Updated Bruce Lehrmann Pt2 * ACT Bar clears former DPP head Shane Drumgold of misconduct

[Kurve]

Here is PART 1

Historical Rape Allegation Against Fmr AG Christian Porter
The Alexander Matters matters

Just a reminder, this is the crime board and we need to be aware that there will be victims of crime either watching this thread or engaging in here from time to time. A degree of respect in all discussions is expected.

LINK TO TIMELINE
CJS INQUIRY
FINAL REPORT – BOARD OF INQUIRY – CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM
Joint media statement – Chief Minister and Attorney-General



FIONA BROWN - AFFIDAVIT

 

[FIGJAM]

Jobs, purely the next job, it happens all around us in Canberra

Yeah, I have thought of that angle and it has some merit, especially for Reynolds and her flowers, as we all know she's an ice cold bitch.

Brown on the other hand was a very heartfelt text exchange. They only worked together for like 3 weeks. Brown looked after her situation and got her to the police where there were the wrap-around counselling services. Brown then handed over to the new guy, informing him of Higgins situation and she followed up on Brittany's welfare a number of times. There is no reason IMHO to suspect that Higgins' text exchange was not her honest opinion.

But with Cash, I listened to the phone call recorded secretly by Higgins and they came across as mates! I'm not sure of that recording is still available.




How can you have a "close bond" with someone who tells you to "suck it up" at security? How didn't she correct Cash on the covertly recorded phone call and say "I told you about this 19 months ago?".

Then you have the manipulation of the psychiatric report to benefit Higgins' argument against her treatment by the above women, to maximise the payout and you can see that whilst you might have a point, the point from others (including Justice Lee) that Higgins told untruths to secure media appearances and maximise her payout....that she'd have been perfectly entitled to to some degree by the way...are also valid and strongly supported by evidence.

 

[Festerz]

Jobs, purely the next job, it happens all around us in Canberra

Yep - licky sucky behaviour from poorly treated subordinates towards their bosses wanting to keep their jobs has been a thing since Noah was whipping his slaves to build a boat in the middle of the desert.

And in the backstabbing world of political offices, ruled by factions, it would be a simple matter of survival. This is all outlined in the Jenkins' Report btw - and is a clear explainer of why very few victims of bullying, sexual harassment and sexual assault in Parliamentary workplaces have ever reported or even complained about their treatment from superiors. A slave-master comparison of how junior political staffers felt towards their Ministerial bosses would be out of place.

'An overwhelming sentiment shared by participants across all Commonwealth Parliamentary Workplaces was a view that working in these workplaces is a ‘privilege and an honour’.

'Participants from the parliamentary departments highlighted unreasonable demands and harassment by parliamentarians, built on a culture of service and subservience with an expectation that "we are meant to be providing a service at any cost … irrespective of how the Members behave"

'The Commission consistently heard that there is considerable hesitancy and fear about making a complaint or report. The Review Survey results indicate that only 11% of people who experienced sexual harassment and 32% of people who experienced bullying in a Commonwealth Parliamentary Workplaces reported their experience. Most people who experienced bullying did not report it because they thought that things would not change or that nothing would be done (55%), or because they thought it would damage their reputation or career (47%). Most people who experienced sexual harassment did notreport it because they did not think that it was serious enough (55%) or that people would think they were over-reacting (43%).The Commission heard overwhelmingly that there are rarely any consequences as a result of making a complaint about bullying, sexual harassment or sexual assault for the person who bullied, harassed or assaulted them, or more broadly'

'A key driver of behaviours and the lack of responses to bullying, sexual harassment and sexual assault in Commonwealth Parliamentary Workplaces was the inherent focus on the pursuit and exercise of power across multiple levels within those workplaces, and the significant power imbalances that exist between Members and staff; and between senior staff and junior staff.'

https://humanrights.gov.au/sites/default/files/2021-11/ahrc_set_the_standard_report_executive_summary_2021.pdf

This is the prevailing cultural context within which the workplace rape of Brittany Higgins occurred and was subsequently processed by those within the office. It is outlined in great detail in Australian Human Rights Commissioner Dr Kate Jenkins' expert analysis and report.

It is within that context that a rape victim providing flowers and thank you notes to responsible Ministers after a devastating sexual assault - despite harbouring a firm belief in their lack of adequate support and leadership in response to that assault - needs to be understood.

