List Mgmt. 2023 GWS Giants List Management - Academy, Free Agent, Trade, Draft

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Giant Strides

Giant Strides

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GWS Giants Team Board Tipping
Nov 23, 2015
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GWS
Trade Period, October 6–18
  • Restricted & Unrestricted Free Agency Period: Friday, October 6, 9am – Friday October 13, 5pm (bid matching ends Monday October 16, 5pm)
  • Trade Period (1), picks & players: Monday, October 9, 9am – Wednesday October 18, 7.30pm
Quiet Period, October 19–November 20
  • Trade Period (2), picks only: Monday, October 23, 9am – Friday November 10, 5pm
  • List Lodgement 1*: Tuesday, October 31, 2pm
  • Delisted Free Agency Period (1): Wednesday, November 1, 9am – Wednesday November 8, 5pm
  • Delisted Free Agency Period (2): Friday, November 10, 9am–5pm
  • List Lodgement 2*: Tuesday, November 14, 2pm


Here's the list of GWS players who are out of contract in 2023 (I'll progressively cross them out as they re-sign):
  • Lachie ASH
  • Callan WARD (Free Agent)
  • Brayden PREUSS
  • Tom GREEN
  • Finn CALLAGHAN
  • Lachlan KEEFFE (Free Agent)
  • Jake RICCARDI
  • Harry HIMMELBERG (Free Agent)
  • Cam FLEETON - delisted (25/9/23)
  • Matt FLYNN (Free Agent) - signed by West Coast as an Unrestricted Free Agent
  • Xavier O'HALLORAN
  • Jack BUCKLEY
  • Callum BROWN
Rookie lists:
  • Phil DAVIS (Free Agent) - retiring at end of 2023 season
  • Jacob WEHR (Free agent)
  • Dan LLOYD (Free Agent) - retiring at end of 2023 season
  • Cooper HAMILTON
  • Wade DERKSEN
  • Nick MADDEN (Cat B) - assumed re-signed due to 2 sources of info
  • Jason GILBEE (Cat B) - delisted (25/9/23)
Current list sizes (for when we get to list/draft/trade speculation):
  • main list = 36 minus 3 (Fleeton, Flynn + Kennedy delisted with a view to be re-selected in the rookie draft)
  • rookie A = 6 minus 2 (Davis, Lloyd)
  • rookie B = 2 minus 1 (Gilbee)
  • total = 44 minus 5
This is the future pick spreadsheet that comes into play only at trade time, as future picks are used in end of season (2023) trading:


Here's the 2023 AFL Academy Squad, so these (roughly) represent the best players for next year as they stand now:

2023 NAB AFL ACADEMY​

NAMESURNAMESTATESTATE LEAGUE CLUBCOMMUNITY CLUB
LachlanCaborNSW/ACTSydney Swans AcademyShellharbour
NateCaddyVIC MNorthern KnightsYarrambat
JackCallinanTASTasmania DevilsClarence
CaidenClearyNSW/ACTSydney Swans AcademySydney University
DanielCurtinWAClaremontWest Coast
JackDeleanSASouth AdelaideReynella
ZaneDuursmaVIC CGippsland PowerFoster
MitchellEdwardsWAPeel ThunderSouth Mandurah
WilliamGreenVIC MNorthern KnightsNorthcote
RileyHardemanWASwan DistrictsCaversham
WilliamLorenzVIC MOakleigh ChargersBoroondara Hawks
KaneMcAuliffeSANorth AdelaideCentral Augusta
ColbyMcKercherTASTasmania DevilsLaunceston
AshtonMoirSAGlenelgPlympton
ConnorO'SullivanNSW/ACTMurray BushrangersAlbury
WilliamPattonSAWest AdelaideMitcham
NathanPhilactidesVIC MOakleigh ChargersBlackburn
EthanReadQLDGold Coast Suns AcademyPalm Beach Currumbin
ArcherReidVIC CGippsland PowerInverloch-Kongwak
HarleyReidVIC CBendigo PioneersTongala
ArchieRobertsVIC MSandringham DragonsHampton Rovers
JakeRogersQLDGold Coast Suns AcademyBroadbeach
RyleySandersTASSandringham DragonsNorth Launceston
CooperSimpsonVIC CDandenong StingraysMount Martha
GeorgeStevensVIC CGWV RebelsSouth Warrnambool
KoltynTholstrupWASubiacoNewtown-Condingup
OrlandoTurnerNTWest AdelaideSouth Alice Springs
JedWalterQLDGold Coast Suns AcademyPalm Beach Currumbin
NickWatsonVIC MEastern RangesEast Ringwood
DarcyWilsonVIC CMurray BushrangersWangaratta Rovers

Happy speculating for 2023!

EDIT: 11/12/22 - Added Free Agent status to OOC player list
EDIT: 24/2/23 - Crossed out Tom Green from OOC player list! (Woo Hoo!!) & Added 2023 Coates Talent League Fixture Link
EDIT: 27/2/23 - Crossed out Finn Callaghan from OOC player list! (Woo Hoo Hoo!!!)
EDIT: 27/4/23 - Crossed out Jacob Wehr from OOC player list
EDIT: 10/5/23 - Crossed out Jack Buckley from OOC player list :thumbsu:
EDIT: 9/7/23 - Crossed out Callum Brown from OOC player list
EDIT: 18/7/23 - Crossed out Lachie Ash from OOC player list
EDIT: 20/7/23 - Crossed out Xavier O'Halloran from OOC player list
EDIT: 3/8/23 - Crossed out Harry Himmelberg from OOC player list
EDIT: 9/8/23 - Crossed out Wade Derksen from OOC player list
EDIT: 17/8/23 - Noted Dan Lloyd retiring at end of season
EDIT: 19/8/23 - Crossed out Jake Riccardi from OOC player list
EDIT: 28/8/23 - Noted Phil Davis retiring at end of season
EDIT: 25/9/23 - Noted Cam Fleeton & Jason Gilbee delisted
EDIT: 4/10/23 - Noted Flynn, Preuss & Keeffe situations
EDIT: 9/10/23 - Updated Flynn to WCE, removed Preuss from OOC player list
EDIT: 12/10/23 - Updated Madden with 2 sources of information
EDIT: 19/10/23 - Updated Keeffe & Hamilton re-signed
EDIT: 31/10/23 - adjusted main list numbers with Adam Kennedy delisting (with a view to be re-selected in rookie draft)
 
