Training 2022 Pre-season

[Quigley]

Regarding Neale & Lyons not getting back in defense enough. This is true to a certain extent.
Not surprised they have been told to work on it but that is just Fagan's mantra, improve, improve, improve.

Midfielders can't be everywhere. You can't be a link player deep in defense. Or set up goals deep in defense.
They both get back for stoppages which in my opinion is all that is required
You don't change the style of 2 players rated elite one a Brownlow winner

Are they any different to Bontempelli, Martin, Petracca, Oliver, Macrae, Merrett, Walsh, Mitchell etc etc
Each of these players have deficiencies but you take that over trying to be a 100% all-round midfield super player if one exists

They don't have to be everywhere but they have to get to their spots and cover the space. When they don't it creates gaps which were exploited last year and made things much more difficult for the defence.

 

[trikster]

 

[davemc_lions]

They don't have to be everywhere but they have to get to their spots and cover the space. When they don't it creates gaps which were exploited last year and made things much more difficult for the defence.

Said not just the mids.
Teams like the dogs and demons run from Half forward to half back.
We zone more in defence last year with Rich, Brichall, Lester and Gardiner/Andrews not 100%. Not really any run.
Mids lack pace or size of a Bont etc. Often we see 2 players bring someone down.
Up forward Charlie can run and chase just seems doesn't some days.
Joe not great at chase and pressure a lot of the time.
Finals missing McStay and under done Berry, Cocky did not help as well.

 

[Section 5]

They don't have to be everywhere but they have to get to their spots and cover the space. When they don't it creates gaps which were exploited last year and made things much more difficult for the defence.

The problem is if they concentrate on that part of their game other parts of their game fall away.
I for one are quite happy how both players apply their skills

 

[Dalions]

They don't have to be everywhere but they have to get to their spots and cover the space. When they don't it creates gaps which were exploited last year and made things much more difficult for the defence.

I don’t really think that we can be too critical of Neale’s performances last year considering the amount and type of injuries he was carrying.
I don’t remember it being much of an issue in 2019 and 2020.
Lyons has always been criticised for his lack of 2 way running.

 

[martinson]

Fake news about Neale & Lyons spending less time on the ball. Neale is our main weapon there & Lyons is also very important. Dont believe everything you hear/read this time of the year.

I'm a bit bemused by some of the disrespect Neale seems to cop.

He's our best player and was a class above anyone else in the team in the Melbourne final running his guts out and getting 40 plus on a limited prep.

I agree the load needs to be spread a bit more as long as you have the cattle to do it and they aren't less effective than what we have.

 

[Grasshopper17]

I like him more onball than on a wing. He is very smart in his positioning and helps the unit function even when he is not getting the ball. He can win it himself but also can allow others to get free. Admittedly I was not that impressed with his onball work last year but I do think he would be better in there long term. Competition though is red hot and I would have Bailey first in line for a material upgrade of onball minutes and Rayner for more spot minutes.

Thought he was really good in the guts against Freo over in Perth last year. Played like a junkyard dog, looked really hungry to chase, pressure and tackle. Would definitely like to see more of that if he stays fit, is able to get from contest to contest and back that up week after week.

 

[Grasshopper17]

They don't have to be everywhere but they have to get to their spots and cover the space. When they don't it creates gaps which were exploited last year and made things much more difficult for the defence.

Hearing an interview with Cameron Bruce recently, it sounds like that is one of the key areas the midfield group has been working on over summer. He has pedigree in this area so looking forward to see what changes, and if we plebs are able to spot it!

At times last season our midfield functioned pretty much perfectly in defence mode, and at other times it was like a sieve, with really nothing in between.

 

[Grasshopper17]

To clarify, C Bruce was talking about working on their "running patterns". I actually have no idea what this means. I assumed it was a mysterious way of talking about "defensive positioning" but could be completely wrong! If anyone would like to correct/enlighten me that would be appreciated.

 

[Gadzorks]

Hope that link works.
It's a description of the current weather system, and why loads and loads of rain is possible.

500-1000mm has dumped just off the seq coast. That's crazy rain.

Hope someone at the club is all over masks and snorkels for the boys. Just in case.

 

[dUkezz]

Hey guys is there anywhere I can find out brisbanes training times and or upcoming practice matches? I’m in Brisbane for a week and wouldn’t mind going down to check them out (ex Fitzroy supporter so always got a soft spot for the lions)
Appreciate it, go lions cheers

 

[Section 5]

I thought we may go with 1 ruck come round one just to have a bit more mobility around the ground
Going on yesterdays interview with Fagan, see link below. He says at present they are going with Fort forward and ruck relief
You could say it worked out well today but the opposition was not great to say the least
However he mentioned they have options. This comes up at the 7 minute mark of video when asked about Hippy's replacement
He mentions Fullarton. Strange since Fullarton has been playing defense. However kicked 3 goals today in VFL so i assume he played forward or ruck.
Also mentions could go small like Rayner

We have a few players fighting out for those final couple of spots but none really change the structure of the team balance
However playing one ruck or two rucks does alter the structure of the team
Be interesting how we set up next week against a good side

 

[POBT]

I assumed Fullarton and Payne played the intraclubs in a different role to give us additional flexibility and depth, not necessarily due to a long term strategy. We don't have great depth in KPPs so it makes sense that we should try and make sure the next two KPPs in line can play at both ends.

