A question for the non Bandwagon world game supporters

[Joffaboy]

unlike me who is a self confessed Socceroos bandwagoner.

Have the new converts been spoiled by this national team?

The fantastic win against Uraguay last November was apparently a very good game.

Now at these finals.

Against Japan 3 goals in eight minutes.

A very good showing against heavyweight WC champs Brazil.

And according to some the best (certainly weirdest) game so far of the finals and a great come from behind 2-2 draw against Croatia.

Must admit I have been fascinated and very entertained by the games the Aussies have played in. Have been told that many international games are dour affairs and the games I have seen are exceptional.

Is it because the Aussies play an attacking game or is it just because of circumstance such as the Croatia game where the game ebbed and flowed because of the 1-0, 1-1, 2-1,2-2 scoreline.

If international soccer is this exciting all the time, I would expect that soccer would gain a real and substantial foothold in Australia, but if it is only circumstance and the Soccerroos lose momentum mabye soccer may not take the great leap forward.

Still, this WC has given me a great appreciation for football, its skill, tactics, and the obvious passion.

Cheers.

 

[m.diddy]

i'm a bandwagoner, but i reckon it would be due to our attacking nature.

 

[moomba]

To an extent, I think for most of us who have watched over a decade of dross in an Australian shirt we can't quite believe the type of football Australia is playing.

I think much of it has to do with the quality of the team, we are capable of playing attractive football. Much of it has to do with the manager, who isn't afraid to chase a game (contrast with Englands manager, and they are just about the most boring team in football at the moment). Much of it has to do with the Aussie attitude to sport in general. And finally much of it has to do with the World Cup atmosphere and aura, it really is the most phenomenal sporting competition in the world.

I think the choice of the next manager is crucial, I would hate to see us turn into a long ball defensive unit (despite my suggestion of Martin O'Neill as a possible candidate), get someone who likes free flowing attractive, attacking football and we've all got many wonderful moments watching the national team to look forward to.

 

[RoosterLad]

We attack rather than sit back because thats basically the only way we know how to play, we cant sit back and hold the ball up for too long. Its great though as it makes for an exciting game.

Its also the 'Aussie spirit' we believe in ourselves, never give up, always go in hard.

Ive followed the world game for over half my life, ive experienced the pain many times over so now we are finally performing so well on the world's biggest stage im absolutely loving it.

I will be gutted if Italy beat us because i dont want this exciting ride to end.

 

[tribey]

I think much of it has to do with the quality of the team, we are capable of playing attractive football. Much of it has to do with the manager, who isn't afraid to chase a game (contrast with Englands manager, and they are just about the most boring team in football at the moment). Much of it has to do with the Aussie attitude to sport in general. And finally much of it has to do with the World Cup atmosphere and aura, it really is the most phenomenal sporting competition in the world.

Like a lonely peanut, that's it in a nutshell.

From about 2000-onwards when we sent a confident Scotland on their path to destruction with our 2-0 friendly win at Hampden, I always knew we'd see such a day when we'd be able to mix it like we have though.

You can't have a midfield boasting,

Kewell (Liverpool)
Bresciano (Parma)
Cahill (Everton)
Culina (PSV)
Grella (Parma)

...and not have it do well and create chances under the right conditions of cohesion and management. These guys do the business week-in, week-out at the highest levels of club football - why can't they repeat the dosage at international level?

The global perception that we were a pack of dirty hacks and the subsequent surprise when we played cavalier, confident football against Brazil - even at the death when most teams would've buttoned up and happily taken an honourable 1-0 reverse - was nothing but ignorance given the first team talent we do possess.

Depth is obviously still a problem though, hello Simunic, Seric, Ergic.

 

[Maguire#31]

Is the fact we play so attacking and attractive styled football cos we don't have genuine full backs? Possibly only Neill is the only genuine full back?

We are actually playing the ball around like a genuine side. The improvemen since November is amazing. Watch the WCQ Sydney Leg andcompare to Australia v. Brazil and its a totally different and more confident unit. I'm Lovin IT!

 

[tribey]

Is the fact we play so attacking and attractive styled football cos we don't have genuine full backs? Possibly only Neill is the only genuine full back?

Definitely a factor - we've only got one genuine centre-half (Moore) as well.

Our lack of natural talent in defence is why the decisions of Josip Simunic and Ante Seric to play for Croatia cut us all to the quick.

With those two in the lineup not only would we have qualified for Korea/Japan 2002, we'd also be far more stable at the back in this one.