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Giant Strides said:
I reckon Watson will go to one of Norths, Hawks or Carlton ... all of whom I expect to finish below us on the ladder. But, you never know what might happen between now and the ND.
Click to expand...
I'm hoping that Richmond fall in a heap and we get pick 4
 

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June draft rankings from Inner Sanctum ... notwithstanding there's a lot of draftwatchers and publications that produce draft rankings, I'd probably agree with the top 6:

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1. Harley Reid
2. Jed Walter
3. Nick Watson
4. Zane Duursma
5. Nate Caddy
6. Colby McKercher

So, with Walter being a Suns academy selection, (and I doubt Suns get ahead of a bid on him, so likely they'll sell their pick and match a bid), I can see it going:

1. West Coast - Reid
2. Norths bid / Suns match - Walter
3. Norths - choice of Watson (small forward), Duursma (mid/fwd) or Caddy (KPF), Watson or Caddy making the most sense you'd think
4. Hawks - you'd think would go Watson or Caddy, whoever Norths doesn't select.

So, I just can't see Watson getting past the third last team unless there's some significant team order changes through pick swapping.

The interesting larger question will be whether teams take a punt on the two Tasmanians. In a draft that lacks a lot of quality midfielders, two of the highest rated being from Tassie suddenly introduces the spectre of the Tasmanian team's introduction in a few years.

I am certainly keen on Connor O'Sullivan, from the Murray Bushrangers, as a developmental KPD given the impending retirement of Davis:

10. Connor O’Sullivan

Allies/Murray Bushrangers

KDEF, 196cm, 85kg

May Ranking: 10

O’Sullivan had a monster game at full back for the Allies against Western Australia, proving a strong aerial presence, with his ability to run and compete through the midfield making him perhaps the most versatile player in this year’s draft pool. The Bushrangers product looks comfortable down back, however don’t be surprised if he lines up at a centre bounce next to McKercher and Sanders at some point.
 
From today’s ’Trade News’ article in News Corp:

GIANTS MEET WITH KEY FREE AGENT

GWS Giants have met with Harry Himmelberg’s management as part of the club’s bid to keep the versatile key position player.

The Giants believe the goal kicker has a bright future at the club despite strong interest from Sydney Swans and Richmond.

The academy product has been tabled an offer from GWS which is understood to be for at least five seasons in length.

While Himmelberg is close friends with Tim Taranto and Jacob Hopper, who crossed from GWS to Richmond last season, the Giants are certain Himmelberg is well-settled in Sydney.

JOURNEYMAN’S FUTURE UP IN THE AIR

GWS Giants’ ruckman Braydon Preuss is facing an uncertain future as he attempts to overcome a troubling back injury.

Preuss, who is in the final year of his contract, has endured a horror injury run since landing at his third club and is currently out indefinitely.

The 206cm big man, who started his career at North Melbourne and Melbourne, has played only 10 games since joining GWS on a three-year deal.

He was traded to GWS in exchange for pick 31 in the 2020 national draft, which was moved on in another deal by the Demons.

For the Giants, Kieran Briggs has taken over impressively as the club’s No. 1 ruckman after patiently developing in the NEAFL.

The 200cm Briggs has fired for coach Adam Kingsley since stepping up in Round 5, averaging 27 hit-outs, 10 contested possessions and five clearances a game as part of the red-hot stretch.

The Giants could look to extend Preuss on a short-term deal if he can recover from his latest back injury which he suffered in the preseason.
 
Brave New World said:
From today’s ’Trade News’ article in News Corp:

GIANTS MEET WITH KEY FREE AGENT

GWS Giants have met with Harry Himmelberg’s management as part of the club’s bid to keep the versatile key position player.

The Giants believe the goal kicker has a bright future at the club despite strong interest from Sydney Swans and Richmond.

The academy product has been tabled an offer from GWS which is understood to be for at least five seasons in length.

While Himmelberg is close friends with Tim Taranto and Jacob Hopper, who crossed from GWS to Richmond last season, the Giants are certain Himmelberg is well-settled in Sydney.

JOURNEYMAN’S FUTURE UP IN THE AIR

GWS Giants’ ruckman Braydon Preuss is facing an uncertain future as he attempts to overcome a troubling back injury.

Preuss, who is in the final year of his contract, has endured a horror injury run since landing at his third club and is currently out indefinitely.

The 206cm big man, who started his career at North Melbourne and Melbourne, has played only 10 games since joining GWS on a three-year deal.

He was traded to GWS in exchange for pick 31 in the 2020 national draft, which was moved on in another deal by the Demons.

For the Giants, Kieran Briggs has taken over impressively as the club’s No. 1 ruckman after patiently developing in the NEAFL.

The 200cm Briggs has fired for coach Adam Kingsley since stepping up in Round 5, averaging 27 hit-outs, 10 contested possessions and five clearances a game as part of the red-hot stretch.

The Giants could look to extend Preuss on a short-term deal if he can recover from his latest back injury which he suffered in the preseason.
Click to expand...
Maybe the Preuss deal could be handy if it's really cheap (maybe not in medical bills).
He would at this stage be the backup ruckman in my mind.
Briggs has clearly stamped his authority.
Given Briggs sudden dominance, Preuss would have time to heal up and get his body right if Briggs was to go out injured. Flynn I doubt will stick around if that's the case.
 
Ideally, I would prefer to keep Briggs and Flynn. Both local guys, Briggs has definitely nudged ahead of Flynn, but the latter still played 9 games this year, and ruckmen always get injured so opportunity exists. If that's the case, then I'd jettison Preuss due to his injuries.

