Coach Adam Simpson Megathread est. 2017 - Staying for 2024, Lyon’s Cryin’

[InTheWings]

What players did we lose with the soft cap? Excuse after excuse at our club, we are crap and it’s time We accepted we are an average team coached very poorly.

i did say staff, not players, but yeah - there's no excuse. We need to be taking a good hard look at ourselves.

 

[Scotland]

i said staff, not players.

Isn't that the point?

In a perfect world we'd have as many assistant coaches and trainers and boot studders as we like, but at the end of the day they don't run out on game day.

Andrew Gaff was one of the best wingmen in the comp. Jack Darling was an AA key forward. These guys have been in the side for 10 years and played 200+ games each. They shouldn't be be performing poorly because of soft cap cuts.

 

[InTheWings]

Isn't that the point?

In a perfect world we'd have as many assistant coaches and trainers and boot studders as we like, but at the end of the day they don't run out on game day.

Andrew Gaff was one of the best wingmen in the comp. Jack Darling was an AA key forward. These guys have been in the side for 10 years and played 200+ games each. They shouldn't be be performing poorly because of soft cap cuts.

Yes, that is pretty much my point from a couple of posts back.

 

[Kwality]

I have always thought anything less than a Prelim appearance is a crappy year.

On SM-G925I using BigFooty.com mobile app

You are in contention with a PF ...

 

[WCE_phil]

Yes, I am aware.

Our best players are all 30+ and declining steadily.

I'm advocating a rebuild. Is Simpson the best person for that? Not sure but he at least deserves a chance after taking us to the only flag Richmond hasn't won in the last 4 years. If it's the same outdated game plan next year, then he gets put on notice, because the club ain't sacking him with 3 years to run on his contract with the current soft cap restrictions.

Any coach can be sacked and only paid out 6 months. It's a clause in all coaching contracts now. Hence the Clarko committing to the club and such publicly. They either need to outright sack their 4 time premiership coach and make the whole thing look like even more of a shitshow or they agreed to pay him for all of next years contract and he goes quietly.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Any coach can be sacked and only paid out 6 months. It's a clause in all coaching contracts now.

I’d never heard of that, but apparently it’s a thing: https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl...yout-clauses-for-coaches-20200918-p55wu1.html

But it only applies to clubs getting AFL handouts, so it won’t necessarily be in Simmo’s contract.

 

[ThePuma #9]

Just another reason why Nisbett needs to be held accountable as well. Adam Simpson had a contract for next year if I’m not mistaken.

What was the rush in extending him in the early stages of this year exactly?

 

[bzparkes]

Still got a better record than Bevo, all things considered. Who knows, might turn it all around next year?

 

[Clubs are trumps]

I’d never heard of that, but apparently it’s a thing: https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl...yout-clauses-for-coaches-20200918-p55wu1.html

But it only applies to clubs getting AFL handouts, so it won’t necessarily be in Simmo’s contract.

Then its done. Sack him and recruit an attacking coach that instills some hardness and accountable footy.

 

[The Passenger]

I'm advocating a rebuild. Is Simpson the best person for that? Not sure but he at least deserves a chance after taking us to the only flag Richmond hasn't won in the last 4 years. If it's the same outdated game plan next year, then he gets put on notice, because the club ain't sacking him with 3 years to run on his contract with the current soft cap restrictions.

Assuming he's still coaching in 2021, the key is going to be seeing a different game plan that can stand up to pressure, something that has been missing for a long time. It's never been a particularly big part of the Simpson game plan, but we definitely had a more physical presence in our flag year.

An obvious issue in 2021 has been a lack of fitness. Endurance absolutely has to be a priority in the 21/22 off-season.

The big question is go again in 2022 or start the rebuild. The latter would mean "the chat" with JK and Hurn. Legends they are and easy in our best 22 but if the cue is in the rack with this playing group, then the list turn over needs to start now.

If we go again in 2022, then we need to see significant turnaround from our top players. This seems optimistic given NN and - to a lesser extent - Redden are the only guys 27+ who are improving. Would a new coach turn this around? If we are going to go again, and replace the coach, the only one we should consider is Clarkson, but he might not even be interested in heading west.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Nothing to even be discussed here, Simmo is out of his depth. Done a good job as a novelty coach and we won a flag, now has fallen away.
Need to move on.