 

[Maguire#31]

Definitely a factor - we've only got one genuine centre-half (Moore) as well.

Our lack of natural talent in defence is why the decisions of Josip Simunic and Ante Seric to play for Croatia cut us all to the quick.

With those two in the lineup not only would we have qualified for Korea/Japan 2002, we'd also be far more stable at the back in this one.

For sure hence why Vinnie Grella is such an important part of our side. Too have him save attack after attack before it gets to the final line in imperative. Is Lucas Neill a tad like Gary Neville? If he was 5-10 cm's taller he'd be one of the worlds premier centre-halves?

On the AIS, why is this not a similar scheme to HECS? The players that leave this earn mega dollars after being in the game by my tax payer dollars?

 

[tribey]

For sure hence why Vinnie Grella is such an important part of our side. Too have him save attack after attack before it gets to the final line in imperative. Is Lucas Neill a tad like Gary Neville? If he was 5-10 cm's taller he'd be one of the worlds premier centre-halves?

Grella is a legend - I was won over the instant I heard his pre-match interview on SBS prior to the Australia vs England game. Such passion and fervour for the shirt - and he wasn't even starting.

With all the debate over Kewell, Bosnich, Zelic, Viduka and the like's commitment to the shirt it was refreshing to hear for the first time (from someone other than a starry-eyed NSL-level backup) what an honour it is to represent Australia and that the green and gold is a privilege that comes first. An absolute terrier who holds down arguably the most important role in the team.

As regards Neill, he has always been a solid to very good fullback, but the way he has excelled in his role as emergency centre-half for Oz has surprised everyone I'm sure. Not certain he could play to this level for long periods, height boost or not, but gee, let's hope it lasts for as long as possible. At 27 or 28yo he is certainly enjoying his peak period.

On the AIS, why is this not a similar scheme to HECS? The players that leave this earn mega dollars after being in the game by my tax payer dollars?

It's been touted for awhile now, not just for the footballers but for the likes of our swimmers who are earning megabucks.

Why is it that a medical student - who is studying to become a healer and save lives to benefit the community directly - has to pay back thousands, while an elite athlete brought up via the various sports institutes can even play for another country but doesn't have to pay back a cent?

 

[The Fonz]

unlike me who is a self confessed Socceroos bandwagoner.

Have the new converts been spoiled by this national team?

The fantastic win against Uraguay last November was apparently a very good game.

Now at these finals.

Against Japan 3 goals in eight minutes.

A very good showing against heavyweight WC champs Brazil.

And according to some the best (certainly weirdest) game so far of the finals and a great come from behind 2-2 draw against Croatia.

Must admit I have been fascinated and very entertained by the games the Aussies have played in. Have been told that many international games are dour affairs and the games I have seen are exceptional.

Is it because the Aussies play an attacking game or is it just because of circumstance such as the Croatia game where the game ebbed and flowed because of the 1-0, 1-1, 2-1,2-2 scoreline.

If international soccer is this exciting all the time, I would expect that soccer would gain a real and substantial foothold in Australia, but if it is only circumstance and the Soccerroos lose momentum mabye soccer may not take the great leap forward.

Still, this WC has given me a great appreciation for football, its skill, tactics, and the obvious passion.

Cheers.

There are other reasons to take into account. Besides cricket this is the only major sport which is truly a national one. But the cricket team are flat track bullies who are the best of five or six decent teams. Much of the Australian public actually dislike the Australian cricket team.

The Socceroos though have that massive underdog tag and no one likes to see an underdog prevail more than Australians. We finally get to compete on a world stage and in fact are showing that we are actually a good side. I wouldn't be suprised if privately FIFA aren't conceding now that for all this time Oceania should have been given its own spot just so we would be there tournament after tournament just like Mexico and Korea.

Before the tournament I was worried how a three and out performance would be accepted by everyone. After all while qualifying is good, a dud performance like Poland's, Saudi Arabia's, S&M's doesn't mean much. Don't have to worry about that anymore.

Just wonder what sort of conversion the World Cup has for the A-League. What sort of crowds and exposure will the competition now get as a result of this?

 

[Cooldude]

It's a team game

The best thing I've seen improved is our play off the ball, just look at how we play when we don't have the ball, that's exactly the difference.

Grella is a star, and one of the reasons of our rise since Guus's reign. The guy holds up the midfield so well it ain't funny.