Realistically, though, I can see Matt Flynn jumping elsewhere for better opportunity - though I'd opine that no club would see him as an immediate first choice ruck, except perhaps the Cats. So, at most clubs, he'd have a similar fight on his hands - probably more so, given that Briggs is slightly his junior but similarly inexperienced, as opposed to trying to overtake a more experienced ruck at most other clubs. If he leaves, then providing we can get Preuss back to being serviceable by end of year, probably give him a 1-year deal at low $ ... see if he's prepared to back himself. It's more a case of not wanting to look for 2 rucks over the off season than liking Preuss.

It depends on how Flynn views the challenge.
 
Giant Strides said:
Ideally, I would prefer to keep Briggs and Flynn. Both local guys, Briggs has definitely nudged ahead of Flynn, but the latter still played 9 games this year, and ruckmen always get injured so opportunity exists. If that's the case, then I'd jettison Preuss due to his injuries.

Realistically, though, I can see Matt Flynn jumping elsewhere for better opportunity - though I'd opine that no club would see him as an immediate first choice ruck, except perhaps the Cats. So, at most clubs, he'd have a similar fight on his hands - probably more so, given that Briggs is slightly his junior but similarly inexperienced, as opposed to trying to overtake a more experienced ruck at most other clubs. If he leaves, then providing we can get Preuss back to being serviceable by end of year, probably give him a 1-year deal at low $ ... see if he's prepared to back himself. It's more a case of not wanting to look for 2 rucks over the off season than liking Preuss.

It depends on how Flynn views the challenge.
Click to expand...

Indication of the direction of thinking might come in the next few weeks. Keeffe originally appeared to have been brought into the firsts to take-on Hawkins when we played Geelong. He has since stayed in with an apparent role of ruck-back-up and forward. This might have been a role that Flynn could have taken (he is playing a similar role in the VFL inter-changing with Madden). If Keeffe stays in this role then Flynn might consider his options at the end of the year, even if Keeffe retires; since Flynn sees he is unlikely to play regularly in the firsts if even in tandem with Briggs?
 
Giant Strides said:
Ideally, I would prefer to keep Briggs and Flynn. Both local guys, Briggs has definitely nudged ahead of Flynn, but the latter still played 9 games this year, and ruckmen always get injured so opportunity exists. If that's the case, then I'd jettison Preuss due to his injuries.

Realistically, though, I can see Matt Flynn jumping elsewhere for better opportunity - though I'd opine that no club would see him as an immediate first choice ruck, except perhaps the Cats. So, at most clubs, he'd have a similar fight on his hands - probably more so, given that Briggs is slightly his junior but similarly inexperienced, as opposed to trying to overtake a more experienced ruck at most other clubs. If he leaves, then providing we can get Preuss back to being serviceable by end of year, probably give him a 1-year deal at low $ ... see if he's prepared to back himself. It's more a case of not wanting to look for 2 rucks over the off season than liking Preuss.

It depends on how Flynn views the challenge.
Click to expand...
I’ll be frank… I don’t think Flynn is good enough… even as a second ruck.
 
Giant Pete said:
I’ll be frank… I don’t think Flynn is good enough… even as a second ruck.
Click to expand...
I thought that early in the year. He turned around my thoughts a bit, but only as far as "as a backup ruck". I don't think he offers enough forward to be a forward/ruck role. Yes, he can mark as we've seen when he's played it in the past, but his mobility is obviously a lot different to the others we've been playing in the role - even Keeffe.
 
PaythePerryman said:
Maybe the Preuss deal could be handy if it's really cheap (maybe not in medical bills).
He would at this stage be the backup ruckman in my mind.
Briggs has clearly stamped his authority.
Given Briggs sudden dominance, Preuss would have time to heal up and get his body right if Briggs was to go out injured. Flynn I doubt will stick around if that's the case.
Click to expand...
I saw a swans poster wanting Flynn on there trade board. Maybe Swans are interested in Flynn.
I wonder which club would be most interested in Flynn, and Flynn in them. As a free agent, reasonable player I guess Carlton, St Kilda, even Geelong, if they see Flynn as better than some of their ruckman and Stanley is getting on, has been injured this year.
 
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Thoughts on chasing Elliot Himmelberg? Let's us offload Preuss and not lose too much experience with a 25yo cheap mature bodied 200cm key forward/2nd ruck. He has thilthorpe, walker, fogarty in front of him, is in and out of the first 22 team and not making waves at SANFL level. Let's us have added motivation for HH to stay. He is only contracted till 2024 so might not take too much to dislodge him if he's interested in the move.

Also keen on trading in another speedy, creative small forward if Nick Watson is out of reach. Out of NSW based players, the ones of interest to me are Lachie Schulz from Freo but originally Moama (unlikely, contracted till 2024 but seems pretty entrenched in their team and too costly to trade for) and potentially Charlie Spargo from the Dees (probably eclipsed by Chandler at AFL level but still hanging onto his spot in the first 22).
 

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Giant Pete said:
I’ll be frank… I don’t think Flynn is good enough… even as a second ruck.
Click to expand...

dlanod said:
I thought that early in the year. He turned around my thoughts a bit, but only as far as "as a backup ruck". I don't think he offers enough forward to be a forward/ruck role. Yes, he can mark as we've seen when he's played it in the past, but his mobility is obviously a lot different to the others we've been playing in the role - even Keeffe.
Click to expand...
Ruck is an odd position. Most teams only play 1, so it's generally difficult to (a) develop your back-up ruck, and (b) get an opportunity to showcase your wares. As soon as a second echelon ruckman shows promise, another club is looking to snap him up. And the process starts again.

I'll disagree with Giant Pete, in that I think Flynn's OK as a second ruck, and occasionally in a 2-ruck setup (such as vs Melbourne with Gawn & Grundy) if the coach wanted. Apart from Melbourne - which is an odd situation - or maybe Fremantle (although arguable that Jackson is a primary ruck) clubs don't have the luxury of a ready-to-go back-up ruck (or they try to play two primary rucks). For back-up, you can either have an over-the-hill ruck (and generally not that good, e.g. Sam Jacobs), a developing young ruck (what Briggs & Flynn have been), or a clear second level ruck (and I don't think there's too many that actually fit that category, perhaps Ladhams, Cox, Soldo).