 

[kid_a]

Getting in a decent tackling coach can't be done quick enough.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Getting in a decent tackling coach can't be done quick enough.

Yep that will change everything lol

 

[The_Gambler]

Still got a better record than Bevo, all things considered. Who knows, might turn it all around next year?

who knows, we may also improve the year after, or the year after? Let’s give it 3 more years with the same team snd game plan. Nothing like backing them in, that always seems to work

 

[BlueandGoldforever]

Have another go at it mate, I didn’t get it the first few times.

Coaching chat goes in the coaching thread. Votes go in the votes thread. Previews go in the preview thread. I’ll let you figure out where the non Eagles discussion goes, but the answer might surprise you.

While we’re at it, if the title of a thread is enough to articulate the entirety of your thoughts on a topic, you’ve probably not thought hard enough about that topic.

Share your thoughts on the coach in here, as you can see in the title above it is the coaching thread!

I disagree. This is a general topic about coaching. My thread was specific about sacking the coach. There is a difference, which you can't comprehend.

 

[Karim Abdul Yeo]

Still got a better record than Bevo, all things considered. Who knows, might turn it all around next year?

I really get annoyed when posts like this appear.This is what happens when you look at only raw data.It is called Data analysis for a reason. take into account home-court advantage, Perth home-court advantage is enormous as bad as travel is for WA players to VIC, it is the same the other way around. so off the bat, try to figure out if those wins have been weighted and adjusted based on home and away. if you do, you will see Simmo win losses is not that good actually. secondly, how badly do you lose and how often? apparently our average loss this year was 37 points based on what I heard. If true, that is terrible. also how often did dogs get belted by 90 points during Bevo coaching time?? how frequently ?? How often they lost to the bottom team at the home ground where most of their wins comes from?? that counts as 4 losses in my book. lose to a team at home counts as 2, lose to the bottom team at home counts as factor fo 4.

It's like NBA and players looking at who won more rings without actually disaggregating the data. Jim Loscutoff won 7 rings with the Celtics. He averaged 6.2 pts/game for his career and averaged 5.5 points per game in the playoffs. He has a better record than MJ, so he is better than him?? incorrect.

 

[javaguice]

We moved on priddis because he could only play one position and role.

then we have a midfield consisting of sheed, redden, gaff.

and play west, O’Neill in a forward pocket for most the game. No one getting a touch, at least make one of them tag.

also anyone kicking 30+m backwards should get an arse kicking

At the risk of starting a shit fight.... I think it was Mitchell that convinced Priddis to retire as he wouldn't be an automatic inclusion in Sam's midfield set-up.

But that's a guess.

I remember before the Geelong game, the ex cat players were saying that we should play more direct on gmhblah stadium. Then simmo sent the boys out to play the usual way..... the players obviously doubted the game plan.

If you doubt the game plan, you aren't going to give 110% to execute it.

Since then, we have had poor performance after poor performance.

The boys aren't buying into the message. Not sure what we can do.... stuck with simmo, stuck with the players

 

[bzparkes]

I really get annoyed when posts like this appear.This is what happens when you look at only raw data.It is called Data analysis for a reason. take into account home-court advantage, Perth home-court advantage is enormous as bad as travel is for WA players to VIC, it is the same the other way around. so off the bat, try to figure out if those wins have been weighted and adjusted based on home and away. if you do, you will see Simmo win losses is not that good actually. secondly, how badly do you lose and how often? apparently our average loss this year was 37 points based on what I heard. If true, that is terrible. also how often did dogs get belted by 90 points during Bevo coaching time?? how frequently ?? How often they lost to the bottom team at the home ground where most of their wins comes from?? that counts as 4 losses in my book. lose to a team at home counts as 2, lose to the bottom team at home counts as factor fo 4.

It's like NBA and players looking at who won more rings without actually disaggregating the data. Jim Loscutoff won 7 rings with the Celtics. He averaged 6.2 pts/game for his career and averaged 5.5 points per game in the playoffs. He has a better record than MJ, so he is better than him?? incorrect.

