Player Watch #29: Will Phillips [Part II] - Extends to End of 2025

[Junk yard]

No, you've made yourself look like a fool. Repeatedly.

Amongst esteemed posters on a football forum... dear me.

 

[Junk yard]

Laz is a good VFL player. Not afl worthy.

So was Xerri this time last year.

 

[Junk yard]

So are you saying you know better than Clarkson and the rest of the coaching staff? I’m not sure what you’re getting out of potting him on here.

Laz was given an extended run of games earlier on in the year when WP was playing VFL and he obviously didn’t fill his role as Clarko would’ve liked. Phillips is given a shot and has done pretty decent filling his role as per team needs week to week.

And Will's been dropped three times too, his current form is not great either and he's been lucky we've had a few fall over.

 

[Handsome.B.Wonderful]

They'd offer more than some on our list. You do understand the premise of coaches votes?

I do. They provide a very limited perspective on a player's worth and would not be used to comprehensively assess who remains on any AFL list at the end of the year.

I believe Daniel Howe topped our VFL side for Coaches Votes in 2023. Didn't help him retain a spot on our list.

 

[Junk yard]

How many coaches votes did Archer get?

Four. Bet you didn't expect that answer? They are coaches votes mate, not brownlow votes. The two coaching panels vote on their determined best players, this often includes role players. If you do what the coach asks of you really well, you will get votes. They are a direct insight into the coaches thoughts.

 

[chubbspeterson]

It's probably somewhere in between the negative comments on his game vs over the top praise imo.
Will was solid, had some good tackles, neat handballs/kicks, not all that damaging and kicked a goal. Had a crucial intervention in the last quarter that stopped a turnover.

I'd probably lean more towards giving him a 1 year extension vs trade value if its just 3rd round offers.
I wonder if he get fitter and play a pressure forward role and stay in that way given he can kick goals and tackle?

I think Lazzaro will be traded. He might be unlucky but being out of contract and the fact he's never really performed all that well at AFL level in multiple roles tells me he's probably just a very good depth VFL player.

 

[Junk yard]

I do. They provide a very limited perspective on a player's worth and would not be used to comprehensively assess who remains on any AFL list at the end of the year.

I believe Daniel Howe topped our VFL side for Coaches Votes in 2023. Didn't help him retain a spot on our list.

But you'd expect more than two from a bloke in his fourth year that's trying to forge a career? He's regressed everywhere from a poor season last year.

 

[FootySmartSimpson]

View attachment 2069412
Did you watch the game? Funny areas for a mid/forward.

This is not netball. AFL midfielders can actually venture into defensive 50. I actually don’t know what kind of feeble point you trying to make.

2/3 of his possessions are in the HF zone. If you really want to prove yourself wrong further, have a look at the heat maps of the top 10 mids of the round and you will see an even spread.

 

[joegreen]

What a divisive player.

I'd still offer him a 2 year deal.

Not wrong. I wonder who are the ducks and who are the rabbits.

Time will tell.

 

[DuckYeah]

So was Xerri this time last year.

Not in Clarksons eyes.

 

[lockheed]

Don't agree based on current performances. Powell's numbers have steadily improved year on year.
I'm still not fully convinced on Powell athletically but he looks more likely to make it than Will at this stage.
Will has some serious work to do on his confidence kicking the ball and building his fitness.

That's the key. Assuming he gets a one year contract, and if he can substantially increase his fitness / work rate and get from contest to contest, he'll have the tools to be a valuable member of the team. But if he doesn't or can't, then we can't justify keeping him on our list beyond 2025.

 

[7577969923]

But you'd expect more than two from a bloke in his fourth year that's trying to forge a career? He's regressed everywhere from a poor season last year.

But it's pretty clear the coaches rate him above Lazarro, so VFL Coaches' Votes are clearly not a great predictor of AFL performance.

Charlie has had his opportunities this year with 11 senior games and only averaged 11 disposals per game. Phillips has more disposals, is a much better user and decision-maker, and is far better defensively than Lazarro.

 

[DrZaius]

It's probably somewhere in between the negative comments on his game vs over the top praise imo.
Will was solid, had some good tackles, neat handballs/kicks, not all that damaging and kicked a goal. Had a crucial intervention in the last quarter that stopped a turnover.

I'd probably lean more towards giving him a 1 year extension vs trade value if its just 3rd round offers.
I wonder if he get fitter and play a pressure forward role and stay in that way given he can kick goals and tackle?

I think Lazzaro will be traded. He might be unlucky but being out of contract and the fact he's never really performed all that well at AFL level in multiple roles tells me he's probably just a very good depth VFL player.

People keep bringing this up but tbh I haven't seen much, if any, over the top praise for Phillips. The most praise he usually gets are comments along the lines of "he played his role well" or "had this good specific moment", which is about what you'd expect for a sub-50 game inside mid.

 

[Junk yard]

But it's pretty clear the coaches rate him above Lazarro, so VFL Coaches' Votes are clearly not a great predictor of AFL performance.

Charlie has had his opportunities this year with 11 senior games and only averaged 11 disposals per game. Phillips has more disposals, is a much better user and decision-maker, and is far better defensively than Lazarro.

Playing completely different roles and I'm sure Charlie was sub once or twice. Will is getting games to see where he's at, not because of form. Colby will go in soon enough and this argument will be moot.

 

[Flawed Genius]

I mean, what I saw was Will contributing.

You can focus on a bunch of different things with a bunch of different players, and there are definitely things he can continue to improve on. He can tighten up his longer kicking. He can work on his leg speed. He can build his tank.

