Bluemour 'Silly Season' Edition XXXIV

[Mondyboy]

Now Narkle wouldn’t be a bad get.


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Yep. Would far rather Narkle for “free” than Bowes and pick 7 with a massive salary dump.


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[RPCB]

 

[katmanblue]

My understanding is that he would be a cat B rookie. Can anyone confirm?

Hasn't played football in 4 years. Should qualify.

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[katmanblue]

If that's what he wants, but if his last deal was heavily back-ended then he's been taking unders for three years straight and probably doesn't want to join a club who wants to tack on a third year for $150k.

Worth asking the question

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[Monty1978]

Why would bowers take 150k in that third year people have suggested that , he isn’t that dumb or nice .. he will play his 2 years and 1mil plus and take his chances … rookies get 100k

 

[Blue__Balls]

Worth asking the question

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Well given we have full time list managers and recruiters I'm sure they are asking the question. However, they're not going to announce it every time they reach out to a player/manager so we'll never know.

My assumption is that we've considered or asked the question of any player who is potentially on the move. If we don't hear about it, it's because either the player or the club decided it wasn't in their interests to take it further.

 

[Foucault1989]

Yep. Would far rather Narkle for “free” than Bowes and pick 7 with a massive salary dump.


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I'm a fan of Narkle however I don't think he fits our list needs.

He would be in our top 7 midfielders, Setterfield is a better footballer I'd rather stick with him. He has a great sidestep but not overly quick.

He'd be a good pick up for a club with a shallow midfield

 

[Gethelred]

IF we were going to go for Bowes - and that's a pretty big Faucon if - I wonder if we'd approach his management and say the following:

"Look, we're keen as hell for Jack to come to Carlton, but the coach is sold on a player coming if he wants to play for us, not for the money. We're also a little tight for capspace, given that we want to structure ourselves on the basis that one of half a dozen players explodes.

What if, instead of offering what GC has him getting over 3 seasons, we offer him the same money over 6? That way, he's still getting his money, Jack comes to Carlton?"

Renegotiation of his contract might not be something he'd be interested in at GC - and it mightn't be something his manager would go for at all - but it'd demonstrate the thing that Voss seems to want from our players: that they actually want to play for Carlton under him.

 

[Blue__Balls]

IF we were going to go for Bowes - and that's a pretty big Faucon if - I wonder if we'd approach his management and say the following:

"Look, we're keen as hell for Jack to come to Carlton, but the coach is sold on a player coming if he wants to play for us, not for the money. We're also a little tight for capspace, given that we want to structure ourselves on the basis that one of half a dozen players explodes.

What if, instead of offering what GC has him getting over 3 seasons, we offer him the same money over 6? That way, he's still getting his money, Jack comes to Carlton?"

Renegotiation of his contract might not be something he'd be interested in at GC - and it mightn't be something his manager would go for at all - but it'd demonstrate the thing that Voss seems to want from our players: that they actually want to play for Carlton under him.

Trying to wrap my head around why a player would take three years' salary that he's already contracted to receive and agree to play for nothing for three years after that.

 

[Gethelred]

Trying to wrap my head around why a player would take three years' salary that he's already contracted to receive and agree to play for nothing for three years after that.

Time is frequently just as important to some players as contract size, and if he wants to play for us it might be an attractive thought: security and desired location over immediate payoff.

If we're tight for cap space, we can't be a player in the market for him. Either the money is the draw or it isn't, and that's what that proposition is designed to unearth.

 

[Bradschi]

IF we were going to go for Bowes - and that's a pretty big Faucon if - I wonder if we'd approach his management and say the following:

"Look, we're keen as hell for Jack to come to Carlton, but the coach is sold on a player coming if he wants to play for us, not for the money. We're also a little tight for capspace, given that we want to structure ourselves on the basis that one of half a dozen players explodes.

What if, instead of offering what GC has him getting over 3 seasons, we offer him the same money over 6? That way, he's still getting his money, Jack comes to Carlton?"

Renegotiation of his contract might not be something he'd be interested in at GC - and it mightn't be something his manager would go for at all - but it'd demonstrate the thing that Voss seems to want from our players: that they actually want to play for Carlton under him.

Wasn't it mentioned on this board that Voss is not keen on players on long term contracts? 6 years seems like a hell of a long time in footy.
From Bowes and his management team it basically means you're taking 50% pay cut, doesn't really make sense to do that for them.

 

[Bletch]

Whoever picks up Bowes will take him for the bare 2 years. Would then look to renegotiate after 2023. No-one's going to sign him for 4-6 years now, based on his output in past couple of years. If he shows something in 2023, he gets an extended contract. If he doesn't, he gets paid handsomely to play 2s in 2024.

 

[Jeremias]

Byrne interests me greatly if we can get him over as a Cat B rookie.

Having another genuine option for us sitting outside the main list would be enormously beneficial.

Geelong just won a flag with how many rookie listed players?

 

[Stamos]

Whoever picks up Bowes will take him for the bare 2 years. Would then look to renegotiate after 2023. No-one's going to sign him for 4-6 years now, based on his output in past couple of years. If he shows something in 2023, he gets an extended contract. If he doesn't, he gets paid handsomely to play 2s in 2024.

I don't think so. If you're taking him for 2 years, you're paying 1.6 ish.
Agree it won't be 6, but 4 would be likely to protect/spread the amount paid.