Yeah, our record is bad, no denying that.

Just like Clarko's record was bad for a couple of seasons after '08 and Bevo's record has been shit the whole time, bar one flukey run to a premiership.

Don't forget Hardwick made 3 finals series and didn't win a single one in the run up to '07.

Simmo might be able to do the same or it all might fall into a heap. History suggests he''s been able to come up with 2 separate game plans good enough to make a grand final, one of those won a premiership.

He at least deserves a chance to do it a third time. If there's no change next year then fine, see you later. But you can't tell me untried assistants and a coach well past it are better options as of right now.

 

[Manbearpig77]

I don't think Simpson is a bad coach, his overall record speaks for itself. The problem is, for me anyway, is that he looks to have completely lost this team.

He appears to be a bad coach of the team NOW. He was excellent up to 2018 (16/17 were pretty poor, but how he turned that around was exemplary). The gameplan is stale and dead as a door nail, the players look lost, disinterested and disillusioned.
He ostensibly refuses to change anything up for an extended period of time. The team selection is consistently foolish (4kpf's yesterday, again!?) and our fitness looks miles off. This is unacceptable for a supposedly elite organisation.

I understand that the soft cap changes hurt, and that Covid-19 has changed everything, but literally every club is in the same boat, however we're uniquely and fortunately placed to actually be able to deal with these issues (eg we're loaded).

It's so clear something is drastically wrong. This list is far too talented to be achieving such mediocre results. Change is now imperative, as to what that translates to? I'm not sure. Assistants and S & C staff must at least be cleaned out as a minimum.

 

[InTheWings]

A huge part of our underperformance has been the inability to keep our best players on the track. Way too many soft tissue injuries over the last few years. Our medical / rehab / strength and conditioning must be reviewed.

Also, basics like tackling, blocking etc - where the hell have they gone from our game? I heard Simmo say tackling was a focus of the last pe-season, so either the coaching of it sucked or the players just haven't bought in... Also, where has our spread gone? Is that a fitness issue or are we just too lazy to do the gut running? And why do our guys kick to the right side for 95% of kick-ins? We are way too predictable and lack creative play.

One other thing.... in the warmup before games I notice teams like the Western Bulldogs and Richmond spend time doing fast hands drills. We don't - well actually we sometimes do similar drills but are not as quick. It makes me wonder if our players are getting the best reflex training available.

 

[ziad]

A huge part of our underperformance has been the inability to keep our best players on the track. Way too many soft tissue injuries over the last few years. Our medical / rehab / strength and conditioning must be reviewed.

Also, basics like tackling, blocking etc - where the hell have they gone from our game? I heard Simmo say tackling was a focus of the last pe-season, so either the coaching of it sucked or the players just haven't bought in... Also, where has our spread gone? Is that a fitness issue or are we just too lazy to do the gut running? And why do our guys kick to the right side for 95% of kick-ins? We are way too predictable and lack creative play.

One other thing.... in the warmup before games I notice teams like the Western Bulldogs and Richmond spend time doing fast hands drills. We don't - well actually we sometimes do similar drills but are not as quick. It makes me wonder if our players are getting the best reflex training available.

I agree with much of what you have written. There is a wide range of views on this site, some i agree with some I dont.

I watch some international professional sports as context to your comments. Your point about medical / rehab / strength and conditioning in particular as well as the players inability to adapt duirng a game (Hurn admitted) which is part player, part coaching for contingencies all say to me that we are not a professional organisation. Losts of flash cash, charities and buildings but poor performance in the core buisness.

 

[Karim Abdul Yeo]

Yeah, our record is bad, no denying that.

Just like Clarko's record was bad for a couple of seasons after '08 and Bevo's record has been sh*t the whole time, bar one flukey run to a premiership.

Don't forget Hardwick made 3 finals series and didn't win a single one in the run up to '07.

Simmo might be able to do the same or it all might fall into a heap. History suggests he''s been able to come up with 2 separate game plans good enough to make a grand final, one of those won a premiership.

He at least deserves a chance to do it a third time. If there's no change next year then fine, see you later. But you can't tell me untried assistants and a coach well past it are better options as of right now.

