Recruiting AFL Draft Watch 2022 - Tsatas, Hayes, Davey x2, Munkara & Montgomerie

[eDPS]

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central.rookieme.com

 

[doug85]

Today's October HS phantom draft has us taking Tsatas at 5 "based on the latest mail". Not sure how accurate their predications have been in the past.

That’s not what it says

 

[Here_we_come]

My bad, I read it at the top of the article but it actually says "including the latest mail".

 

[faible]

I meant the Herald Sun ones, the person I replied to said the HS had mail but didn’t say which HS journo it was. I’d take Peter Ryan or Jay Clark’s word for it. I rate Marc McGowan too, wish he wrote more. Robbo is suspect, has contacts at Essendon but those contacts aren’t necessarily in the know and then he puts his spin on things. Jon Ralph is meh. Landsberger is an ambulance chaser.

Twomey has been doing it for a long time, his speculation is interesting based on his contact with the draftees themselves and his attendance at actual U18 games and at the combine. He knows which draftees have been interviewed by which clubs and what their coaches are saying about them and whatever.

But the real value of Twomey is the final updated phantom he puts out three hours before the draft… when the club recruiters start spilling their guts a bit, final interviews are happening with draft kids, kids are being told “we’ll definitely take you if you’re available” and he can extrapolate most of the first round based on that.

Twomey and Quayle (pre-GWS) were the two most reliable sources IMO.

Personally I'm waiting for eDPS to get a call-up from Barham to replace Dodoro so he can keep us informed on EFC's moves.

 

['51 Bewick]

The Journo is Chris Cavanagh. I'm not really familiar with HS journos so am not sure how valid it is.

'51 Bewick Sorry, can't post the link because it's stuck behind the HS paywall. But you should be able to retrieve it if you google the journo's name and phantom draft.

He does the first 25 and then readers evaluate their assessment of each pick as well.

Got it, cheers mate.

 

[Lore]

Twomey and Quayle (pre-GWS) were the two most reliable sources IMO.

Personally I'm waiting for eDPS to get a call-up from Barham to replace Dodoro so he can keep us informed on EFC's moves.

Quayle was very good, better than Twomey. Quite the loss to the football-obsessed public when GWS brought her in

 

[ant555]

People asking why Tsatas may not be a good fit ?

Well not everyone has had the chance to go and watch him play live and watch what he does off the ball and how he fits into the team defense . That is the issue when judging him. Sure he looks great in the highlight packages and in the replays of games but it masks his biggest issues. From the games I watched live , yes he is an offensive jet. Decent pace . Kicks both sides . Good clearance player. From all reports really good kid.

What he does not do is defend or even look to defend. Right now he is a one way runner. In many ways he is the 188cm Darcy Parish

3

Darcy Parish

Age

27

Ht

180cm

Wt

81kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.4

5star

K

9.2

4star

HB

11.2

5star

M

3.2

3star

T

3.3

5star

CL

3.2

5star

D

16.6

4star

K

7.4

3star

HB

9.1

5star

M

1.4

2star

T

2.0

3star

CL

3.1

4star

D

22.2

5star

K

7.6

3star

HB

14.6

5star

M

3.2

4star

T

4.4

5star

CL

3.6

5star

of his under 18 year. Super offensive player but massively limited at other pats of the game. Some of his defensive efforts I saw where dead set lazy. He did not even look interested in participating . His pressure of the ball can be non existent.
Secondly for a big size midfielder he is not a physical player. Yes he will win a clearance and is strong enough to break the odd tackle but in general he does not use his size to pressure or put any physical pressure on an opponent. His actual physical game is almost Tom Cutler

12

Tom Cutler

Age

29

Ht

192cm

Wt

89kg

Pos.

D/M

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.1

4star

K

11.7

4star

HB

6.4

4star

M

4.7

4star

T

1.7

4star

MG

317.5

4star

D

15.5

4star

K

9.5

4star

HB

6.0

3star

M

4.5

4star

T

1.5

2star

MG

317.5

4star

D

12.0

3star

K

8.4

4star

HB

3.6

3star

M

3.0

3star

T

1.0

3star

.

