Bluemour Melting Pot XXIV

[Gointocarlton]

I’ve had the pleasure of dealing with irrational transactional partners before on high leverage topics.

On the basis that I knew his reputation and history, I would firstly get back to him and say - that’s a transparently ridiculous claim, but I get you need to set out a marker, and you can consider it set. Now - give me something realistic and we can get to work.

if he’s not moving substantially from there, I’m setting my terms, very close to the bone. I’m giving him a time at which that expires. it’s a hard deadline, because at that point I’ll need to move in another direction. I’m here to deal - with you or someone else, because we’ll back the draft getting him to us.

then I’m getting Liddle on the phone to Campbell. Simple message. We like Dodo, we respect what he sees as his role to protect the interest of * but : we’ve all got a lot to do, we can all see a middle ground if we want to be sensible and ultimately, the blokes out of contract and we all know he’s going to find his way to us. So let’s get on with things and maybe we can all shake hands at the end of it and get on with improving our clubs lists without a distracting pissing contest that helps no one.

Sensational insight, thankyou.

 

[Weiterbot23]

Sure.

Here are some facts:

JDG is currently facing charges of indecent assault related to a 2015 incident.

He was caught in 2017 lying to the club about an injured hand, which he hurt in a bar fight.

In 2018 he was caught driving drunk in 2018 and indefinitely suspended by the club.

In 2019 he was caught driving with a suspended license and on his phone.

He is currently set to face trial on Oct 30th. If found guilty he may be sentenced up to 10 years of Jail.

Each time he has apologised, been accepted back by the club. What does that tell you?



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That we might be able to get him for 1 pick rather than 2.


We could just wheel him out gameday like Hannibal


He’s a top 5 player in the Comp when sober.


It makes sense for Collingwood, they could free up space for Cameron as a FA while getting pick 7 for Degoey, while improving tHeir culture.

I would roll the dice on him, we can just put extra behaviour clause on his contract and tear it up if he continues to offend

 

[Stickitupthem]

His dad is his manager

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Collingwood would be wrapped their not dealing with Cloke snr he’d tear Them a new one

 

[Arr0w]

No to JDG, just no

 

[Sheephead]

That we might be able to get him for 1 pick rather than 2.


We could just wheel him out gameday like Hannibal


He’s a top 5 player in the Comp when sober.


It makes sense for Collingwood, they could free up space for Cameron as a FA while getting pick 7 for Degoey, while improving tHeir culture.

I would roll the dice on him, we can just put extra behaviour clause on his contract and tear it up if he continues to offend

How does selecting a player like DeGoey sit alongside our Carlton Respects message? I don’t think it does. Would love the player, but the shitstorm that could come with it, ie hypocrisy, could damage a very worthy platform. I was a Yes, now I’m a No. And to the opposing view, yes ‘Innocent until proven guilty’, but some stench will always stay, that’s human nature.

Let’s go after the angry redhead shall we. Or pull another brick out of the * wall.

 

[Gointocarlton]

Sounds absurd, but Adrian's silly enough for it to be true.

If it is, I want the club to call his bluff and split the pick on day one.

Or just walk away and Saad goes to the PSD. At some point in time, they need to be taught a lesson.

 

[Stickitupthem]

How does selecting a player like DeGoey sit alongside our Carlton Respects message? I don’t think it does. Would love the player, but the shitstorm that could come with it, ie hypocrisy, could damage a very worthy platform. I was a Yes, now I’m a No. And to the opposing view, yes ‘Innocent until proven guilty’, but some stench will always stay, that’s human nature.

Let’s go after the angry redhead shall we. Or pull another brick out of the * wall.

I’m also beginning to being swayed in the No camp I look at the most successful run team the Storm and they seem to have a no dickhead policy and just seem to target players with certain characteristics that help their team structure year after year they lose stars and replace with these players Noone wants And turns them into role players
For this to work a strong leadership group from top down is required I don’t think we are there yet

 

[Weiterbot23]

As much as it is fun to think about this scenario of * missing out on compensation for Saad (and I have brought it up myself), not getting Saad shouldn't be an option. I definitely wouldn't brag about screwing over * in this scenario. Missing out on getting Saad does nothing for Carlton, except hurt the team.

We can just draft him with pick 7 and Essendon get nothing, no one will take him before us as they’d all want a kid, including Essendon, even if Essendon did take him it just moves us up a spot effectively.


No way 7 is on the table for trade.

If their initial offer is 7 plus a player, then I’d say, “**** off we will just draft him at 7, if you want to make a deal where we are giving up less than 7 let us know, but Dodoro needs to wear nothing but his underwear and sit on the floor, otherwise you get nothing and we draft him at pick 7.

 

[Zlatan]

As much as it is fun to think about this scenario of * missing out on compensation for Saad (and I have brought it up myself), not getting Saad shouldn't be an option. I definitely wouldn't brag about screwing over * in this scenario. Missing out on getting Saad does nothing for Carlton, except hurt the team.

Most people here do not want 7 involved at all in the deal, while I’m leaning more on your side (that not getting Saad isn’t an option), therefore potentially having to use it in some fashion.

But when you go into the dealership to buy a Mazda3 and the salesperson says we’ll start the negotiation at $250,000...

 

[The Greek Freak]

I understand all that. And I agree.

However, he’s twice the player Dustin Martin is, and I’m certain Carlton, just like Collingwood, would be right across his personal situation, and would take all of that into consideration, and act appropriately.

From a pure footballing perspective, I’d get him even if it meant he was the highest paid player at our club.

