Autopsy 2023 Round 14 We needed this! Blues break the drought with big win over Suns

[jj1978]

I think Dow should play a full game, probably replacing the injured player that we usually find out about on Fridays

I’d swap him and Cunners... Cunners to sub.

 

[Gethelred]

Think it can feel that way Geth but I like to think people watched the game and had a big sigh of relief. Some peace. Well deserved for all supporters watching and/or turning up

I'm not saying feeling fed up is an unreasonable position. I'm sick of seeing this board flooded with faces I only ever see when we've lost, all too happy to post criticism of club, coach and player but without a positive word in their mouths for any after a victory. It makes me more than a little irritated, because there are people whose positivity has seen them leave this forum because they feel attacked or derided by these people after a bad loss.

We hide behind humour, but one gets an impression that some of our supporter base has conditions on their support. When your own support is not conditional, that tends to grate.

 

[Countryblueswitnotattoos]

I’d swap him and Cunners... Cunners to sub.

Play them both and use Martin as the sub. He clearly can't run out a whole game, so bring him on half-way through the third qtr

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

Great win!


RE: Owies he is clever, gets into some good positions to get himself on the scoresheet and generally shows a lot more footy nous than our other smalls but Jesus is he slow. Far too often defenders beat him for pace to get to the footy and skip away from him (and our forward 50) far too easily.

Happy for him he's kicking goals and he is deserving of his place in the side but it would be disappointing for us as a club if Motlop and Durdin can't go past him as a footballer in the next 12 months.

saw the game live at the G, then watched the replay last night.

Didn't see this happen frankly.

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

Play them both and use Martin as the sub. He clearly can't run out a whole game, so bring him on half-way through the third qtr

Big no to this.

Martin and Cuners are the X factor we crave....and are only just warming up post lengthy layoffs.

Dow in for Fogarty, if anyone.

 

[AndyLucimitis]

The side steps, shimmies and evasiveness from Cunners and Martin is underrated.

Also we have been bemoaning our small forwards not being at the drop of the ball (what was the line - 42,000 know where the ball is going except our small forwards).

Looking at the first half yesterday - Martin front and centre nearly every time. Reads it beautifully.

 

[52Goals4inGranny]

I'm not saying feeling fed up is an unreasonable position. I'm sick of seeing this board flooded with faces I only ever see when we've lost, all too happy to post criticism of club, coach and player but without a positive word in their mouths for any after a victory. It makes me more than a little irritated, because there are people whose positivity has seen them leave this forum because they feel attacked or derided by these people after a bad loss.

We hide behind humour, but one gets an impression that some of our supporter base has conditions on their support. When your own support is not conditional, that tends to grate.

The joint (Carlton)has been ****ed for 20 years mate. What do you expect?

Great to get a win finally. Very trying year. Finding it hard to stay positive and enjoy the games

 

[52Goals4inGranny]

Objectively speaking, Dow has to play...He stood out, he is quick and that's not common in our midfield.

He looked great.

Which actually opens up even more questions.........

 

[Show_Me_The_Money]

Objectively speaking, Dow has to play...He stood out, he is quick and that's not common in our midfield.

He looked great

Yeah but Voss doesn't like him. Had 213m gained in less than a quarter that's world record pace for a midfielder. Four score involvements too.

 

[Robertio]

What?!

There's a few names that stick out ahead of him in our players 23 & under:
Akeui, Binns, Carroll, Cerra, Cottrell, Cowan, De Koning, Dow, Durdin, Hollands, Honey, Kemp, Lemmey, Mirkov, Motlop, O'Brien, O'Keeffe, Philp, Walsh


I wouldn't want to put Jack in the backline now. You're either putting him in for Cincotta or Boyd, which dramatically slows us down and reduces our run form the back half, or you're saying to play him instead of Kemp or McGovern, which again is a reduction in leg speed but also marking ability.

From where I'm sitting, he's depth only.

You don't think that Dow looked ok yesterday?

 

[Blue and Blue]

After 2 hours last week, we were up to more than 20 pages. 2 hours yesterday, and we had 6.

A portion of our supporter base seem to be around solely for the kicking. 'Fed up' might be how they feel, but that isn't my definition of support.

I reckon theres a few would rather we lose cos it vindicates their stance. Supporter is not the right word for that though.

 

[52Goals4inGranny]

I reckon theres a few would rather we lose cos it vindicates their stance. Supporter is not the right word for that though.

I challenge anyone to list 3 genuine positives from this year.....

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

I challenge anyone to list 3 genuine positives from this year.....

Cerra, Charlie, Kemp

 

[CJMB]

You don't think that Dow looked ok yesterday?

He looked alright, but also a little hard to judge in the final 15 mins when we're up by about 10 goals.