My view is what I mentioned earlier. He is a 188cm Darcy Parish

3

Darcy Parish

Age

27

Ht

180cm

Wt

81kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.4

5star

K

9.2

4star

HB

11.2

5star

M

3.2

3star

T

3.3

5star

CL

3.2

5star

D

16.6

4star

K

7.4

3star

HB

9.1

5star

M

1.4

2star

T

2.0

3star

CL

3.1

4star

D

22.2

5star

K

7.6

3star

HB

14.6

5star

M

3.2

4star

T

4.4

5star

CL

3.6

5star

who can break out of a clearance a few more times but is certainly not going to crash through packs on a regular basis. Now that is fine for an offensive Jet and he looks like he could be a genuine A grade player but is it where our list is now at ? He is 100% not going to give us a big body / physical midfielder style. So he would be an upgrade / future replacement for Parish or Shiel . So we would still be looking for a big body work horse.

I would not be upset if we ended up picking him as his offensive quality is chart topping but his weakness is our list weakness. Poor defensive actions . Limited pressure . Not great physically .

 

[Bjchan13]

People asking why Tsatas may not be a good fit ?

Well not everyone has had the chance to go and watch him play live and watch what he does off the ball and how he fits into the team defense . That is the issue when judging him. Sure he looks great in the highlight packages and in the replays of games but it masks his biggest issues. From the games I watched live , yes he is an offensive jet. Decent pace . Kicks both sides . Good clearance player. From all reports really good kid.

What he does not do is defend or even look to defend. Right now he is a one way runner. In many ways he is the 188cm Darcy Parish of his under 18 year. Super offensive player but massively limited at other pats of the game. Some of his defensive efforts I saw where dead set lazy. He did not even look interested in participating . His pressure of the ball can be non existent.
Secondly for a big size midfielder he is not a physical player. Yes he will win a clearance and is strong enough to break the odd tackle but in general he does not use his size to pressure or put any physical pressure on an opponent. His actual physical game is almost Tom Cutler.

My view is what I mentioned earlier. He is a 188cm Darcy Parish who can break out of a clearance a few more times but is certainly not going to crash through packs on a regular basis. Now that is fine for an offensive Jet and he looks like he could be a genuine A grade player but is it where our list is now at ? He is 100% not going to give us a big body / physical midfielder style. So he would be an upgrade / future replacement for Parish or Shiel . So we would still be looking for a big body work horse.

I would not be upset if we ended up picking him as his offensive quality is chart topping but his weakness is our list weakness. Poor defensive actions . Limited pressure . Not great physically .

Being a part of team defence should be a prerequisite to play AFL. It needs to be drilled into our playing group by the coaching group. If a player can't do it or wont do it they can play VFL until they do. I get that some players like Jhye Clark will be inclined to defend more naturally than others but it is not rocket science. Every player currently on our list, Parish included, already have the tools to be a part of team defence if they want. It needs to be taught and drilled into them. A strong coach will set the standards with direct instructions. Id be surprised if Scott puts up with anyone not being on board.

 

[Lads2023]

Any chance that Wardlaw slips to us?

 

[ant555]

Being a part of team defence should be a prerequisite to play AFL. It needs to be drilled into our playing group by the coaching group. If a player can't do it or wont do it they can play VFL until they do. I get that some players like Jhye Clark will be inclined to defend more naturally than others but it is not rocket science. Every player currently on our list, Parish included, already have the tools to be a part of team defence if they want. It needs to be taught and drilled into them. A strong coach will set the standards with direct instructions. Id be surprised if Scott puts up with anyone not being on board.

Trust me it is not that simple. If it was then we would not talk about it. I am sure Scott will not put up with it but there may be some casualties.
Players have a default way they play under pressure.

 

[faible]

Any chance that Wardlaw slips to us?

 

[ant555]

Any chance that Wardlaw slips to us?

