List Mgmt. 2020 Trade Watch

[JasRulz63]

Current no. of players on the list
Senior list - 34 (2-4 free*)
Rookie (Cat A) - 4 (0-2 free*)
Rookie (Cat B) - 2 (0 free)
Maximum list size of 44. Up to 36-38 senior list, 4-6 category A rookie list and 2 category B rookie list.
* Total of four list spots available, with a minimum of 2 senior list spots needing to be utilised.

List changes
IN: Daniher, Cockatoo, Uosis (R)
OUT: Christensen, Wooller, Allison (R), Skinner (R), Eagles (R), C. Lyons (R), Martin, Witherden, Cox, Hinge.
PROMOTED: Fullarton.
ROOKIED: Birchall, Mathieson, Ballendan.

Current picks
25, 53, 58, 69, 70
(2021 - 1st (MEL), 1st, 3rd (WCE), 3rd, 4th (MEL), 4th (COLL), 5th)

Spoiler: 2020 draft order

Useful links
2020 trade news compendium
List changes, contract status and key dates
2020 draft discussion thread

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

Strongly disagree. I have no doubt Witho will be a good footballer given time and experience. It will be Brisbane's loss should he depart the club.

A loss in isolation that can be turned into a gain if used judiciously. You have to give some value to receive it. I trust the club to do that.

 

[Nuggo]

He played with hodge. Gotta think hodge is at least as good as birch as a learning opportunity.

I know Birchall is different type of player then hodge, but I think hodge is able to teach any defensive role, and probably every forward role. So footy smart.

Hodge would have started the process, no doubt. Potential is a dirty word, perhaps he won't make it to the top of hill. Time will tell as usual.

 

[X AE A12]

I reckon we can be too harsh on some of the group re turnovers and decision making, hell Neale has had lapses and coughed up the ball several times this year. I see Witherden playing Birchalls role really well when he moves on, can hopefully emulate the game sense that posters have been commending Birchall on, taking the ball over, short pinpointed passes out of congestion in defense, long clearing kicks to the fat side or corridor, and defensive 50 stoppage pressure. He will add more than we lose by his inability to go back when we are being rebounded on

 

[briztoon]

Had some family issues last year which interrupted his season.
Not seen the magoos this year, we traded Coleman in who played 2 years for us NEAFL who I assume went past him.
Lack of seeing the non 22 play makes things really hard to judge this year.

Coleman came through our academy. Wasn’t a trade in. Didn’t get drafted in his 18th year. Came back as an overage academy player, played in the NEAFL and trained with the senior team his 19th year and was drafted on the back of his improvement.

 

[Mighty Lions]

Curious as to what other role you think he might be able to play? He isn't suited to the lockdown defender role (lacking pace and strength to impact the contest), and in my opinion could not play on a wing or high half forward given he doesn't have the aerobic capacity to work both ways. Do not get me wrong, Witherden is AFL standard, and he might go on to fill a need at another club that requires a distributor, but he is replaceable given who we have on our list.

Additionally, I thought there were a couple of players that clearly struggled to adjust to the pace in last year's finals series which highlighted some deficiencies they had to work on. It might be harsh but I thought Bailey was one of them. However, he obviously worked hard over the summer on clean hands and knowing when to back his pace in and is now thriving. Witherden was exposed (quite publicly as it turned out) for his lack of pace and aerobic fitness and his decision-making under pressure (including when to impact the contest and when not to). 12 months on, from the games he played this year, I don't think he has addressed any of these sufficiently to warrant a spot in a team that is about to play in a prelim.

Having said all of that I agree with Nuggo's point that it would be good to see what he has learnt from Birchall before we move him out, and to give him one more pre season to see how hungry he is to work on his game, his fitness and ultimately win his spot back in the team.

Mate he's 22 years old and has already reached "AFL Standard". He will only improve as he develops & gets more experience/games under his belt. His one so called "bad decision" has not been let go by his knockers but the club has certainly moved on and consider Alex as part of the future of the club. Birchall isnt a teacher.... never will be. He's there short term to help and is by no means a mentor.

