Review Autopsy Thread - Hawks vs Saints

[macdaddio]

Lets not forget that the Saints have been the 2nd best team of the past 2 years, sure we had the game won and our bad kicking lost it and of course the interchange too, but to be in that position againts such a good side is a credit to the team.
We still got 2 points and if the Dogs beat Freo we will only be 1 1/2 game out of top 4 instead of 2 games behind, we could easily have lost the game last night had Roo kicked that goal who knows what would of happend.
I am proud as punch of this club and i can see that this group are playing for their lives they know how important it is, i am 100% confidant that we can win the next 4 games maybe 5 and i am not going to let a draw ruin my happiness for this club..

 

[go hawks!!!]

Spot on, Roby.

I really like the way we are going about it at the moment, and I just feel that with Clarkson on the bench it's giving us that extra level of 'team'.
There's just something about being able to look into your players eyes as he comes off the ground and say 'good job mate, rest up, you'll be back out there in a few'.

I left the ground bewildered at the interchange ruling, forgetting the McEvoy goal, because simply, football is a game of decisions and errors and McEvoy goaled as a consequence of one. That's fine, I can live with that just as I can live with the missed shots on goals.

The endeavour was there, we should've won.
I'm pretty happy with the way in which our group is gelling and playing together at the moment.

And I agree with your comments on Hooper. IMO, he plays, we win.

Agree with both of you. Come finals, we will kick straight (remember 2008) and we will 'brutalise' opponents with pressure. Our team is full of warriors and they will not let up.

Hooper is the X factor that will win us a p'ship (yes optimistic) but will be huge in the next 2 months.

For me, as I have said previously, Taylor is extremely important. Clarko said 2 more works and he will be considered. Against the big boys, we need him.

The Lewis game was a concern. I would like to see Laddo in contention in the coming weeks depending on match ups. We need more run from half back (which St Kilda had more last night).

Last night was a set back, but everyone is looking at the hawks in the rear view mirror, we are coming.

 

[Winged Fang]

Gday all. Long time reader, first time poster.

I feel compelled to write here after last night's belter of a game. A lot has been made of the interchange infringement which cost us the game - fair dos. However, I feel that we were hard done by in another area.

Now, I'm not a Buddy worshipper. I love the bloke, and love having him in my team. He is a showman, turns it on and we love him for it. I just think sometimes he carries on a bit too much, but each to their own. I really do think this behaviour does bring with it the attention of others in the game. Including the umps. Now we know how much his 'shoulder to head' hits lands him in trouble (which is crap), but I'm getting sidetracked. Last night, the two separate 50m penalties against him left me gobsmacked. I thought on both occasions he got to the contest almost at the same time Dawson took the mark - can he not make a contest? I've seen so many more similar contests let go, nothing made of it.

So what needs to happen? Does Buddy need to become less of a personality and stop complaining to the umps? Or do the umps need to be less judgemental about who they are paying free kicks against (ie. ignore personality clashes)? My answer is certainly the latter. That's their job. Just seems that he gets hard done by a lot because of who he is.

 

[macdaddio]

Gday all. Long time reader, first time poster.

I feel compelled to write here after last night's belter of a game. A lot has been made of the interchange infringement which cost us the game - fair dos. However, I feel that we were hard done by in another area.

Now, I'm not a Buddy worshipper. I love the bloke, and love having him in my team. He is a showman, turns it on and we love him for it. I just think sometimes he carries on a bit too much, but each to their own. I really do think this behaviour does bring with it the attention of others in the game. Including the umps. Now we know how much his 'shoulder to head' hits lands him in trouble (which is crap), but I'm getting sidetracked. Last night, the two separate 50m penalties against him left me gobsmacked. I thought on both occasions he got to the contest almost at the same time Dawson took the mark - can he not make a contest? I've seen so many more similar contests let go, nothing made of it.
So what needs to happen? Does Buddy need to become less of a personality and stop complaining to the umps? Or do the umps need to be less judgemental about who they
are paying free kicks against (ie. ignore personality clashes)? My answer is certainly the latter. That's their job. Just seems that he gets hard done by a lot because of who
he is.