 

[briztoon]

I thought we may go with 1 ruck come round one just to have a bit more mobility around the ground
Going on yesterdays interview with Fagan, see link below. He says at present they are going with Fort forward and ruck relief
You could say it worked out well today but the opposition was not great to say the least
However he mentioned they have options. This comes up at the 7 minute mark of video when asked about Hippy's replacement
He mentions Fullarton. Strange since Fullarton has been playing defense. However kicked 3 goals today in VFL so i assume he played forward or ruck.
Also mentions could go small like Rayner

We have a few players fighting out for those final couple of spots but none really change the structure of the team balance
However playing one ruck or two rucks does alter the structure of the team
Be interesting how we set up next week against a good side

Sometimes I wonder if you’re too obsessed with a players listed position.

It’s been clear from day dot that Fagan prefers a 3 tall, forward line up. Now who those three talls are, has often depended on who the best players available were/are.

It believe Fagan has publicly said, if Hipwood was healthy, we would go with three tall forwards and one ruck.

With Hipwood injured, and Fort clearly the next best/competent tall available, were always going with two “rucks”.

But it’s still largely the same game plan. There will still be three tall players in the forward 50, with one of them playing relief ruck. It’s just different personal.

We’re not playing 3 tall forwards and 2 rucks. Now or when Hipwood returns.

Personally, I believe this has been clear as daylight since we were rumoured to be trading for a ruck last post-season.

 

[dlanod]

I assumed Fullarton and Payne played the intraclubs in a different role to give us additional flexibility and depth, not necessarily due to a long term strategy. We don't have great depth in KPPs so it makes sense that we should try and make sure the next two KPPs in line can play at both ends.

Plays into what we've done in previous preseasons as well. I remember similar discussions where Fagan as played X out of position only for week 1, 2 and 3 them to line up in the same position they'd played in previous years.

If anything this year they're being a bit more transparent about some of it, e.g. Zorko playing half-back to focus on getting miles in his legs (before the latest surgey).

 

[POBT]

I wonder who of Payne and Fullarton is the next man in as a tall forward? I personally thought Payne showed something in that role early in the semi final last year. I suspect Fullarton would probably get first crack still but Payne looks like a senior footballer to me and if he can't crack it for a backline spot, there's a temptation to play him forward if the opportunity presents.

 

[davemc_lions]

With Hippy out.. third tall either Fullarton, Fort, Lane, H Smith or Payne.
Forward wise Lane and H Smith young. Payne not played much forward
so comes down to Fort or Fullarton. Fort can hold his own as 1st Ruck.

Fort I like to see how he goes, as I really think we need someone who can ruck not pinch hit even when Hippy returns.
Times last year when either Big O was buggered, carrying a injury or just out played.
We had no plan B as Joe or Fullarton did not offer much as a ruck.

If you look at the other finals sides they have 2 rucks apart from GWS.
Even Big O 80/20 means 20% of the game we have basically no real ruck.
A lot of the time Joe jumps and never gets near it.

Melb Gawn/Jackson
Dogs English/Martin or Young
Port Lycett/Ladhams and also Dixon pinch hit
Cats Stanley/Blicavs and Hawkins/Rat pinch hit
Bombers Draper/Wright
Swans Hickey/McLean
Only GWS Mummy who also made sure he hurt as many as he could as he rucked

 

[Mighty Lions]

I thought we may go with 1 ruck come round one just to have a bit more mobility around the ground
Going on yesterdays interview with Fagan, see link below. He says at present they are going with Fort forward and ruck relief
You could say it worked out well today but the opposition was not great to say the least
However he mentioned they have options. This comes up at the 7 minute mark of video when asked about Hippy's replacement
He mentions Fullarton. Strange since Fullarton has been playing defense. However kicked 3 goals today in VFL so i assume he played forward or ruck.
Also mentions could go small like Rayner

We have a few players fighting out for those final couple of spots but none really change the structure of the team balance
However playing one ruck or two rucks does alter the structure of the team
Be interesting how we set up next week against a good side

My opinion has been that the plan has always been to play Fort & Big O Round 1. Fort had limited time in the forward line yesterday and didn't have much impact while down there however his work as a roaming ruckman was good. The other option is the play Fort off the bench to support Big O so he doesn't burn himself out before the pointy end of the season. Both will play to start the season, then its up to Fort to hold his spot once Hippy returns.

 

[Berrygood]

I assumed Fullarton and Payne played the intraclubs in a different role to give us additional flexibility and depth, not necessarily due to a long term strategy. We don't have great depth in KPPs so it makes sense that we should try and make sure the next two KPPs in line can play at both ends.