With the talent we have at our disposal, even during the Farina era we were able to play some nice stuff. But it's the total change of philosophy of the type of football we played to now instigated by Guus that is the major change. We play possession football, we now keep the ball very well, the back four is now organised and clued up on what they should be doing. Our movement's terrific and every individual player knows their specific roles in the side

There are always lots of rubbish hype about Harry Kewell, but the likes of Jason Culina, Vinnie Grella, etc don't get anywhere near enough the credit.

 

[Maguire#31]

Grella is a legend - I was won over the instant I heard his pre-match interview on SBS prior to the Australia vs England game. Such passion and fervour for the shirt - and he wasn't even starting.

With all the debate over Kewell, Bosnich, Zelic, Viduka and the like's commitment to the shirt it was refreshing to hear for the first time (from someone other than a starry-eyed NSL-level backup) what an honour it is to represent Australia and that the green and gold is a privilege that comes first. An absolute terrier who holds down arguably the most important role in the team.

Seconded, he's my favourite player. He seems to have a genuine love and feeling of pride/privlidge to pull the shirt on. You can't help loving players ala Vidmar, Grella, Moore etc...
On it being the most important role, all good teams seem to have a player that controls the game. Look at the EPL over the last decade, its no suprise that Man Utd, Arsenal and Chelsea have won all the titles with Roy Keane, Pat Vieira and Makelele holding the fort. They not only kill attack after attack but control the tempo of the game, when they're on the back foot they can slow the match down and vice versa push the game forward when needed. I think its the position to build a side around and Vinnie is the first player I'd pick if I was Guus.

As regards Neill, he has always been a solid to very good fullback, but the way he has excelled in his role as emergency centre-half for Oz has surprised everyone I'm sure. Not certain he could play to this level for long periods, height boost or not, but gee, let's hope it lasts for as long as possible. At 27 or 28yo he is certainly enjoying his peak period.

He is playing out of his skin, had a good season for Blackburn but i bet their supporters wished him and Emo played like this for them! I'd take Lucas at Hearts in a second. Just on lacking in the back half, is not taking Kisnorbo or Milicevic going to be a bit of a mistake? Kisnorbo's flexibility would be especially handy...

It's been touted for awhile now, not just for the footballers but for the likes of our swimmers who are earning megabucks.

Why is it that a medical student - who is studying to become a healer and save lives to benefit the community directly - has to pay back thousands, while an elite athlete brought up via the various sports institutes can even play for another country but doesn't have to pay back a cent?

Exactly and in a lot of cases the Sport stars have a lot more means to pay the money back. They're on a massive amount of coin in a lot of cases. The guys that defected to Croatia must be bleeding now, sold out their country for **** all... Sold their souls for the WC. Didliuca even said he is 100% Australian and will move here when he is finished his career. I met him and liked when I worked at the Knights for a little while and was shattered when he defected, Now I just pity him

 

[windyhill]

To an extent, I think for most of us who have watched over a decade of dross in an Australian shirt we can't quite believe the type of football Australia is playing.

.

Dross ? I`d call it heart break. Dross is too harsh mate.

 

[moomba]

I'm going back to the Eddie Thompson, Frank Arok days. Dross was certainly how I'd describe the national team. Played for 1-0 wins, and normally failed to get close to achieving that.

 

[grimlock]

I'm going back to the Eddie Thompson, Frank Arok days. Dross was certainly how I'd describe the national team. Played for 1-0 wins, and normally failed to get close to achieving that.

There's a lot to love about the 4-5-1 formation.

 

[Deej]

Can´t add much to this thread that hasn´t already been said. I bloody love vinnie grella too.
Re answering question i think another reason for our success up to now is the support the fans have been giving them in the stadiums, we´ve been yelling our guts out game after game and i really reckon it fires them up. I reckon it´s like a spare man out on the pitch, when they look a bit jaded we just yell and it´s like lift boys lift and they just keep going.

I´m back in kaiserslauten now and i have to say this town is just a sensational place to enjoy the world cup, best i´ve been to by a mile. The town has really put it on, unlike munich which made hardly any effort at all. Here the streets are a party 24hrs of the day, they have stages set up with bands everywhere, music pumping people singing and dancing and waving flags, and they have heaps of aussie stuff which is fantastic. 5000 aussies singing we come from a land down under with face paint, flags waving, scarf twirling, beer guzzling antics aplenty. It´s mayhem here, f§cking fantastic experience, shudder to think what will happen should we beat italy. More dancing, singing and slamming beer into our guts i guess.
Come on you socceroos.

 

[Weaver]

I'm going back to the Eddie Thompson, Frank Arok days. Dross was certainly how I'd describe the national team. Played for 1-0 wins, and normally failed to get close to achieving that.