 

[Kurve]

At court, Higgins actually said under oath she went to delete the Cash and Try recording, as she was “worried about” it, but didn’t delete it on legal advice.

Why “worry” about information that is presumably telling the truth about things?

The legality of recording a conversation without the other parties knowledge could have been an issue.

 

[Kurve]

How can you have a "close bond" with someone who tells you to "suck it up" at security?

Cash didn't say "suck it up", I'm surprised anybody would unquestioningly think she used those words. The conversation was summarised by Higgins in that way.

It's to Cash's credit that she's refrained from attacking Higgins and interfering in her claim.

 

[Percel]

Yeah, I have thought of that angle and it has some merit, especially for Reynolds and her flowers, as we all know she's an ice cold bitch.

Brown on the other hand was a very heartfelt text exchange. They only worked together for like 3 weeks. Brown looked after her situation and got her to the police where there were the wrap-around counselling services. Brown then handed over to the new guy, informing him of Higgins situation and she followed up on Brittany's welfare a number of times. There is no reason IMHO to suspect that Higgins' text exchange was not her honest opinion.

But with Cash, I listened to the phone call recorded secretly by Higgins and they came across as mates! I'm not sure of that recording is still available.


View attachment 2103414

How can you have a "close bond" with someone who tells you to "suck it up" at security? How didn't she correct Cash on the covertly recorded phone call and say "I told you about this 19 months ago?".

Then you have the manipulation of the psychiatric report to benefit Higgins' argument against her treatment by the above women, to maximise the payout and you can see that whilst you might have a point, the point from others (including Justice Lee) that Higgins told untruths to secure media appearances and maximise her payout....that she'd have been perfectly entitled to to some degree by the way...are also valid and strongly supported by evidence.

Cash is the weird one for me. Her attack fog mentality and general public persona doesn’t lend itself the above.

she’s a lot quieter than she used to be

 

[Kurve]

Cash is the weird one for me. Her attack fog mentality and general public persona doesn’t lend itself the above.

she’s a lot quieter than she used to be

The only time I recall Cash speaking about it is when she's had to, other than then she's stayed quiet, so quiet that I'd be thinking she'd not be impressed with Reynolds dragging this on and on, pulling her back in, using triangulation and now Cash is exposed again through the publishing of the Deed of Settlement.

 

[FIGJAM]

The legality of recording a conversation without the other parties knowledge could have been an issue.

Depends on the state or territory, but I'm pretty sure it's ok if you're doing it to reasonably protect your legal interests.

Cash didn't say "suck it up", I'm surprised anybody would unquestioningly think she used those words. The conversation was summarised by Higgins in that way.

Even if that is Higgins' interpretation of 'the vibe' of the conversation, the conversation and Cash's knowledge is very much in dispute.

It's to Cash's credit that she's refrained from attacking Higgins and interfering in her claim.

It's an example as to the varying human reaction to false allegations:

- Brown denied the allegations and has had a nervous breakdown.

- Cash simply refuted the claims and got on with life.

- Reynolds vehemently denied the claims and has attacked like a rabid dog.

It's interesting that you 'rate' Cash's response as the 'credit' worthy one though. She denied Higgins' untruths, but has largely not interfered with Higgins' "legacy" (as you put it).

 

[FIGJAM]

...and now Cash is exposed again through the publishing of the Deed of Settlement.

That is available via the 2023 Justice Lee civil trial records is it not?

 

[Kurve]

Depends on the state or territory, but I'm pretty sure it's ok if you're doing it to reasonably protect your legal interests.

Doing it to Michaelia Cash carries a much greater risk.

Even if that is Higgins' interpretation of 'the vibe' of the conversation, the conversation and Cash's knowledge is very much in dispute.

Cash is entitled to dispute what Higgins says, when she has to which was the point.

It's interesting that you 'rate' Cash's response as the 'credit' worthy one though. She denied Higgins' untruths, but has largely not interfered with Higgins' "legacy" (as you put it).

Why is it interesting? I don't agree with the way Reynolds has behaved and when I compare the two, Cash comes out on top.

 

[Kurve]

That is available via the 2023 Justice Lee civil trial records is it not?

And if it is? She's exposed and again through this defamation trial when Reynolds attacked the commonwealth's lawyers, Ebsworth.

