Caroline Wilson article re Swan and bad behaviour

[Bay Pie]

why would she run with this unless she had some sort of hard evidence?
and if she had some hard evidence, why would she have used the 'Even if Swan is telling the truth about drugs...' disclaimer?

weird woman.

Baffling??

 

[Old Spice]

why would she run with this unless she had some sort of hard evidence?
and if she had some hard evidence, why would she have used the 'Even if Swan is telling the truth about drugs...' disclaimer?

weird woman.

That's a very good point. Really, the closest the article comes to providing evidence is suggesting:

"Pert has been telling friends for weeks that he is tearing his hair out with concern over the behaviour of certain players at his club."

There may be behavioural concerns amongst players, and that's nothing to scoff at, but then to extrapolate from there about illicit drug taking from one individual is Inquisition logic. Ben Cousins denies he was a drug addict, ergo Swan's rejection of the same claim is implied as denial! The logic is based on a flimsy web of confected reasoning which is not sufficient to hold a human frame.

So when Buckley challenged Caro to provide some evidence to flesh out the caricature and give it some sensible form, nothing has been forthcoming. The Age has responded not with evidence, but grabs from Pie sites that are very much speculative and entirely supportive of Caros line of reasoning and sanctions despite the fact no evidence has been tabled. They also charge that Eddie was guarded in his response to the issue.

I wonder why?

Could it be because clubs are (rightly) not privy to testing results until there are 3 strikes and that they are as much in the dark about drug-taking behaviour as Caro presumably is. I don't imagine Fairfax have a top-secret drug-testing unit who know any more than the club.

As you say Suspense, the disclaimer 'Even if Swan is telling the truth about drugs...' is surely not something you insert in an article with irrefutable proof at hand.

I will say, however, that I'm sure some players do dabble in the off-season with illicit drugs, it would be amazing if they didn't. But the tenor is very much tabloid, 'Gotcha' style. I think maybe the off-season should be quarantined - footy pressure is already so enormous. Ideally it doesn't happen at all, but if drug-taking spills over into performance during the season, that's a serious issue and after 3 strikes, I think it's fair a player gets booted. But the policy is already there Caro, so what's your point?

 

[mattys123]

I'd like to be the first to thank Ricky Ponting for announcing his retirement today, tomorrow's papers won't have a mention of any of this crap thanks to Punter.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

This will tear the club apart!

No it won't.

Caro is a 'sensationalist' journo, always looking to break the next big one.
Most times she gets it right, sometimes she doesn't.
If there is something to what she is saying, the club will deal with it and move on

 

[Baltimore Jack]

That's not going to happen.

The HWT lawyers obviously went through the article before it was released.

Fairfax

 

[blaze036]

I think once Swan/Didak/Shaw ect retire Collingwood won't recruit anymore bad boys for a while, culture is such a good thing and we have been heading in the right direction lately with grundy kennedy broomhead ramsay sinclair thomas ect all having great attitudes, the blokes with bad attitudes (wood ceglar) have been shown the door.

I would be willing to be we won't even consider Garlett in the rookie draft.

 

[ipswichpies]

And that is exactly what I titled my email to her when I first saw the article. My message was not very long, but pointed to the concept of journalistic standards and cited the example of the recent 'nasty' incident.

Mate I tried to send her a nasty email on saturday in regards to her last attack on the club last friday or saturday and the age would not accept it.

I never swore or used underhanded tactics I just pointed a few home truths and what it showed was that they are quite happy to dish it out and but will not received it when it is justified in return.

I used to think that the Age was quality broadsheet but I am no longer certain in fact I am certain it is no longer a quality journal and gets more like the Hun every day.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Mate I tried to send her a nasty email on saturday in regards to her last attack on the club last friday or saturday and the age would not accept it.

I never swore or used underhanded tactics I just pointed a few home truths and what it showed was that they are quite happy to dish it out and but will not received it when it is justified in return.

I used to think that the Age was quality broadsheet but I am no longer certain in fact I am certain it is no longer a quality journal and gets more like the Hun every day.

