Can Richmond go back to back? # Did overconfidence cost them against Collingwood #

[SBD Gonzalez]

We almost changed everything after 2016. We sacked almost the entire assistant coaching ranks and completely change our mindset. The mantra going into 2016 revolved around kicking 2 more goals per game. 2017 it was all about playing to our strengths and having fun. Trent Cotchin lead the transition from trying to be too perfect to embracing flaws. Our entire mindset changed from low risk to not even worrying about the risk. In 2014-16 we corralled instead of tackling for fear of the ball escaping out the back, our ball movement was slow and methodical for fear of turning it over. In defence we allowed the opposition to bring the ball forward, just not too quickly, and relied on our defenders intercepting.
All that went out the window. Since then it's been far more simple - when we have the ball, we try to score, and when we don't, we try to get it back as soon as possible.

We definitely lost the spark late in the year. I thought we'd be able to flick the switch, and it seemed that way when we belted Hawthorn week 1, but Collingwood brought the desire we had last year and we couldn't go with them. We woke up in the 2nd half but by then it was too late. Hopefully that loss burns deep within the players and makes sure that doesn't happen again.

I wasn’t aware you’d sacked almost your entire assistant coaching group. That’s big.

“Mindset”? Pretty nebulous.

 

[dean33]

Quite serious.

I agree that inculcating a new gameplan into an entire playing group is no small change. But Friday night suggests that in the final analysis, maybe that gameplan had only one gear. Near-impenetrable when the Tigers were able to play games on their terms, but no use at all if an opponent brought an alternative and executed it effectively.

In which case, maybe not such a big change after all.

First loss in Melbourne since July 2017. Yes change everything.

 

[peternorth]

To answer the OPs query, no i dont think Richmond can go back to back

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

First loss in Melbourne since July 2017. Yes change everything.

You picked a real doozy of an occasion for it though.

Yes, potentially you might need to make some very big changes. Collingwood cracked the code and 16 other AFL clubs are now working round the clock studying how it was done.

We'll see if Hardwick can think outside the box to counter the counter. Certainly took him a while to come up with Friday's gameplan.

 

[Carlton_Blues]

I cant see us going back to back, someone will knock us off. My tip is it will be Collingwood.

50/50 chance you may be right!

 

[Tarkyn_24]

I remember Collingwood’s “choke” in 2011.

Turns out we just weren’t as far ahead of the pack as we thought we were, as proven by our performances in 2012 and 2013. If Richmond don’t win the premiership, I don’t think it’d be classed a choke. It’s just another team was able to perform and close the gap.

Interested to see what happens next year. I’m confident the Tigers will be thereabouts, but whether they have that same perceived gap and aura will be interesting.

 

[DopeMaster]

"Though it seems many of the worst culprits in making BF a childish, boring place"

And of course Pies supporters are totally innocent of this? OMG hubris arrogance etc LOL .Some are like rabid dogs and you have not even won the flag yet. Clean up your own backyard before degrading Richmond supporters. As for your President imploring Victorians to get behind HIS team.......

You're one of the biggest culprits ya peanut! Here's an illustration:

 

[DopeMaster]

And yes, all teams have spuds for posters on here.

Certainly not degrading 'all' Richmond fans, there's plenty of great ones going around, this year they just got drowned out by a particular subsection is all.

Reckon the Tigers will be back with a bang next year. Might not have the same gap on the competition, but they will up to their eyeballs in it without a doubt. Write them off at your peril.

 

[BBC1967]

Thanks for that! I never get personal. I do hope it is 3/10 against top 8 come Saturday. YOU can't deal with that? Give up the art it is crap!

 

[Tarkyn_24]

The truth is that Richmond had a lucky run while every other team was decimated by injury. Terribly overrated team on par with bulldogs of 2016.

No real need for rubbish like this.

The Dogs were completely uncompetitive this year and were fairly clearly off the pace last year. Richmond at stages this season seemed an irrepresible force with their strong finishes, and I’m proud of our boys for getting over them in the fashion they did, but we’ve had a remarkable resilient squad this year.

I think the Tigers will be up about the top three or so next year, but I reckon that aura might not be about them.

