20th AFL Team

[Canberra Pear]

I'm beginning to think now that someone or some people in AFL house don't want a team in Canberra for reasons unknown to me.

What makes you say that?

We haven't been the highest priority in the past, but I feel attitudes have changed with the CEOs.

Gil called us "Giants territory", whereas I've never heard Dillon say that. Dillon has mentioned us a couple of times when discussing a 20th team, whereas Gil never did.

 

[Aussie in exile]

What makes you say that?

We haven't been the highest priority in the past, but I feel attitudes have changed with the CEOs.

Gil called us "Giants territory", whereas I've never heard Dillon say that. Dillon has mentioned us a couple of times when discussing a 20th team, whereas Gil never did.

"Giants territory" being the key words for me in your reply

 

[Giant YoYo]

What makes you say that?

We haven't been the highest priority in the past, but I feel attitudes have changed with the CEOs.

Gil called us "Giants territory", whereas I've never heard Dillon say that. Dillon has mentioned us a couple of times when discussing a 20th team, whereas Gil never did.

The Giants territory comment is a PR exercise, IMO.

As a footy fan, what Canberra gets from this deal is no where near enough. What Sydney gets from this deal in an allegedly competitive market is no where enough.

You can't have a magic/gather round every single weekend in Sydney and have the Giants play 8 games in Sydney and think it's enough.

We then have the NRL Pacific championships that go right into late November/December then NRL pre season commences. Footy just doesn't come anywhere close enough to be in the news cycle compared to league.

It's beyond hilarious to think 8 Giants games in Western Sydney is enough to get growth..

 

[Johnny Bananas]

So did Ireland should we put a team there?

They didn't, actually. Irish players are signed as Cat B rookies, not drafted.

You need to also look at the big picture. In AFL fan surveys the last 5 years NT is comfortably the preference for a 20th team. Tassie being a clear 19th where people power won the day. The game is built by the fans and you have to give them what they want.

No, you don't. If we asked fans whether they should be let into every game for free, I'm sure many would say yes. That doesn't make it a good idea.

What the AFL has to do is figure out what people will pay money for. How many of the fans that were asked will actually fly to Darwin and go to games there? Because Darwin itself sure as hell doesn't have the population to get the kind of weekly numbers you're claiming it will. Canberra does, even before factoring in the towns around it.

If you enter a crowded market you have to innovate and be bold and dynamic.

No, you just have to offer a better product at a reasonable price and promote it.

Team 20 is a massive drastic step. It needs a fresh approach.

It requires no such thing. The maths does not magically change for team 20 compared to previous rounds of expansion. The cost to set up and sustain a team will be what it is (higher in the NT due to the need for a new stadium, the skills shortage and the higher cost of flights), and the amount of revenue they can raise will be what it is (lower in the NT as people are poorer and the population is smaller) regardless of what team number it is.

 

[Canberra Pear]

"Giants territory" being the key words for me in your reply

It's important to get the context around that though.

It was said by the former CEO. It has never been said by the current CEO, who has shown a greater focus on NSW/ACT.

It was also said in 2019. At that time, Tasmanian expansion didn't look likely. So no expansion looked likely.

So without expansion on the horizon, in 2019, being a part of "Giants territory" was the best we could have hoped for. But things have accelerated with Tasmania's acceptance.

 

[WilloTree]

I can understand the romanticism argument for an NT team but I’m sick of hearing this last piece of the jigsaw puzzle argument.

It’s not a complete national comp without the capital city.

There's no team called 'London' in the EPL.

 

[Canberra Pear]

There's no team called 'London' in the EPL.

That's a weird comparison. There's several teams in London.

Nobody is saying our third largest city isn't represented in the AFL because there's no team called 'Perth'.

 

[RedV3x]

Well whatever keep cheering that mortgage.

Do you always make senseless statements.

An NT team is happening

Well, be sure to keep us up-to-date of the next developments.

 

[RedV3x]

Whether new teams are in Canberra or Darwin or both, neither will be a relocated North Melbourne.

Unfortunately for everybody.

 

[Purple Suit]

The only way the NT is happening is if the federal government backs in a team with north of $1 Billion in stadium / training base and ongoing subsidy.

Greater Darwin has 140,000 people. It is 30 hours drive to get to anywhere with more than 25,000 people.

Greater Canberra has almost 4 times the population and is 3 hours from Sydney and 7 hours from Melbourne

Throw in the Riverina, the south coast etc and Canberra is servicing a region of a million people with significant Australian football interest / pedigree.

3 hours drive will pull zero numbers. GWS has 6 million people at their doorstep and they get bugger all crowds.

Canberra is a rugby territory, it’s going to struggle to make traction. WA3 is the safest and most profitable option.

 

[Aussie in exile]

That's a weird comparison. There's several teams in London.

Nobody is saying our third largest city isn't represented in the AFL because there's no team called 'Perth'.

There are 7 premier league teams in London and there are more teams when you go down to the Championship, League 1 and League 2 and they are full time clubs

 

[Purple Suit]

Do you have any idea what's happening out here or are you just going off a southern vibe?

Every. Single. Weekend. There is a magic/gather round.