If we cast Preuss and Flynn aside, it only leaves Briggs and Madden. I am not convinced that Madden is actually a good choice, but I'll give him time. But losing two rucks leaves us trying to bring in two rucks, which I think is less than ideal. Particularly as we've always struggled to entice rucks to the club.

sydney_gws said:
I saw a swans poster wanting Flynn on there trade board. Maybe Swans are interested in Flynn.
I wonder which club would be most interested in Flynn, and Flynn in them. As a free agent, reasonable player I guess Carlton, St Kilda, even Geelong, if they see Flynn as better than some of their ruckman and Stanley is getting on, has been injured this year.
Click to expand...
Cats would provide him an opportunity to fight for top ruck, given the stocks they have! At Swans and Blues, he'd be battling others. He might like Swans, in that he doesn't have to move from Sydney, and with Hickey on limited time left, he'd be in a battle with Ladhams for the primary ruck role. But that's no different, and could be perceived as even worse, that where he is now. Similarly, at the Blues Pittonet is their top-ranked ruck; they could lose TDK, in which case he's in a 2-way battle.

Any of those are possible - as I said previously, IMHO it comes down to how he sees the situation, and what challenge he's prepared to take on.
 
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Teeso said:
Thoughts on chasing Elliot Himmelberg? Let's us offload Preuss and not lose too much experience with a 25yo cheap mature bodied 200cm key forward/2nd ruck. He has thilthorpe, walker, fogarty in front of him, is in and out of the first 22 team and not making waves at SANFL level. Let's us have added motivation for HH to stay. He is only contracted till 2024 so might not take too much to dislodge him if he's interested in the move.
Click to expand...
I think everyone, especially Crows fans, was surprised when EH was re-contracted. To me, he's a KPD first, and backup ruck second. But you could probably have him share time rucking in VFL to develop that skill. I doubt he'd cost too much, and maybe he would be an added incentive for HH to stay with us. Or he could just switch to Swans to be in the same city. :huh: Not really a long-term ruck solution though. I depends on what we are trying to achieve in the list balance.
 
Giant Pete said:
I’ll be frank… I don’t think Flynn is good enough… even as a second ruck.
Click to expand...
I reckon he is comparable to the back up (reserve) rucks most clubs have. He basically holds his own most of the time, doesnt add a whole lot, but doesnt get beaten too badly.
Stay, go, all the same to me. If we dont keep him, we'll have to just buy someone like him. If he gets a good offer and wants to leave, so be it.
 
Personally just stoked we have finally got our number one ruck sorted.
Also happy to have Madden slowly develop. As for Preuss his far too injury prone to keep and will be somewhat amazed if he isn't delisted. With Flynn if he can have the same attitude as Keeffe and be content to mainly play VFL and only play senior footy if Briggs is out then all for keeping him on. So would be fine with just Briggs, Flynn and Madden but would also look at Aleer to do a little ruck work and be an option if everyone else has fallen down.
 
Giant Strides said:
I think everyone, especially Crows fans, was surprised when EH was re-contracted. To me, he's a KPD first, and backup ruck second. But you could probably have him share time rucking in VFL to develop that skill. I doubt he'd cost too much, and maybe he would be an added incentive for HH to stay with us. Or he could just switch to Swans to be in the same city. :huh: Not really a long-term ruck solution though. I depends on what we are trying to achieve in the list balance.
Click to expand...

I agree and personally I think a KPF that pinch hits in the ruck at VFL level is exactly what we need rather than a true developing ruck. Briggs has made such a surge in his progress and cemented that first ruck spot for now, such a relief for GWS to finally have a ruckman beyond Mummy! Flynn to me is a full time ruck that rests up forward. He is on the cusp of potentially being AFL level and ideally he should be leading the charge at VFL level. Madden is developing and should be learning from Flynn whilst having occasional stints rucking.

Up forward at VFL level, I think it would be fantastic to have Elliot Himmelberg and Derksen as KPFs who pinch hit in the ruck if there are injuries. Cadman and Gruz should both be playing forward only. Most likely one of these 4 will be in the senior team given our KPF stocks in the first 22 are slim pickings beyond Hogan/Riccardi +/- Greene.

Down back at VFL level, Aleer and Fleeton should lead the team, leaves us short 1 KPD personally and I think earns Keefe an extra year given his durability and strength. Gives us that extra ruck option too if anything happens. With Davis' likely retirement and Preuss' body not holding up, I think staggering Keefe's retirement would be better whilst we search the draft/trade for another key position player. Tough decisions to be made when we have Taylor/Buckley/Haynes/Idun/HH also doing well in defence at AFL level.


Looked beyond the NSW origin players and reviewed some out of contract players I'd be interested in for another small forward option:
Lachlan Murphy - 24 years old, 12 games this year, averaging 15.67 possessions/match, 3 tackles/match, 0.4 goals/match
Tyler Brockman - 20 years old, 10 games this year, averaging 11.7 possessions/match, 1.8 tackles/match, 1 goal/match
Phoenix Spicer - 21 years old, 6 games this year, averaging 6.5 possessions/match, 3.83 tackles/match, 0.17 goals/match
Jed McEntee - 22 years old, 11 games this year, averaging 9.36 possessions/match, 3 tackles/match, 1 goal/match
Rhyan Mansell - 23 years old, 12 games this year, averaging 8.25 possessions/match, 2.83 tackles/match, 0.83 goals/match
Jack Petrucelle - 24 years old, 10 games this year, averaging 11 possessions/match, 3.5 tackles/match, 0.6 goals/match

I think my choice would be either Petrucelle, Murphy or McEntee.
 
Flynn could regain some form but I don't see a need to play him and Briggs in the same team. Possibly Derksen in the future could do what Keefe is currently doing. Would happily sign Flynn if he wants to stay, I have little doubt Preuss is on good money, he was still contracted to Melb for 2 years and they bought out his North contract as well. Most likely one of the higher earning 30 game veterans in the league. Good luck to him but the ROI on him has been a disaster.
 