 

[Tiger_4_Life]

Just looking forward to the pummelling they will get in the media over the summer and all of next season for being top (by two games and % no less), being unbackable favourites for the flag and then just having a bad day (as you can).

Or is that only reserved for non-Victorian sides?

With all due respect mate but Adelaide were kicking a lot of own goals post grand final and that chorus was lead by your captain. I don't think you copped too much for the grand final failure itself so I reckon you should stop being so precious. In a 2 horse race, things can happen that tip the scales to the underdog and history is littered with such examples like Friday night.

I'm not happy we lost the game in such a fashion but only the deluded and those drinking up the media scum water would think that we were guaranteed to win it all again. Shit just doesn't happen like that.

 

[DopeMaster]

Thanks for that! I never get personal. I do hope it is 3/10 against top 8 come Saturday. YOU can't deal with that? Give up the art it is crap!

Come on mate, it's all a bit of fun. And I'm well aware of my artistic limitations!

I'll be fine if we get knocked off this weekend. Sure it will hurt, but the Pies have well and truly exceeded my expectations this year, and will be proud of the group either way. Can't wait!

 

[kirky]

Quite serious.

I agree that inculcating a new gameplan into an entire playing group is no small change. But Friday night suggests that in the final analysis, maybe that gameplan had only one gear. Near-impenetrable when the Tigers were able to play games on their terms, but no use at all if an opponent brought an alternative and executed it effectively.

In which case, maybe not such a big change after all.

You match their ferocity but have two genuine forwards and that is how they get beaten - both Adelaide and West Coast were prime examples of that this year against the Tigers and beat them. Collingwood did the same Friday night with Cox and De Goey.

It is the reason they are going after Lynch.

 

[lionsrules]

Friday nights prelim reminded me of the 08 grand final. Just felt like Hardwick had one game plan and that was it.
In saying that I feel the same way as I did after the 08 grand final and that this Richmond team is better than one premiership after this season. Just got this feeling they can come back next year and reclaim the mantle.

 

[Jables]

Friday nights prelim reminded me of the 08 grand final. Just felt like Hardwick had one game plan and that was it.
In saying that I feel the same way as I did after the 08 grand final and that this Richmond team is better than one premiership after this season. Just got this feeling they can come back next year and reclaim the mantle.

I think most coaches only have one gameplan, adjustments are a different issue and I don't believe there's not much Hardwick could have done to solve the fact that they were getting out hunted, Though Clarko made a few savvy movies during 08 the only two big moves for the game were Buddy as a decoy, and Hardwick moved Dew to the forward line because he picked up an ankle injury, the rest like Brown to the forward line were progressive changes to the system over the year.

I don't think Richmond are done yet either, but unlike Geelong back then they don't have a system and list that are far, far superior to 90% of the competition, it's always seemed like a few clubs could take catch up to them imo, you had people tipping Melbourne for a flag and that's almost like someone tipping Collingwood or Carlton for a flag over us in 2013. They've dropped back to the pack for now, it was a thorough demolishing in the PF and that has never happened to a dominant club over an era as far as I can remember.

 

[ManOfClay]

The truth is that Richmond had a lucky run while every other team was decimated by injury. Terribly overrated team on par with bulldogs of 2016.

I’ll bite.


As per usual unadulterated crap from you. You’ve done nothing since pot the dogs since they embarrassed the eagles in 2016.

The performance of the bulldogs in 2017 and 2018 does not cheapen what they achieved in 2016. Retirements, injuries and perhaps a lack of hunger hurt, yes. But it does not change the fact the Bulldogs 2016 finals series was one of the all time great finals series performances.

Not one final on their home ground, underdog in each one, winning twice interstate and against much more experienced opponents. All bar one game was a difficult slog, and the one that wasn’t was in Perth.

Only the jealous and/or moronic would call that overrated. Which one are you?

 

[PetterdHoisted]

I genuninely think Tigers will fall back to the pack.

Friday night exposed them badly.

They had been running on confidence for the past 18 months.

Their list is ordinary- bar the top 5/6

Broad, Graham, Castagna, Grigg, Houli, McIntosh and Conca are one dimensional spuds-who play a good game once in 5.

Higgins and Short have energy and are decent enough.