Doesn't hurt having these two getting some experience at both ends, break glass in an emergency kind of thing. Might be a cpl of years before we draft a cpl of tall kpp's, seeing Ashcroft and Fletcher are in our sights the end of this season and a cpl of years before we know if Lane and H Smith can make it. Fullerton may even learn more about his fwd role by having to defend one, vice versa with Payne. Could make them better players in their primary roles.

 

[davemc_lions]

My opinion has been that the plan has always been to play Fort & Big O Round 1. Fort had limited time in the forward line yesterday and didn't have much impact while down there however his work as a roaming ruckman was good. The other option is the play Fort off the bench to support Big O so he doesn't burn himself out before the pointy end of the season. Both will play to start the season, then its up to Fort to hold his spot once Hippy returns.

I also do not mind Oscar forward.. can take a grab split a pack which Fullarton cannot do.
No idea Fort forward only seen limited vision.
So we could go Fort Ruck and Oscar forward to stretch small defences,

 

[Section 5]

Sometimes I wonder if you’re too obsessed with a players listed position.

It’s been clear from day dot that Fagan prefers a 3 tall, forward line up. Now who those three talls are, has often depended on who the best players available were/are.

It believe Fagan has publicly said, if Hipwood was healthy, we would go with three tall forwards and one ruck.

With Hipwood injured, and Fort clearly the next best/competent tall available, were always going with two “rucks”.

But it’s still largely the same game plan. There will still be three tall players in the forward 50, with one of them playing relief ruck. It’s just different personal.

We’re not playing 3 tall forwards and 2 rucks. Now or when Hipwood returns.

Personally, I believe this has been clear as daylight since we were rumoured to be trading for a ruck last post-season.

Obsessed, i don't think so. Two rucks is a different structure than 1 ruck & either a third tall or a small

It can't be "clear from day dot" considering a few days ago Fagan said:- in relation to Hippy's replacement question
"Try Darcy Fort there"
"we might decide to play smaller in forward line"
"still exploring all those options"
"we have not made up our minds necessarily for round 1"
"the next two weeks will be valuable to make that call"

Either Fagan is blowing smoke or it is still up for consideration
My opinion is it is still up for consideration. And going small is my preference at present
However i won't lose any sleep if they go two rucks, Fullarton included, or if they don't select Cockatoo, Berry, Robbo, AhChee, because they run with two rucks

 

[Grasshopper17]

Obsessed, i don't think so. Two rucks is a different structure than 1 ruck & either a third tall or a small

It can't be "clear from day dot" considering a few days ago Fagan said:- in relation to Hippy's replacement question
"Try Darcy Fort there"
"we might decide to play smaller in forward line"
"still exploring all those options"
"we have not made up our minds necessarily for round 1"
"the next two weeks will be valuable to make that call"

Either Fagan is blowing smoke or it is still up for consideration
My opinion is it is still up for consideration. And going small is my preference at present
However i won't lose any sleep if they go two rucks, Fullarton included, or if they don't select Cockatoo, Berry, Robbo, AhChee, because they run with two rucks

99% of me thinks he is blowing smoke. We have been moving towards or playing 3 tall forwards essentially since Fagan came to Brisbane. But I think it was a good question posed during his presser - we reacted slowly to losing McStay against Melbourne and we weren't much better when we lost Payne against the Bulldogs (although we were better). So I think by extension of that it would make sense if we have used the preseason to not only trial blokes in different positions and different roles, but also trialling different strategies during preseason to better match the personnel we have available at various stages of a game/season.

My caveat to that is that there are a myriad of strategies that might work in the regular season, but there's only a handful of those that have been shown to work in September. Richmond showed in 2017 you can win a flag with only one out and out tall marking forward and a mosquito fleet around him, so it has a precedent, but I'd be very surprised if we went down that path without being forced to by injuries to multiple players.

 

[morsie]

Watching the Fox season preview the consensus of the commentators was that Melbourne play Team Defence and that Brisbane are not quite there I.e some players don't run both ways.
Such anaylis is way above my paygrade especially as I only watch on TV.
Any thoughts?

 

[Dalions]

Watching the Fox season preview the consensus of the commentators was that Melbourne play Team Defence and that Brisbane are not quite there I.e some players don't run both ways.
Such anaylis is way above my paygrade especially as I only watch on TV.
Any thoughts?

They had a fully fit team last year, we didn’t.

 

[a mayes ing]

Watching the Fox season preview the consensus of the commentators was that Melbourne play Team Defence and that Brisbane are not quite there I.e some players don't run both ways.
Such anaylis is way above my paygrade especially as I only watch on TV.
Any thoughts?

Can't comment on all the Melbourne players as l don't watch them that much but l wouldn't be surprised if what they said was true in regards to some of our players not running both ways. However, l am sure every team has a few players who don't run hard both ways either.