Considering we have players in their prime deserving another shot at deep finals run like Hurn, JK, Shuey, NN, Shep and Gov, I would say your approach is an ultimate backhand to those boys and too risky to take. Depends on what the club wants to do.

Richmond was different cuz the list was mainly young when they were getting belted, dogs and Clarko overachieved in 08 and 16 similar to Simmo I think.Our list is one of the oldest lists in the league, based on what we have dished in 15,16,17,19,20 and 21 some would argue that 18 was a little lucky for us. Let's not kid ourselves, if Richmond made 18 GF, they were never going to lose a 5 goal lead. Next year's failure basically means most of those players I Mentioned will be retired. You want to take that shot with simmo after this year??go ahead. Just keep in mind that what happens after 2022 is the rebuilding phase and more 90 plus spankings.

 

[InTheWings]

If Sam Mitchell was as influential in our 2018 campaign as is reported, I don't see that as a negative for Simpson but rather positive in that he knew how to get good people around him with skills that compliment his own. That is the sign of a good leader. Mitchell has skills that Simpson doesn't - but that is why we have line coaches. Head coaches can't be expected the be the be all and end all. The trouble is that we didn't adequately replace Mitchell when he left.

So I don't care what it takes or how much money we have to throw at them, or whether they are currently contracted to some other team, we must get ruthless and headhunt a top class midfield coach in the Mitchell mould. Maybe coaches such as Don Pyke or Michael Voss. Who in the system is seen as an amazing line coach? Let's flex our financial muscles and go and poach them... even if we have to pay some sort of fee for broaching the soft cap - it is a soft cap after all, so we can go over it.

 

[DirtySandman]

I’ve gone from thinking we should have beaten st kilda the bulldogs and Essendon, in those three games were we had a winning position.

to now thinking, we were damn lucky to even get that close.

 

[bzparkes]

Considering we have players in their prime deserving another shot at deep finals run like Hurn, JK, Shuey, NN, Shep and Gov, I would say your approach is an ultimate backhand to those boys and too risky to take. Depends on what the club wants to do.

Richmond was different cuz the list was mainly young when they were getting belted, dogs and Clarko overachieved in 08 and 16 similar to Simmo I think.Our list is one of the oldest lists in the league, based on what we have dished in 15,16,17,19,20 and 21 some would argue that 18 was a little lucky for us. Let's not kid ourselves, if Richmond made 18 GF, they were never going to lose a 5 goal lead. Next year's failure basically means most of those players I Mentioned will be retired. You want to take that shot with simmo after this year??go ahead. Just keep in mind that what happens after 2022 is the rebuilding phase and more 90 plus spankings.

Moot point anyway because the club gave him 3 more years and they aren't going to prematurely end his contract.

Is it Simmo's fault that guys can't hit simple kicks and handballs that they would've easily executed in the past? I lost count of the amount of times Gaff kicked over the head of leading forwards, or missed simple handballs. He's just one player that's considerably gone backwards so maybe father time is catching up with him faster than we realised. Yes, this is on the coaching group as a collective but I'm curious to know what's changed since the bye, when we dumped guys who were willing to do the hard work for 5 under-done senior players who seemingly couldn't care less.

Having said that, it is definitely his fault if the team's lost faith in the game plan.

Hard to tell as an outsider but players not giving effort can't be entirely put on the head coach. Barrass' interview was fairly telling after winning '18 and I wonder how many blokes are just happy to cruise to retirement because it's all gotten too hard. Sure, the game plan sucks and has been figured out but that's no excuse for constantly standing still like a statue, unless you've been instructed to that is.

There was enough conjecture early in his career with us that Tim Gepp was Nisbett's 'watcher' and that he had the hard word put on him when he wanted to move Cox on. Ditto Priddis. The entire match committee is as much to blame for selection of under-performing players as Simpson is for failing to evolve the game plan this year with the rule changes.

You can claim Clarko and Bevo over-achieved all you want but bear this in mind: if either of them didn't 'over-achieve' in those years they won their first flag then it's unlikely they'd have lasted as coaches, considering the years that followed those flags. I've no doubt Simpson wouldn't have gotten an extension either if he didn't win '18 but he did and the club will stick by him for at least another 2 years, regardless of what we think.