 

[John_Proctor]

IMO Witherden is unlucky in our team make up. Hi lack of pace limits him to filling 1 or 2 spots available in the team.

We have Rich and Birchall ahead of him in the "slowish," ball using, smaller defenders which is the position Witherden would play. We can't play 3 "slowish" not lockdown defenders. (noting that we did that last year with Hodge (zone defender and often played on taller oppoenents), Rich and Witherden)

Starcevich is more or the lock down defender with some run and some ability to play on taller players, Ah Chee has played as a bit of a running defender at times this year (as Bailey did last year). Lester is able to play as 2nd/3rd tall freeing up Gardiner to play a lock down role on the dangerous forward (whether small or tall).

Overall think Witherden would be first 22 at just about every other team. I'm sure there are other teams with similar types maybe not West Coast with Hurn and Sheppard.

wouldn't begrudge him asking for a trade this year but would be great to keep him both as squad depth and also ready to step in for Birchall when he retires.

 

[haystark]

Sam Edmund reporting there are whispers about DSmith, Stringer and Tippa exploring their options.

 

[Nunez]

Mate he's 22 years old and has already reached "AFL Standard". He will only improve as he develops & gets more experience/games under his belt. His one so called "bad decision" has not been let go by his knockers but the club has certainly moved on and consider Alex as part of the future of the club. Birchall isnt a teacher.... never will be. He's there short term to help and is by no means a mentor.

What roles do you see him playing at AFL level though? I'm no expert but the only role he seems to fit is the Distribution role off the half back. I think that's what's keeping him out of the team more than anything. Witherden with confidence is best 22 off the half back, but while we're playing Birchall where else would he play?

 

[SizeMatters]

Witherden is a limited athlete, but his weapon (kicking) is very good. Unfortunately for him though, he can play one role and one role only - Birchalls distribution role. If we did trade him I'd be okay with that, but would rather keep him as I can see him playing Birchalls role in 2021. He wasn't afforded the luxury of a run of games when low on confidence as Ah Chee and Rayner were, and think he needs a big off season and a run of games to find his best form.

Sorry but in what world is Withers kicking very good? His kicks are the most overrated thing spoken about on this board. Can anyone find me vision of his very good kicking? Please? Anyone? Just because he tries to take riskier kicks doesn't mean his kicking is very good. Just means he likes to take risks. If I were him I'd be looking for opportunities elsewhere. IMO

Other than that I agree.

 

[WhiteLionFeva]

Sam Edmund reporting there are whispers about DSmith, Stringer and Tippa exploring their options.

All contracted, Tippa until 2022. Little chance he will be let go, or Smith. Stringer, not so sure.

 

[briztoon]

Witho going would be a net loss regardless imo. We have put heaps of effort into him because we know his potential. Are Prior or Smith able to come in if Birchall breaks down

Smith is something between Lester and Gardiner, with a bit of MRobbo niggle mixed in.

Prior potentially is a Birchall replacement with speed. Needs to work on his his defensive game.

 

[X AE A12]

Smith is something between Lester and Gardiner, with a bit of MRobbo niggle mixed in.

Prior potentially is a Birchall replacement with speed. Needs to work on his his defensive game.

Yeah I figured maybe not like for like but all within 1cm of each other so figured smith not really taking Payne out. Come to think of it they each bring something which could be an asset to the list if we can keep them as it would allow us to play a more offensive or defensive type depending on opponent. I watched the prior draft stuff again recently and understand his defensive side was known issue but great attitude I expect big things

 

[Scubaveg]

Where’s Cedric Cox at? I see he’s OOC and didn’t get much game time this season (if at all?) I liked him in his draft year but haven’t followed his career since. What’s the knock on him?

Hope you guys don’t mind the intrusion.

Where he at? On his way out the door.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[3KZ is Football]

Sorry but in what world is Withers kicking very good? His kicks are the most overrated thing spoken about on this board. Can anyone find me vision of his very good kicking? Please? Anyone? Just because he tries to take riskier kicks doesn't mean his kicking is very good. Just means he likes to take risks. If I were him I'd be looking for opportunities elsewhere. IMO

Other than that I agree.