Inform me as what you have written doesn’t make sense. Are you referring to GWS only getting 12k to games after 10 years and a top 4 finish or Canberra?

 

[L_W_P]

The more time goes on, the more I think WA3 becomes reality, if only so that those teams would get extra games in Perth to mitigate the travel issues.

 

[Canberra Pear]

3 hours drive will pull zero numbers. GWS has 6 million people at their doorstep and they get bugger all crowds.

Canberra is a rugby territory, it’s going to struggle to make traction. WA3 is the safest and most profitable option.

Have you spent much time in Canberra?

We're a mixed code town and have more unrepresented AFL fans than any other city.

 

[The Educator]

3 hours drive will pull zero numbers. GWS has 6 million people at their doorstep and they get bugger all crowds.

Canberra is a rugby territory, it’s going to struggle to make traction. WA3 is the safest and most profitable option.

Jesaulenko, Hird, Mick Conlan....

Canberra has substantial Aus football pedigree. And the relevance of the distance was self evidently for the comparison with Darwin. The cost of a darwin team on the rest of the comp is one of the many factors people overlook

Re WA, you seem one of the very few people from WA who think it is going to work who comment around here.

 

[Canberra Pear]

The more time goes on, the more I think WA3 becomes reality, if only so that those teams would get extra games in Perth to mitigate the travel issues.

Luckily North playing their two games there already reduces travel the same amount as a new team would.

A much cheaper and easier option to reduce the travel load.

 

[L_W_P]

Luckily North playing their two games there already reduces travel the same amount as a new team would.

A much cheaper and easier option to reduce the travel load.

Sure, but I don't know that the AFL would want to keep that going any longer than it has to.

WA3 would solve the problem long term.

The same argument could be made for GWS playing games in Canberra, or GC in Darwin.

Teams can always sell games to increase the coverage.

 

[Saucy]

I still think GWS should have been the Canberra Giants from the start. I think at some point it will still happen.

They should be trying to completely dominate the ACT/Riverina areas. People in WS will never care.

 

[Canberra Pear]

Sure, but I don't know that the AFL would want to keep that going any longer than it has to.

WA3 would solve the problem long term.

The same argument could be made for GWS playing games in Canberra, or GC in Darwin.

Teams can always sell games to increase the coverage.

But Darwin and Canberra aren't the same as Perth. FIFO games there aren't reducing travel time for any one.

Reducing travel for West Coast and Freo is a nice bonus, but it shouldn't be the main reason for a team. Especially when there are easier alternatives available.

 

[WilloTree]

That's a weird comparison. There's several teams in London.

Nobody is saying our third largest city isn't represented in the AFL because there's no team called 'Perth'.

Exactly right. Having 'Canberra' as a team doesn't mean it's not represented.

 

[WilloTree]

There are 7 premier league teams in London and there are more teams when you go down to the Championship, League 1 and League 2 and they are full time clubs

Thank you.

That's expanded my point very well.

 

[Canberra Pear]

Exactly right. Having 'Canberra' as a team doesn't mean it's not represented.

Both Perth teams play all their games there, train there, their players live there, and their club's names at least reference the location. Same for the London teams in the EPL.

Canberra doesn't have any of that.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

But real dynamics are needed. Canberra is fine but a 20th team needs a viable but while option and needs to connect with a wider audience and while I haye the world. A real rizz option. NT just provides something to the game ACT doesnt.
Hoe many junior and footy tours are going to the ACT opposed to NT?

Apart from not knowing what "rizz" is supposed to mean here, a one-off hit is basically nothing in the medium term viability.
ACT already has near the same population of Tas and a far bigger economy, both projected to grow considerably faster than Tas. And all in one geographic location, where Tas is at least 2 (and arguably 3) different markets.
To anyone who thinks Tas is viable (and it may not be once the novelty factor wears off), ACT would be much more so while also providing growth options Tas cannot (already saturated by AFL to the point of destroying the sport, and almost every other sport, locally) and much higher returns per capita on the advertising dollar, much greater corporate money for second and tertiary sponsors lobbying federal government and buying contracts via legal corruption, etc.

However, the ACT government won't be so willing to bankrupt itself over a stadium. They can't even find a way to afford to do anything about the run-down rectangle that will get 2-3 (depending on whether the A-League Mens team happens or not) times the use of an oval.

 

[Bjo187]

I still think GWS should have been the Canberra Giants from the start. I think at some point it will still happen.

They should be trying to completely dominate the ACT/Riverina areas. People in WS will never care.

I don't think it will, the game needs two teams in nsw and the swans are the biggest sporting club in the whole state. They grew massively over time and the giants will too if given the right investment and time.

 

[RedV3x]

3 hours drive will pull zero numbers. GWS has 6 million people at their doorstep and they get bugger all crowds.

Yes, they get NRL sized crowds.

Canberra is a rugby territory,

It was VFL territory. Maybe an AFL team will restore that.

it’s going to struggle to make traction.

You'd expect it to get bigger crowds than at present.
A decent stadium would help a lot.

WA3 is the safest and most profitable option.

Ah, so you're saying that's it's easier for Pth3 to steal existing fans than Canberra to create new fans.
No, you're saying Pth3 will jump on the new generation of football fans - that's the exact same logic
of all developmental regions.