Trade Requested Bailey Smith - Reportedly headed to Geelong

[Interdimensional Bigfoot]

Is the pretentious one (Mackie) still attempting to fleece the Dogs? My gut instinct tells me he’ll eventually fold & add a 2nd Rounder to the mix. Smith’s probably already got a Cats Locker with his name on it.

Port wishing they had Mackie, guy sold you Sav for p25 + extras.

 

[branedotorg]

And the thing is Geelong have had CHOSEN to rebuild on the run because unlike some other clubs we uncompromisingly try and compete every year.
We don't receive the same amount of high draft picks as the Bulldogs, which A. makes it very hard to trade BECAUSE OF THE CHOICES THE CLUB MAKES and B. means we need to find players using high picks BECAUSE OF THE CHOICES THE CLUB MAKES and C. we can't afford to pay overs for players BECAUSE OF THE CHOICES THE CLUB MAKES

But it is an attractive club to play for because the players who join know they will be playing finals most years and be in a positive fairly relaxed country Victoria environment.

 

[Interdimensional Bigfoot]

So Smith goes to ND and we get him anyway, Good work Dogs, you really showed us.

 

[adogsfan5]

So Smith goes to ND and we get him anyway, Good work Dogs, you really showed us.

It’s not about the dogs “showing you”. Our footy club still has to do what’s best for them.
Geelong still has a responsibility to get the trade done too. It’ll just mean you (and also the doggies) have pissed off a player, player manager, as well as each other. Plenty to lose for both of us here.
Going to the draft does nobody any favours and club relationships are still important.

 

[Oisin_the_Goat]

Haha branedotorg - Yes its a club choice. But its more like the below.

And the thing is Geelong have had to rebuild on the run because unlike some other clubs we have CHOSEN to uncompromisingly try and compete every year.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

and we get him anyway,

this is doing a lot of heavy lifting for a statement that's both no guarantee as well as not getting him anyway in the smoothest and most preferable manner (having to adjust contract terms, relationship with Smith as a player beginning off on the wrong footy, impact to effectively trade in the future...).

 

[Interdimensional Bigfoot]

It’s not about the dogs “showing you”. Our footy club still has to do what’s best for them.
Geelong still has a responsibility to get the trade done too. It’ll just mean you (and also the doggies) have pissed off a player, player manager, as well as each other. Plenty to lose for both of us here.
Going to the draft does nobody any favours and club relationships are still important.

We still get Smith tho and his management has backed risking him in the ND (more likely putting the pressure on the Dogs). We may take a hit but we ultimately get what we want, and Dogs take a hit and get nothing. What's best for your club is to take 17, no?

 

[Oisin_the_Goat]

this is doing a lot of heavy lifting for a statement that's both no guarantee as well as not getting him anyway in the smoothest and most preferable manner (having to adjust contract terms, relationship with Smith as a player beginning off on the wrong footy, impact to effectively trade in the future...).

Yes - but the only GUARANTEE in all this is that if the WB Bulldogs don't accept pick 17 by deadline, they don't get anything.

 

[adogsfan5]

We may take a hit but we ultimately get what we want, and Dogs take a hit and get nothing. What's best for your club is to take 17, no?

If this is Geelongs trade mentality with other clubs, I’d have grave fears..

I think it’ll get done, but this mentality ain’t the route to go down.

 

[adogsfan5]

his management has backed risking him in the ND (more likely putting the pressure on the Dogs).

Do you have a link for this?

 

[ShadowCat]

It’s not about the dogs “showing you”. Our footy club still has to do what’s best for them.
Geelong still has a responsibility to get the trade done too. It’ll just mean you (and also the doggies) have pissed off a player, player manager, as well as each other. Plenty to lose for both of us here.
Going to the draft does nobody any favours and club relationships are still important.

I say this with the caveat that I still think the trade gets done for 17 and a Future 2nd at the death knell - but we will hold off to the absolute last moment, to see if Oliver is available for a Future 1st. If not, we'll offer the 2nd, because we're not using our 1st. If that offer is rejected, he'll go to the draft, but I've thought that was what's fair since it looked like we'd have Pick 10-14 before we had our surge.

So anyway, on the absolute off-chance it doesn't happen, Smith's management have backed sending him to the draft...so the only group we'll piss off is the Dogs - not Smith and Connors/Gieschen:

"And Smith’s camp reportedly believes Geelong should take its chances selecting the wantaway onballer in November’s national draft...Smith’s management is saying: ‘fine, walk him (to the draft), the offer’s fair, he gets to Geelong anyway’. It’s a strong draft, nobody’s going to take Bailey Smith…it’s hard to see who’s going to defy everyone and pick him.”