There is. Some mail around North will take Sheezal and Tsatas and they are not necessarily looking to draft another inside mid to replace JHF. Time will tell.

 

[Lore]

Trust me it is not that simple. If it was then we would not talk about it. I am sure Scott will not put up with it but there may be some casualties.
Players have a default way they play under pressure.

And when gassed too. If you've run yourself ragged to the point of puking and someone says "go chase that bloke with the ball whose blown past you 20 times already today while we're 40 points down" ... it'd take some serious mental fortitude to go after it. You'd have to believe that you'd be dropped if you didn't and that everyone else in the team is doing it except you (hence why you can be dropped as if no one is doing it then they can't really drop the whole 22).

 

[Bjchan13]

Trust me it is not that simple. If it was then we would not talk about it. I am sure Scott will not put up with it but there may be some casualties.
Players have a default way they play under pressure.

I am fine with there being casualties. Im not saying its simple, im saying its not rocket science. I think the standard will be set by the coach. Truck allowed Parish to play a certain way. He was one of Trucks favourite players. If Scott comes in and asks Darcy to tweak his game, to sacrifice his own game for the team, i think Darcy will do it. If he doesnt im more than happy to let him play VFL all year until he gets it. Same for any player.

 

[Bjchan13]

And when gassed too. If you've run yourself ragged to the point of puking and someone says "go chase that bloke with the ball whose blown past you 20 times already today while we're 40 points down" ... it'd take some serious mental fortitude to go after it. You'd have to believe that you'd be dropped if you didn't and that everyone else in the team is doing it except you (hence why you can be dropped as if no one is doing it then they can't really drop the whole 22).

Which is why getting pre season right is so important. The footage of our last one looked pathetic. Soft and easy.

 

[citizen-erased]

And when gassed too. If you've run yourself ragged to the point of puking and someone says "go chase that bloke with the ball whose blown past you 20 times already today while we're 40 points down" ... it'd take some serious mental fortitude to go after it. You'd have to believe that you'd be dropped if you didn't and that everyone else in the team is doing it except you (hence why you can be dropped as if no one is doing it then they can't really drop the whole 22).

The dees built this under burgess and you can already see it in the way adelaides kids play.
Its pushing through the mental barriers of fatigue and pain.

Ideally an area the development focus will be.

 

[Yoda_]

People asking why Tsatas may not be a good fit ?

Well not everyone has had the chance to go and watch him play live and watch what he does off the ball and how he fits into the team defense . That is the issue when judging him. Sure he looks great in the highlight packages and in the replays of games but it masks his biggest issues. From the games I watched live , yes he is an offensive jet. Decent pace . Kicks both sides . Good clearance player. From all reports really good kid.

What he does not do is defend or even look to defend. Right now he is a one way runner. In many ways he is the 188cm Darcy Parish of his under 18 year. Super offensive player but massively limited at other pats of the game. Some of his defensive efforts I saw where dead set lazy. He did not even look interested in participating . His pressure of the ball can be non existent.
Secondly for a big size midfielder he is not a physical player. Yes he will win a clearance and is strong enough to break the odd tackle but in general he does not use his size to pressure or put any physical pressure on an opponent. His actual physical game is almost Tom Cutler.

My view is what I mentioned earlier. He is a 188cm Darcy Parish who can break out of a clearance a few more times but is certainly not going to crash through packs on a regular basis. Now that is fine for an offensive Jet and he looks like he could be a genuine A grade player but is it where our list is now at ? He is 100% not going to give us a big body / physical midfielder style. So he would be an upgrade / future replacement for Parish or Shiel . So we would still be looking for a big body work horse.

I would not be upset if we ended up picking him as his offensive quality is chart topping but his weakness is our list weakness. Poor defensive actions . Limited pressure . Not great physically .

would you leave Tsatas on the board and go with a McKenzie or Phillipou?

 

[Old Campaigner]

would you leave Tsatas on the board and go with a McKenzie or Phillipou?

