List Mgmt. Collingwood Trade and FA

[Jasper84]

Can you be specific- which players had odd shaped bodies or health issues.

Drafting a guy with a bionic ear who spend his last junior year on the sidelines with crook shoulders, comes to mind.

Or the guy with syndesmosis who we used a top 10 pick on.

 

[cfc19902010]

No1, after we throw Lipinski in as steak knives.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

lipinski isn't even plastic party knife

 

[HoraceStrasbork]

No neither am I it’s mostly me flying a kite at this stage (as we all are with it firmly in the rumour column) although there is the potential to move Ed to Freo for something, but not sure how that looks.

If by some miracle this were all true I think our best bet would be ANB nominates Adelaide and we get involved in the Houston trade. A 1st + Houston is enough for Petracca if he forces the deal so you’d have to unlock

And so begins the sifting through the trash in the hope of finding treasure but really just finding more trash.


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And scrap metal. Particularly copper wire

 

[sr36]

Exactly right. And how is 20 a first rounder .. it ain't!!

the actual trade:

• Geelong gave up two middling 1st rounders (13 & 15), a 2nd rounder (20) in 2020 and a future 4th rounder (2021)
• Geelong received Cameron + two future 2nd rounders (one from GWS & one on-traded from Ess).

GWS finished 7th and Ess finished 8th in 2021 so Geelong received back picks 24 & 25 in 2021 draft in addition to securing Cameron, arguably the best forward in the game.

that might be close to the best trade value ever extracted in the history of the afl or perhaps a close run second to their trade with GCS, receiving Bowes + 7 in exchange for a 3rd rounder!!

Geelong
What Geelong Gave	What Geelong Got
						Jeremy Cameron	80 games		53 XG
Pick 13	Pick not used	1212 points	79 XG
Pick 15	Pick not used	1112 points	71 XG
Pick 20	Pick not used	912 points	66 XG
					2021R2 (Essendon) (estimate: pick 24)	Pick not used	785 points	56 XG
					2021R2 (Greater Western Sydney) (estimate: pick 27)	Pick not used	703 points	51 XG
2021R4 (Geelong) (estimate: pick 71)	Pick not used	29 points	5 XG
4 picks	0 players	0 games	3265 points	221 XG	2 picks	1 player	80 games	1488 points	160 XG

Pick 20 was Geelongs first round pick. They were runners up and there were compensation picks that had already pushed it out beyond pick 17 to pick 20 before the trade was made.

 

[JLC]

It would be worth Trac coming to the Pies just to see that arrogant twat in Gary Lyon squirm and sulk.

'They should only let him go to Tasmania' lol

 

[Markfs]

Can you be specific- which players had odd shaped bodies or health issues.

i hate to get into some discussion about players' issues. I was making suggestions that we might be trying to be more inclusive. The bottom line is that we are drafting a lot of players who arent up to playing AFL at the top level. I was looking for reasons. People seem to be pretty happy with derek's job so obviously our drafting is going well and as per strategy....i was just wondering what the strategy was.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

So I guess a future first would be needed for Trac at minimum. So we’ll be semi-forced into that spot again. But worth it I guess

But I guess taking on his entire wage might keep the trade price more doable for us?

 

[partypie]

Battle would be perfect and doesn't cost a thing.

Real missed opportunity.

Apart from a number closer to $1m per year over 5-6 years than we'd like that is, the market for him will be hot if he decides to leave the Stains.

Our form slide probably hurts our chances a little as well, especially with the Hawks looking on the up comparatively speaking and being cashed up like they are.

 

[No SPIN]

Drafting a guy with a bionic ear who spend his last junior year on the sidelines with crook shoulders, comes to mind.

Or the guy with syndesmosis who we used a top 10 pick on.

Who had syndesmosis?
A bionic year didn’t make McClarity a bust.
He just wasn’t good enough - just like Kelly, McMahon, Bianco etc etc.
We picked up Stephenson with a known Heart condition and he won the Rising Star.
Contentions that we have a STRATEGY ( suggested by an earlier poster) of picking players with “odd” bodies and health issues is just patently absurd.