Himmelberg is yet to decide on the formal offer the club put to him, but that hasn’t stop the media from speculating! Fox seems to indicate that this 5 year deal is around $700k. However, the article reiterates that we are “very confident” of retaining HH, and that he is yet to meet with other clubs.

The Giants, though, would also have the option of matching a rival club’s prospective offer for Himmelberg – who isn’t an unrestricted free agent – to broker a trade and acquire more than one pick. They did this in 2020 when they matched Geelong’s offer for superstar forward Jeremy Cameron and, subsequently, received three top-20 picks.

Either way, a Himmelberg departure would put the Giants in an excellent position to make a bold play up the draft order and acquire Pick 1 for the second consecutive season, which would give the club best access to acquire Harley Reid – the white-hot top prospect of this year’s draft class who kicked three first-quarter goals against South Australia on Sunday.

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Mid-season review of GWS:

GWS mid-season review: Keiren Briggs’ form creates ruck contract logjam

News Corp Australia Sports Newsroom

21 June 2023

The GWS Giants head into the bye on the back of their best victory of the season against Fremantle.

We run our eye over their year so far, and what’s to come for the team from Western Sydney.

Trade review

In:

Toby Bedford (Melbourne)

Picks 1, 15, 18, 19, 31 and 57

Future 1st (Richmond)

Out:

Bobby Hill (Collingwood)

Jacob Hopper (Richmond)

Tim Taranto (Richmond)

Tanner Bruhn (Geelong)

Picks 3, 21, 40, 44, 63

Future 2nd

It was always going to be a chaotic trade period for the Giants, but it had a big impact on their strongest team. The departure of Hill, Hopper, Taranto and Bruhn forced a big readjustment, especially Taranto who has continued his rise as one of the AFL’s best midfielders.

It was an eye to the future with their trades, bringing in the coveted No.1 pick to secure Aaron Cadman. However, Toby Bedford was the one name coming in from Melbourne and has slowly made an impact. He debuted for the Giants in round seven against the Swans, playing every match since. The 23-year-old has impressed with his tackle pressure and is generating more score involvements as the weeks go on.

List management continues to be the big issue for the Giants with so many high draft picks in previous years. While they’ll be lamenting just how well Taranto is playing at Richmond, the strong hand they were able to take into the draft will give them plenty of confidence in the direction they’re heading.

They’ve at the very least come out even on the trades involving Bruhn, Hill and Hopper, with none of the trio going on to have incredible seasons so far.

TIM TARANTO 2022 VS 2023

2022 - LAST SEASON AS A GIANT

Games: 16

Ranking points: 91

Disposals: 25.4

Inside 50s: 3.9

Contested possessions: 9.7

Clearances: 3.8

Tackles: 4.8

2023 - FIRST SEASON AS A TIGER

Games: 14

Ranking points: 120 (+29)

Disposals: 32 (+6.6)

Inside 50s: 3.9

Contested possessions: 13.6 (+3.9)

Clearances: 6.9 (+3.1)

Tackles: 7 (+2.2)

Draft review:

Pick #1 – Aaron Cadman

Pick #16 – Harry Rowston

Pick #21 – Darcy Jones

Pick #22 – Max Gruzewski

Pick #34 – Toby McMullin

Category B rookies – Nick Madden and Jason Gillbee

All eyes are on Aaron Cadman at the Giants and the No.1 draft pick has had an underwhelming start to life in the AFL. The key forward has yet to kick more than one goal in a game and has struggled to get involved in matches, with a season-high of seven disposals against Collingwood. The Giants aren’t worried by his slow start with Adam Kingsley happy to give the 18-year-old all the time he needs to build into life in the AFL. He needs a game where a few more marks stick and he kicks a few goals to get his confidence up.

Harry Rowston is the only other Giants’ draftee to have played in 2023. The midfielder was given a long stretch in the side across the opening months and finished with 14 touches against Carlton in round three. However, the Academy product has been out of the team more recently, only returning for their win against the Kangaroos as the medical sub. He has looked promising in the VFL, averaging just shy of 24 touches a game.

Max Gruzewski has also shown some impressive signs in the VFL, kicking 21 goals in 11 matches. They’ll have to wait until next season to get a glimpse of Darcy Jones after he ruptured his ACL in his first match in the VFL.

Pass mark

For the Giants, 2023 was always going to be a year of unknowns. Would the undeniable talent in their midfield group balance out the departures of four key players? And which players would step up to take the pressure off captain Toby Greene going forward?

Sitting just one win outside the eight going into the bye gets a tick for the Giants, but finals footy would still be a bonus for this group. If they can get at least four more wins this season, it’s probably a strong year – but if they play like they did against Fremantle anything is possible.

However, getting more games into the likes of Tom Green and Finn Callaghan was always a key goal, and they’ve continued to excel at AFL level.

Who is out of contract?

The big story out of the Giants surrounds the future of Harry Himmelberg. An elite and versatile player, the 27-year-old has taken his game to a new level, particularly since being played in defence.

The Giants are doing everything they can to keep him at the club, and as a restricted free agent they will have a few chances to convince him to stay. But he will undoubtedly attract offers from rival teams.

Two of the Giants’ inaugural captains Callan Ward and Phil Davis are both off-contract at the end of 2023. Davis has yet to play this year after being picked up via the rookie list, while Ward is still proving to be an important role player.

Lachie Ash continues to build on his performances, averaging 24 disposals a game, with the former No.4 draft pick remaining patient in the hope of a new deal for 2024 and beyond.

With so much of their cap tied up in a small group of high-profile players, several players could be forced to make way.

They have three talls who can play in the ruck in Braydon Preuss, Lachlan Keeffe and Matthew Flynn all coming off-contract. With the rise of Kieren Briggs, it will be a balancing act to decide which of the trio Kingsley will want to keep around.