AFL trades LIVE: Fresh twists threaten to blow up three-club trade; swaps to unlock bigger moves

LIVE: Fresh twists threaten to blow up three-club trade; Dogs reject rival’s offer for star

www.foxsports.com.au

Seems Geelong, Smith and his management are aligned on this going nuclear if it needs to. I don't think it will, but it does lessen the leverage if the only party not aligned is the Dogs.

Again, my thought and my preference is that doesn't happen - and I have been firm (for the last 6 months) that our 2024 1st and our 2025 2nd is where it should land, for an OOC player off an ACL, who has questioned his commitment to the game, and that doesn't want to return (for reasons that are his alone).

If that proposal doesn't get offered/that gets rejected, then he will go to the draft and we see something we haven't seen in quite a while. I hope it doesn't, as it's so pointless and it doesn't really help anyone. But either way, we'll find out in a little over 48 hours.

 

[Interdimensional Bigfoot]

Can we not trade out our F2 & F1?

 

[BigFrizz36]

So if he goes to the National draft his salary demands go to all clubs (assume that he puts a huge price for year 1 to determine as many as possible) . Why wouldn't the likes of the Saints, who have enough cap space and a desperate need for a gun midfielder, just take him with their second pick.

If he stands out surely he gets a long suspension for draft tampering. Why would the saints believe that they owe the cats a favour by waving him through?

 

[adogsfan5]

I say this with the caveat that I still think the trade gets done for 17 and a Future 2nd at the death knell - but we will hold off to the absolute last moment, to see if Oliver is available for a Future 1st. If not, we'll offer the 2nd, because we're not using our 1st. If that offer is rejected, he'll go to the draft, but I've thought that was what's fair since it looked like we'd have Pick 10-14 before we had our surge.

So anyway, on the absolute off-chance it doesn't happen, Smith's management have backed sending him to the draft...so the only group we'll piss off is the Dogs - not Smith and Connors/Gieschen:

"And Smith’s camp reportedly believes Geelong should take its chances selecting the wantaway onballer in November’s national draft...Smith’s management is saying: ‘fine, walk him (to the draft), the offer’s fair, he gets to Geelong anyway’. It’s a strong draft, nobody’s going to take Bailey Smith…it’s hard to see who’s going to defy everyone and pick him.”

AFL trades LIVE: Fresh twists threaten to blow up three-club trade; swaps to unlock bigger moves

LIVE: Fresh twists threaten to blow up three-club trade; Dogs reject rival’s offer for star

www.foxsports.com.au

Seems Geelong, Smith and his management are aligned on this going nuclear if it needs to. I don't think it will, but it does lessen the leverage if the only party not aligned is the Dogs.

Again, my thought and my preference is that doesn't happen - and I have been firm (for the last 6 months) that our 2024 1st and our 2025 2nd is where it should land, for an OOC player off an ACL, who has questioned his commitment to the game, and that doesn't want to return (for reasons that are his alone).

If that proposal doesn't get offered/that gets rejected, then he will go to the draft and we see something we haven't seen in quite a while. I hope it doesn't, as it's so pointless and it doesn't really help anyone. But either way, we'll find out in a little over 48 hours.

Where would you sit if your final offer is pick 17 and that’s it? Or pick 17 and a third?
Would you therefore conclude that Geelong would be at fault if he is then walked to the draft?
I think this is a pretty important point around where you draw the line…

 

[ShadowCat]

Where would you sit if your final offer is pick 17 and that’s it? Or pick 17 and a third?
Would you therefore conclude that Geelong would be at fault if he is then walked to the draft?
I think this is a pretty important point around where you draw the line…

I'd think that 17 and a Future 3rd would be borderline, and would question why we're playing it so tight. It could be that we still have concerns over aspects of his off-field issues, and don't want to invest too much - his posting as of late and some of his conduct haven't been great so there is risk attached coupled with his previous history.

In regards to where I'd draw the line, if we were offer absolutely nothing on top of 17 at 7:29, and Oliver is 100% not coming (which means our Futures aren't locked given our 1st won't be traded), then I'd say we're at fault because we haven't budged one iota from our initial position, when it's not costing us a ton to do so. Very much like the Jordan Clark trade, where we pushed hard for a Future 3rd and haggled, so we'd get something on top of 22 (when we initially asked for a Top 10 pick and got stonewalled).

