News Coaching Thread: The Hardwick Era
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Would you rather it go to the convicted drug cheat, whose singular great season came on the back of a club endorsed, structured PED scandal?
I won't get into this in full, but you sound like a one-eyed Essendon supporter right now. WADA doesn't come to the party on things like this unless there IS substantial evidence.
The only 'tribunal' that found there wasn't enough evidence to constitute a ban was the AFL anti-doping tribunal, which was basically just the AFL doing what they always do and trying to sweep it under the rug to protect the integrity of the game.
There is and never was any doubt that they were receiving club wide injections and not a single player declared any of the substances they were being injected with to any ASADA testers at any point during the season.
McDevitt said no Essendon player declared the injections during Asada testing missions to the club, “despite being asked each time whether they had taken any supplements”.
They also found abnormally high levels of Thymosin-beta 4 within the 2 frozen urine samples of players at the club during that period. While it does naturally occur in the body and would be expected to be found in the blood, finding elevated levels in a urine sample of not one, but both players whose urine was frozen is a million to one chance.
evidence of the use of Thymosin Beta-4 also comes from the fact that they have text messages from Dank to key personal about the use of Thymosin, his past use of Thymosin Beta-4 and multiple players also admitting they were told they were being given Thymosin.
- he sent a text message to James Hird stating “I.V start next week. And Thymosin…We will start to see some real effects”
There is also evidence that he had Thymosin-Beta 4 shipped in from China during this period
- "He (Dank) denies he had biochemist Shane Charter source the peptides for Essendon from China, but Charter maintains he delivered the ingredients from the Chinese-based company, GL Biochem, and these were to be compounded in Melbourne."
Theres also a tonne of other accumulative evidence pieces, such as the pre-supplements program blood test for all involved players
- That there was no other explanation identified for the blood tests (recommended prior to use of peptides like TB4) of the players, that had occurred prior to the commencement of the injecting regime
Text messages from Stephen Dank to those involved in the regime
- in text messages; the “closed circle of officials within the club privy to Mr Dank’s regime, and exclusion of the club doctor from knowledge of it; the instruction to the players to “keep it secret”
All of this combined with 16 key strands of evidence and supporting documents allowed for the suspension (and a light suspension based on most other sports) of the players involved.
Essendon supplements saga: Expert reveals possible health breaches
A leading expert on sports supplements has outlined the possible health ramifications the Essendon players involved in the club's 2012 supplements program could face.
The Essendon supplements scandal explained
Russell Jackson: The supplements saga that has rocked the AFL this season is as complex as it is shocking. Who are the main players, what have they done, and how did it get to this point?
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My favourite part was when they said they were not guilty because they weren’t sure if the vials were in fact peptides. “ we aren’t sure what we injected into our players”I won't get into this in full, but you sound like a one-eyed Essendon supporter right now. WADA doesn't come to the party on things like this unless there IS substantial evidence.
The only 'tribunal' that found there wasn't enough evidence to constitute a ban was the AFL anti-doping tribunal, which was basically just the AFL doing what they always do and trying to sweep it under the rug to protect the integrity of the game.
There is and never was any doubt that they were receiving club wide injections and not a single player declared any of the substances they were being injected with to any ASADA testers at any point during the season.
McDevitt said no Essendon player declared the injections during Asada testing missions to the club, “despite being asked each time whether they had taken any supplements”.
They also found abnormally high levels of Thymosin-beta 4 within the 2 frozen urine samples of players at the club during that period. While it does naturally occur in the body and would be expected to be found in the blood, finding elevated levels in a urine sample of not one, but both players whose urine was frozen is a million to one chance.
evidence of the use of Thymosin Beta-4 also comes from the fact that they have text messages from Dank to key personal about the use of Thymosin, his past use of Thymosin Beta-4 and multiple players also admitting they were told they were being given Thymosin.
- he sent a text message to James Hird stating “I.V start next week. And Thymosin…We will start to see some real effects”
There is also evidence that he had Thymosin-Beta 4 shipped in from China during this period
- "He (Dank) denies he had biochemist Shane Charter source the peptides for Essendon from China, but Charter maintains he delivered the ingredients from the Chinese-based company, GL Biochem, and these were to be compounded in Melbourne."