Callum Brown and Jake Riccardi were two of the Giants’ best against the Dockers as they look to secure new deals.

Xavier O’Halloran has had one of his most consistent years at GWS, while Daniel Lloyd will be looking to extend his stay after eight years at the club.

Potential trade moves

At its core, the Giants’ side is relatively balanced. They’ve got three elite ball-winning midfielders in Green, Kelly and Coniglio, while their full-strength defence when Whitfield, Ash, Perryman and Haynes are all playing is strong.

With Davis coming towards the end of his career, looking for a key defender could be prioritised, particularly if they aren’t able to hold on to Himmelberg.

The Giants also have two first-round picks in this year’s draft, which could put them in a position to trade up to No.1 again. The focus will be on re-signing some key players, but it gives them the option to be aggressive while looking for trades.

As long as the club is happy to be patient with Aaron Cadman, then there will be no need for them to go searching for another key forward.

Haynes has had one of his quieter seasons and with so much money tied up in his contract could be someone they look to use in any potential deals.

After four matches last season, Leek Aleer has yet to appear in the AFL in 2023. There could be plenty of value in the former No.15 draft pick.

Wade Derksen is another player who has yet to appear for the Giants after being picked up in last year’s mid-season draft. The 22-year-old from WA has 16 goals in the past five weeks in the VFL and could look to force a move.

Champion Data green and red flags

Green flag - Red-hot form

In the past month, the Giants have become one of the best attacking teams in the competition.

Since round 10, GWS are first in the AFL for most points from the forward half. While they’re also in the top four for most points scored inside-50 differential and forward-half intercepts.

The Giants have scored 100+ points in each of the last three weeks, while the 81 points they scored in their win at GMHBA Stadium is the most points by an away side in Geelong since Melbourne in 2021.

Red flag - Leaky defence

Unfortunately, it has been their defence letting them down for the most part in 2023.

Decimated by various injuries, the Giants have struggled to consistently repel opposition attacks.

Their ratio for opposition scores per inside 50, 48 per cent, is the third-highest in the AFL.

They were much improved in the demolition of the Dockers, allowing just 11 scores from 44 inside-50s (25 per cent).

GWS Giants’ Best 22

B: I. Cumming, S. Taylor, C. Idun

HB: L. Whitfield, H. Himmelberg, N. Haynes

C: J. Kelly, H. Perryman, F. Callaghan

HF: B. Daniels, J. Riccardi, T. Greene

F: X. O’Halloran, J. Hogan, T. Bedford

FOL: K. Briggs, T. Green, S. Coniglio

IC: L. Ash, C. Brown, C. Ward, B. Preuss

In: Riccardi, O’Halloran, Briggs, Brown

Out: Lloyd, Peatling, Cadman, Aleer

A few names are interchangeable as the Giants wait for players to return from injury. Daniel Lloyd will still see plenty of game time, but the strong form of Xavier O’Halloran will make it a hard decision for Adam Kingsley as to who they should keep in the side.

Briggs has emerged as the dominant ruckman but would welcome the return of Braydon Preuss to make a formidable combination.

Aaron Cadman drops out of the best side for now but will benefit from more game time at the VFL level.
 
Brave New World said:
Mid-season review of GWS:

GWS mid-season review: Keiren Briggs’ form creates ruck contract logjam

News Corp Australia Sports Newsroom

21 June 2023

The GWS Giants head into the bye on the back of their best victory of the season against Fremantle.

We run our eye over their year so far, and what’s to come for the team from Western Sydney.

Trade review

In:

Toby Bedford (Melbourne)

Picks 1, 15, 18, 19, 31 and 57

Future 1st (Richmond)

Out:

Bobby Hill (Collingwood)

Jacob Hopper (Richmond)

Tim Taranto (Richmond)

Tanner Bruhn (Geelong)

Picks 3, 21, 40, 44, 63

Future 2nd

It was always going to be a chaotic trade period for the Giants, but it had a big impact on their strongest team. The departure of Hill, Hopper, Taranto and Bruhn forced a big readjustment, especially Taranto who has continued his rise as one of the AFL’s best midfielders.

It was an eye to the future with their trades, bringing in the coveted No.1 pick to secure Aaron Cadman. However, Toby Bedford was the one name coming in from Melbourne and has slowly made an impact. He debuted for the Giants in round seven against the Swans, playing every match since. The 23-year-old has impressed with his tackle pressure and is generating more score involvements as the weeks go on.

List management continues to be the big issue for the Giants with so many high draft picks in previous years. While they’ll be lamenting just how well Taranto is playing at Richmond, the strong hand they were able to take into the draft will give them plenty of confidence in the direction they’re heading.

They’ve at the very least come out even on the trades involving Bruhn, Hill and Hopper, with none of the trio going on to have incredible seasons so far.

TIM TARANTO 2022 VS 2023

2022 - LAST SEASON AS A GIANT

Games: 16

Ranking points: 91

Disposals: 25.4

Inside 50s: 3.9

Contested possessions: 9.7

Clearances: 3.8

Tackles: 4.8

2023 - FIRST SEASON AS A TIGER

Games: 14

Ranking points: 120 (+29)

Disposals: 32 (+6.6)

Inside 50s: 3.9

Contested possessions: 13.6 (+3.9)

Clearances: 6.9 (+3.1)

Tackles: 7 (+2.2)

Draft review:

Pick #1 – Aaron Cadman

Pick #16 – Harry Rowston

Pick #21 – Darcy Jones

Pick #22 – Max Gruzewski

Pick #34 – Toby McMullin

Category B rookies – Nick Madden and Jason Gillbee

All eyes are on Aaron Cadman at the Giants and the No.1 draft pick has had an underwhelming start to life in the AFL. The key forward has yet to kick more than one goal in a game and has struggled to get involved in matches, with a season-high of seven disposals against Collingwood. The Giants aren’t worried by his slow start with Adam Kingsley happy to give the 18-year-old all the time he needs to build into life in the AFL. He needs a game where a few more marks stick and he kicks a few goals to get his confidence up.