Twice the player dusty is f*** me I've heard some out there comments but that takes the cake

 

[Arr0w]

If they demand pick 7 and or more, just walk away

Send Saad to the PSD, with a contact of a million $ for 1 year. Once we take him, we negotiate the balance of his salary for his remaining tenure

 

[Manhattanite]

Honestly I think we are wasting time speculating what will get the Saad trade done. For example if 1-3 more players leave * then their goals will change from picks to players. So why bother worrying about pick 7 or 27 or two firsts or whatever when trade week is a month away.

p.s. and if * want players it doesn’t need to be ours - just needs to be picks to get other players done eg maybe Port is OK with Pick 15 and a future second for Wines so * will be ok with Pick 15 from us

Hence we have no idea what * want because they also have no idea what they want


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[jimsta10]

If they demand pick 7 and or more, just walk away

Send Saad to the PSD, with a contact of a million $ for 1 year. Once we take him, we negotiate the balance of his salary for his remaining tenure

Think that’s plan C. Austin will be trying to get A or B over the line just to prove that we’re not like them.

 

[Arr0w]

Think that’s plan C. Austin will be trying to get A or B over the line just to prove that we’re not like them.

No doubt

Happy to negotiate fair value, but if dodo wants to be moronic, you walk away

 

[The Greek Freak]

The Saad trade will play out like this, pick 7 to Essendon a round 2 (maybe 3) going back to Carlton.

Cats need young talent I doubt they will trade for 7. They don't have a reason too, this draft is messed up because none of the Victorian Kids have been playing, so you would think they would prefer to have 2 cracks at a round 1 rather than taking the risk of having a crack at 1.

As for Carlton trading 7, it is a good thing for the same reason, you could end up getting a Blaine Boekhurst or Josh Bootsma. Unless you look interstate, then you run the risk of them wanting to go home in a few years.

They do have a reason to, there's players they want that will be gone by 11

 

[Blue__Balls]

What's this "match-winner" status people keep going on about?

Reckon JDG "won" Collingwood as many matches this year as Newnes did Carlton. It's nonsense.

We don't need a bloke who will win us one or two games a year with incredible performances, and be ordinary in the other 20+. We need someone who fits into our midfield or forward line and consistently improves our output. I'd sooner a Mitch Wallis or Bayley Fritsch than a Jordan De Goey (I'm aware those two aren't available, highlighting a type).

 

[Ninja Worrier]

If this is true I’d love us to say “Adrian, your next offer is your last so I’d think long and hard about it. You’d want to be happy with it being public and if you keep up this garbage you’ll be getting nothing for him. See you in three weeks”. He is trying to start ridiculous we “negotiate” him down to taking just pick 7. He can piss off

Saints showed us the best way to deal with this crap, just trade the pick away

 

[The Greek Freak]

It’s either oliver or dunkley

It's not Oliver...

 

[Skull Face]

Saints showed us the best way to deal with this crap, just trade the pick away

Be lovely if we could land that mid now trade 7+future 1st and be left with a pick around 15-18.

If the dodo bird won't take it for Saad we can draft him in the ND using it should the need arise.

 

[Blue__Balls]

No doubt

Happy to negotiate fair value, but if dodo wants to be moronic, you walk away

I think we should just decide what we think a reasonable club would accept (18-20), tack on a "Dodo Tax" of a sweetener or a 2-pick improvement, and present that first up. Then never deviate from it. Refuse to play his back and forth game, just give him a "better than fair" offer and a deadline.

 

[jimsta10]

No doubt

Happy to negotiate fair value, but if dodo wants to be moronic, you walk away

He’s scare tactics are so old school. Pretty sure we’re already 3 steps ahead . Can’t wait until pull that card on the turn/river.

 

[RPCB]

Most people here do not want 7 involved at all in the deal, while I’m leaning more on your side (that not getting Saad isn’t an option), therefore potentially having to use it in some fashion.

But when you go into the dealership to buy a Mazda3 and the salesperson says we’ll start the negotiation at $250,000...

I don’t want Pick 7 involved either. But if we split 7 and hand over one of the picks, I would make that trade. I think Saad entering the draft should be an absolute last - Dodoro is being an absolute moron - resort.

 

[Jabba73]

That we might be able to get him for 1 pick rather than 2.

I would roll the dice on him, we can just put extra behaviour clause on his contract and tear it up if he continues to offend

We could do that ... and completely waste the picks we used to get him by tearing up his contract after he does something stupid during preseason. Where does that leave us?

The guy has a history of being a loose cannon, nothing suggests this is going to change and we would offer him a big contract, pay a high price, then shoot ourselves in the foot by holding him accountable to standards he could never hope to meet?

No thanks

 

[sweethoney]

Read in today’s paper Brisbane won’t trade for Daniher if * match the bid. Hopefully dodo matches and we walk Saad to the draft just to watch all * supporters melt

 

[Beast__Mode]

As tempting as it is, I’ve found it more effective to avoid trying to ‘beat’ an arseh*le with a higher level of assholery.

better to be calm, while still making it clear you absolutely won’t be pushed off your perch, and the antics are not going to impact the outcome. That can sometimes take more than one negotiation until it sinks in.

most important though is that you have to live all of your statements. If you say ‘x’, then it has to be x. Because they know they’ve got a wide band between what they’re telling you and what they’re prepared to do, they’ll only close that gap once they realise you don’t have one yourself.

so usually it’s best, if you end up having to give your position earlier than you’d like: Get it very close (but not quite) to your landing spot. You need a tiny bit of wriggle room if they need a little win, but it can only be a little win.

also got to remember that the most important battle for them is the battle they’re fighting internally - not with you. So giving a little win at the end can help them maintaining the relationships they’re living everyday in their own environment. If they get a feeling it’s a do or die situation, the lack of rationality can shift from being performative to a survival mechanism.