Lester, Rich and Birchall are all superior when it comes to transition kicking out of defence.

 

[pod17]

He played with hodge. Gotta think hodge is at least as good as birch as a learning opportunity.

I know Birchall is different type of player then hodge, but I think hodge is able to teach any defensive role, and probably every forward role. So footy smart.

True - though I have heard some commentators talk about the difference between Hodge and Birchall specifically.

Mate he's 22 years old and has already reached "AFL Standard". He will only improve as he develops & gets more experience/games under his belt. His one so called "bad decision" has not been let go by his knockers but the club has certainly moved on and consider Alex as part of the future of the club. Birchall isnt a teacher.... never will be. He's there short term to help and is by no means a mentor.

No, I definitely agree he can play at the level. But I would argue there has been only slight improvement in his game since debut, and that his deficiencies mean he can't play anywhere outside of the half back where there are a number of others ahead of him.

I am not referring to the Daniels incident, more other issues throughout the year where he didn't take the first option under some pressure. Not impacting the contest is also pretty glaring, whereas someone like Starcevich not only knows when to go and when not to, he uses his pace and engine to create play further up the ground.

Birchall may not be an instructor like Hodge, but you can learn from his on-field decision making. Watching someone up close might benefit him, it might not.

I wouldn't lose much sleep over Witherden being traded to relieve cap space and fill greater needs on our list.

 

[Nuggo]

Birch has won four flags, surely he has something to offer/pass on. Even M.Pike went on to coaching at the lower levels.

 

[MacMum]

Who if anyone, do we have earmarked to take over Rich's role when he retires? God forbid that day.

 

[Nunez]

Who if anyone, do we have earmarked to take over Rich's role when he retires? God forbid that day.

Rich has got a good few years left in him. Reckon he's the type of player who'll play at a high standard until he hangs up the boots.

 

[Fagenslions36]

He doesn’t rely on pace for his game and with his leg it gives him a big advantage as he won’t lose that .

 

[M Malice]

I don't buy the narrative from some on our board that Daniel Rich is slow, very rarely gets shown up for a lack of pace, granted Shai Bolton ran away from him in one contest in the QF but he is one of the fastest players in the game, I actually think he has good closing speed.

 

[SizeMatters]

I don't buy the narrative from some on our board that Daniel Rich is slow, very rarely gets shown up for a lack of pace, granted Shai Bolton ran away from him in one contest in the QF but he is one of the fastest players in the game, I actually think he has good closing speed.

Hodge like. Not overly quick but works the angles to perfection. Boxed Bolton in on boundary and had to rely on a miracle goal. Good effort from Bolton though.

 

[davemc_lions]

Coleman came through our academy. Wasn’t a trade in. Didn’t get drafted in his 18th year. Came back as an overage academy player, played in the NEAFL and trained with the senior team his 19th year and was drafted on the back of his improvement.

Sorry should off used drafted.

 

[Bobby Beecroft]

Lester, Rich and Birchall are all superior when it comes to transition kicking out of defence.

I know you are Ryan’s No 1 fan, but I can’t have he is a better kick than Witho. If Ryan kicks to his limitations he is fine.

Exhibit A - the 45 degree kick to Zorko that have away the Richmond 2nd goal last Friday. Commentators gave Dayne a bad wrap - the kick was horrendous & shouldn’t have been attempted.

I agree Withos kicking can be overrated, but I would much prefer him to be taking a risk than Ryan in this skill. Having a great year though Ryan, & well done KZ for sticking fat.

 

[SizeMatters]

Lester, Rich and Birchall are all superior when it comes to transition kicking out of defence.

Yeah and why they are best 22. I see witherden and answerth competing for birchsll role once he is moved on. While answerth has shit disposal I feel he takes less unnecessary risks with it but provides much more athletically than poor old withers. If witherden builds his body better he would be a nice replacement when the great frog retires.

 

[Ironmonger]

The changes to the kick-in rule limited Witherden's usefulness. He is particularly good at controlling his kick-ins when he has a limited amount of space, and a large amount of time. Now full-backs have more space to work in it doesn't matter so much.