But I also see hin winning a clearance and handballing to LDU for his long running goal. I see him in a perfect position to receive from Sheezel and kick a perfectly weighted left foot snap for a goal. I see him finding space in the 50 and taking a strong mark and converting to keep us in touch on the first quarter. I see him wanting the footy more, using his body well to position himself around a Tigers player and turn a 50/50 ball into a Phillips ball, then disposing neatly by hand. I've posted in here before that I think LDU having 33 and 3, or Sheezel having a billion and kicking two isn't possible, or at the very least as likely, if you don't have Phillips at the coalface as a defensive clearance midfielder. And I think his stats from the weekend prove this. 15 touches, three of them genuine clearances. 1 goal and a goal assist. Six tackles. He stands up at the source, he plays a thankless task, and he makes the lives of our prime movers easier. I think he's doing exactly what he needs to and what he's being asked to. I would like to see him get another two years.

 

[Flawed Genius]

Also he's a 1000% better footballer than Lazzaro. Laz is a great VFL level footballer but he doesn't have the tricks Phillips does.

 

[Sillygit]

People keep bringing this up but tbh I haven't seen much, if any, over the top praise for Phillips. The most praise he usually gets are comments along the lines of "he played his role well" or "had this good specific moment", which is about what you'd expect for a sub-50 game inside mid.

if there is any over the top praise it pails in comparision to one dude's mission to type him out of the team

 

[7577969923]

Playing completely different roles and I'm sure Charlie was sub once or twice. Will is getting games to see where he's at, not because of form. Colby will go in soon enough and this argument will be moot.

If anything, Charlie should have been getting more disposals, as for several games Will had been asked to stop one of the opposition's best mids.

By your logic, they gave Charlie 11 games to see where he is at after building some pre-season hype, and it turns out he's not really up to AFL standard. Seems like a great young guy, clearly trains hard, can run and has a bit of pace, just not that good at the pure football parts.

 

[ferball]

Tom Murphy and Will Fordham are VFL coaches votes darlings as well.

Should we re-draft them?

Funny you mention Murphy cos I was just thinking the other day that Clarko might have made a half decent footballer out of him.

 

[ferball]

But you'd expect more than two from a bloke in his fourth year that's trying to forge a career? He's regressed everywhere from a poor season last year.

While he has regressed last year wasn't a poor season.

And in the game on the weekend he played a crucial role in our first two (should have been three) goals by working very effectively with our midfielders while we were struggling early in the game.

 

[The Dingrel]

That's the key. Assuming he gets a one year contract, and if he can substantially increase his fitness / work rate and get from contest to contest, he'll have the tools to be a valuable member of the team. But if he doesn't or can't, then we can't justify keeping him on our list beyond 2025.

Personally think we should give him a couple of years to show a bit of faith. Hell the kid has had such an interrupted start to his career with Covid, and then bouts of glandular. Missed all of 2022. 2023 averaged 19 touches across 16 games. Down a touch this year but has been subbed, and played a run with role. While he's a 4th year player...the amount of footy he has played probably equates to a kid late in his second/early third season of AFL. Can train and run all you like, but there's nothing like playing games of footy to really build the tank. Taking everything into consideration, his stats compare very well with a second or third year Swallow, Cunnington, or LDU. I think people's problem with Will Phil is they're spoiled by comparing him to the impact Sheezel, McKercher, and Wardlaw have made early in their careers. Trading him would be a massive mistake.

 

[lockheed]

It's more after sitting back and looking at other sides that are going ok, for us our midfield should consist of

1. LDU - he can go fwd
2. Wardlaw - seems more labradore chasing a ball, so purely midfield
3. Simpkin - can go fwd with some success, his ball butchering is for the first time getting on my nerves, but he knows where to be.
4. Sheezel - can do it all
5. McKercher - will be a mid who can play other roles
6. Powell - is ahead of Phillips and maybe he's learning the art of being adaptable.
7. Undrafted - I assume we will take a mid with pick 3, the local experts would have forgotten more about the available players than I'd know. I don't draft watch.
8. Phillips - one-paced stopper with limited ball winning ability.

You do the math, now yes if he stays I'm not concerned, but heck for us to improve we cannot carry players, we're 17th and will probably finish 16th. After 4 previous years of between 18th/17th.

Currently we have the below players with a very high ceiling.

1. Archer - who is going well but a mile of the finished product, that's a compliment
2. Duursma - isn't much he cannot do on the park, is 3 miles off the finished product.
3. McKercher - loving his run, 13 games in, so as above
4. Comben - cripes, I did say he'd be the ' difference'. if he ever got fit.
5. Wardlaw - sloppy trainer, but will get there.
6. Sheezel, really has arrived but will get stronger and further improve, mind boggles.

So you'd pick those six every week, ride the ups and downs.
But the likes of Phillips, Ford for example I do wonder what their ceiling will be.

I think Will would be crackers to stay fwiw.

Give or take a few injuries, he's at least good depth

 

[Makeshift Park]

If Phillips is our worst inside mid for the next couple years, things really will have turned for the better.

 

[Mcarcherey]

not a bad game considering:

14 CBA's
69% game time - the least of the team outside of stephens and hansen.

give him another year to get fitter after all the sickness he's had and see what he's made of.

 

[ferball]

One more point that was made by a commentator during the game and looked fairly accurate on tv (but its harder to tell properly) was just how hard our other mids were working to make blocks and create lanes for LDU and Sheeze. That's Will and Jy alot of the time.