Harry Rowston is the only other Giants’ draftee to have played in 2023. The midfielder was given a long stretch in the side across the opening months and finished with 14 touches against Carlton in round three. However, the Academy product has been out of the team more recently, only returning for their win against the Kangaroos as the medical sub. He has looked promising in the VFL, averaging just shy of 24 touches a game.

Max Gruzewski has also shown some impressive signs in the VFL, kicking 21 goals in 11 matches. They’ll have to wait until next season to get a glimpse of Darcy Jones after he ruptured his ACL in his first match in the VFL.

Pass mark

For the Giants, 2023 was always going to be a year of unknowns. Would the undeniable talent in their midfield group balance out the departures of four key players? And which players would step up to take the pressure off captain Toby Greene going forward?

Sitting just one win outside the eight going into the bye gets a tick for the Giants, but finals footy would still be a bonus for this group. If they can get at least four more wins this season, it’s probably a strong year – but if they play like they did against Fremantle anything is possible.

However, getting more games into the likes of Tom Green and Finn Callaghan was always a key goal, and they’ve continued to excel at AFL level.

Who is out of contract?

The big story out of the Giants surrounds the future of Harry Himmelberg. An elite and versatile player, the 27-year-old has taken his game to a new level, particularly since being played in defence.

The Giants are doing everything they can to keep him at the club, and as a restricted free agent they will have a few chances to convince him to stay. But he will undoubtedly attract offers from rival teams.

Two of the Giants’ inaugural captains Callan Ward and Phil Davis are both off-contract at the end of 2023. Davis has yet to play this year after being picked up via the rookie list, while Ward is still proving to be an important role player.

Lachie Ash continues to build on his performances, averaging 24 disposals a game, with the former No.4 draft pick remaining patient in the hope of a new deal for 2024 and beyond.

With so much of their cap tied up in a small group of high-profile players, several players could be forced to make way.

They have three talls who can play in the ruck in Braydon Preuss, Lachlan Keeffe and Matthew Flynn all coming off-contract. With the rise of Kieren Briggs, it will be a balancing act to decide which of the trio Kingsley will want to keep around.

Callum Brown and Jake Riccardi were two of the Giants’ best against the Dockers as they look to secure new deals.

Xavier O’Halloran has had one of his most consistent years at GWS, while Daniel Lloyd will be looking to extend his stay after eight years at the club.

Potential trade moves

At its core, the Giants’ side is relatively balanced. They’ve got three elite ball-winning midfielders in Green, Kelly and Coniglio, while their full-strength defence when Whitfield, Ash, Perryman and Haynes are all playing is strong.

With Davis coming towards the end of his career, looking for a key defender could be prioritised, particularly if they aren’t able to hold on to Himmelberg.

The Giants also have two first-round picks in this year’s draft, which could put them in a position to trade up to No.1 again. The focus will be on re-signing some key players, but it gives them the option to be aggressive while looking for trades.

As long as the club is happy to be patient with Aaron Cadman, then there will be no need for them to go searching for another key forward.

Haynes has had one of his quieter seasons and with so much money tied up in his contract could be someone they look to use in any potential deals.

After four matches last season, Leek Aleer has yet to appear in the AFL in 2023. There could be plenty of value in the former No.15 draft pick.

Wade Derksen is another player who has yet to appear for the Giants after being picked up in last year’s mid-season draft. The 22-year-old from WA has 16 goals in the past five weeks in the VFL and could look to force a move.

Champion Data green and red flags

Green flag - Red-hot form

In the past month, the Giants have become one of the best attacking teams in the competition.

Since round 10, GWS are first in the AFL for most points from the forward half. While they’re also in the top four for most points scored inside-50 differential and forward-half intercepts.

The Giants have scored 100+ points in each of the last three weeks, while the 81 points they scored in their win at GMHBA Stadium is the most points by an away side in Geelong since Melbourne in 2021.

Red flag - Leaky defence

Unfortunately, it has been their defence letting them down for the most part in 2023.

Decimated by various injuries, the Giants have struggled to consistently repel opposition attacks.

Their ratio for opposition scores per inside 50, 48 per cent, is the third-highest in the AFL.

They were much improved in the demolition of the Dockers, allowing just 11 scores from 44 inside-50s (25 per cent).

GWS Giants’ Best 22

B: I. Cumming, S. Taylor, C. Idun

HB: L. Whitfield, H. Himmelberg, N. Haynes

C: J. Kelly, H. Perryman, F. Callaghan

HF: B. Daniels, J. Riccardi, T. Greene

F: X. O’Halloran, J. Hogan, T. Bedford

FOL: K. Briggs, T. Green, S. Coniglio

IC: L. Ash, C. Brown, C. Ward, B. Preuss

In: Riccardi, O’Halloran, Briggs, Brown

Out: Lloyd, Peatling, Cadman, Aleer

A few names are interchangeable as the Giants wait for players to return from injury. Daniel Lloyd will still see plenty of game time, but the strong form of Xavier O’Halloran will make it a hard decision for Adam Kingsley as to who they should keep in the side.

Briggs has emerged as the dominant ruckman but would welcome the return of Braydon Preuss to make a formidable combination.

Aaron Cadman drops out of the best side for now but will benefit from more game time at the VFL level.
Click to expand...
I agree with almost all of this, would have Buckley in our best 22 though, instead of Pruess. Himmelberg forward. It is a fairly tall backline, thats ok vs a team with 3 talls.
 
What are people's thoughts about salary cap purchasing via a pick trade? It's been the subject of discussion recently and appears to be gaining traction.

www.afl.com.au

Pick purchasing: Why clubs are keen to buy draft selections

Cal Twomey explains how 'pick purchasing' would fast-track rebuilds and allow powerful teams to contend for longer
www.afl.com.au www.afl.com.au

Here's how pick purchasing would work.

North Melbourne, Essendon and Hawthorn are the three most cashed-up clubs this year but history suggests they will struggle to attract top-end free agents by virtue of their ladder positions. In the past decade, only three restricted free agents (generally the best available) have left a club to join a side that was bottom-six that year - George Hewett at Carlton, Brandon Ellis at Gold Coast and Matthew Leuenberger at Essendon.