 

[Babylove]

Who had syndesmosis?
A bionic year didn’t make McClarity a bust.
He just wasn’t good enough - just like Kelly, McMahon, Bianco etc etc.
We picked up Stephenson with a known Heart condition and he won the Rising Star.
Contentions that we have a STRATEGY ( suggested by an earlier poster) of picking players with “odd” bodies and health issues is just patently absurd.

Wasn’t that Scharenberg? (Sorry if the spelling is incorrect, I couldn’t be bothered looking it up).

 

[Jasper84]

Who had syndesmosis?
A bionic year didn’t make McClarity a bust.
He just wasn’t good enough - just like Kelly, McMahon, Bianco etc etc.
We picked up Stephenson with a known Heart condition and he won the Rising Star.
Contentions that we have a STRATEGY ( suggested by an earlier poster) of picking players with “odd” bodies and health issues is just patently absurd.

Sharenberg in both feet. FWIW It's pretty ordinary asking people to back up their little off the cuff BF anecdotes with a peer reviewed research piece, then arguing with them about it.

We could get into it but it always derails the thread (see your tiff about other club's recruiting from decades ago)

 

[partypie]

Delisted by the saints is enough for me

It's the Ross the Boss effect as much as anything imo, very much a favourites-driven coach so if you don't get on his radar early you don't get a look in.

I quite like Hayes as someone who plays taller than the numbers say he should up forward and pinch hits ok in the ruck (only 194cm but every time I've watched him play for the Stains I walked away thinking he must be bigger), or at least he looked like he could play that role before doing his knee.

Only reasons you wouldn't look at him now to fill a list hole as a rookie or SPP addition are the knee and foot injuries as a 29 year old, otherwise he's a high effort / intensity type who has simply had bad luck with serious injuries just as he was finding his feet at AFL level.

Not saying we should automatically fall over ourselves to bring him on board, but he's not the hot garbage he seems to have been painted as here.

 

[Carlthetruth]

It's the Ross the Boss effect as much as anything imo, very much a favourites-driven coach so if you don't get on his radar early you don't get a look in.

I quite like Hayes as someone who plays taller than the numbers say he should up forward and pinch hits ok in the ruck (only 194cm but a very time I've watched him play for the Stains I walked away thinking he must be bigger), or at least he looked like he could play that role before doing his knee.

Only reasons you wouldn't look at him now to fill a list hole as a rookie or SPP addition are the knee and foot injuries as a 29 year old, otherwise he's a high effort / intensity type who has simply had bad luck with serious injuries just as he was finding his feet at AFL level.

Not saying we should automatically fall over ourselves to bring him on board, but he's not the hot garbage he seems to have been painted as here.

Nah, still hot garbage.

 

[stormskye]

It's the Ross the Boss effect as much as anything imo, very much a favourites-driven coach so if you don't get on his radar early you don't get a look in.

I quite like Hayes as someone who plays taller than the numbers say he should up forward and pinch hits ok in the ruck (only 194cm but a very time I've watched him play for the Stains I walked away thinking he must be bigger), or at least he looked like he could play that role before doing his knee.

Only reasons you wouldn't look at him now to fill a list hole as a rookie or SPP addition are the knee and foot injuries as a 29 year old, otherwise he's a high effort / intensity type who has simply had bad luck with serious injuries just as he was finding his feet at AFL level.

Not saying we should automatically fall over ourselves to bring him on board, but he's not the hot garbage he seems to have been painted as here.

A delisted injury prone soon to be 29 year old doesn’t get me excited party. If he was maybe 25 maybe

 

[adammania9]

I like Hayes - his VFL form has always been great, but you'd probably have to delist Kreuger for it to make sense, right?

 

[partypie]

A delisted injury prone soon to be 29 year old doesn’t get me excited party. If he was maybe 25 maybe

Not like we're going to throw a first round pick at him or anything, depending on how the rest of the off season goes he might be worth a look as a train-on, assuming he passes all the medicals.

One thing that can't be denied is we lack depth at the forward and ruck spots to the point where it has largely cruelled our season, so I wouldn't be writing off anything at this stage.

 

[Apex36]

Sharenberg in both feet. FWIW It's pretty ordinary asking people to back up their little off the cuff BF anecdotes with a peer reviewed research piece, then arguing with them about it.