I was responding to a claim that he looked about the best of our players under 24, and he's daylight off the likes of Cerra & Walsh.

Not sure I'd be elevating him into the starting 22 next game, because we're sure as hell not dropping Cerra, Cripps, Walsh or Kennedy after their performances, and I actually like the difference we seemed to get from having DC & Fog on the flanks & pinch hitting on-ball.

I'd be pretty keen to keep that midfield structure/balance/CBA-split for the next game to get another look at it, and if Dow comes in he's got to play on-ball like he did after coming on as sub.

 

[Blue and Blue]

I challenge anyone to list 3 genuine positives from this year.....

1. I am alive thats a positive for me (though not necessarily everone would agree....)
2. Carlton Football Club is a positive in life, for me at least. Win lose or draw it's there and fantastic. But its only a part of life also. Theres always music to fall back on when we are out of form or books or hobbies etc. Family and friends too.
3. Every game can be the beginning of something great. Optimism is a better feeling than pessimism.

 

[Robertio]

He looked alright, but also a little hard to judge in the final 15 mins when we're up by about 10 goals.

I was responding to a claim that he looked about the best of our players under 24, and he's daylight off the likes of Cerra & Walsh.

Not sure I'd be elevating him into the starting 22 next game, because we're sure as hell not dropping Cerra, Cripps, Walsh or Kennedy after their performances, and I actually like the difference we seemed to get from having DC & Fog on the flanks & pinch hitting on-ball.

I'd be pretty keen to keep that midfield structure/balance/CBA-split for the next game to get another look at it, and if Dow comes in he's got to play on-ball like he did after coming on as sub.

I like the point of difference he brings to the midfield, I'd like to have a good look at he and Cuningham flying in the same team.

 

[Bell Ringer]

After 2 hours last week, we were up to more than 20 pages. 2 hours yesterday, and we had 6.

A portion of our supporter base seem to be around solely for the kicking. 'Fed up' might be how they feel, but that isn't my definition of support.

When we win our 6th on the trot, knocking off the Pies or Dons, you can compare thread lengths.

 

[ajb72]

Well done team for getting a comprehensive victory. It wasn't too long ago that we bemoaned the inability to put other teams away, so to have done so twice this year is a plus.

 

[ESKIE]

I challenge anyone to list 3 genuine positives from this year.....

Cerra, Hollands (early on ) and beating Geelong

 

[BM123]

I'm not saying feeling fed up is an unreasonable position. I'm sick of seeing this board flooded with faces I only ever see when we've lost, all too happy to post criticism of club, coach and player but without a positive word in their mouths for any after a victory. It makes me more than a little irritated, because there are people whose positivity has seen them leave this forum because they feel attacked or derided by these people after a bad loss.

We hide behind humour, but one gets an impression that some of our supporter base has conditions on their support. When your own support is not conditional, that tends to grate.

Toxic positivity is a thing and I've seen people use it a weapon here to talk themselves up while they take whacks at other supporters. A lot of people are afraid to post on forums in general because they are worried about how others will treat them. It's understandable but the word forum itself is associated with discussion and if they struggle with accepting opposing/negative pov about Carlton that's their hurdle to overcome. Autopsy threads right after a loss are never going to be the best place for feel good vibes and most people are going to be running red hot with emotion. Mods do a good job here but supporters tearing at each other because of being "too positive" or "too negative" is pointless.

Unfortunately people are hardwired to focus on negatives over positives for survival reasons and they are more likely to post when they are emotionally compromised than when they are feeling good after a win. People tend to engage with things the most when they are frustrated. Just look at talk back radio after a loss compared to a win.

There are very few things in life that deserve your unconditional support and a football club shouldn't be one of them. Carlton isn't exactly innocent and it doesn't need any white knights. People can have grievances with something and still be supporters. We've tolerated decades of ineptitude and the humiliating salary cap scandal. Very few people supporting Carlton are fair weather at this point.

Expecting everyone to be flooding back in droves praising Carlton to the heavens after yesterdays win is a bit odd. It was a good win but 2023 like 2022, 2021, 2020 etc has been very disappointing. Personally I was glad to watch us win yesterday even with Kayo's shit stream trying to ruin it but it tasted bittersweet because we rarely play like that when it's do or die.

Heres hoping the club gets as much value out of the season as it can but now would be a poor time to question each others support for the club.

 

[Countryblueswitnotattoos]

Big no to this.

Martin and Cuners are the X factor we crave....and are only just warming up post lengthy layoffs.

Dow in for Fogarty, if anyone.

The last 2 weeks Martin has been subbed out at 3 qtr time, and had no more than 8 possessions. I want him to do well, but all he has ever done is tease us with his potential. We need to move past him.