Have to agree with you.

Australia used to be boring, defensive and cowardly. We picked a heap of big, strong thugs and kicked teams to death. We basically played long-ball to guys like Krncevic, Mitchell, Kosmina and Arnold.

For a generation all our best players were sweepers like Yankos, Zelic, Okon.

We were a joke on the world stage.

This Australian team has nothing in common with what we have been served up for 20+ years previously.

It will be interesting to see if this is a once in a generation spike. We have never had so many top-draw players at the one time before. If we lose Kewell, Aloisi and Viduka to retirement they are much tougher to replace for us than many nations. A strikeforce of Kennedy and Thompson just doesn't begin to compare.

When you see guys like Milligan and Wilkshire in the squad ... well we aren't that far away from being a bit rubbish.

 

[ErnieSigley]

It will be interesting to see if this is a once in a generation spike. We have never had so many top-draw players at the one time before. If we lose Kewell, Aloisi and Viduka to retirement they are much tougher to replace for us than many nations. A strikeforce of Kennedy and Thompson just doesn't begin to compare.

When you see guys like Milligan and Wilkshire in the squad ... well we aren't that far away from being a bit rubbish.

Agree.
Greece showed in Euro 2004 its more about the team not the individuals. I understand you need your very good players to win a WC but like AFL there are a lot of stars that never reached the top in a team.
Most Australian teams in any sport have a capacity to give their best and fight for each other. Hiddink's harnessed it. I don't think that will change in years to come.
With the current exposure and Australias love of sport the next Kewells and Cahills will come through. Hopefully better and more of them.

 

[Weaver]

Greece showed in Euro 2004 its more about the team not the individuals.

But then Ukraine showed them that one star player can make the world of difference and eliminated them in qualifying.

Most Australian teams in any sport have a capacity to give their best and fight for each other. Hiddink's harnessed it. I don't think that will change in years to come.

In AFL you can huff and puff and scrap and be competitive. Soccer can be a crueller beast. Ronaldo can jog on the spot and score two goals and Brazil can win, whereas for all the heart in the world Australia have struggled to convert.

Paul Hudson was despised in the AFL for doing nothing but kicking goals. In soccer he would be worshiped for it.

Star players can make so much more of an impact where all they have to do is break a 0-0 deadlock. To have a similar impact an AFL star would have to be a 15-goal, or 50 possesion player.

Judd can influence a game and be a dominant player. He can't literally win it with one touch (or stumble ) in the way that a Shevchenko can.

 

[MrAaron]

Any money about 2 weeks after the world cup is over all these bandwagone fans will jump right back off and go back to enjoying their Rugby League/AFL/Rugby Union club teams.

No 2 worries about that Sonny Jim !

 

[MrAaron]

There's a lot to love about the 4-5-1 formation.

Not when you have Viduka as your lone Striker. He is a bloody rabble to say the least. 6 goals in 37 internationals. that is 1 of the worst strike rates of any striker anywhere in the world. After the world cup I'd either demand he retires or I'd personally drop him for the remainder of his footballing career.

A striker is emant to score scores not only just assist his team mates up the field.

 

[Deej]

Any money about 2 weeks after the world cup is over all these bandwagone fans will jump right back off

Just enjoy the game, forget comparisons. this is a glorious experience just enjoy it.

 

[Joffaboy]

Thanks to all the contributions.

Deej, if you read this dont fall off your chair, but i am definately taking your advice and truly enjoying the ride. Why not? The team has performed above expectations and has represented our country with pride and has been a credit to themselves and Australia.

As for jumping off well, the WC is a hard act to follow, and AFl is my first love, but most of us bandwagoners have a new appreciation for the world game and will watch with renewed interest. Cant ask for more than that from a country that traditionally scorned soccer as a second rate game, not suited to the Australian character. This current national team has hopefully foreever dispelled that belief.

 

[Diego]

Start to follow Melbourne Victory Joffaboy. The standard is not world class but the league needs to turn converts like yourself into full time fans. And it won't get in the way of the AFL season as well.

Well done for giving it a go!

 

[Borgsta]

Not when you have Viduka as your lone Striker. He is a bloody rabble to say the least. 6 goals in 37 internationals. that is 1 of the worst strike rates of any striker anywhere in the world. After the world cup I'd either demand he retires or I'd personally drop him for the remainder of his footballing career.

A striker is emant to score scores not only just assist his team mates up the field.

Once again, you are an idiot. Viduka has been in the top 3-4 players for us this WC.