We could get into it but it always derails the thread (see your tiff about other club's recruiting from decades ago)

Tbf we had the syndesmosis sorted in his first 6 months at the club. That really had nothing to do with his knee injury issues which in hindsight he probably had a genetic disposition to given his brothers all ended up doing their ACL’s too.

 

[No SPIN]

Sharenberg in both feet. FWIW It's pretty ordinary asking people to back up their little off the cuff BF anecdotes with a peer reviewed research piece, then arguing with them about it.

We could get into it but it always derails the thread (see your tiff about other club's recruiting from decades ago)

Sharenberg had problems with his feet but not Syndesmosis.
Selwood was a far greater injury risk than Scharenbetg and became a star.
Swing and round about.

If people don’t want their opinion challenged then they shouldn’t post.
Especially posts that are just irrational, which inevitably will attract debate.

 

[frizzle]

i admire your patience but i sat looking at a list of players that we have drafted over the last decade and a lot of them havent played games. Wouldnt it have been better if they had played games? i know derek likes to target players that no one else wants but maybe there's something wrong with that strategy....dont get me wrong, i know derek is doing a great job. He's said that a number of times. I just feel uneasy...

With some of our selections? Umm no it wouldn’t have been.

 

[Markfs]

With some of our selections? Umm no it wouldn’t have been.

well that's true but it seems that we are now down to about 17 players who are up to standard.... people are talking about retiring sidebottom to give a chance to the youngsters....but what youngsters? I know the club has a strategy but I just think the club should tell the fans what the strategy is. It takes careful planning to draft players like the ones that we are currently drafting. I wish that i knew derek's secret.

 

[sr36]

Apart from a number closer to $1m per year over 5-6 years than we'd like that is, the market for him will be hot if he decides to leave the Stains.

Our form slide probably hurts our chances a little as well, especially with the Hawks looking on the up comparatively speaking and being cashed up like they are.

Yep. Quality marking defenders are gold.

It's why I can't understand people talking about retiring Howe.

 

[Jasper84]

Sharenberg had problems with his feet but not Syndesmosis.
Selwood was a far greater injury risk than Scharenbetg and became a star.
Swing and round about.

If people don’t want their opinion challenged then they shouldn’t post.
Especially posts that are just irrational, which inevitably will attract debate.

Thanks for confirming my point. Discussing what injury Sharenberg had before getting drafted is a complete thread derailment but you just can't let it go. So you keep prodding others with your counter points until it takes over the thread completely. All of this from an off the cuff tidbit from Markfs. Learn to move on for all of our sakes

 

[No SPIN]

Thanks for confirming my point. Discussing what injury Sharenberg had before getting drafted is a complete thread derailment but you just can't let it go. So you keep prodding others with your counter points until it takes over the thread completely. All of this from an off the cuff tidbit from Markfs. Learn to move on for all of our sakes

I questioned the point about syndemosis because I thought I’d missed a detail about a recruit.

Nothing more nothing less.

This forum’s purpose is to facilitate opinion and debate. Some debates are short others eg Hine are far more protracted because it’s a hot topic in which many posters want to participate.

As to my “prodding” it’s simply a means to get posters to clarify their ambiguous posts.

 

[JuniorB]

Agreed - but at 19 and very raw he will still need some time and development before he's ready to step up to the level.

Love his aggression and high energy around the ground!

There were some melts when we picked him instead of Teakle in the MSD.
We trialled Teakle in the SSP period and passed on him, then again in the MSD.
Why?
Because he's average.

Young Illiro has the attitude and aggro to be a star - it will just take a while, but we'll be happy when he does.

 

[JuniorB]

i hate to get into some discussion about players' issues. I was making suggestions that we might be trying to be more inclusive. The bottom line is that we are drafting a lot of players who arent up to playing AFL at the top level. I was looking for reasons. People seem to be pretty happy with derek's job so obviously our drafting is going well and as per strategy....i was just wondering what the strategy was.

We drafted Jay Rantall, because he could run all day.
The problem was that he couldn't play football.
Drafting is always a bit of a lottery - Dow was a pick 3, and now he is in and out of the St Kilda side.