 

[Gethelred]

Toxic positivity is a thing and I've seen people use it a weapon here to talk themselves up while they take whacks at other supporters. A lot of people are afraid to post on forums in general because they are worried about how others will treat them. It's understandable but the word forum itself is associated with discussion and if they struggle with accepting opposing/negative pov about Carlton that's their hurdle to overcome. Autopsy threads right after a loss are never going to be the best place for feel good vibes and most people are going to be running red hot with emotion. Mods do a good job here but supporters tearing at each other because of being "too positive" or "too negative" is pointless.

Unfortunately people are hardwired to focus on negatives over positives for survival reasons and they are more likely to post when they are emotionally compromised than when they are feeling good after a win. People tend to engage with things the most when they are frustrated. Just look at talk back radio after a loss compared to a win.

There are very few things in life that deserve your unconditional support and a football club shouldn't be one of them. Carlton isn't exactly innocent and it doesn't need any white knights. People can have grievances with something and still be supporters. We've tolerated decades of ineptitude and the humiliating salary cap scandal. Very few people supporting Carlton are fair weather at this point.

Expecting everyone to be flooding back in droves praising Carlton to the heavens after yesterdays win is a bit odd. It was a good win but 2023 like 2022, 2021, 2020 etc has been very disappointing. Personally I was glad to watch us win yesterday even with Kayo's s**t stream trying to ruin it but it tasted bittersweet because we rarely play like that when it's do or die.

Heres hoping the club gets as much value out of the season as it can but now would be a poor time to question each others support for the club.

I think the comment 'expecting everyone to be flooding back in droves praising Carlton to the heavens' isn't the fairest of depictions of my position, BM.

I suppose I expected more 'thank **** for that' than the scant posts we got.

I think I explained my position well enough in the post you quoted. I'll leave it here with this: I'd hazard a guess that most of our connections to this football club are emotional rather than logical, bound up (as tribal support of this kind often is) in notions of family. In this sport, changing clubs is seen as profoundest disloyalty; something you'd sooner die to do. My support of Carlton is due to my father and grandfather and nanna supporting them, but it was forged when I was booed as a child in 2001 on my primary school's AFL day by adults.

Telling me then that my support of Carlton should not be conditional seems to me a bit of a dismissal of those experiences and that connection, something that while not be all that much comfort at present - yesterday excepted - has been a great source of it over the years.

I think sometimes too many focus on the Carlton part of the equation, and not enough on the club part.

 

[gab213]

The last 2 weeks Martin has been subbed out at 3 qtr time, and had no more than 8 possessions. I want him to do well, but all he has ever done is tease us with his potential. We need to move past him.

He had more impact with his 8 possessions yesterday than some players have with 20. His problem is a lack of continuity otherwise I'd imagine that he'd be one of the first picked every time.

 

[Monty1978]

Glad we won for the players , lifts a little pressure off the boys and I can go to work now and not get bagged all day ..glad players like Dow fog and anyone who shows some form in the reserves get rewarded .. I feel like if Voss was doing that from the start of the season we would have been better off

 

[agro]

Toxic positivity is a thing and I've seen people use it a weapon here to talk themselves up while they take whacks at other supporters. A lot of people are afraid to post on forums in general because they are worried about how others will treat them. It's understandable but the word forum itself is associated with discussion and if they struggle with accepting opposing/negative pov about Carlton that's their hurdle to overcome. Autopsy threads right after a loss are never going to be the best place for feel good vibes and most people are going to be running red hot with emotion. Mods do a good job here but supporters tearing at each other because of being "too positive" or "too negative" is pointless.

Unfortunately people are hardwired to focus on negatives over positives for survival reasons and they are more likely to post when they are emotionally compromised than when they are feeling good after a win. People tend to engage with things the most when they are frustrated. Just look at talk back radio after a loss compared to a win.

There are very few things in life that deserve your unconditional support and a football club shouldn't be one of them. Carlton isn't exactly innocent and it doesn't need any white knights. People can have grievances with something and still be supporters. We've tolerated decades of ineptitude and the humiliating salary cap scandal. Very few people supporting Carlton are fair weather at this point.

Expecting everyone to be flooding back in droves praising Carlton to the heavens after yesterdays win is a bit odd. It was a good win but 2023 like 2022, 2021, 2020 etc has been very disappointing. Personally I was glad to watch us win yesterday even with Kayo's s**t stream trying to ruin it but it tasted bittersweet because we rarely play like that when it's do or die.

Heres hoping the club gets as much value out of the season as it can but now would be a poor time to question each others support for the club.

As Rudyard Kipling wrote “If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster and treat those two imposters just the same.”

For us here if allowed to write about both in our own way.