However, the free agency system that was designed to help struggling clubs but instead has come to benefit the best can be flipped by the capacity to trade salary cap space for picks.

Hawthorn, keen to speed up its rebuild, could offer Collingwood $500,000 for its first-round draft pick this year. The Pies, knowing they are in the premiership window, might prefer the extra money in their cap to keep their list together and retain a gun player rather than be squeezed out through salary cap issues.

It might be something for GWS to consider. We always say that we don't need more draft picks, we actually need to retain players. (There's some fundamental competition issues that VFL House need to address, but let's just focus on this as a small piece of the puzzle.) Retaining guys like Ash & HH would be the goal, as opposed to ending up with more high draft picks. Of course, the counter is that players could inflate their value and tell the club to trade a pick for more $ for them. It can hurt in the long run if a club doesn't continue to draft youth. I don't see that there would be any change to the requirement for clubs to use a set number of first round picks in a certain number of years, which would be one measure to prevent a club completely selling its future for the present.

Looking at this year, if they brought it in for trade/draft 2023. Using the example above, Collingwood's pick would be expected to be in the #15-18 range for $500k. Is that realistic? Essentially that's one player's wage on slightly above average wages. Just for one year, mind you. So, if we traded the Tiger's pick of say around #11-13, does that get $1m in salary cap relief? Does that bring us any value? We've probably traded the pick that would get us a decent experienced player, unless we don't draft anyone in the first round (which I would not agree with). There's probably no decent FAs this year - do we need any of Parish, Redman, Ben McKay, Doedee?

What about splitting it then? Let's say a trade to Melbourne for #16 & #25. #16 to Norths for $500k (or so), leaves us with a standard first & second round pick this year, plus the extra TPP space in 2024. With Haynes' inflated contract ending next year, that extra TPP could enable us to retain HH and Ash in 2024, with a view to significantly reducing Haynes' contract $ after 2024 (after all, he is in his 30s) and spreading those $ out to Ash/HH/others in future years.

Obviously, clubs will need to remember it's just one year. If they overcommit, they end up pushing the problem a year later, when it bites again, or they need to trade another pick for TPP space (and maybe there's not a spare pick that year).

Thoughts?
 
Giant Strides said:
What are people's thoughts about salary cap purchasing via a pick trade? It's been the subject of discussion recently and appears to be gaining traction.

www.afl.com.au

Pick purchasing: Why clubs are keen to buy draft selections

Cal Twomey explains how 'pick purchasing' would fast-track rebuilds and allow powerful teams to contend for longer
www.afl.com.au www.afl.com.au

Here's how pick purchasing would work.

North Melbourne, Essendon and Hawthorn are the three most cashed-up clubs this year but history suggests they will struggle to attract top-end free agents by virtue of their ladder positions. In the past decade, only three restricted free agents (generally the best available) have left a club to join a side that was bottom-six that year - George Hewett at Carlton, Brandon Ellis at Gold Coast and Matthew Leuenberger at Essendon.

However, the free agency system that was designed to help struggling clubs but instead has come to benefit the best can be flipped by the capacity to trade salary cap space for picks.

Hawthorn, keen to speed up its rebuild, could offer Collingwood $500,000 for its first-round draft pick this year. The Pies, knowing they are in the premiership window, might prefer the extra money in their cap to keep their list together and retain a gun player rather than be squeezed out through salary cap issues.

It might be something for GWS to consider. We always say that we don't need more draft picks, we actually need to retain players. (There's some fundamental competition issues that VFL House need to address, but let's just focus on this as a small piece of the puzzle.) Retaining guys like Ash & HH would be the goal, as opposed to ending up with more high draft picks. Of course, the counter is that players could inflate their value and tell the club to trade a pick for more $ for them. It can hurt in the long run if a club doesn't continue to draft youth. I don't see that there would be any change to the requirement for clubs to use a set number of first round picks in a certain number of years, which would be one measure to prevent a club completely selling its future for the present.

Looking at this year, if they brought it in for trade/draft 2023. Using the example above, Collingwood's pick would be expected to be in the #15-18 range for $500k. Is that realistic? Essentially that's one player's wage on slightly above average wages. Just for one year, mind you. So, if we traded the Tiger's pick of say around #11-13, does that get $1m in salary cap relief? Does that bring us any value? We've probably traded the pick that would get us a decent experienced player, unless we don't draft anyone in the first round (which I would not agree with). There's probably no decent FAs this year - do we need any of Parish, Redman, Ben McKay, Doedee?

What about splitting it then? Let's say a trade to Melbourne for #16 & #25. #16 to Norths for $500k (or so), leaves us with a standard first & second round pick this year, plus the extra TPP space in 2024. With Haynes' inflated contract ending next year, that extra TPP could enable us to retain HH and Ash in 2024, with a view to significantly reducing Haynes' contract $ after 2024 (after all, he is in his 30s) and spreading those $ out to Ash/HH/others in future years.

Obviously, clubs will need to remember it's just one year. If they overcommit, they end up pushing the problem a year later, when it bites again, or they need to trade another pick for TPP space (and maybe there's not a spare pick that year).

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
I don't like it really. If it happens it shouldn't be allowed to affect 1st rounders in my view.
I might be biased, but I think other mechanisms are more important to help us, Gold Coast, the general integrity of the draft ( like 3 year rookie contracts. I would like to see a rule where if players demand a trade after 1 or 2 years, the team signing them has to pay a loading to the original draft position, say 150 points and this being 2 picks only, not junk picks).
I was a bit pissed seeing Tanner Bruhn last night, seemed a bit smug to me ( I guess can't blame him , lots of other players go home.He is enitled to be happy he is playing better, as you would expect a 3rd year player too compared to their 2nd year).
 
Honestly irrelevant to me. It's basically the Bowes trade without having to convince Bowes he's better off at Geelong. So better from the player's POV and easier from the club's. Don't care, basically.
 

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