Buddy got screwed by the umps, 4 50m penalties againts him us crap!
Only 1 was worth it when he knocked ball put of Dawson,
2 occasions Buddy tackled Dawson to the ground and a free was paid againts him, Hawthorn is 16th for frees againts and even though we had 31-24 in our favour it was the 4 50m againts Buddy that screwed us big time, Hawthotn should have a duscusion with Jeff G and find out what can be done to stop Buddy from getting screwed week in week out.

 

[spikers]

Went to the game last night and can I just say what a wonderful game it was. Thought the team was gone at 3/4 time, they looked dead on their feet, but boy did they come out punching. Obviously the result was disappointing, however I am not going to complain about the umpiring, or the interchange breach or even the last bad piece of set play because simply I thought it was a great game. However, I am worried that this last month of football has taken a physical toll on the team - so many of the guys were severly cramping in the last quarter. It is going to be a real challenge to the football club to manage these players - there are three interstate trips ahead - and unfortunately our poor start to the season really does not allow us to 'rest' as we cannot afford to lose.

Coming from Sydney I only get to a few games a year. Before last night the last game I went to was the first Essendon game this season. The difference in the team was simply amazing and if you had told me then that Hawthorn would be considered a flag chance and that Essendon would be considered a wooden spoon chance I would have wondered what drugs you were on!

 

[Paul Kersey]

Well we're two games in now with North Melbourne losing tonight. North have the Bulldogs next week, so it is probable they will lose again. Was hoping the WCE could beat Carlton too.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

So what needs to happen? Does Buddy need to become less of a personality and stop complaining to the umps?

No, Buddy doesn't need to become less of a personality, it's his personality that makes him the player he is. However, somehow the club needs to have a word with Buddy and convince him to ignore the umpires and just keep playing the ball. I'd also like them to do some serious work on his aerial skills over the summer. Apart from that, let's hope Buddy just keeps being Buddy.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

Whenever I see Buddy give away a 50m penalty I'm not too concerned. The does his best work when he runs high on emotion, so the 50m penalty is usually a precursor to a magic goal or two.

 

[Easy Slips Catch]

Not so sure on Lewis as a HFF, he did a reasonable defensive job but did not give much offensively.

Sewell is a worry. His disposal is too slow and when he does get it away he is not a good kick.

At stages we had 8 forwards and 4 backs trying to go man on man. It was good resolve by AC and I reckon all teams will play the saints that way.

Dirty we did not win but the saints hold no fears for us.

 

[Winged Fang]

Buddy got screwed by the umps, 4 50m penalties againts him us crap!
Only 1 was worth it when he knocked ball put of Dawson,

In particular, the 50m that was paid aganst Buddy immediately before this indiscretion was ridiculous. It was blatantly simultaneous, no way was it late!

 

[Teamwork Talks]

Yes Spikers I thought we would get run over in the last quarter when I saw a lot of our players cramping up. They just willed themselves on which is great to see.

I think the team needs a bit of a let down so I am not expecting a great performance next week against the Power. Expect us to win in a close one. Perhaps we need to rest some players and bring in Laddo and Peterson if they are fresh.

Lewis had one of the best backmen in the league on him - Fisher. So don't be so hard on him. Also I think Young was tagged for the first time in a while by Jones.

 

[MinerBoy]

Few comments on players:
-Roughie - heres hoping that pressure goal near the end has boosted his confidence as his missing easy goals is stopping us putting away teams early. Looked very dangerous for most of the game. Umpire seemed to be telling him a few times to stop wingeing / faking marking infringements - was hard to tell on tv but rarely appeared to get a clear run at the ball (i.e. reiwoldt always seemed to get a run at it but roughie seems to struggle - im not sure if this is good defending or infringements by saints or poor defence by us)

Was kicking the ball with more conviction. Still missed a few but hopefully the penny has dropped in regards to how he should be kicking through the ball. The clutch goal should hopefully validate this.

