We front loaded all the contracts signed around the time Hamling signed his according ti media reports. I'd be very surprised if we couldn't pay out his 2022 contract this year to be honest. I'm basing that on how we had enough space to sign Cerra and we didn't end up doing that. Bringing Clark and Brodie would be on less than that remembering somehow Belly got Gold Coast to pay $200,000 of Will 2022 salary in the deal of the century.
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List Mgmt. 2022 List Management: Draft, Trade and FA
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All true, most people here would gladly take pick 3 for pick 15 and 16 but not everyone here would use pick 3 on Jackson. A bona fide star natural key forward to soon cover for Tabs would be just as useful or a 200cm + key defender to replace Alex Pearce should one of his ankles flop over, would be more important.
If we wanted to play two rucks off the bench we have Meek anyway and could already be doing it.
We are only structured the way we are, ie with our second ruck as our main key forward because we have a very unusual player in Lobb. If he goes, we change the structure, we dont try to shoehorn Jackson into becoming another Lobb. If Lobb goes I would hope we go back to a more traditional setup of two key forwards, neither of whom help out in the ruck.
Im not saying Jackson might not work out as a second ruck off the bench, its just that I wouldnt sell the farm to get him and certainly wouldnt alienate the rest of the young crew with some ridiculous payment. I fully expect that what Freo should offer, wouldnt get it done. Cest la vie.
My assumption would be that any leftover cash would have been used to shift some players money forward already this year
Any KPF you take at Pick 3 isn't playing for 3 years, same probably goes for a KPD. They might actually play but their impact is minimal.
Jackson is ready to go.
You don’t need a backup ruck these days, teams are having great success with midfielders and third talls like Finlayson who can actually move and impact the contest, winning the tap is overrated
Jackson impacts the contest more than Finlayson or most third talls. His agility on the ground is one of his strengths. This helps in the forwardline too as he tackles more than Lobb does.
He’s not going to be a 100% like for like swap with Lobb but he has some very unique weapons, scope for improvement & youth on his side. I back our coaches in to develop and utilise these strengths to help us win a lot of games.
Taylor
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I think if we had two Sean Darcys we would play both of them with one of them starting as a marking forward target because we would have the luxury of three of the top five ruckmen in the league - which is the reason I think teams opt for a smaller player as their second ruck.
They don't have a second good one. There might be 15 good rucks in the whole league.
They don't have a second good one. There might be 15 good rucks in the whole league.
Personally I think second ruck is a position that can be used to create advantages and exploit opposition weakness.
We have a number of second ruck strategies we could pursue.
I want Jackson but my walk away price is probably unrealistically low. But if it was in the order of 1st round + want-away Lobb I'm all in. That trade provides the bulk of his salary and we won't miss the draft pick. Potentially Meek could also be used in a trade. Well below what Melbourne would look for.
We have a number of second ruck strategies we could pursue.
- persuade Lobb his home is Fremantle for life. 3-4 good seasons from a player already in the squad surely is the best option? We do have Benning in development.
- go hard at Jackson. He is clearly an outstanding talent but also has question marks over his forward abilities. His salary and trade price may have negative impacts across the squad.
- Meek is clearly emerging as a decent ruck and may be able to form a 2 prong ruck combo with Darcy, with a question mark over their contribution to the forward line.
- an alternative should we lose Lobb that I would like to see is utilising Logue and Treacy in the ruck. They have the physicality to compete, and even in a losing ruck battle could impact through their second efforts. Gives some potential to give Darcy some relief by having them take some ruck contests in the forward and defensive zones.
I want Jackson but my walk away price is probably unrealistically low. But if it was in the order of 1st round + want-away Lobb I'm all in. That trade provides the bulk of his salary and we won't miss the draft pick. Potentially Meek could also be used in a trade. Well below what Melbourne would look for.
I’m agree with all your points except for the price. I’d pay next years first on top of Lobb & this years. In my optimistic mind, this years is 18 though.
We can’t keep Lobb & get Jackson. It’s either one or the other so if Lobb stays I think we’re out of the race.
I do laugh at some posters thinking Lobb’s 2022 is now his base level for the rest of his career. He’s got some big motivation to drive him so it might not last, just as Jackson’s dip could be homesickness. They are both similar risks on future output.
Snuffaluphagus
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I think yours is closer, but with something back. Assuming Lobb is still leaving I think we could upgrade our first with Saints or Dogs and get something else back late. Trade two firsts to Melbourne with a second back
Just spitballing numbers without ladder order but;
10, 40 -> Lobb, 18
Jackson, 34 -> 10, future 1st
Net: Jackson, 34, 40 -> Lobb, 18, 18
That would be my rough guess in the case Melbourne don’t want Lobb
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Taylor
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This is why I want Jackson to be unsure about his intentions until after the contracted required player Lobb has been traded for a top twenty pick meanwhile West Coast will be implicated in an attempt to steal him for free in the PSD.
Then we will have let's say pick #16, #18 and can offer that for Jackson. They'll be upset with it, but are we supposed to pay Tim Kelly trade price for him? If the Dogs do pinch Logue then I'd try and use one of those firsts to upgrade to their top ten pick and then offer that too so it's #9 and #18 for Jackson which is still just picks for a player.
But it's cost us two best twenty two players and our first round pick.
