Updated with the Dutch squad. Michael Rippon's unavailability is a big blow for their chances.

 

[Marklar_33]

Updated with the Dutch squad. Michael Rippon's unavailability is a big blow for their chances.

That does hurt. What’s his story?

 

[The Speaker]

That does hurt. What’s his story?

He and Logan van Beek will be playing in the Plunkett Shield at the time.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

I knew, then forgot that!

Do they compete well?

Yeah they're competitive. Win a few games here and there.

Have mostly spinners and all their batsmen slog. Good fielders. Better suited to T20

 

[ioppolo]

Yeah they're competitive. Win a few games here and there.

Have mostly spinners and all their batsmen slog. Good fielders. Better suited to T20

They played some one dayers against Hong Kong last year and did well from memory, one of their blokes scored a well paced century

 

[The Speaker]

Updated with the Scottish squad. They won the last Qualifier, but about half their squad did not play at the 2015 World Cup, and last time they didn't have to face the West Indies, Zimbabwe, Ireland or Afghanistan.

 

[Harlequin Dream]

Updated with the Scottish squad. They won the last Qualifier, but about half their squad did not play at the 2015 World Cup, and last time they didn't have to face the West Indies, Zimbabwe, Ireland or Afghanistan.

It will be hard for them.

I honestly think they are trying to rebuild. The majority of their squad are 25 or younger.

This is really a period of development for Scotland and this tournament will serve them well even if they don't qualify.