Get Humphrey instead

 

[ant555]

I am fine with there being casualties. Im not saying its simple, im saying its not rocket science. I think the standard will be set by the coach. Truck allowed Parish to play a certain way. He was one of Trucks favourite players. If Scott comes in and asks Darcy to tweak his game, to sacrifice his own game for the team, i think Darcy will do it. If he doesnt im more than happy to let him play VFL all year until he gets it. Same for any player.

In fairness we never had a full midfield group at any stage of the year. There was no selection pressure. Truck had his hands tied. There where no VFL games where our midfielders played. He was hardly going to select Lord or Hird or McDonaugh to play midfield when he was under pressure to win games because the likes of Barham and coterie groups where agitating for wins.

Sorry to be blunt but it is not that simple. I coached development for over 10 years. Players play a certain way. I saw it with players I watched in recruiting that went into an AFL system as well. You can get players to do things. Pressure etc. What is difficult is to get them to do things that are not in their nature week in and week out , quarter by quarter . If it is as simple as you say we would not have the conversation. I have spent 20 years trying to figure out why it is not simple at various levels. When I was playing I could never understand why others would not play as hard as I did or why players with 100% more ability than me where wasting their talent by not putting in the same effort.

Parish has a level he will get to. He will try and improve it but he is a ball hunter. That is what he is wired to do. That is what he has been allowed to do. Sides can carry them but you have to have the rest of the group willing to pick up the slack. Trouble is if youa re going to carry a player he had better be Martin or Fyfe or Dangerfield.

 

[ant555]

would you leave Tsatas on the board and go with a McKenzie or Phillipou?

Personally I would although I would go Humphry first . That is just my view. Tsatas will be a good player in my view but he will need to have some hard nuts to support him. He has the scope to be a Pendlebury type midfielder. A genuine star but not your physical bull. If we draft him we will need to draft some supporting cast.

 

[Howard Moon]

Personally I would although I would go Humphry first . That is just my view. Tsatas will be a good player in my view but he will need to have some hard nuts to support him. He has the scope to be a Pendlebury type midfielder. A genuine star but not your physical bull. If we draft him we will need to draft some supporting cast.

Sounds like the guy who dosent star with us but if we pass on him he becomes a star at another club and revisionist drafters give us egg face..omg how could they let him slip... Can't win

 

[ant555]

Sounds like the guy who dosent star with us but if we pass on him he becomes a star at another club and revisionist drafters give us egg face..omg how could they let him slip... Can't win

Probably. Dare I say it he suits Norths midfield better than ours.

 

[citizen-erased]

Sounds like the guy who dosent star with us but if we pass on him he becomes a star at another club and revisionist drafters give us egg face..omg how could they let him slip... Can't win

Can draft him now, plan for success in a post shiel/merrett/parish world.

Hobbs, caldwell and perkins bring good competitiveness.
Grab tsatas now as a jet to go with martin.
If it means a reach or engineering a draft position (a la west coast) where we slide away from jets and into those grunt mids in the coming years, do that.

Guess it comes down to the list team having a plan that spans beyond just this draft.

 

[ant555]

Can draft him now, plan for success in a post shiel/merrett/parish world.

Hobbs, caldwell and perkins bring good competitiveness.
Grab tsatas now as a jet to go with martin.
If it means a reach or engineering a draft position (a la west coast) where we slide away from jets and into those grunt mids in the coming years, do that.

Guess it comes down to the list team having a plan that spans beyond just this draft.

The last line is simply , well rubbish. Sorry.
Every club has a list plan projecting 3 to 4 years ahead. They may **** them up but to say they haven't is simply wrong.
Our list plan beyond this draft would include competitors and leaders and then some more competitors and leaders.

 

[Wahooti Fandango]

Quayle was very good, better than Twomey. Quite the loss to the football-obsessed public when GWS brought her in

Quayle was really good.

 

[BrunoV]

They’ve got max Heath who will start to play games next year

Beat Bryan when they faced off this year.

He's a a big boy. Almost Pittonet build but quite a bit taller.