Our first this year and next I'm happy with, happier than trading out Lobb and Logue along with it. Expecting to lose Lobb anyway but I'd rather we see the draft capital from that ourselves.
Perhaps:
Lobb to North for Zurhaar and their 2023 2nd.
Then we will have let's say pick #16, #18 and can offer that for Jackson. They'll be upset with it, but are we supposed to pay Tim Kelly trade price for him? If the Dogs do pinch Logue then I'd try and use one of those firsts to upgrade to their top ten pick and then offer that too so it's #9 and #18 for Jackson which is still just picks for a player.
But it's cost us two best twenty two players and our first round pick.
Our first this year and next I'm happy with, happier than trading out Lobb and Logue along with it. Expecting to lose Lobb anyway but I'd rather we see the draft capital from that ourselves.
Perhaps:
Lobb to North for Zurhaar and their 2023 2nd.
Pathetic article by Braden in today's toilet paper.
Basically saying that Ross avoided the rebuild, and that our picks were squalored during that period.
No mention of Luke Ryan, picked out from the carcass of the draft, and became an All Australian, Darcy etc etc.
Ended up saying that his team (vomit inducing Toast) would never have the patience of a Freo rebuild.
Can't believe he gets paid for finger nail deep analysis
Basically saying that Ross avoided the rebuild, and that our picks were squalored during that period.
No mention of Luke Ryan, picked out from the carcass of the draft, and became an All Australian, Darcy etc etc.
Ended up saying that his team (vomit inducing Toast) would never have the patience of a Freo rebuild.
Can't believe he gets paid for finger nail deep analysis
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Now do hitouts to advantage % in grand finals….
Dayts
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He’s only 20. He will get better without doubt.
Was thinking that say we don’t go after Jackson. I’d be all for trading our first or “firsts” for a ready made player.
We’re ready to contend now, we don’t need more guys developing in the 2s.
I just don’t see a better or likely option than Jackson, or maybe anGus.
In saying that, If we did trade the firsts away we should try get back into the second round to get a KPD.
Luke Jackson's situation looks very similar to Jake Lever's in 2017. Uncontracted tall first round draft pick that was an important part of a grand final team wants to go home after 3 seasons. The Dees ended up trading pick 10, future 1st, future 4th for Lever, pick 35 and Adelaide's future 3rd. Leading up to that season the Dees had finished 17th (2 wins), 13th (7 wins), 11th (10 wins), and 9th (12 wins missing finals by 0.5%). Their future first was probably expected to be around pick 12. So expected value might've been 10, 12, 66 for Lever, 35, and 53. Valuing Lever at roughly 2,000 points or pick 4.
King Huskii
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And some people think we should hand over this and next year's first pick plus Lobb.
Lobb alone is playing better than him currently
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Good post.
I was thinking the same and your point 2 is my concern also re group dynamics.
Anyone got the article text?
Think it's fair to say that we all knew Sumich's comments re the amount Freo were offering was utter BS.
Melbourne ruckman Luke Jackson’s offers from Fremantle and West Coast are south of $1 million a season as he prepares for a contract decision based on loyalty versus a return to family in West Australia.
West Coast club great Peter Sumich’s speculation of a $10.5 million deal over seven seasons caught fire over the weekend but has been dismissed as utter rubbish.
The Herald Sun understands Melbourne has already tabled a multi-year deal for Jackson that is not far short of what Fremantle and West Coast would offer.
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All three deals are lucrative but far from ridiculous, with West Coast’s salary cap tight and Fremantle attempting to build a premiership list.
At 20, industry experts suggest a fair deal at Melbourne would be around $800,000 per season and be in line with deals for young stars Sam Walsh, Ben King and Max King.
The contract figures are good news for Melbourne because they will not be blown out of the water by an offer Jackson cannot refuse.
Melbourne hopes it can keep him, with triple premiership Hawk Jordan Lewis urging him to stay to win more premierships over the weekend.
Insane deals worth over $1 million a season are believed to have come from fellow Victorian sides in offers that are designed to see if Jackson would move for money alone.
But as he prepares to lead Melbourne’s ruck department in the absence of injured skipper Max Gawn for a month, his only consideration is where he wants to play his football.
Jackson will be extremely well paid in his future and will not make a short-term decision to leave or stay based on money.
West Coast has the No.1 overall draft pick but has to use a first-round pick this season after trading out several in recent years.
Under the AFL’s rules it would need to split its No.1 overall pick or secure another selection by trading a veteran player if it wanted to hand one to Melbourne for Jackson.
Lewis told Fox Footy’s First Crack on Sunday night Jackson should remain at the Demons.
“It is a decision that, quite often if you haven’t got the right people around you, you can think short term.
“Melbourne right now is clearly in the premiership window, Luke Jackson has been a part of that, I can imagine if you are a young player you want to continue to be a part of that.
Can you then sacrifice a little bit of money to stay in a side that is clearly at the top echelon to play and perform?”
DRAGONS FFC - Moderator
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This is beautiful
West Coast club great Peter Sumich’s speculation of a $10.5 million deal over seven seasons caught fire over the weekend but has been dismissed as utter rubbish
West Coast club great Peter Sumich’s speculation of a $10.5 million deal over seven seasons caught fire over the weekend but has been dismissed as utter rubbish
Snuffaluphagus
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I dont really want to draw attention to it since we all knew it was complete bullshit but he really shouldnt be allowed to just blatantly make shit up
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