-Lewis - thought was terrible as a defensive fwd - continually got beaten in contests by fisher and didnt appear to apply a lot of pressure

Fisher is a gun and this isn't Lewis' natural game. To my mind, Fisher and Gilbert were a shadow of what they normally provide the Saints. Not worried about Lewis at all. He also copped quite a heavy knock early on that left him looking a little dazed (from Buddy I think).

-Gilham - was really worried at the start - looked like kossie was going to go a hold of him like tippett did, but fought back well. I still have concerns about him against the quality opponents - does well on the rebound but is a liability IMO against a tallm quality opponent

Not too worried. When he decided to actually play on Kosi he pantsed him. Just have NFI how he let him get so far on his own in the early stages. the last thing we needed was to let Kosi get on a roll. Luckily for us, he is mentally fragile and was easily contained after that.

 

[JustKickIt]

Hawthotn should have a duscusion with Jeff G and find out what can be done to stop Buddy from getting screwed week in week out.

I would like to see Hawthorn make their own DVD of example poor decisions to take to that discussion. They probably wont fit on a DVD though.

 

[The_Axeman]

Young has taken his game to a new level.

Yep, he sure has. I love seeing the Ball in Youngies hands as he streams down the wing and roosts it into the forward 50, or even better, through the middle of the goals from 60 metres out.

 

[Great 2008]

Despite the Buddy 50's, the interchange debacle and over officiating (the last two which we have no control over) I have a couple of issues with our performance tonight.

I thought a lot of St Kilda's goals were soft. They scored far to easily, firstly Kosi's 3 goals (none for the rest of the night). Secondly, 6 between Milne and Schneider? Schneider's goals in particular were far to easy.

Then a couple of times during the game we marked, turned to take our kick just outside 50m only to chip it 10-15m to a contest, turning it over resulting, imo in a 100m turnaround. Surely a better option would be to kick to the top of the square. We have two tall guns down there for goodness sake (and Ossie). Roughy's mark on the goal line is a perfect example of the point I am trying to make.

Thought we were the better team all night and let them back in on to many occasions. Maybe this result was our 'down' game after being up for a while.

 

[Brant]

Great 2008:

I think we are often vulnerable to soft goals on the rebound - see the geelong game as evidence. It just seems to be the way we play. That is why I like the concept of us playing a defensive forward (Musto / Lewis) & can't wait for the return of Hooper. Adding pace / grunt to our Forward Pressure will restrict our opponent's ability to rebound quickly.

In saying that, it highlights (to me) how well our Back 6 are playing in that we are still managing wins & restricting scoring.

 

[HAWKS HEROES]

such a weird feeling after a draw was this the first draw you been too ? [draw virgin] ? or have any of you been to a drawn game before

 

[go hawks!!!]

This is a guy who was out to 6am with one of the Pussycat Dolls

I will now propose to Jennifer Hawkins, will let you know how i go

 

[macdaddio]

This is a guy who was out to 6am with one of the Pussycat Dolls

I will now propose to Jennifer Hawkins, will let you know how i go

How did you go?

 

[Hawksgirl4eva]

such a weird feeling after a draw was this the first draw you been too ? [draw virgin] ? or have any of you been to a drawn game before

think this is the first draw in my lifetime. didnt know what to think when there was no song at the end, i just felt kinda empty.

 

[HolyRioli]

I play hockey, and as such have come to experience more draws than an AFL player (had one yesturday). Apart from feeling pretty flat, it's always one of two feelings at the end:

a) we were lucky to get away with that or
b) fuming because we should've won

For this particular game against the Saints though, for me, neither fit - a draw almost seems to be a fair result. Both teams won a quarter by a point, and couldn't be split after half time. About as close as you can get.

















I'd still prefer a win though :/

 

[WillowSF]

Top 4 is just about beyond us. Poor kicking for goal cost us the game. There were several times in the second half where we had an opportunity to break it open and just didn't, which kept the Saints alive. Credit to them for taking their chances. They are a very disciplined unit.