Not to forget either that the last time Reynolds spoke to the press, she dragged Cash's name back up.

 

[FIGJAM]

Doing it to Michaelia Cash carries a much greater risk.

Why?

Why is it interesting? I don't agree with the way Reynolds has behaved and when I compare the two, Cash comes out on top.

I don't agree with the way Reynolds has behaved, but you did express to Recliner that you are worried about certain actions by Reynolds tarnishing Higgins' "legacy".

And Fiona Brown's demonstrable nervous breakdown is swept under the rug time and time again, which again would tarnish Higgins' "legacy", because she did make false allegations that lead to that breakdown.

But Cash's behaviour is in the 'Goldilocks' zone. Told everyone that Higgins is full of shit, but largely kept to herself thereafter.

So you're all good with letting women speak, so long as it is favourable to a specific outcome?

 

[Kurve]

Why?

Cash is smarter, tougher, has far more experience and she's also a lawyer.

I don't agree with the way Reynolds has behaved, but you did express to Recliner that you are worried about certain actions by Reynolds tarnishing Higgins' "legacy".

I said I was worried about Reynolds tarnishing Higgins legacy?

And Fiona Brown's demonstrable nervous breakdown is swept under the rug time and time again, which again would tarnish Higgins' "legacy", because she did make false allegations that lead to that breakdown.

This court case isn't about Brown who could however, be suing the government for being left floundering as Chief of Staff, without the proper training and resources to rightly deal with the situation.

Maybe she has already.

So you're all good with letting women speak, so long as it is favourable to a specific outcome?

Be better.

Please.

 

[FIGJAM]

I said I was worried about Reynolds tarnishing Higgins legacy?

Yes:

Had Reynolds submission been successful going forward, it would have essentially destroyed Higgins legacy.

Not sure what is meant by Higgins legacy.

Did you miss the marches and the Jenkins Review?

Not the first time you've mentioned Higgins' "legacy" either:

We can credit Higgins for influencing change within PH through the Jenkins Review, that was important work.

That will be Higgins legacy imo, not one of getting carried away and making a couple of ill advised tweets or with encouragement, going a bit overboard on The Project, that she might have to pay for.

So you want Higgins' legacy to be Grace Tame-esque? The marches, the empowerment, the Jenkins review.....buuuuuuuuut, you want to downplay throwing women under a bus for a false narrative as "going a bit overboard on The Project".

Still, I'll give you credit that at least you admit that she did go overboard on The Project, because most here are still stuck on that point.

I know you and some other posters are focussed on the good that has come from Higgins' standing up and there indeed has been some good! But we can't ignore the intentionally bad that she's done either, hence why I keep posting on this topic and from that angle.

Ultimately, she's no Grace Tame.

As an aside; I'd love to know why Grace 'curated' some social media data about her and Higgins. It's almost like she knew something...

 

[Kurve]

So you want Higgins' legacy to be Grace Tame-esque? The marches, the empowerment, the Jenkins review.....buuuuuuuuut, you want to downplay throwing women under a bus for a false narrative as "going a bit overboard on The Project".

This conversation isn't likely to be of any value if you continue in this vein.

As an aside; I'd love to know why Grace 'curated' some social media data about her and Higgins. It's almost like she knew something...

Creepy.

 

[FIGJAM]

This conversation isn't likely to be of any value if you continue in this vein.

Why don't you just address the points raised instead of outright avoiding them?

Creepy.

On what planet is that "creepy"?

 

[Kurve]

Why don't you just address the points raised instead of outright avoiding them?

Your focus is in the wrong place and I prefer to engage with posters of good faith.

 

[campbell]

I find it hard to understand how LR and supporters lack insight into how bad this looks for her and her alone.

She alone has portrayed herself this way.

She chose to sue for defamation.
She chose who was called in court to support her.

She alone made this about events prior to said post , that she alleged defamed her.

 

[FIGJAM]

Your focus is in the wrong place and I prefer to engage with posters of good faith.

I act in good faith in perpetuity.

You just want to spin a narrative that suits you.

 

[Kurve]

You just want to spin a narrative that suits you.

Maybe go back and take a look at what you've posted today.

 

[FIGJAM]

Maybe go back and take a look at what you've posted today.

I posted a tonne of evidence-based discussion points.

Conversely, you just want Higgins to be remembered for the marches and the Jenkins report.