(I seriously cant believe we are looking to get Conca!!))

Rioli is a front runner, Caddy is a hoax, Edwards and Rance are the worst AA selections in years (granted Edwards can seriously play- yet is inconsistent).

Grimes, Riewoldt, Vlaustin, Astbury are guns- and I would take Nank in a second.

Cotchin is a star- yet seems as though his bets is behind him.

Dusty will be an interesting one- have heard some strong rumours about severity of his injury- I hope he manages to get back to 100% as I absolutely love the way he plays.

Even bringing in Lynch, I can't see where they will improve.

I predict they finish between 12-8 next year.

Happy to be quoted and reminded in 12 months

But this is the incredible thing about the Richmond story since end-2016, what can be achieved by a rag-tag team of rookies, retreads, and a handful of stars if you get the psychology right.

We may never see another forward line as small as that win a premiership and minor premiership (modern era), especially one without a resting 2nd ruck.

 

[Brunswick Trap King]

I’ll bite.


As per usual unadulterated crap from you. You’ve done nothing since pot the dogs since they embarrassed the eagles in 2016.

The performance of the bulldogs in 2017 and 2018 does not cheapen what they achieved in 2016. Retirements, injuries and perhaps a lack of hunger hurt, yes. But it does not change the fact the Bulldogs 2016 finals series was one of the all time great finals series performances.

Not one final on their home ground, underdog in each one, winning twice interstate and against much more experienced opponents. All bar one game was a difficult slog, and the one that wasn’t was in Perth.

Only the jealous and/or moronic would call that overrated. Which one are you?

False dichotomies are for simpletons, so I'm not surprised you resorted to one.

You can actually go back further than 2016 on my account to find my 'respect' for the Bulldogs. 2016 changed nothing. Sometimes you just have to embrace luck (And farcical grand final umpiring displays), MoC, your team certainly did.

 

[ManOfClay]

False dichotomies are for simpletons, so I'm not surprised you resorted to one.

You can actually go back further than 2016 on my account to find my 'respect' for the Bulldogs. 2016 changed nothing. Sometimes you just have to embrace luck (And farcical grand final umpiring displays), MoC, your team certainly did.

So really nobody should listen to you and any opinion you have on the bulldogs because it is clearly borne out of your disrespect of them and no rational thought?

 

[kickazz]

I felt running up to the finals that Richmond were not playing particularly well, just doing enough.

Their QF again was ok but not great.

Thing is, I always believed they had another gear. They didn't need to win as badly as other sides in the run up to the finals.

Couple of injuries + couldn't find the extra gear = the result we saw.

 

[The King!]

I dont think over confidence cost them, going back to back is rare in this league, to follow up a drought breaking flag with a prelim birth in the scheme of things is a good achievement. Now yes they did finish top and were favourites but with all due respect it was built on capitalising at home and a reasonably nice run of injuries which may have given a false impression of how great they were?

I think its more about what Collingwood did and how well they played, Richmond did not lose to a bad side.

 

[FastLane]

But this is the incredible thing about the Richmond story since end-2016, what can be achieved by a rag-tag team of rookies, retreads, and a handful of stars if you get the psychology right.

We may never see another forward line as small as that win a premiership and minor premiership (modern era), especially one without a resting 2nd ruck.

Agreed
like the Dogs before them- champion team beat a team of champions

Hope they manage to keep momentum going for next year-but legitimate fears that the bubble may have burst- bloody good while it lasted though

 

[kendrick]

Sportsbet have us clear favourites for the 2019 flag.. So it seems the betting public is not jumping off us after a bad game..

 

[BM123]

I know it's not the most competitive mindset but I'd imagine Richmond supporters wouldn't be too crushed after they broke their premiership drought last year anyway. Collingwood just seemed like the better team on the night regardless of peoples predictions beforehand and it's not like Collingwood didn't have to play well to roll the Tigers. Kinda cringe worthy how some people rip into a team and it's supporters for failing to go back to back when even Geelong couldn't achieve that with a much stronger team.

 

[Max zero]

Sportsbet have us clear favourites for the 2019 flag.. So it seems the betting public is not jumping off us after a bad game..

Robert Walls also predicted West Coast will win the spoon again in 2019.