Our backline is still a concern. Kosi, Schneider & Milne were able to slip our defenders far too easily. Gilham, Murphy & co need to tighten. I also would have preferred to see Stratton go to Riewoldt. He has a bigger leap and would be in a better position to spoil in contested marking situations.

We also did a bad job of protecting the center corridor. How many times were St. Kilda players allowed to run through the center uncontested?

On the players...

Jordan Lewis played a terrible game. Amongst other things he had a chance to soccer a relatively simple goal in the last quarter and let it slip.

I've been a big supporter of Skipper but it may be time to bring Taylor in to see what he can do. While good around the ground as others have mentioned his ruck work is ineffectual.

Whitecross was OK but didn't really get enough footy.

Ellis just continues to struggle. His disposal has little impact and he is easily brushed aside due to his slight physique. I don't think he is in our best 22.

Birchall needs to develop his right side.

Franklin was good but needs to play smarter. (Controlled aggression Buddy...)

Liked Young's game. He's such a gifted player.

Guerra is fast becoming my favorite player. His calmness under pressure and physical presence is so critical.

And of course, Hodge was Hodge.

 

[Valve Bounce]

The tied game brings out all manner of insights in a replay

I was unable to watch the Hawks tied game with the Saints live, so I recorded it, and watched it after the tied result was known.

It is most interesting as I watched it how I saw each clanger could have changed the outcome. Riewoldt kicking the ball directly to a Hawk, marks that were not payed, and of course the silly interchange infringement that cost the Hawks dearly.

But the one or should I say two incidents that I felt Hawthorn could not excuse was Buddy's stupidity in givng away the double 50. I mean how silly was that, giving a away a fifty, then punching the ball out of the guys hand as he was moving forward.

But watching this game in retrospect made me appreciate the significance of chances missed, bad passes, and silly behaviour. There is no doubt in my mind that Hawthorn won this game, but lost 2 points through no one's but their own fault.

Do any Hawks fans see it this way?

 

[sydney_hawka]

Re: The tied game brings out all manner of insights in a replay

I was unable to watch the Hawks tied game with the Saints live, so I recorded it, and watched it after the tied result was known.

It is most interesting as I watched it how I saw each clanger could have changed the outcome. Riewoldt kicking the ball directly to a Hawk, marks that were not payed, and of course the silly interchange infringement that cost the Hawks dearly.

But the one or should I say two incidents that I felt Hawthorn could not excuse was Buddy's stupidity in givng away the double 50. I mean how silly was that, giving a away a fifty, then punching the ball out of the guys hand as he was moving forward.

But watching this game in retrospect made me appreciate the significance of chances missed, bad passes, and silly behaviour. There is no doubt in my mind that Hawthorn won this game, but lost 2 points through no one's but their own fault.

Do any Hawks fans see it this way?

Thats a reasonable assessment.

We lost because we didn't take our chances. Too many missed shots on Goal. The Interchange infringement was the icing on the cake.

Even though we drew and got two points, it still feels like a loss to me. A very hollow result given we should have won. We're just lucky that other results fell our way.

 

[Davo23]

Re: The tied game brings out all manner of insights in a replay

I was unable to watch the Hawks tied game with the Saints live, so I recorded it, and watched it after the tied result was known.

It is most interesting as I watched it how I saw each clanger could have changed the outcome. Riewoldt kicking the ball directly to a Hawk, marks that were not payed, and of course the silly interchange infringement that cost the Hawks dearly.

But the one or should I say two incidents that I felt Hawthorn could not excuse was Buddy's stupidity in givng away the double 50. I mean how silly was that, giving a away a fifty, then punching the ball out of the guys hand as he was moving forward.

But watching this game in retrospect made me appreciate the significance of chances missed, bad passes, and silly behaviour. There is no doubt in my mind that Hawthorn won this game, but lost 2 points through no one's but their own fault.

Do any Hawks fans see it this way?

Yes, don't make any mistakes, boys.
The easiest way to rectify this is to use a time machine, go back to the start of the game, and give the players all these insights.

We'll probably win the game.



Or maybe not.




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