 

[LanceRomance]

Byrne interests me greatly if we can get him over as a Cat B rookie.

Having another genuine option for us sitting outside the main list would be enormously beneficial.

Geelong just won a flag with how many rookie listed players?

How many rookie listed?

 

[Jeremias]

How many rookie listed?

At least 2 I think. Close and Atkins.

 

[Blue_Fusion]

Now Narkle wouldn’t be a bad get.

Yes, he would actually. Another bloke that slaps it on the boot and has nfi where he's kicking. No thanks.

 

[Forty3]

I don't think so. If you're taking him for 2 years, you're paying 1.6 ish.
Agree it won't be 6, but 4 would be likely to protect/spread the amount paid.

You're missing the point here. Bowes is contracted for 2 more years, he agreed to delay payment of large amounts of his salary this year and last to allow the sun's to balance their cap.
He's not looking to renegotiate the remainder of his salary to spread it out over longer. Worse case scenario for him and his manager is they get paid an awful lot to do very little for the next two years. Best case is he gets to a new club, gets what he's already owed, plays well and gets an extension. There is literally no reason why he would agree to earn the same amount as he's already promised but spread it over another couple of seasons. He'd much prefer to take it and prove himself before negotiating more years/money.

 

[Stamos]

You're missing the point here. Bowes is contracted for 2 more years, he agreed to delay payment of large amounts of his salary this year and last to allow the sun's to balance their cap.
He's not looking to renegotiate the remainder of his salary to spread it out over longer. Worse case scenario for him and his manager is they get paid an awful lot to do very little for the next two years. Best case is he gets to a new club, gets what he's already owed, plays well and gets an extension. There is literally no reason why he would agree to earn the same amount as he's already promised but spread it over another couple of seasons. He'd much prefer to take it and prove himself before negotiating more years/money.

Fair enough, but he's owed say 1.6 for the next 2, you don't think he'd go for 2.5 over 4?

 

[Blue__Balls]

Time is frequently just as important to some players as contract size, and if he wants to play for us it might be an attractive thought: security and desired location over immediate payoff.

If we're tight for cap space, we can't be a player in the market for him. Either the money is the draw or it isn't, and that's what that proposition is designed to unearth.

But what use is "security" if you're not getting paid for the second half of it? If i can gdt 1.8mil over three years, or 1.8mil over six, give it to me in three thanks.

 

[TENACIOUS]

Question - Salary Cap

If a player signs on for say 5x $500,000 = $2,500,000…

Due to our cap we need to pay $300k, $300k, $500k, $700k &
$700k…

Does the player actually just get paid the flat $500kpa and the erratic
$300k, $300k, $500k, $700k &
$700k is for cap accounting purposes?

Or do they get paid the erratic amounts each year? Wouldn’t they pay more in tax?

 

[Garters]

We can't even handle a different cat like Stocker. Gawd help us having to deal with someone who has deeper issues.

Can't handle a kid that doesn't want to put in the work v dont want to handle. A big difference.

 

[Gethelred]

But what use is "security" if you're not getting paid for the second half of it? If i can gdt 1.8mil over three years, or 1.8mil over six, give it to me in three thanks.

Obviously, me too, but I'm not currently on 300 thousand plus dollars a year. Were I on an average AFL player wage, above a certain amount of money I don't know how much I'd care about the excess, given my inability to spend it as I choose, hampered as I am by the need to stay fit and not travel during the season.

To an extent, that much money is sufficiently outside my experience that I have no context other than what I'm informed about how they think from the information that's released.

 

[Jeremias]

Question - Salary Cap

If a player signs on for say 5x $500,000 = $2,500,000…

Due to our cap we need to pay $300k, $300k, $500k, $700k &
$700k…

Does the player actually just get paid the flat $500kpa and the erratic
$300k, $300k, $500k, $700k &
$700k is for cap accounting purposes?

Or do they get paid the erratic amounts each year? Wouldn’t they pay more in tax?

The amount paid per annum would be agreed upon when the contract is signed.

Front and back ending contracts is pretty common.

 

[CJMB]

IF we were going to go for Bowes - and that's a pretty big Faucon if - I wonder if we'd approach his management and say the following:

"Look, we're keen as hell for Jack to come to Carlton, but the coach is sold on a player coming if he wants to play for us, not for the money. We're also a little tight for capspace, given that we want to structure ourselves on the basis that one of half a dozen players explodes.

What if, instead of offering what GC has him getting over 3 seasons, we offer him the same money over 6? That way, he's still getting his money, Jack comes to Carlton?"

Renegotiation of his contract might not be something he'd be interested in at GC - and it mightn't be something his manager would go for at all - but it'd demonstrate the thing that Voss seems to want from our players: that they actually want to play for Carlton under him.

Maybe he aggressively to smooth it out from the supposed 850x2 to 700x3 or 600x4, ie tack a year or two on at 350-400, but why would he want to take his 2 years and then effectively play for free for another 1-4?

Surely in that case you’d back yourself to get a new deal after the two, be it an extension or at a new club.

Worth keeping in mind this 850 isn’t the number he’s been on for the whole contract duration, it’s been pushed back and is more or less money owed.

Current AFL average wage is something like 375, so tacking on an extra 3-4 years is 1.125M to 1.5M of sacrificed income. That’s a pretty sizeable ‘pay to play’ request for Mr Bowes.