Perhaps if you stopped being "nasty" and concentrated on the issues it might have been accepted.
I email her on occasions and sometimes I am quite hard on her views and opinions, she ALWAYS returns my emails and is open to discussing the issues.

 

[cleomenes]

The article is no more than a mass of supposition and innuendo. No facts are presented, and no references to anything that could be substantiated are made. (It reminds me so much of the current assault on Julia Gillard). This kind of stuff gets oxygen because we are all so outraged by it. The argument made by some that she would not write this if there was nothing happening is just the sort of thinking that muckrakers love.
Swan seems guilty of having a sense of humour, and of not taking football as seriously as supporters. What Heinous crimes. The crazy notion that footballers have to have christ's moral strength, while the general public don't, is something that has been allowed to become an intuitive truth in football circles instead of being regarded as the nonsense it is.
For this woman to be allowed to get away with effective slander, and to imperil players livelihoods to pursue sales in her paper is an indicator of her and her employer's moral bankruptcy.

 

[ipswichpies]

Perhaps if you stopped being "nasty" and concentrated on the issues it might have been accepted.
I email her on occasions and sometimes I am quite hard on her views and opinions, she ALWAYS returns my emails and is open to discussing the issues.

Maybe if you have her ear so much you should ask her to desist or at least put some proof instead of insinuations.
Another thing I will say is that I did actually concentrate on the issues when emailing her but maybe I was not sycophantic enough for her.

I was going to ask you for some pointers but that maybe a tad harsh.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

The article is no more than a mass of supposition and innuendo. No facts are presented, and no references to anything that could be substantiated are made. (It reminds me so much of the current assault on Julia Gillard). This kind of stuff gets oxygen because we are all so outraged by it. The argument made by some that she would not write this if there was nothing happening is just the sort of thinking that muckrakers love.
Swan seems guilty of having a sense of humour, and of not taking football as seriously as supporters. What Heinous crimes. The crazy notion that footballers have to have christ's moral strength, while the general public don't, is something that has been allowed to become an intuitive truth in football circles instead of being regarded as the nonsense it is.
For this woman to be allowed to get away with effective slander, and to imperil players livelihoods to pursue sales in her paper is an indicator of her and her employer's moral bankruptcy.

I'm starting to come across as a Caro defender which I am not, but I think your post raises a couple of points.
1. She doesn't say "footballers have to have christ's morale strength". In fact she is talking about the exact same issue that Pert discussed the same day. Drugs
2. How do you know its slander, it might just as easily be the truth.
I think we as Collingwood supporters should be demanding of Caro and ask for hard evidence, but sometimes we have to be carefully about what we wish for, we might not like it.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Maybe if you have her ear so much you should ask her to desist or at least put some proof instead of insinuations.
Another thing I will say is that I did actually concentrate on the issues when emailing her but maybe I was not sycophantic enough for her.

I was going to ask you for some pointers but that maybe a tad harsh.

See, you take a perfectly benin and factual piece of information and attempt to turn into something its not, right there is the reason people like Caro ignore you.
Do you get it?

 

[ipswichpies]

The article is no more than a mass of supposition and innuendo. No facts are presented, and no references to anything that could be substantiated are made. (It reminds me so much of the current assault on Julia Gillard). This kind of stuff gets oxygen because we are all so outraged by it. The argument made by some that she would not write this if there was nothing happening is just the sort of thinking that muckrakers love.
Swan seems guilty of having a sense of humour, and of not taking football as seriously as supporters. What Heinous crimes. The crazy notion that footballers have to have christ's moral strength, while the general public don't, is something that has been allowed to become an intuitive truth in football circles instead of being regarded as the nonsense it is.
For this woman to be allowed to get away with effective slander, and to imperil players livelihoods to pursue sales in her paper is an indicator of her and her employer's moral bankruptcy.

Agree 100% and eloquently and succinctly summed up.

 

[ipswichpies]

See, you take a perfectly benin and factual piece of information and attempt to turn into something its not, right there is the reason people like Caro ignore you.
Do you get it?

I certainly do get it,it maybe a factual and according to you "a benign piece" but it certainly felt like you were on the attack.
Yes you are correct that you do sound like an apologist for C Wilson.