That's how I see this trade going. Bulldogs need something on top of 17, to make it viable. We needed some scraps on top of Ratugolea, for our own purposes. We wanted the Future 3rd on top of Clark to make our stance viable. Power, like the Dunkley trade, wants something on top of 17 to make it viable. A 2nd is fair, as that will be around 30-35ish. A 3rd is absolutely borderline, but is still some semblance of good will. A 4th is insulting. Nothing on top of 17 is scorched earth, and shows an unwillingness to engage in a compromise, and does not augur well for future dealings.

Rightly or wrongly, that's my objective (as possible given I support Geelong), stance.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

So Sammy Power being unreasonable to 3 clubs...

Turning down 25 for Daniel is madness. As is rejecting Macrae to Saints.

 

[MisterMarcus]

The Doggies are now playing super hardball over McRae and Caleb Daniel

35

Caleb Daniel

Age

28

Ht

171cm

Wt

72kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

21.3

5star

K

11.5

4star

HB

9.8

5star

M

3.5

4star

T

2.9

4star

CL

1.4

4star

D

19.5

4star

K

11.1

4star

HB

8.4

4star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.0

3star

CL

1.0

3star

D

16.4

4star

K

7.2

3star

HB

9.2

5star

M

3.4

4star

T

2.6

4star

CL

0.2

2star

. Getting upset because North and Saints aren't coughing up for blokes who are borderline best 22.

It can't always be every other club's fault, can it?

 

[Tristan34]

So if he goes to the National draft his salary demands go to all clubs (assume that he puts a huge price for year 1 to determine as many as possible) . Why wouldn't the likes of the Saints, who have enough cap space and a desperate need for a gun midfielder, just take him with their second pick.

If he stands out surely he gets a long suspension for draft tampering. Why would the saints believe that they owe the cats a favour by waving him through?

Teams want to interview the players they are picking. Do you think anyone will risk a r1 pick especially in this draft for Smith if he refuses to do an interview???

 

[adogsfan5]

So Sammy Power being unreasonable to 3 clubs...

Turning down 25 for Daniel is madness. As is rejecting Macrae to Saints.

It was 25 for Daniel and 48. Plus we would have had to cover a portion of the contract. At least provide full context mate.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

because there's precendent in the EU, it utterly changed how contracts work in professional sporting leagues including soccer, basketball, ice hocket and more.

Bosman ruling - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

A recent case with the European Court has just strengthened it too. Now FIFA are in trouble and needing to change their contract rules.

 

[adogsfan5]

The Doggies are now playing super hardball over McRae and Caleb Daniel. Getting upset because North and Saints aren't coughing up for blokes who are borderline best 22.

It can't always be every other club's fault, can it?

Macrae*

Uncontracted player - cop what you’re given.

Contracted player - cop what you’re given.

Makes sense.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

It was 25 for Daniel and 48. Plus we would have had to cover a portion of the contract. At least provide full context mate.

Pick 25 in (which could come in a couple places) a strong draft for a fringe 28yo midget. Madness to reject it.

 

[adogsfan5]

Pick 25 in (which could come in a couple places) a strong draft for a fringe 28yo midget. Madness to reject it.

Depends what the portion was that North wanted us to pay on his deal. None of us would have any idea what that is. Maybe it was unattractive for us?

 

[sexyhunk]

So if he goes to the National draft his salary demands go to all clubs (assume that he puts a huge price for year 1 to determine as many as possible) . Why wouldn't the likes of the Saints, who have enough cap space and a desperate need for a gun midfielder, just take him with their second pick.

If he stands out surely he gets a long suspension for draft tampering. Why would the saints believe that they owe the cats a favour by waving him through?

clubs usually able to do medicals, interviews, tests, etc for any potential draftee. it will be a big risk for saints to take to just pick a player with no knowledge of his mental state and no exposed form for the past year.

not to mention what if he has an average year and then ask to be traded again next trade period. just a lot of hassles for any club to take on.

not that i am advocating smith nominating ND.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

If Smith makes it to the draft and sets terms that Geelong want then his contract will be smallish right?

Surely Richmond with a bevy of picks in those teens takes him?

Extremely confident a Richmond type don't touch him with a 10ft pole. Young easily influenced playing group with a relatively high priced, high profile player with a history of off field issues hanging around? Zero chance Yze wants him.