So unless you want to address the evidence that I provide, kindly desist from replying to my posts.

 

[Kurve]

Conversely, you just want Higgins to be remembered for the marches and the Jenkins report.

So unless you want to address the evidence that I provide, kindly desist from replying to my posts.

If the evidence you provide is to mischaracterise my position, wrongly assume my motivations and put words in witnesses mouths, that they did not say, then no I won't desist.

It's not a reasonable ask.

 

[Underarrest_]

And if it is? She's exposed and again through this defamation trial when Reynolds attacked the commonwealth's lawyers, Ebsworth.

Not to forget either that the last time Reynolds spoke to the press, she dragged Cash's name back up.

Could Reynolds want to expose/highlight what was said about Cash?
Reynolds was the one questioned about her handling of the allegation in the media whereas the settlement states that both Reynolds and Cash mishandled it. I’d assume Reynolds might be annoyed she was the one mentioned.

 

[Kurve]

Could Reynolds want to expose/highlight what was said about Cash?
Reynolds was the one questioned about her handling of the allegation in the media whereas the settlement states that both Reynolds and Cash mishandled it. I’d assume Reynolds might be annoyed she was the one mentioned.

Reynolds went down after all this, Cash came out of it with barely a dint.

Reynolds got a lot of backlash after the "lying cow" comment, dropped Kimberley Kitching in it in the senate under questioning by Labor and which would have alarmed everybody.

Nobody on either side would trust her with information again after that, whether it was true or not.

She lost the ministry for defence and she missed out on a shadow ministry.

Meanwhile here's Michaelia Cash.

Biography​

Michaelia Cash is the Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate, Shadow Attorney-General, Shadow Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations, and a Liberal Senator for Western Australia.
Senator Cash was elected to the Senate in 2007 and has held a number of Ministerial roles in the Abbott, Turnbull and Morrison Government.

Since entering public life Michaelia has held a number of Ministerial appointments. Most recently, Senator Cash served as the Attorney-General of the Commonwealth, and as the Minister for Industrial Relations.
Prior to entering Parliament, Senator Cash was a senior lawyer at law firm Freehills (now Herbert Smith Freehills) practicing employment and industrial law.

Senator Cash holds an Honours Degree in Law from the University of London and a Bachelor of Arts (Social Science) from Curtin University in Perth, graduating with a triple major in public relations, politics and journalism. In addition, she holds a Graduate Diploma in Legal Practice from the University of Western Australia.

 

[Underarrest_]

Reynolds went down after all this, Cash came out of it with barely a dint.

Reynolds got a lot of backlash after the "lying cow" comment, dropped Kimberley Kitching in it in the senate under questioning by Labor and which would have alarmed everybody.

Nobody on either side would trust her with information again after that, whether it was true or not.

She lost the ministry for defence and she missed out on a shadow ministry.

Meanwhile here's Michaelia Cash.

Biography​

Michaelia Cash is the Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate, Shadow Attorney-General, Shadow Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations, and a Liberal Senator for Western Australia.
Senator Cash was elected to the Senate in 2007 and has held a number of Ministerial roles in the Abbott, Turnbull and Morrison Government.

Since entering public life Michaelia has held a number of Ministerial appointments. Most recently, Senator Cash served as the Attorney-General of the Commonwealth, and as the Minister for Industrial Relations.
Prior to entering Parliament, Senator Cash was a senior lawyer at law firm Freehills (now Herbert Smith Freehills) practicing employment and industrial law.

Senator Cash holds an Honours Degree in Law from the University of London and a Bachelor of Arts (Social Science) from Curtin University in Perth, graduating with a triple major in public relations, politics and journalism. In addition, she holds a Graduate Diploma in Legal Practice from the University of Western Australia.

Yeah life throws us curveballs and sometimes it’s better to rise above it, continue to grow, learn and live.
As it is now, Reynolds has spent 5 years of herself and others lives trying to prove something to everyone else, instead of doing this.

 

[campbell]

Yeah life throws us curveballs and sometimes it’s better to rise above it, continue to grow, learn and live.
As it is now, Reynolds has spent 5 years of herself and others lives trying to prove something to everyone else, instead of doing this.

I wonder if she thought she would turn back the clock, and be on the next Senate ticket at No 1, or get an amazing post government defence or Diplomatic job?
No insight this one.