 

[Old Spice]

 

[Knightmare]

the blokes with bad attitudes (wood ceglar) have been shown the door.

Did Ceglar ever have a bad attitude?

He always had the thin frame and always had difficulty putting weight on and we saw Witts as our future which is why we moved Ceglar on but I never got the sense that he had a poor attitude.

 

[Hardas]

Mate I tried to send her a nasty email on saturday in regards to her last attack on the club last friday or saturday and the age would not accept it.

I never swore or used underhanded tactics I just pointed a few home truths and what it showed was that they are quite happy to dish it out and but will not received it when it is justified in return.

I used to think that the Age was quality broadsheet but I am no longer certain in fact I am certain it is no longer a quality journal and gets more like the Hun every day.

Well, I haven't heard back from her yet, but it's interesting to hear from Baltimore Jack that she does reply and take an interest in discussing issues.

I couched my criticism in terms of what standards a quality journalist might employ, and I have read quality writing from Ms Wilson in the past, partly because the Age does employ several very good writers. Put it this way, I wouldn't bother contacting a lot of writers.

I do think they are imitating the Hun to a much greater extent in the past few years - probably something pushed on them by management, I expect.

Also, I think that a lot of people would prefer that sports journalists concentrated on what happens between the white lines of the field, but if a story interests enough people it will get written.

 

[blaze036]

Did Ceglar ever have a bad attitude?

He always had the thin frame and always had difficulty putting weight on and we saw Witts as our future which is why we moved Ceglar on but I never got the sense that he had a poor attitude.

A few people have said he had a bad attitude, i can't verify it but it does make sense.

 

[Hardas]

FWIW, SEN is now saying they have heard 'disturbing news' emanating from Collingwood from several sources, but because Collingwood are denying it, they are not running with the story at this stage.
Anyone closer to the scene have anything?

 

[Hardas]

Sorry, false alarm on the SEN news - rubbish and unconnected to this thread.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

The article is no more than a mass of supposition and innuendo. No facts are presented, and no references to anything that could be substantiated are made. (It reminds me so much of the current assault on Julia Gillard). This kind of stuff gets oxygen because we are all so outraged by it. The argument made by some that she would not write this if there was nothing happening is just the sort of thinking that muckrakers love.
Swan seems guilty of having a sense of humour, and of not taking football as seriously as supporters. What Heinous crimes. The crazy notion that footballers have to have christ's moral strength, while the general public don't, is something that has been allowed to become an intuitive truth in football circles instead of being regarded as the nonsense it is.
For this woman to be allowed to get away with effective slander, and to imperil players livelihoods to pursue sales in her paper is an indicator of her and her employer's moral bankruptcy.

Whatever Caroline Wilson may have written, The Age is far less morally bankrupt than any of Murdoch's papers or the Herald Sun. I know which paper I prefer to read to get an understanding of current events and issues.

 

[jonbe54]

Whatever Caroline Wilson may have written, The Age is far less morally bankrupt than any of Murdoch's papers or the Herald Sun. I know which paper I prefer to read to get an understanding of current events and issues.

None of the above, news is now processed and packaged to appeal to focus groups or not to offend others, in other words our news programs have become magazine programs.

 

[Pera]

Yet, her club recruits the loosest unit in Pinger Edwards.

 

[the distributer]

Whatever Caroline Wilson may have written, The Age is far less morally bankrupt than any of Murdoch's papers or the Herald Sun. I know which paper I prefer to read to get an understanding of current events and issues.

Why are you defending her? IMO that was one of the trashiest AFL articles i've ever read, makes roy masters look credible lol, also, i read before you were saying Pert was partly to blame for this, but did you know Pert was elected as spokesman for all the clubs on this issue?

 

[TheycallmeBruce]

Rumor has it that Swan has been "charged" and it will be on the front page of tomorrows Herald Sun. Don't know how reliable my source is but with all the shit brewing over the past 2 days I would not be surprised. The reaction from Eddie today is what has me worried, he would normally slam anyone that said something like that about one of our stars but chose not to. Really hope this is not true as it has the potential to derail our season before it even starts. Before anyone asks I was not told who or why he was charged but was told it will be big news tomorrow.