Theres also a tonne of other accumulative evidence pieces, such as the pre-supplements program blood test for all involved players
- That there was no other explanation identified for the blood tests (recommended prior to use of peptides like TB4) of the players, that had occurred prior to the commencement of the injecting regime
Text messages from Stephen Dank to those involved in the regime
- in text messages; the “closed circle of officials within the club privy to Mr Dank’s regime, and exclusion of the club doctor from knowledge of it; the instruction to the players to “keep it secret”
All of this combined with 16 key strands of evidence and supporting documents allowed for the suspension (and a light suspension based on most other sports) of the players involved.
Essendon supplements saga: Expert reveals possible health breaches
A leading expert on sports supplements has outlined the possible health ramifications the Essendon players involved in the club's 2012 supplements program could face.www.theage.com.au
The Essendon supplements scandal explained
Russell Jackson: The supplements saga that has rocked the AFL this season is as complex as it is shocking. Who are the main players, what have they done, and how did it get to this point?www.theguardian.com
The Kings Ransom
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I haven’t paid too much attention to this whole story, so maybe have not heard things correctly.
We heard that Dew wasn’t sacked until West came back from overseas.
Is there a chance he was meeting Hardwick prior to pulling the trigger on Dew?
We heard that Dew wasn’t sacked until West came back from overseas.
Is there a chance he was meeting Hardwick prior to pulling the trigger on Dew?
Don't want to be a wet blanket but who was the last Grand Final coach who went to another Club and won another Grand Final
Leigh Matthews like a hundred years ago?
Leigh Matthews like a hundred years ago?
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Malthouse
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Haha.
It’s a legitimate concern IMO.
Had success with a particular game plan - pretty much the exact opposite of the game plan we have had drilled into us for 6 years.
I reckon there will be a bit of a learning curve - and even then who knows how it pans out!
So you’re saying we should get Matthews, got it
You’re right, who knows what happens but what I do know is Dews plan wasn’t working 5.5 years into it
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I think the more important stat is how many premiership coaches have gone to another club and taken them from complete embarrassment to kinda decent?
We’re yet to win more than 10 games in a season. I’m more concerned about Dimma being able to deliver that than whether or not history suggests he will lead us to a flag.
We’re yet to win more than 10 games in a season. I’m more concerned about Dimma being able to deliver that than whether or not history suggests he will lead us to a flag.
People keep saying this about a grand final coach but let’s be honest get us to playing regularly in finals first before we worry about if a coach can win grand finals at 2 clubs
Collingwood missed out on finals between 1995-1999 (including the wooden spoon in 99), Mick Malthouse took over in 2000 and missed out again, made the 8 in 2001 and played in a grand final in 2002 & 03.
1 more example because looking back on 90's AFL is fun.
Leigh Matthews took over the Brisbane Lions in 1999 (who had recently merged with Fitzroy in 96).
Brisbane had just finished last in 98 sacked their current coach and hired Leigh.
Brisbane then finished 3rd in 99
6th in 2000
Premiers in 2001
Premiers in 2002
Premiers in 2003
While I think our list is good and it's a good starting point for a new coach just look at the rest of competition. It has never been so equal. Which team would we replace in top 8?
Usually, 1-2 teams struggle with injuries, but I can't see Melbourne, Lions, Carlton, Port, Collingwood, WB miss out on finals next year. Then you got GWS, Swans, Freo. Are we better than those teams? Essendon and Adelaide are also on the up. Maybe Saints will drop out but who knows. Even Hawks play great footy sometimes.
Usually, 1-2 teams struggle with injuries, but I can't see Melbourne, Lions, Carlton, Port, Collingwood, WB miss out on finals next year. Then you got GWS, Swans, Freo. Are we better than those teams? Essendon and Adelaide are also on the up. Maybe Saints will drop out but who knows. Even Hawks play great footy sometimes.
Totally supportive of Dimma if he comes
Just a caveat in terms of not expecting miracles
Just a caveat in terms of not expecting miracles
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He isn't going to fill the holes in our list in his first year.
MarcLocksCrustySock
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Does damo do skilled based preseasons or our usual runup mount everest preseasons
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Damien Barrett on MMM the other day mentioned Dimma was in the process of assembling his assistant coaches. Some bloke currently at Brisbane who he used to work with the main priority. Forget the name.
I guess they are waiting until the season ends to make it all official.
I guess they are waiting until the season ends to make it all official.
This was Barrett just trying to make himself look like he has some inside word. He doesn’t as Dimma hate that grub
Danny Daly.
Lions CEO Greg Swann said on SEN on Friday that a lot of clubs have contacted Danny but had not heard from the suns
Probably has the same manager as Liam Jones who no doubt he blocks calls from The Suns
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